6.12 Labyrinth - Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

[The Incredible Hulk]

I think it would have been better if the episode wasnt presented in such a dreamlike fashion to the audience. Its hard to be interested when you know its all an illusion from the start.

well yes it was an "illusion" but it also could've became a very permanent one if Clark didnt buck up and fight it. It's not like he could just wake up, he had to go against his nature by killing the Doc to get out. Therein lies the drama. Of course being that this series is a prequel to Superman, everyone knows he gets out of it beforehand, but thats no different than any other episode the past 6 seasons

 

[Red]

Here's a part of one of the most insightful comments that I've seen posted about this ep:

credit: the lovely, fleegull.
we saw both Clark's fondest hopes and biggest fears in relation to all of the women in his life, here: his hope that Lana would always love him, that Chloe would always be loyal, and that his Mom would always be there for him, and his fear that loving Lana will lead to tragedy and threaten his role as protector of the world, his fear that his secret will destroy Chloe and his fear that his Mom will marry Lionel Luthor.

Like I said in my previous post - people can ***** and moan about their shipper issues in this ep, but it really was all about Clark.

The more I think about this, the more it makes sense.

 

[Brainiac 2009]

well yes it was an "illusion" but it also could've became a very permanent one if Clark didnt buck up and fight it. It's not like he could just wake up, he had to go against his nature by killing the Doc to get out. Therein lies the drama. Of course being that this series is a prequel to Superman, everyone knows he gets out of it beforehand, but thats no different than any other episode the past 6 seasons

Disagree. We don't know exactly what kind of Superman universe its a prequel to. One where Lex knows about Clark's abilities and how to counter them?

If so the prospect of Clark in a 33.1 institution powerless could have been a believeable one to the audience if presented in the right way.

Same thing with Splinter, it would have been good if it was presented in a way that the audience would believe that Clark was sane and what he was seeing was real, with the twist ending that he was dellusional the whole time.

I'll show you an example of what I mean;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0t0wfSY887E
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArAMUpTeXGI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JW9bfyf8NkE

 

[Serene]

I'm sorry. I cant figure what you wouldnt have liked, it seemed to be in the same tone as that post you copied over. I seem to be way off base lately, maybe I should think before I speak.

No! Don't be sorry. I'll still read anything you recommend to me. I don't really want to get into ripping apart that person's review, she did have some good points, but overall, I find ALL their reviews have a perspective I can't appreciate.

Was that diplomatic enough? I tried.

*hugs her avid* :heart:

 

[Serene]

Back to back posting just cause I'm feeling ornery.

My son just called from college to RAVE about how much he loved this weeks SV ep. He said his roommate, who only watches occasionally, thought it was the best episode he's seen.

My son says it's definitely one of his all-time favorites. He really loved all the Clark psyche stuff, and seeing MM! Although my son is (alas) no comic fanboy, he really loved MM and wanted to know all about him. I directed him to wikipedia.. like a good mom. LOL

I love that kid. :heart:

 

[Whiteflag]

Back to back posting just cause I'm feeling ornery.

My son just called from college to RAVE about how much he loved this weeks SV ep. He said his roommate, who only watches occasionally, thought it was the best episode he's seen.

My son says it's definitely one of his all-time favorites. He really loved all the Clark psyche stuff, and seeing MM! Although my son is (alas) no comic fanboy, he really loved MM and wanted to know all about him. I directed him to wikipedia.. like a good mom. LOL

I love that kid. :heart:

I'm so glad your son loved it! He has good taste, like his mom. I personally hadn't liked an episode this much in a long time!

I look forward to seeing more of the Clark/MM interaction.

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

Disagree. We don't know exactly what kind of Superman universe its a prequel to. One where Lex knows about Clark's abilities and how to counter them?

regardless of the Superman universe this a prequel to, you know he goes on to become Superman, so pretty much anytime he's in trouble you know in the end he's getting out of it

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

Labyrinth review is now up. First time I've given out a score this high ina LONG while:

http://www.dc-kingdom.com/index.php?categoryid=42&p408_articleid=70

 

[thebigtree95]

Anyone notice the address on that prescription bottle of Martha's, 100 Sayour Rd. Same as Tom Welling's former stunt double and now stunt coordinator Chris Sayour.

Did they explain how J'onn was able to communicate with Clark, was it his telepathic ability or that crystal he had?

