War Zone Box Office Thread

[Figs]

No. Not a masterpiece, ofcourse, but.....well, let me put this in pespective:

Let's say you're a music fan. A rock fan, specifically. In your cd case or shelf you have mostly vintage rock albums like Pink Floyd's "The Wall", Queen's "A Night At The Opera", The Beatles' "Abbey Road", or U2's "Joshua Tree". But among all those albums of heart & soul, somewhere there in that cd case you have Kiss' "Destroyer" and Def Leppard's "Pyromania"! Are these two albums masterpieces like The Wall or A Night At The Opera? Hell no! Not even close. But they're both still pretty badass albums to listen to every now and then. And that's what PWZ would be as a dvd title. It's no Dark Knight or Iron Man, but it's still kickass fun.

I love your analogy!

 

[rogue trooper]

I love your analogy!

Thanks.

 

[The Shape]

I also provided a specific example, citing that its user rating has actually risen on Rotten Tomatoes. You generally don't see that happen when a movie's critical score is in the teens.

This is not to say that the film has, or will have, strong word-of-mouth among casual moviegoers. Just that is has generated a degree of positive word of mouth among its intended audience.

73% of members polled on this site have said it's worth checking out. You can also find plenty of people saying, "Hey, this was actually a pretty entertaining film" on most movie sites. Its IMDB rating is currently 7/10, which is also surprisingly strong for a movie with lousy reviews and a $4 million opening weekend. You'd expect such a combination to be met with a rating somewhere down in the 2-3/10 territory.

Normally when a comicbook film veers into camp, it generates a negative backlash that is fairly consistent. The main difference this time is that the movie didn't pull its punches, and audiences- particularly the youthful fanboy crowd- tend to respect that quality in an R-rated film.

First of all, IMDB user ratings have no meaning. The people who rate movies there are the same crew that launched a campaign to make TDK the highest rated movie there by all rating it with 10s. Then, die-hard Godfather and Shawshank fans united to raise those movies up to beat TDK. The users who frequent the IMDB boards are generally biased, which explains why it doesn't have a horrid rating, similar to how it's been well-received to the few Punisher die-hards here. Same goes for Rotten Tomatoes and Superhero Hype, for the most part.

It's an effect we've seen over and over again here. No matter how ****** PWZ is, die-hards will praise it, saying things like you have to be a true fan to like it, or if you don't like it then you're not a true fan, etc. Of course, there are people that actually enjoy the film, and I respect that, but face the facts. It's not a popular film and it most likely never will be.

Yeah, you can blame Lionsgate for not marketing it enough, but I would thank Lionsgate if I were you. They pushed the movie to this grave of a release date in early December because they knew how much it sucked. Had they created a sweet marketing campaign that made the film look great and stuck it in a more crowded release date, it would have been more embarrassing for them.

 

[rogue trooper]

It's not a popular film and it most likely never will be.

Never say never, my friend.

 

[liquidssh]

I love your analogy!

Ugh...painful...just....painful. nice job there.

 

[liquidssh]

Never say never, my friend.

never

 

[I Am The Knight]

So....No more Punisher films in the future it seems. Maybe DTV?

 

[lou2099]

So....No more Punisher films in the future it seems. Maybe DTV?

The B.O. of PWZ should stop future movie efforts.

Besides, now we have three different Punisher movies to suit whatever mood we're in. Kinda like a mood ring, only it's Mood Punisher.

 

[PunisherPoster]

First of all, IMDB user ratings have no meaning. The people who rate movies there are the same crew that launched a campaign to make TDK the highest rated movie there by all rating it with 10s. Then, die-hard Godfather and Shawshank fans united to raise those movies up to beat TDK. The users who frequent the IMDB boards are generally biased, which explains why it doesn't have a horrid rating, similar to how it's been well-received to the few Punisher die-hards here. Same goes for Rotten Tomatoes and Superhero Hype, for the most part.

There's always two little camps that oppose each other on a film. The difference this time is that the positive group seems to be in the majority.

Look, this was a campy superhero film that received terrible reviews, and only managed $4 million on opening weekend. On paper, I would expect such a film to be taking a huge beating right now on fanboy sites like IMDB, RT, and SHH. But it's not. Regardless of what you thought of the film, there's no denying that that's pretty significant.

It suggests that the film will most likely enjoy a healthy life on dvd. The 2004 version took a far worse online beating when it was released. Fans hated it because of the liberties it took with the character, and kids couldn't understand why the filmmakers had approached the material like a cheesy B movie. Yet that film still went on to make a ton of money once it hit dvd.

