All Things Wonder Woman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 24

[Primal Slayer]

I was surprised that they used the Lasso so much in action sequences as they did. It made me very happy.

My mind instantly jumped to that as I was watching lol. WW is inspired by so many sequences of movies/media it truly helped make the film more powerful.

 

[Flemm]

I don't particularly give a **** if it's insulting to Jenkins, and yes, folks are deluding themselves.

So everyone else is biased, while you are free from bias? Got it

It's a Jenkins film. All of these films are collaborative efforts, with a lot of moving parts, but it's the director's vision that sets the overall tone and creates a cohesive whole, as was clearly the case here.

 

[Dark Raven]

I was surprised that they used the Lasso so much in action sequences as they did. It made me very happy.



My mind instantly jumped to that as I was watching lol. WW is inspired by so many sequences of movies/media it truly helped make the film more powerful.

I think you could probably piece the general outline of this movie together using scenes from other movies. You'd have the dive from Pocahontas immediately followed by the rescue by the Little Mermaid. There would also be the Superman alley fight or the scene from Casablanca before Ingrid Bergman boards the plane. And I'm sure there are many others.

There's also this which shows how Moana's song could completely fit with Diana's story:

http://uproxx.com/hitfix/wonder-woman-moana-mash-up/

 

[Joe Von Zombie]

So everyone else is biased, while you are free from bias? Got it

It's a Jenkins film. All of these films are collaborative efforts, with a lot of moving parts, but it's the director's vision that sets the overall tone and creates a cohesive whole, as was clearly the case here.

Fair enough. I understand what everyone is saying. I know I'm coming off as incredibly negative, but I expected more from what we got. I did not hate the film so I'll be positive for a minute, I think the is cast really good, Chris Pine especially and I enjoyed the second act.

If I were to rank the DCEU films, it would look something like this:

Man of Steel
Wonder Woman
BVS
Suicide Squad.

 

[Paradox1]

Fair enough. I understand what everyone is saying. I know I'm coming off as incredibly negative, but I expected more from what we got. I did not hate the film so I'll be positive for minute, I think the cast really good, Chris Pine especially and I enjoyed the second act.

If I were to rank the DCEU films, it would look something like this:

Man of Steel
Wonder Woman
BVS
Suicide Squad.

That's my order to for the DCEU. I suspect my ratings are higher though as I think MOS is one of the best first contact films in the past 40 years.

 

[Willi Berg]

MOS impressed me more on a technical and visual level, but I was affected more emotionally by WW.

 

[jaymes_e06]

I agree Willi it just felt very hollow so it was hard to feel for Clark like you should as the main protagonist.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

Uh-oh here we go.

Yep and it's always the same people

 

[flickchick85]

Yep and it's always the same people

On both sides.

Posts like this are unnecessary. If you're here to repeatedly complain about your fellow posters (which 4 of your last 6 posts have done), you're in the wrong place. Keep it to the movies, folks.

 

[Black Narcissus]

I should post it here, instead. Hmmm.

Eh, I'll be posting more in the JL lounge thread.

Fantastic WW script mistah, Whedon!

Lawd:

 

[Micromind]

I should post it here, instead. Hmmm.

Have you read the script ? It gets better.



Now, I wonder what he's going to write on Batgirl.

 

[Black Narcissus]

50 Shades of Themyscira!

 

[Blitzkrieg]

I'm gonna watch Wonder Woman today. I'm giddy AF.

 

[Micromind]

I'm gonna watch Wonder Woman today. I'm giddy AF.

Enjoy. t:

Is it in 3D ?

I watched the movie two times, both times were in 3D but in different theaters.

 

[DieSmiling]

Patty Jenkins has said in interviews that she wants to do something different before potentially jumping into Wonder Woman 2 -- is anyone else concerned WB will want to fast track a sequel and do it without her? Or maybe just a negotiating ploy on her part?

 

[DACrowe]

I was surprised that they used the Lasso so much in action sequences as they did. It made me very happy.



