Who Would Really Win?

Discussion in 'Fight Club' started by hyperion04, Jul 23, 2004.

  1. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    The HULK over came the energy field that could move planets from thier orbits in TTA 79. I have already pointed this out though.

    The Juggernaut doesn't get any stronger than what he already is. Which he hasn't displayed much power when compared to the likes of Thor, Hulk, Superman, and Doomsday.
     
  2. torkibe Registered

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    Did you get a good deal on the crack you're smoking? You're calling ME a fanboy? That's a joke. Do you read anything other than the Hulk? Do you know anything about Doomsday? First of all, he is nearly indestructable. Second, even IF the Hulk managed to hurt him, his healing factor is just as good as the Hulk. Third, he's STRONGER than SUPERMAN, which is stronger than the Hulk, whether you want to admit that or not. Fourth, he's AS FAST as Superman. The Hulk wouldn't even be able to hit him. Last but not least, he is constantly evolving, so even if the Hulk managed to get the upper hand for a while, it wouldn't last.

    As far as intelligence, Kryptonians are thousands of years more evolved than humans. Superman is a genius by Human standards. It's not his "thing" though, so they don't really show it in the comics.
     
  3. Toby_Temple Registered

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    Wahahahaha. Now that is a joke. Doomsday got his bones broken by Superman in Doomsday, The Death of Superman, and it never grew back. Nearly indestructible, yes and so is Hulk but Doomsday's so called regenerative healing factor failed him and he DIED. Hulk only died on Marvels WHAT IF comics.

    If he lived in Krypton upto adulthood, he would have taken Krypton education, thus the Krypton level of knowledge. So NO, you're wrong. He can't even be compared to half of Batman's intelligence and Batman is a genius in human intelligence standards.

    Sorry, Mr. Torkibe.:down
     
  4. torkibe Registered

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    Hulk never fought Superman to the point where Superman was TRYING to kill him either. The only way Doomsday loses is dying, then he comes back and can't be beaten the same way again. The Hulk would NOT be able to beat Doomsday to death because it's already been done. I noticed you didn't reply to all the other reasons why he'd beat the Hulk...

    True, he didn't have a Kryptonian EDUCATION. Neither did Batman. Just because he wasn't educated on Krypton doesn't mean that he isn't GENETICALLY more intelligent than humans. His IQ is off the charts. I'll find where it states it somewhere, but for now I'm going to bed...
     
  5. Toby_Temple Registered

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    I already did in my previous posts. Remember? Hulk could surpass Superman and Doomsday's strength with his escalating strength. You just answered it with the same old response:Superman is stronger than Hulk. Again, Hulk can easily surpass Superman's strength level, same with Doomsday.

    And Hulk and Superman only fought twice so far in comics. Hulk also was not written to go all out. Hulk was not even the Savage Hulk when they fought in the DC/Marvel crossover.

    And about Doomsday cannot be beaten the same way, that is false. Hulk's strength can just increase to the point that Doomsday has to evolve another level of protection for it. Remember, Hulk's strength upto now is shown to be limited by the amount of rage he can muster. The highest so far is being in the state of mindlessness, breaking an armor that even the combined might of the Avengers and X-Men could not even scratch.

    How could Batman get Kryptonian education? What a pointless comparison. Batman got earthly education. So did Superman. But Batman became a genius and made alot of vehicles for air, space, water and land travel while Superman cannot even design a motorcycle.
     
  6. Ahura Mazda Registered

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    I think Doomsday would beat the Hulk because....he is DC's version of the Hulk but if they ever met in a comic, Doomsday would lose because......Hulk is a popular hero and Doomsday is/was a plot device to take out Superman
     
  7. Toby_Temple Registered

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    I lean on the opposite way. With Hulk's regenerative healing powers and his vast resistance to injury, it is extremely hard to be knocked out cold or even be killed in a cataclismic battle with another extremely strong being. And with virtually limitless strength, only beings with perfect invulnerability can remain virtually unscathed.
     
