BvS All Things Batman v Superman: An Open Discussion (TAG SPOILERS) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

[L33CHem]

It's funny with all the bullets on the ground and destruction of Lexcorp, many of us assumed it meant Doomsday escaped from research containment lab. It kind of is a bummer that he wasn't created as a fail safe device against meta-humans. Could have worked in a Waller cameo as well, and would have worked between films in the DC universe. Lex having worked with the government or something for its creation would not have implicated him either. Instead they waited till end of the movie and had a mess of Lex interrelate to Martha, Lois, Superman, and Batman. Doomsday was the backup if he couldn't force these 2 heroes to destroy each other.

Let's say his plan worked by the way. One of them would have died presumably right? That means he does not end up killing both heroes. One way or another he'd still have an enemy left over. Was he just on team Batman then and counting on Superman to lose? From what I remember he did seem to smile or something when finding the [blackout]batarang from stolen kryptonite right?[/blackout]

You don't understand Lex and what plays a part in his motivations. This version of Lex is psychotic, in a similarity to the version of Joker played in Nolan's TDK. Lex was not concerned about sharing Doomsday for the protection of the work. He doesn't play that tired old game of pretending to do something for world interest but really just for his own. This version of Lex is more layered and psychotic, so kind of like the Joker where he just wants to watch it all burn in a way. He hates Superman, so Doomsday was created specifically for that reason. Lex wants to get rid of the God of Krypton. That was his endgame. This version of Lex has plan A through Z. He always has another backup plan. All Doomsday was, is the backup plan if his primary did not work. A fail safe device actually sounds ridiculous! Oh let me create a monster to kill all metahumans No....

 

[Charlatan]

You don't understand Lex and what plays a part in his motivations. This version of Lex is psychotic, in a similarity to the version of Joker played in Nolan's TDK. Lex was not concerned about sharing Doomsday for the protection of the work. He doesn't play that tired old game of pretending to do something for world interest but really just for his own. This version of Lex is more layered and psychotic, so kind of like the Joker where he just wants to watch it all burn in a way. He hates Superman, so Doomsday was created specifically for that reason. Lex wants to get rid of the God of Krypton. That was his endgame. This version of Lex has plan A through Z. He always has another backup plan. All Doomsday was, is the backup plan if his primary did not work. A fail safe device actually sounds ridiculous! Oh let me create a monster to kill all metahumans No....

I hope the extended cut elaborates a bit more on Lex's motivations for creating Doomsday. He went to the ship and said "teach me" then it leaves us right there and when we come back he has this idea for resurrecting Zod as the forbidden abomination. I have a sneaky suspicion that he was being manipulated. Maybe Steppenwolf or Darkseid (whoever that was)told him that if he paved the way for him that he would be given dominion over Earth or something? Or maybe he was just somehow subjugated altogether?

 

[Adhesive Boy]

You don't understand Lex and what plays a part in his motivations. This version of Lex is psychotic, in a similarity to the version of Joker played in Nolan's TDK. Lex was not concerned about sharing Doomsday for the protection of the work. He doesn't play that tired old game of pretending to do something for world interest but really just for his own. This version of Lex is more layered and psychotic, so kind of like the Joker where he just wants to watch it all burn in a way. He hates Superman, so Doomsday was created specifically for that reason. Lex wants to get rid of the God of Krypton. That was his endgame. This version of Lex has plan A through Z. He always has another backup plan. All Doomsday was, is the backup plan if his primary did not work. A fail safe device actually sounds ridiculous! Oh let me create a monster to kill all metahumans No....

Sounds more like you're saying that he has plan A through B, as he had no real plan beyond Doomsday. That's barely a plan as well as he clearly wasn't smart enough to see what he was doing and he ended up needing Superman's help.

 

[The Endless]

To be fair, the Bat-franchise has a history of editing problems: look at the armored car chase scene in TDK. It is almost incomprehensible.

I agree. It was a poorly edited chase sequence. It was tense and had great moments though.

