America...the Thread

[Addendum]

[YT]LbSekuR040c[/YT]

 

[TEDDY]

AMERICA'S DEMOCRACY IS AWESOME!!!

It beats the hell out of Russia.

With their Communist TEDDYS! ("COMEDDYS"?)

 

[Memphis Slim]

Greatest country on the planet! We know it. That's why we don't leave it.

Raybia...didn't you do a farewell concert to the Hype a while back?

Welcome back.

 

[XtromaniaK]

Meh. Having lived in the Midwest, which is supposedly the "nicest place you can ever live" for the majority of my life.. I can tell you that this is not the greatest country on the planet. Far from it. Probably nearer one of the most commodified, ignorant places I've ever been.

But then again, I live in a Roman Catholic region. So that makes sense.

 

[MaskedManJRK]

The movie, it was a deleted scene before they got into the rock hall of fame they tried to get all this ninja gear from an army/navy store run by this militia nut. When they realized they didn't have any money but had to have the walkie-talkies to "triangulate their mission objectives" they decided to give the guy a custom made song. It was called "the government totally sucks, you mutha@ucker" and it made the guy cry. Second funniest song in the whole movie and one of the best sequences. MMJKR little speach just really reminded me of the militia guy.

Ah--saw the movie on Cinemax a few weeks back, haven't gotten the DVD yet.

America is in a bad way right now. But I think that is slowly changing. There is a rift in the country. People under 30 demand change. They want to know their social security will be available. They want to help the environment. They want to change our foreign policy. The problem is no one under thirty is in any real power in the US. The government is made up of a lot of old geezers who will not change a way of life that they have been living for 50, 60 or even 70 years. When this younger generation becomes the older generation and takes power, I think the nation will undergo great changes and change, ironically enough, back into what it was founded on. We youngsters are more rebellious and more in tune with our revolutionary forefathers. The times are a changin'.

PS, Americans. Stop spending so much damn money on crap you can't afford!!!!

That's a good way to sum it up--the big bastards are a bunch of old f**ks who I bet sold their souls to the devil. How the hell else can you explain these devient and corrupt f**ks living to be 189?

But I think one of the only ways that the country can be fixed a complete retolling of all the political parties. Take the Democrats and the Republicans, break each of them apart into their own sub-groups and we need bigger names within the smaller parties, such as the Libertarians, the Independants, and the Green Party (which Al Gore should just go "F**k you, Donkies!" and join, by the way, because environmental issues and going on Futurama is about the only times where he doesn't sound like a robot). I fear if we don't, and the massive polarization these parties are creating, we'll not just have this whole f**k-up with the Middle East to deal with--we'll also have to deal with a civil war.

 

[AhabTheArab]

consistently making weird threads to debate the aspect of freedom and where society is going in america... im not trying to write your thesis paper for you.

 

[Arkady Rossovich]

Americans sit on their lazy butts,and still think they are the best in the world.Europe,China and Russia are comming out and could surpass the USA in many areas within 10-20 years.

 

[DarthRekal]

Americans sit on their lazy butts,and still think they are the best in the world.Europe,China and Russia are comming out and could surpass the USA in many areas within 10-20 years.

bitter NON American t:

 

[hammy]

Ugh. The US is not a democracy, it's a republic.

 

[raybia]

Greatest country on the planet! We know it. That's why we don't leave it.

Raybia...didn't you do a farewell concert to the Hype a while back?

Welcome back.

I did. But I just cannot quit it.


So I'm here on a part time basis.

 

[raybia]

Ugh. The US is not a democracy, it's a republic.

Its a constitutional republic which in itself is a form of liberal democracy.

 

[rdh007]

I did. But I just cannot quit it.

 

[raybia]

Tell you what... truth is, sometimes I miss the Hype so bad I can hardly stand it...

 

[hammy]

Its a constitutional republic which in itself is a form of liberal democracy.

