All Things DCEU News, Discussion, and Speculation - Part 1

[UltimatePyro9]

Superman is the most iconic superhero of all time. It's a shame DC can't seem to get him right outside of a couple of films in the 70s and 80s.

If done right, Superman would rival Batman in terms of popularity and I'd wager he would surpass Bats. Give me a Superman trilogy with villains like Brainiac, Metallo, and Mongul. Tell me that wouldn't clean up at the box office. If the DCEU would stop being so Batfamily focused for five seconds, they could get Supes off the ground.

Yeah, it feels like the only thing that the DCEU/WB are interested in is Batman. I mean Gotham City Sirens, Deadshot, Nightwing? Really? Gonna milk the Bat-Cow for all its worth, huh? Sure they announced other movies coming up (Flash, Shazam, Green Lantern) but aside from Aquaman, who knows when those movies will start production. You could say the same for the Batman movies but you get the picture.

Superman has interesting secondary characters that I'd argue are just as memorable as the Batfamily. Heck, I'd be stoked if a Supergirl movie was announced. Mainly to wipe the taste of the 1984 movie out of my mouth. Just give them character and life and it should be fine.

 

[writer0327]

Yeah, it feels like the only thing that the DCEU/WB are interested in is Batman. I mean Gotham City Sirens, Deadshot, Nightwing? Really? Gonna milk the Bat-Cow for all its worth, huh? Sure they announced other movies coming up (Flash, Shazam, Green Lantern) but aside from Aquaman, who knows when those movies will start production. You could say the same for the Batman movies but you get the picture.

Superman has interesting secondary characters that I'd argue are just as memorable as the Batfamily. Heck, I'd be stoked if a Supergirl movie was announced. Mainly to wipe the taste of the 1984 movie out of my mouth. Just give them character and life and it should be fine.

I mean, it's just their "go-to" move, like Kareen Abdul-Jabbar's skyhook. When in doubt, bring out a Batman film. They had the 4 Batman films from 89-97, then Nolan's TDK Trilogy, and then instead of getting a MoS sequel, we get BvS, where Superman's character is completely underwritten and is almost a supporting character and Batman takes center stage.

Come on DC, can we get MoS sequel, some news, any news? MoS is still the best DCEU film so far, why won't they capitalize on that? There's no need to be coy, we know he's coming back in JL.

 

[batfreakforever]

I can't complain. Its all going my way.

 

[The Batman]

Superman is the poster child of Action Comics. They changed to DC for a reason.

Do you even know what you're talking about?

The company was never called Action Comics. First, it was two separate companies called National Allied Publications and Detective Comics Inc. Then, they merged and DC took its title from some variation of the "National" moniker or another.

They don't officially start calling it DC Comics until the 70's, and despite what you're trying to imply, they didn't call it DC because of Batman.

For one thing, Detective Comics was the first comic book National published, and that was before Superman or Batman show up.

Second, when National officially became DC, Superman was still the top dog.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

How convenient

Almost too convenient.

 

[writer0327]

I can't complain. Its all going my way.

You should complain. It's about the big picture. Batman has been well taken care of, almost to the point of being overdone. DC needs to expand and explore and deepen their universe, otherwise why even have a DCEU?

 

[2kt09]

Do you even know what you're talking about?

I read the wiki.
Apologies if I implied Action Comics was a company.

Apparently, it went by "Superman-DC" in the 40s.
Though, like writer suggested regarding "adapting with times", modern society simply outgrew Superman.

 

[writer0327]

I read the wiki.
Apologies if I implied Action Comics was a company.

Apparently, it went by "Superman-DC" in the 40s.
Though, like writer suggested regarding "adapting with times", modern society simply outgrew Superman.

The character of Superman has remained popular throughout the years, but Batman spoke to the nature of the era in which he was born. Batman was the "World's Greatest Detective" and hard boiled detective stories were huge during the 30s and 40s. That's what I meant.

Superman has been more popular on television with the Adventures of Lois and Clark and Smallville. Superman:TAS was an incredible cartoon in the 90s. No reason why they can't have made a quality Superman film since 1980, but that is the case.

 

[Milk Tray Guy]

If the DCEU would stop being so Batfamily focused for five seconds, they could get Supes off the ground.

I get what you're saying and I agree with you, but I'm sure that WB/DC would say that's what they tried to do with Man of Steel and it didn't quite 'fly'.