There's no reason to think the 2008 version will be any different. There's an entire market out there for direct-to-video action films that barely feature any action. Do people really believe an over-the-top action film like Punisher War Zone won't find an audience- simply because it doesn't faithfully adapt Born or The Slavers? That's just silly.

 

[rogue trooper]

got 6th spot yesterday.

http://www.showbizdata.com/dailybox.cfm

 

[The Guard]

THE PUNISHER: WAR ZONE is a much, much better film than GHOST RIDER or THE FANTASTIC FOUR movies. That puts it in the midrange more or less, below movies like X-MEN and SPIDER-MAN. Story qualitywise, it's about BLADE or HULK level, but it's far more faithful than most superhero movies.

Yup, and it's on FX every week now. After rewatching it, it's not horrible. The finale is the best on-screen Punisher we've seen, I feel. That whole movie is Frank becoming the Punisher, and he doesn't truly do that until he goes after Saint and his men.

I like THE PUNISHER. The finale of THE PUNISHER is appropriate, but "best"? WAR ZONE pretty much takes the best parts of The Punisher from the finale from 04 and runs with them from the word "go". WAR ZONE's Punisher has every element that Jane's finale had, and then done.

Agreed. Frank has a real arc and changes into the Punisher in the movie, as seen by the final line of the movie being "Frank Castle is dead. Call me The Punisher." It was a much better rounded movie than this one. Sure, he spends most of the movie plotting, but that is part of Frank's arc. This movie, Frank's arc is shallow and almost non-existant.

He has an arc in the 2004 film, but it's not an impressively written one. Like the comics, he just suddenly decides to punish people, and does so. Frank does change into the Punisher, yes. And he did not in WAR ZONE.

But that's because THE PUNISHER was an origin movie, and WAR ZONE is not. I'm confused as to what you mean when you say that the 2004 film was a "more rounded movie". Which elements are you specifically referring to? In the comics, Frank Castle becomes who he is going to be when he becomes The Punisher, and he stays there, short of a few "hiccups" along the way. rarely having anything resembling an actual "character evolution" beyond his origin. But you could consider what happens with the innocent FBI agent his "arc" in WAR ZONE. They certainly delved deeper into those ideas of the character than THE PUNISHER did. He is, at least, tested, as is his mindset.

The story is very underdeveloped, I agree.

"Very" underdeveloped? How so? The story is a straightforward one, and develops as much as it needs to. It is the characters who were underdeveloped, if anything, and the 04 film, short of the origin development for Castle, had the same kinds of character development issues in large part. In fact, the argument could be made that many of the characters in WAR ZONE were, to some extent, developed more than the ones in the 04 film. Especially the main villain.

Getting a little sick of hyperbole like "Every performance was bad in this movie". That's just not the case.

I also question what the hell would be good dialogue if the majority of the dialogue in The Punisher, wasn't at least decent. And I'm serious. Because most the dialogue was either appropriate for the characters, or had some subtle little twist that made it better than the average lines. Yes, there were a few corny lines, a couple of "puns", but why wasn't most of the dialogue decent? Oh. Speeches. I keep forgetting that a few corny lines ruin the movie for most people. There goes THE DARK KNIGHT, I guess...

I do think the "true Punisher fan" stuff is a bit ridiculous, but let's face it...a true Punisher fans embraces, or at least recognizes, most of the classic elements of the character, not just one or two "serious" elements while discounting what had always distanced The Punisher and his foes from other, similar characters to begin with.

But hey, if you'd rather have stock villains with nothing interesting about them...just because they're more "serious"...

It doesn't have to be The Godfather, what it should have is a compelling story and good dialogue. And not just use violence as a crutch, for the film to limp along with.

WAR ZONE doesn't use violence as a crutch. There was violence in the action scenes, which came into being as a result of the story. What does "compelling story" mean in the context of The Punisher, if this isn't one on some level? Why isn't the idea of Castle shooting an innocent man and protecting his family "compelling"? Why isn't seeing how this man wages his war on crime short of "finding weapons in a locker" compelling?

Oh. I keep forgetting. Because it's not "The Slavers".

Those were some of the worst accents in movie history , they should
of hired ex soprano/goodfella actors

Yeah. The accents were grating. But "worst" implies that the actors did not do a good job with the accents. That's not the case at all.

And will you please explain to me how in one part of this sentence you whine about over the top New York accents, and then talk about hiring ex Soprano/Goodfell actors?

???

So many of you have confused "I don't like the way it sounds" with "bad accent" or "bad performance" that it's becoming pathetic. Clearly many of you have never been to certain parts of New York, or do not realize that there is a reason the "New York mobster" accent is called "New Yawk accent".