 

[Krandor]

they were well after Vietnam was over. Carter was president. No wars during his term (only president in modern age) Sure there was a cold war with Russia but when Carter was in office it wasn't ramping up like it did after Reagan was elected. The big news of the day then was OPEC,the "energy crisis" and inflation.

There may have beenn no wars durign Carter, but there was the whole iranian hostage crisis and the disasterous rescue attempt. Nightline even had a "american held hostage day xxx" during the whole thing.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

I hope the extended cut elaborates a bit more on Lex's motivations for creating Doomsday. He went to the ship and said "teach me" then it leaves us right there and when we come back he has this idea for resurrecting Zod as the forbidden abomination. I have a sneaky suspicion that he was being manipulated. Maybe Steppenwolf or Darkseid (whoever that was)told him that if he paved the way for him that he would be given dominion over Earth or something? Or maybe he was just somehow subjugated altogether?

Lex was plotting for a way to make them fight long before he got the Kryptonian knowledge.

Sorry, but my crazy hope was they'd take Zuckerberg business world and work it into the corporate version of Lex. I thought Eisenberg would push his range a bit, and I actually think he did the opposite. I don't want a Lex that makes some of you guys think about the ticks or psychotic nuances of Ledger as Joker comparatively. If you are thinking about that as a reason that this Lex is actually good... I think the character was far removed and this Lex becomes LINO.

 

[Clark-Kent]

Nah, this version of Lex was more like Riddler from BF, with just a slight touch with his vocal "mmmmm's" grabbing a bit of Ledger's Joker (who instead made the mouth noise like he was tasting something).

 

[Deserana]

Whilst I defend the movie it's so difficult to defend Snyder. He just seems so blissfully ignorant when it comes to his faults. People moaned that Superman killed Zod? I'm gonna make Supermans first act seem ridiculously brutal. People love Batman? I'm gonna make him kill. People complained about Superman flying through populated buildings? First thing I'm gonna do is make Doomsday throw Superman into a populated building.

He reminds me so much of basically the American Steven Moffat, the show runner of Doctor Who and Sherlock. He just does things purely for their cool factor than any logical sense.

Also he'll do interviews before release making his thing sound awesome then you'll watch it and think "what the f- were you talking about?". Like for example Moffat said about the ending of Sherlock S2 that he knew how Sherlock survived and that there was a big clue in the last episode that revealed it. Anyone who saw the beginning of Season 3 knew that was all bollocks! I remember Snyder talking about Doomsday and how he has his own internal mythology and that the film needs to explore it. What? Where the heck was all that?

 

[Deserana]

Nah, this version of Lex was more like Riddler from BF, with just a slight touch with his vocal "mmmmm's" grabbing a bit of Ledger's Joker (who instead made the mouth noise like he was tasting something).

He was nothing like Riddler. The comparison is so dumb.

 

[Clark-Kent]

He was nothing like Riddler. The comparison in so dumb.

In what now? Anyways yes if I were to compare if he is closer to Rosenbaum Lex or TAS Lex versus Riddler from BF, I'd say it goes closer towards the Riddler.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

He did remind me of Riddler a bit when stumbling his words at the speech during his party.

 

[Wylie Times]

He did remind me of Riddler a bit when stumbling his words at the speech during his party.

When people say he reminds them of the riddler it's because of how the characters look and the way they talk and move.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

All I know is whether you saw Riddler, Joker, or whoever... I was not seeing the confident business man version, and that's what I was hoping for.

 

[Deserana]

In what now? Anyways yes if I were to compare if he is closer to Rosenbaum Lex or TAS Lex versus Riddler from BF, I'd say it goes closer towards the Riddler.

Don't compare to any? Why do you feel you need to? He's not like any Lex that came before and neither is he like Riddler. Whether or not people like the motivation (or as some here seem to do, purposely ignore the motivation just so they can continue hating) there is one there.

His manic persona is the result of early abuse from his dad. It's there, in the film and undeniable. Whether it's fleshed out is another matter. Riddler on the other hand just got brushed off by Bruce Wayne one time. There is also the scene between him and the Senator in his office in which he does take a slightly more menacing turn. The scene on top of the helipad is also far better than anything the Riddler did. There are some moments where he comes off as a genuinely evil piece of ****.