We elect representatives to (supposedly) represent us. We do not, as an electorate, directly vote on nor necessarily influence, all matters that come before congress. The majority doesn't even necessarily elect the president, though that is often the case. As a nation we have democratic leanings, but fortunately, our founding fathers were wise enough to anticipate the 'tyranny of the majority,' as it is called, and make provisions, against it.

 

[Fred_Fury]

You know what I love about America? The fact that we're probably the only western nation that hasnt become a bunch of whiny candy ass pacifist *****es. The last place on earth I'd want to live is europe, its like they put estrogen in the water over there. I'd rather live in the aids capital of africa.

 

[Memphis Slim]

Meh. Having lived in the Midwest, which is supposedly the "nicest place you can ever live" for the majority of my life.. I can tell you that this is not the greatest country on the planet. Far from it. Probably nearer one of the most commodified, ignorant places I've ever been.

But then again, I live in a Roman Catholic region. So that makes sense.

Then why don't you move to the country you think is better?

 

[Memphis Slim]

You know what I love about America? The fact that we're probably the only western nation that hasnt become a bunch of whiny candy ass pacifist *****es. The last place on earth I'd want to live is europe, its like they put estrogen in the water over there. I'd rather live in the aids capital of africa.

"I do believe you hit on somethin, Private Pyle!!!"

 

[XtromaniaK]

Then why don't you move to the country you think is better?

I'm planning on it once I get a stable job and a MBA.

 

[XtromaniaK]

Americans sit on their lazy butts,and still think they are the best in the world.Europe,China and Russia are comming out and could surpass the USA in many areas within 10-20 years.

Not that I don't slightly agree, but your harsh generalizations of all Americans is sickening. Who exactly says that the USA is the best country in the world, besides the dumbasses you see blurting out "USA! USA!" everytime the topic comes up? Not all Americans are like that. Alot of us our proud (I'm not, ironically), but not blind.

America is just as f-ed up as any other country in the land. In some ways, more so. In others, we're at the forefront of the pack. You can't merely paint this in black and white tones.

 

[Addendum]

America, Love it or Leave it? by M. Leo Baker

My father used his trump card in one of our recent political debates. That is, he asked me why I did not just leave if I disliked America so much. This, of course, is a variant of the highly sophisticated “America, love it or leave it” argument. How could I respond to such a well-reasoned attack on my anti-state views (or, as I like to call them, my pro-liberty views)? Maybe the better question was should I even bother to respond to such sixth grade logic.

Unfortunately, this argument is all too prevalent in discussions with state lovers. When the state lovers are backed into a corner with no other arguments to defend their views, just as my father, they often resort to the tried and true “love it or leave it” argument. o refute this supposed untouchable statement, a thorough analysis of it is in order.

Let us start with the term America itself. What does America stand for anyway? Does it stand for the wide expanse of beautiful land located on the continent of North America, for the diverse people peacefully interacting on such land, and for the material prosperity provided by industrious entrepreneurs and manufacturers? If this is what one means by America, then I love it with all my heart. Thus the state lovers should not tell me to leave, because I have already met their required condition of love.

If, on the other hand, America stands for the United States federal government, which steals from people, tells them how to conduct their personal affairs, and incarcerates them for fictitious crimes, then, no, I do not love America. In fact, I hate it, just as anyone would hate the person who stole from him and threatened his life and liberty.

As an aside, this discussion regarding the definition of America applies equally to the “anti-American” argument that is so prevalent today in the news media. It seems that anyone who apposes the Bush administration’s foreign policies (or, for that matter, anyone who apposes any policies of the federal government) is labeled anti-American. If America refers to the people currently located in the geographic region known as the United States, then I am not anti-American. But if it refers to the federal government, and the policies of the Bush administration specifically, then I am rightly called anti-American. The news media should avoid this confusion, however, by properly labeling it anti-Bush instead of anti-American.