I guess it's ok when Tom Wilkenson does it in BATMAN BEGINS because he's making speeces while he does it.

And people, this movie wasn't "campy". Comedy itself does not make a movie campy. Camp is a movie that is self aware and a parody. You can't look at this movie realistically and make that assessment. Campy movies don't ask fairly deep questions about morality and the nature of justice and vengeance.

As for a sequel, it looks unlikely, but a sequel looked unlikely for the 2004 film, too until DVD sales began. Let's see how it does on DVD before we decide there will never be another Punisher film.

 

[Balthus Dire]

Besides, now we have three different Punisher movies to suit whatever mood we're in. Kinda like a mood ring, only it's Mood Punisher.

Ok, that actually made me laugh.

As for a sequel, it looks unlikely, but a sequel looked unlikely for the 2004 film, too until DVD sales began. Let's see how it does on DVD before we decide there will never be another Punisher film.

That's exactly what I've been saying. Nobody ever thought they'd do a sequel after 04, let alone a reboot altogether, so who knows what can happen?

 

[KT7777]

So....No more Punisher films in the future it seems. Maybe DTV?

That's what I'm seeing right now too,if PWZ does real on DVD.It will have a DTV(hopefully)

 

[Mito88]

Advanced Dark is rolling over in his grave right now with the numbers this movie is pulling in.

 

[StylishHokie21]

What did AD predict for this movie?

 

[Superwoman Prime]

nope. look at the results of the fan review thread, they are mostly positive. look at the community rating on rottentomatoes, it's at 76%. i think it's fair to say that this film has been well received by most fans.

Where did you get the impression I was talking about only the fans? The majority outside of your little pocket universe here has brushed the movie aside as "bad." There's no arguing against that.

 

[grout]

I watched "wanted" last night for the 1st time....Can somebody please explain to me how a movie (that sucked!!!!!!!) can make a buck. PWZ will pick up. Maybe Frank should have bent the bullets when he shot them for financial box office success. Gimme a break, please give PWZ some due in comparison to these lame blockbusters of the same cloth so to speak. Be a critic all you want but really PWZ held its own.

 

[Nivek]

It's over Johnny, it's over!

 

[lou2099]

That's what I'm seeing right now too,if PWZ does real on DVD.It will have a DTV(hopefully)

Why would we want to go backwards? The Dolph Lundgren version was DTV! Hell, Captain America went DTV here in the US! And would Ray Stevenson actually want to be a part of a movie that goes DTV?

If we are to get DTV Punisher I would hope more for an R-Rated Animated sequel, and Ray does the voice.

 

[rogue trooper]

Monday it made $386,547



Tuesday: $393,000

adding up to: $5,018,000



http://www.showbizdata.com/dailybox.cfm

 

[The Guard]

I watched "wanted" last night for the 1st time....Can somebody please explain to me how a movie (that sucked!!!!!!!) can make a buck.

Morgan Freeman, Angelina Jolie, James McAvoy, and a much flashier presentation and marketing blitz.

 

[Heretic]

Monday it made $386,547



Tuesday: $393,000

adding up to: $5,018,000



http://www.showbizdata.com/dailybox.cfm

That much hoped for word of mouth is kicking in! 100 million, here we come!

 

[Nivek]

That much hoped for word of mouth is kicking in! 100 million, here we come!

They just need to keep it in theaters for 2 years!

 

[dft-313]

Wanted is better than PWZ - and i was disgusted at that adaptation of Millar's amusing little series.

Mad Max: cult classic, serious as a heart attack, pompous as they come (certainly Road Warrior is) but awesome fun, great spectacle and shot for almost nothing.

The script's no great shakes, merely passable - so what made the difference? Why is it a cult classic and why will PWZ not be?

because PWZ is as one dimensional as they come. it's violent, sickening, poorly written and poorly acted and takes you nowhere.

Mad max is violent, aggressive, but also builds its characters, creates motivation and sympathy then bludgeons you so that you end up as desensitized as Max himself. When it concludes, you see what revenge has cost him.

Whether you think it's a cinema classic or not, people can take lots of different things from it. PWZ is a violent exploitation movie - nothing more.

it is dead and it has taken The Punisher with it, unless Jane decides to come back to it in a few years, with a bit more experience and gets Marvel to bring it to life.

 

[Heretic]

They just need to keep it in theaters for 2 years!

Hey, it could happen! They can rerelease it around Oscar time and watch the money pour in. It could be a Titanic sized hit! Actually, literally speaking, it already is.