All Things Wonder Woman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 23

[MydnightPhoenix]

Whoa whoa whoa! Patty dethroned 50 Shades? There is hope for humanity and woman kind!
As for future directors I hope WB doesn't just stick with the same one but expands as well. Patty should do WW2 and Zack should do that separate project he wanted to make. I honestly would rather see Joss do JL2 than Batgirl because I can't stand Batgirl. And all the talk on these boards has made me giddy about MoS2 being directed by George Miller or Matt Reeves.

 

[Tg11]

Or George Miller could always direct WW2

 

[Micromind]

Not gonna lie, as much as I want Jenkins for WONDER WOMAN 2 and I'm sure Gadot wants that as well, to truly move forward and be progressive in this process, if I'm Jenkins, I ask for JUSTICE LEAGUE 2.

Think about what she delivered for the studio this weekend. A new franchise. Maybe a new superstar actress. A film that's being considered the savior of the DCEU (I don't think so, but...), a historic film that broke serious barriers...

...why should she settle for just the sequel?

I want nothing more for Snyder to come back, fully of mind, body, and spirit, and direct JUSTICE LEAGUE 2 but we all assumed after what happened with BATMAN v SUPERMAN that once Snyder was done with JUSTICE LEAGUE, he was gone anyway. Johns was taking the universe in a new direction and it seems WONDER WOMAN is that direction.

Let Patty handle WW 2, making a movie that has universal appeal with a woman protagonist is not an easy job.

Why shouldn't Jenkins get JUSTICE LEAGUE 2?

Eh, character driven movies is what she excels at, not ensemble movies with high action quotient where there is a minimal room for character development.

Not saying that characters cannot be developed in ensemble movies but it is lot easier to do that in solo movies as opposed to team-up movies.

Which is why WB allowed Zack Snyder to direct JL (experience in Watchmen) and now they have hired Joss Whedon for that.

 

[Snow Queen]

Not gonna lie, as much as I want Jenkins for WONDER WOMAN 2 and I'm sure Gadot wants that as well, to truly move forward and be progressive in this process, if I'm Jenkins, I ask for JUSTICE LEAGUE 2.

Think about what she delivered for the studio this weekend. A new franchise. Maybe a new superstar actress. A film that's being considered the savior of the DCEU (I don't think so, but...), a historic film that broke serious barriers...

...why should she settle for just the sequel?

I want nothing more for Snyder to come back, fully of mind, body, and spirit, and direct JUSTICE LEAGUE 2 but we all assumed after what happened with BATMAN v SUPERMAN that once Snyder was done with JUSTICE LEAGUE, he was gone anyway. Johns was taking the universe in a new direction and it seems WONDER WOMAN is that direction.

Why shouldn't Jenkins get JUSTICE LEAGUE 2?

Why is telling a full story about one character settling, while Justice League is an endgame?

 

[Raiden]

I really hope WW's incredible success will led to more female superhero movies greenlighted by Kevin Feige. The fact that there's only one female superhero movie from MCU and it's coming out in 2019 is a travesty. Yes, they don't have that many well-known female characters like DC does, but they have been able to make B or C list (or like GOTG a D list property) into A listers; I think Marvel can do it if they try.

 

[Micromind]

Making a successful movie that has a universal appeal with a female lead is not an easy job, let Patty direct WW 2.

 

[terry78]

And as soon as she gets JL2 and for some reason it falls short, there goes her credibility with fanboys.

 

[Thome216]

That's because they wanted the Batman V Superman face-off kind of movie, and adding Wonder Woman in a prominent role would have ruined it. WW would've beaten both men up until they're reasonable and not acting like a child in the movie.

Although I'm okay with the infamous 'Martha Scene,' I would much rather have seen this...^^

I can picture a scene with her holding them both by the ear and they're bent almost double trying to ease the pain.t:

 

[Boom]

I think we can rule George Miller out of any big budget films not named "Mad Max." He seems pretty set on those two sequels, and it sounds like he wants to do smaller films in between.

 

[-Arya-]

What's JJ Abrams up to these days?

 

[Raiden]

And as soon as she gets JL2 and for some reason it falls short, there goes her credibility with fanboys.

Credibility can turn like a dime. Jon Faverau was sky high when Iron Man came out, but the lackluster reception to IM2 really hurt his resume imo. However, the success of Jungle Book has renewed his credibility and he's now tapped to direct The Lion King live action movie. Patty Jenkins can do no wrong right now, but she must choose her projects carefully.

