Why are people so skeptical of UFO's?

[Thundercrack85]

Why is it that only place UFO's seem to pop up are in backwood places? you never hear of a UFO spotted in Beverly Hills.

I take it you haven't actually read up much on this subject?

Washington DC, 1952. Google it.

 

[Alex_Spider]

Beyond being sarcastic and overly sensitive about one sentence, what about the actual content of the article? Or the other one?


And that counts as evidence of it being a massive space craft how?

No. It's just a valid question on why the delay after all these years and why hearing this from an article in the net instead of the official state.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Policy is to not comment on UFO's. So, that's why. Hell, Roswell didn't get an official explanation until the 90's, and that was only due to public pressure.

And technically that wasn't a UFO... Wasn't exactly flying.

 

[moviedoors]

You know there is something hilariously ironic about the aircraft coming from the Barry Goldwater Range.

Still I'm skeptical. Unless thousands of people were really drunk that night, there's something funny about all this. Not to mention the secrecy. The governor has even come out and said it was certainly not flares (he's also a USAF veteran).

Looks like half of Phoenix is posting their complaints in that second link.

Clearly, you're not. All that evidence to the contrary and you're putting stock in unverifiable anecdotes and appealing to authority.

The case is closed. There was no ship over Phoenix that night.

 

[moviedoors]

And technically that wasn't a UFO.

Yeah, because we identified it.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Clearly, you're not. All that evidence to the contrary and you're putting stock in unverifiable anecdotes and appealing to authority.

The case is closed. There was no ship over Phoenix that night.

It's your word vs thousands (who were actually there), including the governor of the state (who tried to get answers through government channels).

The case is not closed.

Well, for you it is.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Yeah, because we identified it.

Go on.

I'm curious to see if you actually know what you're talking about, or just reading off of Wikipedia.

 

[Mr.M]

Well by the term "Advanced" we mean the technological capability that will enable us to explore our galaxy and solve the energy shortages. Only then we will perceive our selves as one planet populated only by humanity and not by divided countries. Right now we 're not that advanced so the divisions remain and the pursuit for every country is more land and power through scuffles and wars.

You are thinking too idealistically. I'd like to say the most logical explanation is "we have nothing to offer them." Then again, what if the highest evolved life form in the galaxy is one that consumes at will. A predator that will use any and all means neccessary to gather every resource available to it. Maybe they just haven't come to our solar system yet? There are near infinite amounts of energy sources in the galaxy, so the chances of this super evolved life form hitting our sun any time soon is remote. But such a life form could exist. It's an equally valid scenario vs a civilization that is just documenting and recording ****, going on about their business quitely and peacefully.

Given these two polar opposite scenarios, you'd have to think the real answer is somewhere in between. Maybe there are intergalactic struggles going on at this very moment. I don't see why one of these idealogies can exclusively win out and dominate the galaxy, although if one has, it's unlikely we'd find out any time soon. However, I think the predator scenario becomes much less likely the longer humanity is around, because if they hear us, they would be more likely to kill us sooner than later. But it will take time scales over a few cosmological epochs before we can favor one scenario over the other.

 

[Alex_Spider]

You are thinking too idealistically. I'd like to say the most logical explanation is "we have nothing to offer them." Then again, what if the highest evolved life form in the galaxy is one that consumes at will. A predator that will use any and all means neccessary to gather every resource available to it. Maybe they just haven't come to our solar system yet? There are near infinite amounts of energy sources in the galaxy, so the chances of this super evolved life form hitting our sun any time soon is remote. But such a life form could exist. It's an equally valid scenario vs a civilization that is just documenting and recording ****, going on about their business quitely and peacefully.

Given these two polar opposite scenarios, you'd have to think the real answer is somewhere in between. Maybe there are intergalactic struggles going on at this very moment. I don't see why one of these idealogies can exclusively win out and dominate the galaxy, although if one has, it's unlikely we'd find out any time soon. However, I think the predator scenario becomes much less likely the longer humanity is around, because if they hear us, they would be more likely to kill us sooner than later. But it will take time scales over a few cosmological epochs before we can favor one scenario over the other.