 

[2kt09]

The character of Superman has remained popular throughout the years, but Batman spoke to the nature of the era in which he was born. Batman was the "World's Greatest Detective" and hard boiled detective stories were huge during the 30s and 40s. That's what I meant.

And what I mean is that readers seem to have gravitated to men who are gods/strive to be gods and not the other way around.
Goes back to that whole "Superman is boring" thread. On top of the whole gritty trend of the 90s and 2000s.

Superman has been more popular on television with the Adventures of Lois and Clark and Smallville. Superman:TAS was an incredible cartoon in the 90s. No reason why they can't have made a quality Superman film since 1980, but that is the case.

I'm assuming because Batman climbed in popularity. He's gotten more shows courtesy of the DCAU and all the other reboots since, more video games, more movies (live-action and animated). Heck, Adam West Batman is still of some value.

 

[Osiris-Rex]

Detective stories were very popular in those days. Sam Spade, Philip Marlowe, Ellery Queen. Makes sense to adapt with those times.

True. Slam Bradley was the original detective of Detective Comics. It was 27 issues in before Batman showed up usurped him. And the only reason Batman was created was because Superman was so popular.

The character of Superman has remained popular throughout the years, but Batman spoke to the nature of the era in which he was born. Batman was the "World's Greatest Detective" and hard boiled detective stories were huge during the 30s and 40s. That's what I meant.

Superman has been more popular on television with the Adventures of Lois and Clark and Smallville. Superman:TAS was an incredible cartoon in the 90s. No reason why they can't have made a quality Superman film since 1980, but that is the case.

Don't forget the Adventures of Superman in the 1950s, which pretty much started the concept of superheroes on TV. It could well be that like superhero comic books might not even exist without Superman,
superhero TV shows might not exist without Superman paving the way.

Oh, and I hear Superman's cousin now has a TV show that is the second highest rated show on the network that broadcasts the show. And Superman even paid his cousin a visit on TV a while back.

 

[STARMAN]

Superman can be successful on the big screen again. Audiences have been rejecting the quality not the character.

 

[The Guard]

Superman can be successful on the big screen again. Audiences have been rejecting the quality not the character.

It takes a quality film like SUICIDE SQUAD or Transformers to bring in the bucks. I see no sign that audiences are rejecting Superman as a character. He's simply not THE superhero anymore, in part due to changing cultural values about heroes and in part because of audience exposure to a number of other superheroes in this comic book boom.

 

[STARMAN]

There are plenty of other Superhero films. All the more reason Superman can't rely on mediocre to bad films.

 

[The Joker]

It takes a quality film like SUICIDE SQUAD or Transformers to bring in the bucks.

Only on SHH would you see someone call movies like that quality.

 

[TeeKay]

It takes a quality film like SUICIDE SQUAD or Transformers to bring in the bucks. I see no sign that audiences are rejecting Superman as a character. He's simply not THE superhero anymore, in part due to changing cultural values about heroes and in part because of audience exposure to a number of other superheroes in this comic book boom.

Sig worthy.

 

[Erzengel]

Meanwhile, Captain America and his antiquated morals, can easily give Iron Man a run at #1 in the MCU in terms of popularity.

 

[misslane38]

Only on SHH would you see someone call movies like that quality.

Sig worthy.

Maybe I'm mistaken, and if so I apologize for the misguided correction, but I believe The Guard was being sarcastic. It was said that Superman wasn't successful on the big screen because audiences were responding to the poor quality of the films. By pointing out that films like Suicide Squad and Transformers can be successful (financially) suggests that success and quality don't always go hand in hand.

 

[2kt09]

Meanwhile, Captain America and his antiquated morals, can easily give Iron Man a run at #1 in the MCU in terms of popularity.

No. It's Iron Man that went from highest box office success relative to most phase 1 solos to it's a sure fire bet the next one is making a billion+.

I'm certain there are more people who line up to watch Cap's mma on full display OR ship Cap with Bucky.

 

[writer0327]

Meanwhile, Captain America and his antiquated morals, can easily give Iron Man a run at #1 in the MCU in terms of popularity.