 

[omermer]

I've been away from this thread for two days and just read the discussion regarding her outfit. While I think it makes perfect sense giving her Greek origins even if you disregard it I completely agree with Petty Jenkins.
I want my Wonder Woman to be bad-ass, smart, fierce but look incredibly hot and feminine doing it. She needs pants to be taken seriously? To look capable? That's just ridiculous to me.
I don't wear makeup, or put on heels and nice clothes to appease men, I do it for myself. And I think it's the same here.
Gal is gorgeous and no matter what she wears and men and women will be attracted to her.
The heels and skirt flaunts her femininity and shows what a true bad-ass she is far better than any pair of pants will be able to.

 

[Gu3ree]

Saw the movie today finally and loved it. First great DC film in the DCEU in my opinion. Not a perfect film, but a great film. Very pleased.

Man of Steel was a good start, and I liked it, but at the same time it was just as divisive as Batman v Superman. I was disappointed in BvS whereas I did like MOS, but was slightly disappointed and wished it could have been better, because honestly, Superman deserves better. Suicide Squad or Wonder Woman were DC's only chances of bringing hope and optimism in the films and I think Wonder Woman did that. Suicide Squad was messy.

Could Batman v Superman have been any more miserable and realistic than it needed to be? And Wonder Woman just wasn't. That was relieving.

Wonder Woman had charm...oh and she smiled. There was chemistry. There was character development. Things I wanted to see with Superman. Snyder seems too keen on realism at the expense of theater. Why can't Superman make a joke, smile, and why can't Lois have a little more personality and be funny like we've known her to be? Everyone is too straight in the film, there's hardly any light to the movies...we can't there be Jimmy Olsen?

It isn't humor on the whole that Snyder's two DC films have been lacking, but I guess the spirit of Superman. Wonder Woman smiles in this film, she's heroic, and she's honored among people. Why can't they do the same with Superman?

I have faith that the DCEU films will get better. Hopefully Justice League will too. I'm not too worried about Aquaman and I am optimistic about the film, but what I'm more worried about in the DCEU is whether Justice League will be good. Seriously, if Justice League bombs...then the DCEU will be done, and there won't be any more DCEU films for at least 20 years, or never...and Wonder Woman will have been the only good DC film that succeeded in the franchise only to have ended so shortly after 6 films....versus Marvel's successful 20+ films.

But it's looking more and more likely that Justice League will be good, and I hope it does.

This film managed to be a standalone without relying on cameos or references and tying everything to the other DC films. One of the things I was worried about before seeing the film was it being a flashback film...and also being just like the first Captain America film.

This film managed to tell its own story without focusing on the events of BvS. Still, I could have gone without the email from Bruce Wayne. The film may have had some similarities to The First Avenger but in comparison, I thought Wonder Woman was better. In regards to Wonder Woman being a flashback film, though it wasn't the film's intention, I was also worried the film would be kind of like the first Captain America movie, where it felt more like just a filler film to set up the Avengers, but in this case, the Justice League. But I didn't feel that was the case with Wonder Woman.

The first Cap film I felt rushed toward the ending a little, and the film wasn't that long. Once they flash-forwarded to the present day in 2011, I felt like the film could have taken itself maybe a little more seriously. Once Rogers had donned the standard Cap suit, there wasn't that much time to go with before the film was going to end. After his Cap suit debut in the montage, they get to the train sequence, then the final showdown with Red Skull, and then it was over.

Wonder Woman I felt almost suffered the same trend. Although the film was over 2 hours long, I felt the climax emerged rather quickly and was slightly rushed. Some of the solo hero Marvel films except Iron Man didn't do to well at least in their first run. Thor, Ant-Man, Cap (was kind of meh). Ant-Man tries to do what it can with a little bit of humor, set-up the character, go through his training, and it reaches the climax considerably early, and the whole film felt incredibly short.

Back to WW though. Great acting. Despite the cliches which I think many of us saw coming, Wondie's aunt dying in her arms...but at least the acting wasn't bad. Great directing...maybe too much slow-mo, but they were very well done. Great characters. Lovely moments. Plenty of humor. I do have to watch this movie again. 4 out of 5.

 

[jfurioso]

You realize that before BvS, Wonder Woman was actually pretty much unknown in many parts of the world, right? This might seem like shock to you, but culture in other parts of the world differs significatly from USA.

You realize that the Lynda Carter tv show was shown all across the world, including this little third-world Spanish-speaking country called Honduras where I happen to live and where EVERYONE and their 3-legged-dog knows who is Wonder Woman? Do not try to pass your particular local ignorance as universal.