And one could say you are basing your claims too much in fear mongering and the Hollywood perception that we have of Alien life forms. Maybe that is the real deal though I don't know.

I am just stating that if you discover the means to travel in space like going for a walk in the park, then it is safe to assume that you wouldn't need to gather other energy sources, or invade other species. You would already have in place an infinite type of energy for travel in space and food. Think a society like in Star Trek. Humanity has whatever it needs through advanced tech and doesn't need to invade another planet to gather recourses.

I am pretty certain that infinite energy is the key to our salvation and the tool for the abolition of wars, diseases, and poverty. But nevertheless you have valid points as well.

 

[Thundercrack85]

There's always a bigger fish, I suppose.

An alien civilization a thousand years "ahead" of us would make us stand in awe. But what would we (i.e. both us and them) be in the eyes of a civilization millions of years more advanced? But then even most ambitious science fiction authors have trouble envisioning a civilization millions of years old.

I can only hope there is a lot of space between inhabited planets.

 

[NickNitro]

What if the first alien contact we have, turns out to be thousands of years behind us. That'd be something huh?

 

[Thundercrack85]

What if the first alien contact we have, turns out to be thousands of years behind us. That'd be something huh?

Arthur C. Clarke had an interesting quote on that: "we will find apes or angels, but not men."

Though if life is common enough, we might find a few men too.

 

[moviedoors]

Go on.

I'm curious to see if you actually know what you're talking about, or just reading off of Wikipedia.

Remember those links I posted....

It's your word vs thousands (who were actually there), including the governor of the state (who tried to get answers through government channels).

Now I'm just repeating myself: you're putting stock in unverifiable anecdotes and appealing to authority in spite of the evidence that points otherwise.

 

[Alex_Spider]

Remember those links I posted....


Now I'm just repeating myself: you're putting stock in unverifiable anecdotes and appealing to authority in spite of the evidence that points otherwise.

But why leave an "anecdote" like this unexplained for all these years? Would it compromise national security by admitting officially that it was indeed a US Air force task the day it happened? So many people got ridiculed, even the governor himself, be stating that he believes they were alien ufo's, just because the Air force didn't bother to explain the truth?

I get that policy is not commenting on UFO's, but in cases like this what's the harm?
And why should we believe an article we just read in the web? Where is the source from the official statement they got it from?

 

[Thundercrack85]

Remember those links I posted....


Now I'm just repeating myself: you're putting stock in unverifiable anecdotes and appealing to authority in spite of the evidence that points otherwise.

I could make some counterpoint, but I guess I could just suggest reading the counterpoints posted in those links (about the two events, etc).

What still bothers me about that event is the fact that even the governor was kept in the dark. If it's just a mundane air force exercise, it seems very odd, that in the aftermath, there was never a single statement. Especially with the local hysteria (not every day the governor holds a press conference to talk about a UFO sighting).

Flares are routinely dropped on those test grounds. You would think the witnesses, including pilots, would be able to easily discern them from something "otherworldly".

I'm on the fence with this one.

 

[Thundercrack85]

But why leave an "anecdote" like this unexplained for all these years? Would it compromise national security by admitting officially that it was indeed a US Air force task the day it happened? So many people got ridiculed, even the governor himself, be stating that he believes they were alien ufo's, just because the Air force didn't bother to explain the truth?

I get that policy is not commenting on UFO's, but in cases like this what's the harm?
And why should we believe an article we just read in the web? Where is the source from the official statement they got it from?

Well, I suppose the simplest answer would be that they didn't feel the need to. Why open that can of worms?

Even if the Phoenix lights were the moving lights of an alien spacecraft, it's not coming back.

I do wonder though what would have happened if the governor hadn't dismissed the whole sighting at the time with a mock press conference. He only changed his tune after he retired. Then there might have actually been some serious public reaction.

 

[Piper Maru]

I know it's been mentioned before, but I wonder how would all of mankind react if contact with aliens were made. Would people go into a blind panic?

 

[Thundercrack85]

I know it's been mentioned before, but I wonder how would all of mankind react if contact with aliens were made. Would people go into a blind panic?