Exactly. Many people thought Cap would be cheesy and goofy and silly, but Cap is just as popular as any character in the MCU, if not the most popular. Why? Because his character is drawn out so well. He has Superman's value system but it's not about the values, it's about the character and how well he is written. Just like we said in the other thread, a exciting Superman film can done if the writer and director knows how.

And as much as people claim they want everything to be "dark" or "cool" or "edgy", that old fashioned charm of Captain America (hell just listen to his theme song by Alan Silvestri) harkens back to something sorely missed in this day and age and people love that.

 

[STARMAN]

Maybe I'm mistaken, and if so I apologize for the misguided correction, but I believe The Guard was being sarcastic. It was said that Superman wasn't successful on the big screen because audiences were responding to the poor quality of the films. By pointing out that films like Suicide Squad and Transformers can be successful (financially) suggests that success and quality don't always go hand in hand.

To be fair to The Guard, I believe he was sarcastically trying to make the point you made.

 

[misslane38]

Exactly. Many people thought Cap would be cheesy and goofy and silly, but Cap is just as popular as any character in the MCU, if not the most popular. Why? Because his character is drawn out so well. He has Superman's value system but it's not about the values, it's about the character and how well he is written. Just like we said in the other thread, a exciting Superman film can done if the writer and director knows how.

And as much as people claim they want everything to be "dark" or "cool" or "edgy", that old fashioned charm of Captain America (hell just listen to his theme song by Alan Silvestri) harkens back to something sorely missed in this day and age and people love that.

Meanwhile, Captain America and his antiquated morals, can easily give Iron Man a run at #1 in the MCU in terms of popularity.

I'm not going to debate the financial success of the MCU characters, but I don't know if Captain America and Superman are analogous. Captain America doesn't have prior films and nostalgia to compete with nor is he as overpowered as Superman is to inspire questions or complaints about failing to achieve perfection (omniscience, omnipotence, etc.). Steve is also a soldier, so his killing and his early promotion of war and enlistment of soldiers to engage in killing within the context of war seems to have provided him more latitude. His wholesomeness comes more from his reminders to people to watch their language rather than iron clad morals or moral dilemmas. Captain America also isn't presented as the scary "other."

 

[Erzengel]

No. It's Iron Man that went from highest box office success relative to most phase 1 solos to it's a sure fire bet the next one is making a billion+.

I'm certain there are more people who line up to watch Cap's mma on full display OR ship Cap with Bucky.

Yeah.

IGN's Marvel Cinematic Universe Character Face-Off gave you the opportunity to cast your votes and determine once and for all who are the greatest characters in the MCU. After more than one million votes, the results are in!

http://www.ign.com/articles/2016/05/06/the-marvel-cinematic-universes-most-popular-characters

 

[writer0327]

I'm not going to debate the financial success of the MCU characters, but I don't know if Captain America and Superman are analogous. Captain America doesn't have prior films and nostalgia to compete with nor is he as overpowered as Superman is to inspire questions or complaints about failing to achieve perfection (omniscience, omnipotence, etc.). Steve is also a soldier, so his killing and his early promotion of war and enlistment of soldiers to engage in killing within the context of war seems to have provided him more latitude. His wholesomeness comes more from his reminders to people to watch their language rather than iron clad morals or moral dilemmas. Captain America also isn't presented as the scary "other."

I think as far as traditional "American" ideals, they are quite analogous. Superman is an American icon, and the idea of "Captain America", as well as what the character values, are synonymous with American traditions. But your last sentence really says it all.... It's not about all that other stuff, it's about how Cap has been presented on film.

He's been present as a champion and a hero. It's the version that the director chose for his character and its appropriate for Captain America. This current version of Superman feels "inappropriate" for the character in many ways. The character hasn't been fully realized, isn't really "Superman" yet, at least according to the director. I feel waiting 3 films (at least) to finally get a fully realized "Superman" was a big mistake and the reason why Cavill's Superman isn't more beloved. They decided to direct the focus of Superman's character on his trials and growing pains of becoming a hero rather than his his traditional values, or at least not punctuate his values firmly on film as they've been in the past.

Maybe they were afraid of nostalgic feelings of Reeve's Superman and afraid that since no one will be able to duplicate what Reeve did, they should go in the complete opposite direction. I don't necessarily have a problem with that, but eventually we need to get to a Superman we can relate to.

 

[2kt09]

Yeah.

Glad to be in agreement.

That top comment is hilarious.