 

[misslane38]

Although I'm okay with the infamous 'Martha Scene,' I would much rather have seen this...^^

I can picture a scene with her holding them both by the ear and they're bent almost double trying to ease the pain.t:

The point with "Save Martha" is that it's rooted in love and in the idea that that which unites us being greater than that which divides us. To have violence, especially from the loving and compassionate Diana, to end things would send the wrong message and likely wouldn't have made a difference to Bruce who needed to be reminded of who he was to stop becoming like the man who killed his parents. Diana has a moment [BLACKOUT]like Bruce in her own movie when loss makes her teeter on the edge but the memory and love of Steve restores her[/BLACKOUT]. It works really well in both cases, and I wouldn't wish to change either.

 

[Bagide]

Spoiler

t:

Haha

 

[Bagide]

What's JJ Abrams up to these days?

Adjusting lens flares

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

Oh gawd Thome look what you did

And as soon as she gets JL2 and for some reason it falls short, there goes her credibility with fanboys.

That's for sure

 

[Micromind]

You realize that the Lynda Carter tv show was shown all across the world, including this little third-world Spanish-speaking country called Honduras where I happen to live and where EVERYONE and their 3-legged-dog knows who is Wonder Woman? Do not try to pass your particular local ignorance as universal.

Yeah and Wonder Woman was in Bruce Timm's Justice League and Justice League Unlimited series which was widely popular across the world, I mean how can anyone see JL series and not see WW ?

 

[Zero_Effect]

You realize that the Lynda Carter tv show was shown all across the world, including this little third-world Spanish-speaking country called Honduras where I happen to live and where EVERYONE and their 3-legged-dog knows who is Wonder Woman? Do not try to pass your particular local ignorance as universal.

You should do the same. Just because she was popular in Honduras doesnt mean the 70s show was popular everywhere else.

 

[jfurioso]

Yeah and Wonder Woman was in Bruce Timm's Justice League and Justice League Unlimited series which was widely popular across the world, I mean how can anyone see JL series and not see WW ?

I suppose there must surely be some forsaken backwater places where they do not who is WW. But to be worse off than my country in anything is taking forsaken and backwater to truly exponential levels.

 

[jfurioso]

You should do the same. Just because she was popular in Honduras doesnt mean the 70s show was popular everywhere else.

The poster was making it sound like a very localized property. However, Honduras is a damn backwater country that at the time was under a military dictatorship. Everyone I know in Spain and the rest of LatinAmerica knew who was WW, whether from the tv show, the Superfriends, the JL Timm show, etc. I have seen WW memorabilia magazines from Japan.

Sure, there must be lots of places where culture was even less attuned to US-TV shows, but this is a country where you can still see GRINGO GO being written in walls and a good part of the population refers to US-Nationals with mostly four letter words. (The other parts are either casual about it or trying to get thru the US border). So if the TV show and other incarnations are still known here that is a big signifier of universality.

 

[idiot09]

And as soon as she gets JL2 and for some reason it falls short, there goes her credibility with fanboys.

Tbf that happens in the fanboy world for all directors male or female. Whedon got a lot of flak for AOU for example.

 

[Flemm]

I've been away from this thread for two days and just read the discussion regarding her outfit. While I think it makes perfect sense giving her Greek origins even if you disregard it I completely agree with Petty Jenkins.
I want my Wonder Woman to be bad-ass, smart, fierce but look incredibly hot and feminine doing it. She needs pants to be taken seriously? To look capable? That's just ridiculous to me.
I don't wear makeup, or put on heels and nice clothes to appease men, I do it for myself. And I think it's the same here.
Gal is gorgeous and no matter what she wears and men and women will be attracted to her.
The heels and skirt flaunts her femininity and shows what a true bad-ass she is far better than any pair of pants will be able to.

I've seen a lot of conflicting ideas over the years regarding this topic. Which is understandable, certainly, given the complexity of the issues involved.

It seems to me that there are at least two important points that create tension with one another.

The first is the modern tendency to objectify female characters, especially in genre flims and tv shows, with tight and/or revealing outfits for no other reason than to pander to young men and adolescent boys in the audience.

The second is the older mysogynistic tendency of concealing and suppressing female sexuality, partly by literally covering it up with clothes, veils and so on.

With those two things in mind, I think it's easy to see why opinions on the topic might be conflicted.

Anyway, I think this movie made the right choice. WW's outfit felt like a natural extension of the Amazonian warrior culture, and certainly not something that was being forced on her by an oppressive male gaze.

 

[JtheDreamer]

Still haven't seen it yet. Can't get anyone to go with me - not even my sister believe it or not.

Dying to review it and confirm if it's actually a solid movie or if it just appears that way because of how poor the other DCEU entries were. Guess I'll just have to do an afternoon showing by myself.