Returning to our main analysis, assume, then, that America does stand for the federal government. I do not love it, but why should I leave. Why shouldn’t the federal government leave, or at least leave me alone? By stating that I should leave, the state lovers are telling me that I do not have a right to own property, and that I do not have a right to freedom from physical aggression.

If I have a right to own property, including real property (land), then I have a right to exclude others from such property. This right to exclude includes the right to exclude the federal government and it agents. If I truly own my land, then I have the right to tell the federal government to stick its laws where the sun doesn’t shine, because the land is mine and I can conduct myself on it as I please. If anyone should be leaving, then, it should be the federal government. I am rightly located on my land, while it is a trespasser. When the state lovers tell me to leave, they must assume, then, that the federal government has a territorial monopoly on all of the property located within the United States. In their view, the federal government must own all of the property and is only leasing it to me as long as I obey its commands.

The state lovers must also assume that I do not have a right to be free from physical aggression and threats of physical aggression. If I had a right to freedom from such aggression, then I could tell the tax collector to go to hell anytime he came knocking at my door. This, of course, is not an option allowed by the state lovers. If I refuse to pay my taxes, the federal government will come to arrest me. If I resist arrest, government agents will shoot me. So the state lovers are telling me to love being robbed at gunpoint or leave. Nice guys, these state lovers.

In conclusion, the only way that the state lovers’ “love it or leave it” argument holds up is if they concede that (1) America stands for a tyrannical federal government, (2) that no one has the right to own property, and (3) that everyone must be subject to threats of physical aggression. Seems like a very bleak place to live if you ask me.

 

[LexCorp]

Another reason I like the USA is that you have to be 21 to drink!!!

That just makes sense. Over here in the UK we let them drink at 18!!

They are kids at that age.

 

[S_H_F_4839]

Another reason I like the USA is that you have to be 21 to drink!!!

That just makes sense. Over here in the UK we let them drink at 18!!

They are kids at that age.

true, but several people I know went back to acting like kids when they got old enough to drink.

 

[Memphis Slim]

Another reason I like the USA is that you have to be 21 to drink!!!

That just makes sense. Over here in the UK we let them drink at 18!!

They are kids at that age.

Europe is waaaay to liberal. Sometimes we need barriers and contraints to keep us from hurting ourselves.

 

[Sandman138]

Europe is waaaay to liberal. Sometimes we need barriers and contraints to keep us from hurting ourselves.

Spoken like a true Democrat.

 

[Sandman138]

Off goes the head of the king, and tyranny gives way to freedom. The change seems abysmal. Then, bit by bit, the face of freedom hardens, and by and by it is the old face of tyranny. Then another cycle, and another. But under the play of all these opposites there is something fundamental and permanent — the basic delusion that men may be governed and yet be free.

-- H. L. Mencken, Preface to the first edition of The American Credo : A Contribution Toward the Interpretation of the National Mind (1920)

When a candidate for public office faces the voters he does not face men of sense; he faces a mob of men whose chief distinguishing mark is the fact that they are quite incapable of weighing ideas, or even of comprehending any save the most elemental — men whose whole thinking is done in terms of emotion, and whose dominant emotion is dread of what they cannot understand. So confronted, the candidate must either bark with the pack or be lost... All the odds are on the man who is, intrinsically, the most devious and mediocre — the man who can most adeptly disperse the notion that his mind is a virtual vacuum.' The Presidency tends, year by year, to go to such men. As democracy is perfected, the office represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. We move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron.

-- H. L. Mencken, Baltimore Sun (26 July 1920)

The fact is that the average man's love of liberty is nine-tenths imaginary, exactly like his love of sense, justice and truth. He is not actually happy when free; he is uncomfortable, a bit alarmed, and intolerably lonely. Liberty is not a thing for the great masses of men. It is the exclusive possession of a small and disreputable minority, like knowledge, courage and honor. It takes a special sort of man to understand and enjoy liberty — and he is usually an outlaw in democratic societies.

-- H. L. Mencken, Baltimore Evening Sun (12 February 1923)