The Dark Knight Rises Would you consider Jim Carrey for Nolan's Riddler if he never did Batman Forever?

[The Shredder]

No worries there.

 

[Anjow1060]

Carrey is a fantastic dramatic actor.

There's an old acting saying, "If you can do comedy, you can do anything."

I personally believe any comedian can play the Riddler and do so in a serious, straightforward manner that will "ooze" and all these other ridiculous adjectives being thrown around.

But Carrey is water under the bridge, or over the dam, or wherever you like him.

No sense arguing about it.

- Jow

 

[raybia]

I have to ask. I mean, obviously the guy did Batman Forever and played the Riddler, but just hypothetically, if he had never accepted the role, would you consider him a candidate for a new age, Nolan Riddler in Batman 3?

Well, when you put it that way...No.

 

[jakinj]

God no

 

[Hulkfan2008!]

i would consider him for joker if ledger had not been used

 

[jordanasmith]

i think he is good for comedy movies...

 

[WeaponXProject]

I'm not defending Jim Carrey or any of his Number 23's, Yes Man's or Bruce Almighty's but it wasn't necessarily him that was the reason why the Riddler was lame in Batman Forever. It was Schumacher who had both Two-Face and the Riddler so over the top it was terrible. I think it depends on the director and I still wouldn't want Jim Carrey. I would rather have a serious actor play the Riddler. I have feeling that Nolan's version will be so different than the Riddler we've seen.

 

[namtaB]

I'm not defending Jim Carrey or any of his Number 23's, Yes Man's or Bruce Almighty's but it wasn't necessarily him that was the reason why the Riddler was lame in Batman Forever. It was Schumacher who had both Two-Face and the Riddler so over the top it was terrible. I think it depends on the director and I still wouldn't want Jim Carrey. I would rather have a serious actor play the Riddler. I have feeling that Nolan's version will be so different than the Riddler we've seen.

I think Schumacher gets unfairly blamed sometimes. There's no question that he is partly responsible for the failures of BF and B&R. But its not always the director or cast for that matter that leads to a poor movie.

Take for instance, the Mask of Zorro and the Legend of Zorro. Both were directed by Martin Campbell who also directed Goldeneye and Casino Royale. Both had Banderas and Zeta Jones in their respective roles. Yet where Mask of Zorro shined, Legend of Zorro was subpar at best.

The studio wanted to lighten it up for the kiddies and the writing became horrendous. Both factors lead to the flawed sequel. From the news reports since then it sounds like the studio reaction became so polarized after BR's merchandise tie in fiasco that the third Batman film would have sucked even if Burton remained on as director.

 

[WeaponXProject]

I see your point Namta but Jim Carrey's acting was not the issue it was either the way the character was written and how they went forward with it. At some point the director needs to take responsibility for it but so do the writers. If you go forward with crap perhaps you should stop and change some things. To me it was obvious that Schu went for the Adam West Batman feel where the villains were slaptastic. I can't blame Tommy Lee Jones for his slaptastic performance either, some one behind the scene is telling them to do this a certain way. Unfortunately it was the wrong way.

 

[I Am The Knight]

Carrey is a fantastic dramatic actor

Agreed!!!!

 

[markstrange]

ew number 23...

That was an awesome movie!

 

[shauner111]

Gotta bring this back..

This is an interesting topic. Whether Jim Carrey played Riddler in Forever or not, i think Nolan using him to play a more serious version of Nygma...would have been awesome. Jim is a great dramatic actor with the right script, and Nolan had many discussions with him to star in his Howard Hughes movie. So it would have fit like a glove.

But if the sequel to Dark Knight had included the Riddler, who else would people want in the role? I think Jesse Eisenberg would have made an excellent Riddler. Way more than Lex Luthor. Dicaprio would have worked. Michael Emerson or Robin Williams for an older version.

 

[BatLobster]

Hmm. Let me just say that I grew up a diehard Jim Carrey fan. When I was a kid, I was probably more excited about him being The Riddler than anything else going on in Batman Forever. And we know he has some dramatic range too.

That said, I don't think it would've ever worked to re-cast the same actor for the same role, especially not in the Nolan series. It just draws too much attention to itself. In an alternate universe where Batman Forever didn't exist, heck yeah. Shoot, I'd love to have seen his Joker too. But as is, I would've preferred to see another actor.

I liked Jude Law, Guy Pierce and Casey Affleck for Riddler. There are really a lot of actors out there who could probably make a great Riddler, but those are my three picks.

 

[bilbo baggins]

Gotta bring this back..