I think it really depends on the circumstances.

Hopefully the aliens would have the sense not to do that thing where they just park their ships over our biggest cities.

 

[Mr.M]

There's always a bigger fish, I suppose.

An alien civilization a thousand years "ahead" of us would make us stand in awe. But what would we (i.e. both us and them) be in the eyes of a civilization millions of years more advanced? But then even most ambitious science fiction authors have trouble envisioning a civilization millions of years old.

I can only hope there is a lot of space between inhabited planets.

I'd imagine these civilizations (assuming their technological progress is never significantly impeded throughout their history), would no longer be physical beings in the sense like you and me. They would just be conscious entities or brains. Networks wired by vast information highways and near infinite processing capabilities. Perhaps such networks pervade through multiple dimensions in a multiverse. They would essentially be God, and if there is no limit or cap to these inherent or learned abilities, there is no reason why they cannot engineer a universe themselves, making everything we know a gargantuan simulation of sorts like The Matrix. But in the context of modern physics, I don't believe a civilization can reach such a state. I think they die out at some threshold or are stunted by some limiting factor, and whatever AI they may leave behind suffers the same fate.

 

[Alex_Spider]

I'd imagine these civilizations (assuming their technological progress is never significantly impeded throughout their history), would no longer be physical beings in the sense like you and me. They would just be conscious entities or brains. Networks wired by vast information highways and near infinite processing capabilities. Perhaps such networks pervade through multiple dimensions in a multiverse. They would essentially be God, and if there is no limit or cap to these inherent or learned abilities, there is no reason why they cannot engineer a universe themselves, making everything we know a gargantuan simulation of sorts like The Matrix. But in the context of modern physics, I don't believe a civilization can reach such a state. I think they die out at some threshold or are stunted by some limiting factor, and whatever AI they may leave behind suffers the same fate.

Dude, you just destroyed my brain synapse now by the level of awesomeness of these sci fi concepts . Seriously though those are some good points. I could see it happen.

 

[Bim]

I know it's been mentioned before, but I wonder how would all of mankind react if contact with aliens were made. Would people go into a blind panic?

I think many would totally panic, even if the aliens didnt show signs of being aggressive. I just hope that the ones who panic arent the ones who have access to press the button for nukes.

 

[Steyin]

I witnessed several UFOs a couple of years ago. I was waiting for the train in the morning, and ever since 9/11 for some reason, I have an uncanny ability to sense when there is an aircraft in the sky without seeing it. So this sense kicked in, and I saw a plane. However, I also noticed 3-4 other orb like objects around the plane, and could only see them with my sunglasses on as it was a bright, sunny summer morning. I should also note that I was the only one watching this unfold, but I also noticed I was the only person with shades on looking at the sky. The "orbs" we moving very rapidly, zipping from one spot to another, hence not being able to get an accurate count. After a couple of minutes they disappeared.

My first reaction was to record the event with my phone, but I have/had a crappy phone so it wouldn't even be noticeable on its video quality. Now I am a believer in alien life existing somewhere out there, but I'm a logical person first and foremost, so I went through every possible thing the objects could have been aside from a UFO that day, while perusing the surrounding sky directly after and during the event. No other planes, no birds, completely clear sky, etc.

I can only surmise what I witnessed were UFOs. I honestly don't even think they were flying around the plane, but were in the distance in the same plane/field of space. It was merely my sensing of the aircraft that alerted me to the existence of them. Quite a sight and experience.

 

[Mr.M]

Dude, you just destroyed my brain synapse now by the level of awesomeness of these sci fi concepts . Seriously though those are some good points. I could see it happen.

Go watch Into the Wormhole with Morgan Freeman. It's all covered there.

 

[NickNitro]

All you had to of said was Morgan Freeman, and I would of went regardless.

He's out there......somewhere

 

[Mr.M]

The episode on E.T is particulary good. I gave away the climax though, because some of the physicists and computer scientists come to the conclusion of a "Super Brain". But if you like the questions mankind has been pondering since mankind could ponder, the show covers it in one episode or another.