 

[L33CHem]

Many of the general audience liked this version of Lex. Even those that felt the movie was a bit slow, enjoyed this version. I think a lot of Superman hardcore fans are holding on to the previous incarnations of Lex and not being open to the new take on it from Snyder.

 

[Deserana]

Many of the general audience liked this version of Lex. Even those that felt the movie was a bit slow, enjoyed this version. I think a lot of Superman hardcore fans are holding on to the previous incarnations of Lex and not being open to the new take on it from Snyder.

The main issue is that he never has a single straight scene. Like I said earlier there is moments where he makes a gesture of his face turns or he says something a bit more stern but there is no clear distinction between personas. I would have loved that final prison scene if it was played completely straight.

I still enjoyed it, my dad thought he was the best thing in it as did my friend.

 

[BatmanVSuperman]

I don't think anyone is arguing that this Lex had the same backstory or motivations as the Riddler. I think the issue is the appearance, mannerism, voice, ... and this version of Lex not being the confident businessman. He's quirky in their attempt to make him come off psychotic. We are talking about a Lex that many fans of Superman would like to see be able to manipulate behind the scenes. Not being on a rooftop talking about that special lady and Martha, Martha, Martha... *cringe* Not being the guy that gets put in jail because he failed to have the people under him take the fall. I'd just prefer him pulling the strings, not wrapping a rope around his own neck.

 

[The Guard]

I can't get on board with

Spoiler

Superman's sacrifice

and the public's reaction to it being unearned. Him being their hero is set up and explored. The film contains a sizeable conversation about the nature of his involvement in their world, the conflicts and advantages therein, including a subplot with one of the people his actions affected, and the end of the film shows a very clear decision on the part of the world to accept him as a hero and one of their own.

 

[Clark-Kent]

Martha, Martha, Martha reminds me of...

[YT]y3RclLJraqw[/YT]

 

[green]

Do people still think the Reeve era movies debuted during a campy, lighthearted, happy time? It was the total opposite. They were charming, hopeful movies in a dark, dreadful decade of geopolitical war.

LOL. That's why the number 1 movie that year was Grease and the number 3 was Animal House. Yeah, people weren't going to the movies for light hearted campy times.

 

[NotSoLongAgo]

I can't get on board with

Spoiler

Superman's sacrifice

and the public's reaction to it being unearned. Him being their hero is set up and explored. The film contains a sizeable conversation about the nature of his involvement in their world, the conflicts and advantages therein, including a subplot with one of the people his actions affected, and the end of the film shows a very clear decision on the part of the world to accept him as a hero and one of their own.

The sacrifice feels shoe-horned and rushed. There's no weight to it whatsoever because the films do a bad job of making you care for Supes.

LOL. That's why the number 1 movie that year was Grease and the number 3 was Animal House. Yeah, people weren't going to the movies for light hearted campy times.

Um.. you don't think people would be attracted to light-hearted fare during dark times? It's called an escape

 

[Clark-Kent]

Most people don't even hate the movie. They just think it's Ok but VERY flawed. Bur for whatever reason pointing out those flaws and saying how much they bothered you is interpreted as "hating on" the movie.

People do criticize other films for flaws in the script, it's just that this one had so many that's really hard to ignore them or give them a pass for most people.

If anything people just feel extremely disappointed with the movie.

That's where I'm at. It was disappointing and frustrating even, but hate? No. The possibilities that would have made it so much better is a shame though.

 

[Poni_Boy]

LOL. That's why the number 1 movie that year was Grease and the number 3 was Animal House. Yeah, people weren't going to the movies for light hearted campy times.

That's the point. The times weren't light, the movies offered that hopeful escapism.

 

[green]

Um.. you don't think people would be attracted to light-hearted fare during dark times? It's called an escape

Ummm that's exactly what I was getting at.

 

[NotSoLongAgo]

Ummm that's exactly what I was getting at.

So then you agree with him?