This is an interesting topic. Whether Jim Carrey played Riddler in Forever or not, i think Nolan using him to play a more serious version of Nygma...would have been awesome. Jim is a great dramatic actor with the right script, and Nolan had many discussions with him to star in his Howard Hughes movie. So it would have fit like a glove.

But if the sequel to Dark Knight had included the Riddler, who else would people want in the role? I think Jesse Eisenberg would have made an excellent Riddler. Way more than Lex Luthor. Dicaprio would have worked. Michael Emerson or Robin Williams for an older version.

i concur, carrey has the chops to play any role. also i bet if you did a poll when heath ledger was announced to play joker that over 70% of all people scoffed, and the performance is out this world. bottom line is carey was directed by shumaker and we will never know. but i know in my bones that he would been great with a serious director, even greater with nolan.

 

[shauner111]

I agree Bilbo. Carrey would have been great under Nolan's guidance if say Tim Burton had made Batman Forever with Robin Williams, which was the original plan. Especially since Chris and Jim really wanted to work with each other all throughout the last decade. Carrey going up against Bale would have been pretty damn awesome.

BatLobster, i've never been a Jude Law fan and i always thought Guy Pearce would have made for a better Black Mask or even Harvey Dent than Riddler. But Casey is a cool choice. I expected him to be cast in the reboot but now it won't happen since his brother is Batman. Nolan would have used him well. Heck, he had good scenes with Bale in Out Of The Furnace and he has a small role in Interstellar.

Michael C Hall, Michael Emerson and Johnny Depp were just fan rumors, and that never influences the filmmakers. Or at least not Nolan. Hall would have been too close to Dexter IMO, plus he's in shape so having Riddler seem like he can go toe to toe with Bats, is just wrong. Emerson is currently being written by Jonah Nolan on Person Of Interest, so that would have been interesting. He was one of my top picks back in the day. But he's close to 60 and it would be a repeat of his Ben Linus performance on LOST.

Anybody else think Jesse Eisenberg would have made for a better Riddler than Luthor?? Besides me? Lol.

Dicaprio might be a little bit too cool for Nygma though. Too much of a forced idea from the studio too. But damnit it would have been awesome seeing him go up against Bale. Plus all that marketing? My God.

But i think for me it comes back to Carrey. Just something about that idea, it's crazy. Nobody would have seen it coming. It would either worry the fans/studio or intrigue them...probably both...but Nolan has always been unpredictable with his casting. Having Carrey play a completely unrecognizable Nygma compared to his 95' version would have been a wicked move. Risky. But i just think he fits Nygma so well. It was just the wrong era, the wrong director and script back then.

 

[BatmanBeyond]

I liked Jude Law, Guy Pierce and Casey Affleck for Riddler. There are really a lot of actors out there who could probably make a great Riddler, but those are my three picks.

Most definitely. Love the guy. He can do such a great villain.

 

[BatLobster]

I think Jude Law is a pretty consistently good actor. IMO he's been the backbone of the new Sherlock movies while RDJ's been hamming it up. I've never considered myself a Jude Law "fan", but recently it dawned on me that I've liked him in pretty much everything I've ever seen him in so I'd like to see him in a role where he could really 'go for it'. Plus I think he's got a cool look for the part, especially as he's aged.

The Carrey thing would've indeed been crazy, and maybe even a stroke of brilliance, but under no circumstances do I believe Nolan would've ever done it because no matter how different his version was, it would still feel like stunt casting and he assiduously avoided that when he was in charge of the franchise. It's the same reason I never believed any of the persistent rumors that Adam West would cameo. That said, I would love for Nolan to work with Jim some day on something.

And yeah, I could see totally see Eisenberg being The Riddler if they were going for a younger, smug, whip-smart yet highly neurotic version. It would definitely make some sense. I tend to envision The Riddler as more a more suave, charmer with his brilliance, but that's just one take. Eisenberg could've definitely played a Riddler that you loved to hate.

 

[shauner111]

There's no way Nolan would have done it haha. It would probably feel like they're really lazy and can't think of any other actor to do the role, when there's tons of actors who fit Riddler. Probably more than any other comic book villain.

Yeah, good point. Jesse as a Riddler "you love to hate". I think that version would make for a smaller role though. Like a secondary villain. Michael Emerson would be like the older version of this same interpretation that Eisenberg could do so well.

The charming, suave Riddler could be done by Pearce or Law. Dicaprio too.

 

[BatLobster]

I mean, I feel pretty confident that The Riddler will be in a new Batman film within the next 5-6 years, so these names (save Carrey, Eisenberg and yeah probably Casey too) plus tons more could be back on the table theoretically. We'll get our modern Riddler some day.