  8. Shadow_Knight AKA Symbiote Spider-Man

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    I think the Hulk would take down Superman God I hate Superman but as shamed that I am to say it Suuperman wouldn't go down so wasy though.
     
  9. torkibe Registered

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    Hulk has NOT shown that he can surpass the Strength of Superman or Doomsday. Yes, in THEORY he could, but as of yet he hasn't. To say he can do it EASILY is ******ed. If it was so easy, then why does Emil own him all the time? So, for now THEY ARE STRONGER. But no Hulk fanboy is going to admit that, so I'm just gonna let that go. You ignored the speed factor entirely. He took out the entire Justice League in minutes. The first few in seconds. The Hulk can't do that...

    Doomsday is constantly evolving to overcome whatever it is he cannot defeat, or that hurts him. Dying at the hands of Superman made him MUCH more powerful when he came back. Even with the added powers of a Motherbox Superman couldn't defeat him a second time. A bruiser like the Hulk just couldn't hurt him now. Even if the Hulk keeps getting stronger, Doomsday will adapt. He has shown the ability to actual develop NEW powers that he has never shown before, like when he developed an energy field to defeat the radiant. He would probably develop some sort of power that would disrupt the Hulk's gamma enduced strentgh increases. Even if he didn't, the Hulk can't get stronger if he's dead or unconcious.

    As to my comparison of Batman and Superman's education, you missed the point. You said Superman couldn't be smarter than Batman because he didn't have a Kryptonian education. My point was, neither did Bats, so that's NOT the deciding factor. In any event, Superman has access to all the knowledge of Krypton anyway, so it's a moot point. Batman has had help from his Wayne-tech guys designing most of the things he uses, so don't give him ALL the credit. Superman created a device that could send all the people on Earth to the Phantom zone. But, I'm not saying that Bats is NOT a genius, I'm just saying SO is Superman. Byrne tried to "humanize" him a little more in the Man of Steel run, but prior to that he showed genius level intellect. Birthright has retconned most of that back in again.
     
  10. Firehawk Registered

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    My vote goes to Hulk

    Superman would be beating his ass for like a hour or two doing little to no damage but superman doesn't know it.. As soon as superman thinks he has stopped the HULK you see the Hulk get up shake his head lets out a loud growl while Superman is standing there damn near out of breathe in complete shock. All hell breaks loose from there
     
  11. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    Doomsday can die, the HULK cannot. They both seem to get stronger as they fight. Doomsday has died before. And as far as being as fast as Superman, it never says that according to any guide. It only says he's fast, which the HULK has always been as well. According to the guide Doomsday only evolves AFTER he has died, which means whatever strenghts he has coming into the fight are the ones he'll have when he's killed from that fight. Not until he comes back would he evolve. Which I think should give the good Doctor plenty of time to come up with a way of killing him again.

    Even if Doomsday gets the upper hand he can't kill HULK. The HULK is indestructable. Whatever body mass of his is left will regenerate into a madder HULK.

    All this said I again agree that Doomsday would be a better fight than Supes. Supes strenght doesn't increase, the HULK's does.

    And one last point. I want everyone to think of one of the HULK's signiture moves. His thunder clap. Which is so loud it has destroyed cities, shatter steel, and torn apart other dimensions. When he snapes his fingers other heroes fall to the ground in pain from the sound of just a finger snap. Now let's focus on Superman with his super-hearing. I've seen at least once when Supersonics caused the man of steel to bleed from his ears and nose, and others when just a high pitch noise caused him pain. The same supersonics shattered windows. That's it. The HULK's thunger clap not only shattered windows but cause a shock wave so strong it has destroyed cities ect..

    I think you get my point...one thunder clap and Superman's head might explode, or he'd just be nockedout. Whatever the case I'm sure HULK's thunder clap would KO Superman.
     