My mind instantly jumped to that as I was watching lol. WW is inspired by so many sequences of movies/media it truly helped make the film more powerful.

I read somewhere that it is also visually influenced by this famous scene:

 

[DACrowe]

Diana's optimism narration at the end is post-BvS and she said that AFTER she saw the photo Bruce sent her and made her remember all the memories she had when she first encountered humanity as a naive woman. [BLACKOUT]So that triggered her to be proper WW again (DS battle was a one off) and jump out of the balcony to save the day in that last shot[/BLACKOUT]. That's why the [BLACKOUT]last shot[/BLACKOUT] has so much impact because she remembered everything/everyone and that hope drove her back to us.

THAT'S THE WHOLE POINT OF THAT LAST SCENE

I didn't get that narration at first and thought she [BLACKOUT]jumped out towards London[/BLACKOUT] so I didn't get the impact and wife thought it was a lame ending, but once you understand the connections [BLACKOUT]photo -
memory - motivation - action - WW's back![/BLACKOUT] That's a much more inspiring ending, and that didn't retcon anything from BvS. If they wanted to retcon it they'd have shown her [BLACKOUT]jumping towards London or some other town sometime in the past[/BLACKOUT] - to debunk "she walked away from humanity" line.

Does that mean that 2 line from BvS is gonna haunt the future movies? Hell no, you can choose to ignore it if you like but WW and BvS don't contradict each other, heck, the start and ending is basically connecting itself to Bruce Wayne. Can they retcon it later? Yes! But my money's on them just ignoring it and let Patty fill the gaps later.

But I dont think it does. She built a life in Man's World as evidenced by the fact that she was still in it working and living. That doesnt limit Patty because Patty doesnt need to tell any more stories in the past if she doesnt want to. (and she doesnt it seems)

It isnt like Snyder didnt know Patty's story (he was out promoting the movie before he left JL due to the tragedy) and he didnt seem to care at all. I dont even think it runs afoul of what she said in BvS anyways because I think people are being way to literal with it. (and I said that at the time) She walked away from protecting us like she did in WWI because she cant protect us from ourselves. Humanity is both good and evil and she cant fix that. (like Steve said, there is no one big bad guy to kill) So you say she spent the years living amongst us, learning from us and helping where she could without being noticed. To truly help Man she needs to understand him. Boom 2 lines of exposition and all problems solved. And it even runs parallel to Clark's journey so it can be something they bond over.

I double quoted to just point out that we are interpreting Wonder Woman (the movie) incredibly differently because of that single line in BvS shows that it does have some importance. And the way that it is delivered and contextualized in BvS is meant to be interpreted that she has not fought to help humanity in a century.

With that said, I strongly disagree with Greenlite's interpretation and it is not what Jenkins is going for. Her jumping into Paris (not London ) is not indicative of Bruce Wayne's letter or Superman's sacrifice. It is her answering a call, one she never abandoned. The lines in Wonder Woman that matter are "They are everything you say and so much more." Her opinion did not sour on humanity.

Which is all to say that I agree if Patty wants to make another movie set in a time period, and I hope she does, that she has the freedom to do so. I imagine they will just ignore that one line in BvS. Because the ending it set up for her solo movie is not the ending we ended up getting. We got a better one.

 

[-Arya-]

WB will probably do everything possible to eliminate BvS from people's memories. Either they will outright ignore it or find a different way to interpret it.

 

[Osiris-Rex]

WB will probably do everything possible to eliminate BvS from people's memories. Either they will outright ignore it or find a different way to interpret it.

I suspect by the time a Wonder Woman sequel gets made only Sheldon Cooper will remember that line from BvS.

 

[misslane38]

WB will probably do everything possible to eliminate BvS from people's memories. Either they will outright ignore it or find a different way to interpret it.