I just hope they do a really mindblowing new take on him. He's arguably an A-list villain but that's really only in a pop culture sense thanks to the 60s show, and doesn't really hold up when you look to the source material. There isn't that one "classic" Riddler story really. I'd love to see a movie fill that void and create a definitive Riddler story that elevates his status as one of Batman's greatest villains.

I think Scott Snyder was doing some stuff with Nygma in Year 0 and tying him into the origin story, but I'm quite a few issues behind now so I don't know how worthwhile it ended up being.

 

[shauner111]

I thought it was for sure, that we would get Riddler in the first (and possibly only) Affleck solo film. But now im not so sure. He would have to be older, late 30s and up..in order to be different from the Lex Luthor we're getting. I say that for two reasons: I think Snyder's Lex will be classic Jesse Eisenberg. Smart, a bit nerdy, small guy, someone you want to strangle, interacts with Bruce Wayne. Riddler needs to be different. More charm, Affleck's age, more star power.. a Dicaprio type. Also because the Gotham tv series has Riddler. He might be a teenager or in his 20s on that show, so if it's connected, he needs to be older now.

Maybe if the show gets these characters, the solo film will choose completely different villains. So im not so sure anymore that Riddler will be in the next movie. Same for Penguin. Who do you cast? Toby Jones? OK. But if he's a huge part of the tv show, maybe people won't want to see him AGAIN right away.

I'd love to see a cool detective story with Nygma on film. But at the same time i don't buy into the A-lister mentality that people have about this guy. Like you said that's mainly due to Frank Gorshin. And then Jim Carrey was able to bring it back into the limelight by playing a young Gorshin type of Riddler for the new age. But where is he in the comics? I barely see him in a good story. He's in Arkham City for example, but he's really in the shadows.

I want to see the general audience view him differently. Take him seriously for once. But at the same time, ive seen so many detective shows/movies, investigation shows & movies..that im numb to that particular villain. There's always a Riddler-esque character hanging over these things. Even Dexter had a couple of these. David Finchers movies, etc.

It's like i want to see him but i don't at the same time. Im stoked but bored. You know?

I wouldn't fuss if they just gave him a cameo in Arkham Asylum in the next solo, along with Two-Face and Joker locked up in there. Maybe they should give another villain a chance like forumers keep suggesting in the Batman threads. Freeze, Clayface, Black Mask, Hugo Strange. Im sure Affleck's directing skills can persuade a Christoph Waltz to play Hugo or if Joaquin Phoenix won't be in a Snyder movie with Superman maybe he'll play a crimelord in a batman movie.

 

[shauner111]

One more quick reason to not want Riddler in the next movie. Ive seen a crime thriller/drama type movie with a villain taunting Batman, leaving clues for police and Batsy. TDK of course. This would be very similar. Maybe a more sci-fi type story would be more "fresh".

This is why im kinda intrigued by Batman vs Superman/Justice League or Batman Beyond...because we haven't seen batman in this kind of movie yet. Id like for that to continue.

Id love to look back on Batman's legacy on film and see a wave of movies that keep progressing into new territory. Constant change. Fresh stuff that shows how versatile and diverse he is. That's why i prefer a more sci-fi plot or a horror movie for the solos. Im not sure if Riddler fits these ideas unless he cameos like he does in comics like Long Halloween/Dark Victory.

 

[Bathead]

Nope. I actually think he'd have been a better Joker than the Riddler.

 

[BatLobster]

Haha I know what you mean shauner. It's somewhat of a conundrum to reinvent him in a more "real world" way but also not have him just be another Zodiac, or Die Hard villain or Joker in TDK. That's why I said I hope if they ever do it, it's just something mindblowing that nobody has quite thought of yet.

If they ever went the Batman Beyond route, I could actually see Riddler fitting in as a cyberpunk, hacker-type. Or if they wanted to switch things up more, maybe a network of hackers inspired by The Riddler (who Batfleck would've encountered years ago).

I'd probably rather see something like that than a gang of "Jokerz" for instance.

 

[shauner111]

Im right there with you on that. Sounds a lot more original. As for Beyond, i actually think they could use Mr. Freeze and his classic origin and everything. I mean, why not? Why couldn't they take a pretty futuristic kind of villain, do the live-action Heart of Ice thing, mix it with the Batman Beyond concept. Have Bruce be very much involved. Sounds good to me anyway.

I'm up for a surprising take on Riddler, beats the same old plot we're all expecting.

 

[Tequilla]

Probably not.