  12. torkibe Registered

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    Hulk's immortality has never been shown in continuity. Much like the no limit to his strength, it's all theory. But he has never had a battle as savage as it would be with Doomsday. Doomsday was designed for one thing and one thing only, to KILL. Like I said, I don't think the Hulk could even hurt him at this point, let alone kill him, so he wouldn't NEED to evolve. But if he did, he would come back and over come whatever it was that allowed the Hulk to beat him in the first place. We're not talking about Banner vs. Doomsday. In his current incarnation Hulk is not a genius and would not have those skills.

    As to the thunderclap theory... Can you give me some examples of the way you say he has used it? I'm not doubting you, I've just never seen that as far as I can recall and I was just interested.
     
  13. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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  14. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    "With a super Thunderclap the Hulk is able to deflect the Nightcrawlers sonics. Once deflected the sonics showed sufficient force as to destroy the entire otherdimensional cosmos. all citizens had to teleport to another dimension to survive." -IH 126
     
  15. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    "HULK:The End" I think deminstrated it rather well.


    ". Hulk is fightng the Leader who is wielding his kenitictronic gloves. They deflect the all kenetic energy used against them back at their foe. Hulk eventuals grows strong enough to overcome the gloves (or his own power) (3 minutes)."-IH: 225

    "Hulk is trying to Destroy a massive Deviant machine built to defeat the Celestials on thier next visit. Narration states:
    "He just pulls all the more, straining with every iota of his strength to rip free this infernal object...becoming madder and madder, his strength BUILDING with his anger, as he tugs against a device built to withstand the power of gods (celestials)! But this is the power of the HULK! AND ULTIMATLEY, THERE IS NO FORCE STRONGER THAN THE HULK!"-IH: 242: I think this one is a good example.

    Marvel the RPG game (1998): HULK potential strength is listed at limitless. Guys like Thor, Juggernaut are 19s. destroyer armor is 24, Drax starts at 20 but can go 25 at max (with powergem). Celestials and Galactus are listed at 30s. Hulk is the only character whos strength can potentially go beyond 30 (he starts at 19).-Game is in continuity

    The HULK overcoming of the energy field that could move planets from thier orbits in TTA 79- I believe this to be one of the the best examples. When people who believe Superman is stronger than the HULK are backed into a corner they bring up the Pre-crisis Supes who moved a planet. I think this counters that pretty well. It's obvious that this issue shows that the HULK was able to overcome a force able to move planets out of their orbit (Hey! Like Pre-crisis Supes!). So I think it's fair to say if Superman's maximum level of strengh is that of Pre-crisis Supes is to move a planet (which we've not seen anything bigger TMK) than the HULK should have no problem over coming that.
     
  16. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    That's checkmate I believe.
     
  17. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    Seeing as how you've run out of steam when it comes to Supes VS HULK we could continue our Doomsday VS HULK debate. That's always been a much better match IMO.

    "Doomsday's physical abilities perhaps even surpass Superman. Doomsday's strength has no known limits and is such that he can easily move and lift weights in excess of 200,000 tons."

    "During the Secret Wars mini-series, for example, he was seen effectively holding up a 150 billion ton mountain, which was dropped on them by the Molecule Man, until the heroes buried inside could find a way to blast their way out."

    Source
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hulk_(comics)

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doomsday_(comics)

    They site their sources from comics on the bottom.
     
  18. GammaMike Registered

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    Excellent points Dac. You left off the thunderclap that KO'd Venom
     
  19. torkibe Registered

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    The End isn't in continuity, so no, it doesn't demonstrate his immortality. That's why I said "In Continuity".

    The Kinetic gloves don't prove anything. It just means they could only deflect so much energy.

    Destroying a device built to withstand Celestials is impressive, Ill give you that.

    Overcoming an energy field that moved a planet out of orbit is apples and oranges. That's the if person A beats person B and person B beats person C than person A must beat person C.

    RPG means dick.
     
  20. torkibe Registered

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    150 billion ton mountain thing has been done to death. Every time it's brought up, it has to be pointed out he didn't LIFT 150 billion tons. He didn't even MOVE 150 billion tons. He BRACED it and kept it from collapsing on top of them. With help.

    But I agree, at this point in time, Doomsday WOULD kick Supes ass.
     