 

[Serene]

Anyone notice the address on that prescription bottle of Martha's, 100 Sayour Rd. Same as Tom Welling's former stunt double and now stunt coordinator Chris Sayour.

Good catch!
I also read elsewhere that the song they played during the final Talon scene with Clark and Lana was the same song they played during a Clark/Lana scene in S2's Lineage. I would have never picked that up.

 

[Grand Sophy]

...My son just called from college to RAVE about how much he loved this weeks SV ep. ...

Heartwarming, isn't it, how a good episode can unite generations? My family is forced (by me) to watch Smallville during dinner on Thursdays, since it's on here at 6pm. My ornery son, who in days of yore (before he hit puberty) used to snuggle with me to watch each episode, actually said he enjoyed it, for the first time in a year. My amiable son, an inattentive dreamer who lives in a world of his own and never watches television, became interested enough to ask me what the backstory was (I calmly filled him in without revealing I was leaping in glee on the inside). So there we have it, Smallville as a force for intergenerational understanding.

By the way, Hulk, nice review. Five stars sounds about right.

 

[Mr. Credible]

i finally saw this episode... and liked it, as a "what if" episode.

i didn't hear the barking all these guys seem to be complaining about, though.

 

[Serene]

i finally saw this episode... and liked it, as a "what if" episode.

i didn't hear the barking all these guys seem to be complaining about, though.

There was an ongoing "hum" of sorts, but the way I heard it, and I really tried to pay attention during the second and third viewings, there was a muffled "zoner" scream played at certain dramatic moments in storyline. Offhand, I thought the one where Lana confronts Clark and Chloe in the Talon was most obvious. As Clark is waffling between Chloe and Lana, we hear the Zoner just as Lana says her line and gives a creepy smile. I love the way it added to the atmosphere in follow-up viewings, knowing that the Zoner is pulling some of the strings in dreamscape.

Clark did hear Shelby - when he was about to get his head drilled, then he realized that he was still in the barn and went all Texas Ranger on everyone.
So, yay for Shelby saving the universe.

 

[Kaboom]

we call him T.R. for short.

 

[Whiteflag]

Labyrinth review is now up. First time I've given out a score this high ina LONG while:

http://www.dc-kingdom.com/index.php?categoryid=42&p408_articleid=70

Great review! I enjoyed reading it.

 

[04nbod]

didn't like this episode at all. it had so much promise but it became a boring rehash of JLU only the cartoon did it better. It was just a routine in going around and seeing what each character was like in this world with very tenuous reasons to explain why. I saw no repercussions for later in the season besides martian manhunter who was a highlight of the episode. The humour was alright with arthur curry and victor stone being fat white guys and raya being a fat black nurse. I think my biggest problem was that we stayed in clarks imaginary world too long with no breaks, unlike JLU where it was split up with a fight concerning batman and wonder woman. I found myself skipping major chunks when i watched it because it was just boring and kept on going and going. In lex's short scene in the imaginary world i thought Michael rosenbaum's performance was great however even alternate reality lana was grating and kreuks performance flat.it was disappointing following the outstanding episode in Justice and was a missed opportunity to show clark's history and motivations. its not every episode we get into our heroes head. We already know he's afraid of being experimented on because of his powers- nothing new there. i was disappointed when the doctor turned out to be the phantom he was my favourite character in this episode and seemed genuine so seeing him be killed especially with clark doing it unnecessarily violently and without remorse( which was out of character) was hard to watch

 

[avidreader]

Labyrinth review is now up. First time I've given out a score this high ina LONG while:

http://www.dc-kingdom.com/index.php?categoryid=42&p408_articleid=70

Great review Hulk. I particularly liked the "wait and see" stance that you took regarding the Clark and Lana scene.

I thought it was particularly interesting that they had Clark turn around to look forward, with Lana being the one to keep moving forward but look back.

 

[M.O.Steel]

i reall enjoyed this episode. and like most said, it was a good episode in a long time

 

[The Incredible Hulk]

i was disappointed when the doctor turned out to be the phantom he was my favourite character in this episode and seemed genuine so seeing him be killed especially with clark doing it unnecessarily violently and without remorse( which was out of character) was hard to watch

I addressed that very point in my review this week:

Another cool twist was that the phantom seemed to know Clark’s biggest weakness: caring for people, and used that against him. In order for Clark to end the alternate reality he had to do the one thing that he’s most opposed to: taking a man’s life. He didn’t do that until he heard the dog barking and was absolutely sure things weren’t real.