That'll be pretty hard to do given how much its events and developments already play a major role in JL. Plus, nothing needs to be forgotten. The characters are naturally evolving as a result of their struggles, and issues with tone and editing aren't plot points to be forgotten. The BvS line is like a question WW answers. It's addressed directly; it's not forgotten.

 

[idiot09]

Riight. Here's what Patty Jenkins had to say :

I think that there is potentially a misunderstanding between what it means to turn her back on mankind… there could be a difference between having people save themselves and knowing that people must save themselves, and even still, being optimistic and loving about them.

So yeah...no ignoring, but believe what you wanna believe.

I liked what Andrew Dyce said on the subject :

In essence, Jenkins suggests that Diana may win the day, but ultimately have her eyes opened to the reality of man’s world. Instead of grabbing up her sword, shield, armor, and taking responsibility for the world’s problems, she realizes she must step back and let it follow its own course. The real key point here isn’t whether or not Diana “walked away from mankind” – she admits as much to Bruce – but the esteem in which she held mankind as she surrendered any duty to save it.

Looking at it from the perspective Jenkins suggests, setting Diana up as simply observing mankind while holding onto love and hope for its future makes her role in Batman V Superman and Justice League even richer. You could argue that Superman is a perfect embodiment of the hero, the icon, the ‘savior’ she chose not to be for the world. Over the course of Snyder’s films that means Diana has seen her decision validated, given the torment Superman is put through… until his death shows how much impact a single hero can have.

At the very least, the world’s embrace of Superman after his death could give her hope she’s apparently been missing by the time she re-emerges. The events of BvS and the new threats of Justice League hopefully show her that mankind isn’t capable of defending itself from every enemy. And Unlike World War I, this threat is even beyond the guilt or responsibility of everyday humans… we assume. Unless you want to blame Lex Luthor. Always blame Lex Luthor.

Nicely summed up.

That'll be pretty hard to do given how much its events and developments already play a major role in JL. Plus, nothing needs to be forgotten. The characters are naturally evolving as a result of their struggles, and issues with tone and editing aren't plot points to be forgotten. The BvS line is like a question WW answers. It's addressed directly; it's not forgotten.

I think its more wishful thinking than anything else.

 

[Boy Scout]

Cross posting:

I finally saw WW and it was DAMN good. I was blown away by how well done the emotional moments were handled. It's so rare that superhero movies succeed at eliciting genuine emotional reactions from me, and WW exceeded expectations in that regard.

The chemistry between Gadot and Pine was ELECTRIC (though their conversations got a little repetitive toward the end) and I was pleasantly surprised by Gadot's performance. Her only real weak moments were: [BLACKOUT]her reaction to injuring Antiope; her reaction to Antiope's death; and her reaction to seeing the village wiped out by Dr. Poision's gas.[/BLACKOUT] Otherwise, she was solid.

My criticisms of the film itself are fairly minor. I thought it meandered too much in the second act (they could've cut the scene where Diana bought new clothes entirely); conflicts between Diana and her mother were resolved FAR too quickly; the ending was just a tad rushed (that final shot was pretty weak); and Etta Candy was kind of annoying. I also would've liked the final battle to have been an intense, brutal fight that utilized stunt choreography instead of CGI mayhem, but that's more of a preference than a real criticism.

8/10. I had a great time with this.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

Thanx for posting that idiot, that clears up a little about what the statement means to everyone. I still do wonder why she was so hesitant to join the Doomsday fight if she wasn't reluctant to become WW again.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

Her only real weak moments were: [BLACKOUT]her reaction to injuring Antiope; her reaction to Antiope's death; and her reaction to seeing the village wiped out by Dr. Poision's gas.[/BLACKOUT] Otherwise, she was solid.

I thought she was absolutely amazing in that last moment you mentioned. How else do you sell that? Plus, her little outburst afterwards was perfect.

 

[Boy Scout]

The outburst was fine; even good. But I was very aware of the fact that she was an actress trying to portray grief before that. She knew what to do, and to her credit came close to pulling it off, but fell short.