  21. torkibe Registered

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    Yes, he does. And he's also A LOT tougher than Wolverine. The rest of those feats wouldn't have phased someone of Superman's level. I don't want this to sound argumentitive, I just don't think they're of the calibur you mentioned. I had pictures of mass destruction and what not in my mind.
     
  22. Toby_Temple Registered

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    Wrong again.You said you collected Hulk comics. He surpassed alot of beings in par and even stronger than Supes. You're just denying it. Supes strength has its limit. Doomsday has to die to become stronger. In all Hulk comics, his strength is shown to increase everytime he gets angry.
    Emil owning Hulk all the time? That's bull****. Hulk has defeated Emil several times. Don't tell me you don't know that. The only reason Doomsday took out the Justice League so fast was that those idiots did not expect the brute to survive their combined energy attacked. They were surprised. Thats the fact. Coz if Doomsday is indeed faster than Flash and as strong as Superman, Superman would not stand a chance. But you obviously failed to understand that fanboy.

    Wrong again. Doomsday only evolves after he dies. That means that what killed him will not kill him again once he resurrects. Drain Hulks gamma induced strength increase? Where the hell did that came from. A speculation I suppose. Hulk's strength is not from radiation. His shear existence is due to that radiation. But his strength comes from his body's ability to generate a type of adrenalin whose amounts increases when he is experiecing anger. The more adrenalin is secreted, the stronger he becomes. That is why the madder he gets the stronger he becomes.

    Wrong. Stop putting words in my mouth fanboy. You said that Clark is smarter than average humans coz he is kryptonian. Wrong. He might be kryptonian but he grew up as a human. He learned the human ways and just became an average joe with super powers. Bruce Wayne on the other hand became a genius in human standards. Thats why in all dc comics, Batman is shown as the shrewd tactician while Superman is not. He can't even be compared to the intellect of Lex Luther and you call Clark a genius. Now thats ******ed.
     
  23. Toby_Temple Registered

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    Obviously, if anyone did read and understand the pictures, Hulk did not lift it. It was thrown towards the heroes and Hulk catched it. But instead of being crushed, he was able to prevent 150 billion tons of pressure with his strength. Get it? Its still a feat worth of someone like Hulk. His body immediately responded and secreted enough adrenalin to make Hulk strong enough to stop 150 billion tons of pressure. Thats from class 100 ton to class 150 billion tons. :eek:
     
  24. DACMAN The Spidey Fan

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    I brought that to your attention because people often fall back on the "Supes moved a planet" thing all the time. My point was that the HULK has strenght that rivals, and according to Marvel, can pass the Pre-crisis Supes. So the Post-crisis Supes wouldn't stand a chance strenght wise.
    Yeah I understand what you're saying. But the end is only a possible end as far as if the Marvel Universe goes down that path. It didn't constrew(SP?) or change anything about the HULK as a character it only took a different direction story wise. It COULD happen is the point. Things like "What if Spider-Man was never bitten buy a radioactive spider" is totally different. It is out of continuity. He was bitten. But "HULK: THE END" could happen. The character could live out what is going on in the story. He has the ability to carry out what he does in the story. You gettin me?


















    We're such nerds ya know.
     
  25. MR.Fixit Registered

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    You guy are going back and forth and saying the same things.It doesnt seem like everybody will agree cuz they wont.The facts are there and u cant argue them.Though Super Man is more powerful then Hulk(meaning he has more powers)its impossible for him or anybody else to be stronger.Why?cuz his strength is unlimited.A fight always depends on the writer.If your gonna write that Supes wins then the fight is gonna have to last 3 pages,cuz he's gonna have to knock him out quick or else it last long and by then Hulk is too strong.I said Supes is more powerful,but what power does he have that could actually play a part in the fight?Super speed?ok he hits Hulk a thousand times in a second,and pisses him off even more.To tell u the truth I see both of them near death at the end of it all.But thats where Hulks advantages come into play against all comers:He just keeps on ticking.Every hero died in Hulk:the end.all except HUlk.
     

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