 

[rowan sjet]

Great review, Hulk. And you can actually remember what happens in the flipping episode unlike some of the other reviewers out there. They've got Martha Kent interrupting the MM/Clark scene and Shelby licking Clark to wake him up. There's one who doesn't even realise MM and "the oreo guy" are the same person.

 

[04nbod]

I addressed that very point in my review this week:

i read it after i posted my opinion. i didn't want my view to be tainted after my first watch. i wouldn't have give it anywhere near 5/5. i thought whither was better. this is around static and subterranean standards for me. Your review was good though and you expressed yourself very well. i would have preferred if we'd seen MM in the barn with him throughout as he figures out how to get to clark, maybe with martha(just not chloe) and ignored the whole - 'i was out for a second' idea
as for your quote, it was the look in his eyes that upset me the most- like he was determined to hurt the phantom. Clark has a lot of patience and mercy and he didn't even look as if he was sorry it had come to destroying the phantom.

 

[AgentPat]

Great review, Hulk. And you can actually remember what happens in the flipping episode unlike some of the other reviewers out there. They've got Martha Kent interrupting the MM/Clark scene and Shelby licking Clark to wake him up. There's one who doesn't even realize MM and "the oreo guy" are the same person.

HAH! I read those "reviews" too. Who ARE these people? Where do they come up with this stuff? Talk about embellishing.

The dialog in the ep was so intelligent and thought provoking. In trying to convince Clark to undergo the procedure, Lana tells Clark that if his reality is correct, she is about to marry his greatest enemy, and that he is responsible for so much tragedy. Is that something he wants to believe? But in Clark's mind, those issues while very sad, are only a small part of Clark's world. In Clark's reality, he's never been "normal." He IS an alien, and he uses his powers to save humanity. Dr. Hudson confirmed this to him.

Clark's eventual choice was a very Matrixy red pill decision. He doesn't want to live in a fantasy world where he has no power to help people like Chloe or even Lex. He'd rather sacrifice his own happiness with Lana because he knows what's "real." For Clark, what's real is a completely different future.

 

[RakuMon]

There was an ongoing "hum" of sorts, but the way I heard it, and I really tried to pay attention during the second and third viewings, there was a muffled "zoner" scream played at certain dramatic moments in storyline. Offhand, I thought the one where Lana confronts Clark and Chloe in the Talon was most obvious. As Clark is waffling between Chloe and Lana, we hear the Zoner just as Lana says her line and gives a creepy smile. I love the way it added to the atmosphere in follow-up viewings, knowing that the Zoner is pulling some of the strings in dreamscape.

Clark did hear Shelby - when he was about to get his head drilled, then he realized that he was still in the barn and went all Texas Ranger on everyone.
So, yay for Shelby saving the universe.

I believe that "muffled 'zoner' scream" was actually Shelby barking the entire time. Clark was hearing it, but didn't realize it was Shelby until he saw Lana's visage fading in the window.

If you notice, the muffled barking is only heard when Clark is at a moment of doubt. It's as if Clark's will is trying to wake him, but he doesn't realize until he's about to go under thr procedure.

 

[LEX]

I loved this episode. It made for a great follow-up after Justice and perhaps even surpassed it in my opinion. I was entranced by it. Sure, the whole plot point about the protagonist being the odd one out inside a madhouse has been done to death before it's becoming way redundant, but they managed to even hold my interest throughout. Tom did a fantastic job, I would hardly say he can't act, so I don't know what the naysayers are smoking. MM was golden, amazingly played by Phil Morris. I look forward to more of him in the later episodes. The Jorel soap was hilarious. I don't think there was anything I didn't like, except that Allison did a terrible job at dying but that's about it. Then to top it all off, there was Shelby the wonder dog. I can't wait for Crimson. They're certainly stepping up their game this time around.

 

[thebigtree95]

I'm really not getting the impression that it was Shelby barking every so often, I think it was the rumble of the phantom. How would Clark not realize that it was the dog if he had clear recollection that he was just in the barn with the dog.

Someone needs to get a Q&A with the writing duo so when can get some of those subtleties straight.

I didn't even notice that constant hum the first time I watched it, but I sure did the second time. That might get annoying on even more viewings.

I'd go 5/5 on this one, no points I wanted to fast forward through on this one.