Contest of Marvels II Thread 1

LOCATION: Savage Land

The Savage Land is a hidden prehistoric land within the fictional Marvel Comics Universe. It is a tropical preserve hidden in Antarctica.

There are many types of races in the Savage Land and Pangea. Examples of Savage Land races include the bird people called Aerians, the Fall People who are friends of the X-Men, the monkey-tailed Tree People, the amphibious Tubanti fish-people of the inland Gorahn Sea, the Lizard Men of Vali-Kuri City, and the nomadic cat people of Pandori. Popular races in the Savage Land are the Man-Apes, the Lemurans, the Pterons (pterodactyl-like people), the human Sun People, the Swamp Men, and the Zebra People.

(The Savage Land is inhabited, as shown above; no super-powered individuals are included, though, including the likes of Sauron, Moon-Boy, or Devil Dinosaur.)
 
OPENING COMMENTS: Graviton vs Durok the Demolisher

Graviton is one of the most powerful characters Marvel has to offer, who has complete and utter control of the gravitational forces, while Durok the Demolisher has simple super strength and endurance. He's a class 75 at minimum, so he'll definitely give most powerhouses a run for their money. I'm going to borrow a page from my Power Princess debate, since Graviton's opponent is quite similar here.

In this case prep-time is not useful for either really. The element of surprise however is Graviton's. He's got such a versatility of powers, and that makes it much easier for him to deal with Durok than the other way around. The advantage of flight is also great, as that way, Graviton can easily locate Durok.

Lest we forget, Graviton schooled the Avengers in his first appearance, all the while holding a piece of land in the air. He was only defeated because he, at that time, did not yet know the limits of his powers, and he went too far after thinking his love killed herself. Over the years, he has learned those limits, and was able to add the name of the Thunderbolts to his list of ass-kickings.

There is literally nothing Durok can do to hurt Graviton:
- Graviton can manipulate the Savage Land against his opponent, protecting him.
- He can increase the gravity upon Durok, bringing him to the ground.
- His forcefield has withstood the blows of Thor, so he can take punches from Durok.
- He can manipulate the gravity in such a way that he can blow him away with pure energy.
- Furthermore, he can use his powers to halt him in his tracks and just keep him floating immobile. He has done this to a group of Avengers, regulating his gravity powers in such a fine matter that it would keep them down, but would not kill them.
- Although his blasts have hurt the Silver Surfer (after a while), Graviton won't allow them to come anywhere near him. He can deflect them using his gravity powers (they are concussive force, not some fancy light beam or anything), and his force field has withstood class 100 blows.

On the other side, all of these powers can be used offensively as well, and Graviton just needs to keep going until Durok is knocked out, which considering the easy manner that he took down both Beast and Wonder Man, should grant Graviton a rather quick win.

gravitonro8.jpg

WINNER=GRAVITON
 
OPENING COMMENTS: Black Panther vs Savage Hulk

For this one, I'll also borrow a page from Black Panther's matches, because it's much easier to repost these things. What is the one thing that defines the Panther? Prep-time. So, first off, let's handle his powers and pointing you to some great respect threads.

Strength, speed and endurance
Marvel Directory.Com: The Black Panther is near the pinnicle of human physical perfection, his natural strength and abilities having been heightened by unidentified heart-shaped herb administered only to Wakandan kings during a sacred ascension ritual. The herb is also only in Wakanda. While not superhuman, he is nearly as strong as a human being can become. He can lift (press) a maximum of 750 pounds with supreme effort.
Other skills
Marvel Directory.Com: An accomplished gymnast and acrobat, T'Challa is also an expert tracker. In addition, he has mastered various African martial arts.
Standard equipment
Marvel Directory.Com: T'Challa's Vibranium micro-weave bodysuit not only stops bullets, but saps their momentum. His boots' Vibranium soles absorb sound and impact -- enabling him to leap from structures up to eight stories tall and land without injury, and literally run up the sides of buildings. The Panther's retractable claws contain a new composite of the experimental "anti-metal" Vibranium that can break down other alloys. T'Challa wields an energy dagger that can be fired, thrown or handled like a knife. At its highest setting, the weapon easily can cut through forged steel.

For more of an idea of what the Panther can do, I invite you to look at this respect thread, detailing some of the awesome feats he's pulled off. Let's recap a few things here: Black Panther originally tested himself against the Fantastic Four, he's stared down Iron Man, has held his own against guys like Captain America, Iron Fist, Ka-Zar and Wolverine. Heck, he recently one-punched Karnak. Now anyone who still doubts the awesomeness of the Panther, can take a look at this particular thread, which gives a play-by-play of the Panther's feats, by year!

You might notice that the Panther and Hulk have faced off before. First off in Avengers Annual #2, where the Black Panther is capable to keep standing. He's not fighting the Hulk as much as he's stalling for time. I want to note that before that, the Panther also took down the Thing back in his first appearance, and was later even capable of single-handidly taking down the New Warriors (including Nova, Speedball and Namorita).

Now, he faces Hulk again with in an issue of Defenders. Another important battle is in Priest's run, where he is capable of hanging with the Savage Hulk once again. He'll be able to survive close combat thanks to his vibranium. You can see a page from that fight here. Interesting to see as well is him robbing the momentum from a Hulk-thrown car, here.

Of course, these are not Panther's greatest assets. He's a technological and scientific genius. Exempting for one moment the possibility that Panther is able to (temporarily) cure Banner, he's got numerous devices to aid him. He's got sonic blasters, vibranium cages, you name it. He's got the resources of the Von Doom/Richards caliber.

So, beyond the fact that the Panther has been shown to able to take the Hulk's blows, as well as dodge them, he's got the scientific resources to take the Hulk down. It won't be easy, but he's got 24 hours, and we already know he has numerous plans for dealing with the Hulk, and Panther's plans have pretty much shown to work nine times out of ten. He can win it, and he will.

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WINNER=BLACK PANTHER
 
Iron Man vs. Jack Of Hearts:

Iron Man would know how to combat Jack Of Hearts, and while Jack might have a good idea, he simply won't know what Tony is going to bring to the party. My vote will be for Tony, regardless.
 
Mastermind (DARTHPHERE) bio

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vs.

Sunfire - Exiles (KYTRIGGER) bio

This is actualyl a very interesting fight because of the location advantage for Sunfire.

Powers:
Mastermind can create illusions that fool people. He is very good at usign these, and even fooled Dark Phoenix (although he had a device that amped up his powers for that one.

Sunfire is likethe Sunfire from 616 basically. She can generate a ridiculousl amount of heat and radiation, fly, and can also see in infa-red.

Prep time doesn't mean much for either since they are form different timelines. Mastermind would probably guess she is like the 616 Sunfire, and she would most liekly guess that he is like every other Mastermind she has faced while in the exiles also.

Okay, so the battle starts off, and Mastermind would obviously try and fool her. This isn't that easy though because he has a pretty limiteds range for this, and the Savage Land is a pretty big place. Sunfire would also take to flight immediately giving her even more distance between them. She would easily spot Mastermind too. USing her infrared vision she could easily see through the trees and spot him, while he will be basiclly blinded by the dense foliage on the ground. Remember, this is basicalyl a rainforest, there isn't a great field of vision from ground up.

So, Sunfire can get an attack up first, and can strike form long range with her heat/energy blasts. It won't take much to take down Mastermind physically, he isn't in good shape.

IF he does manage to ensnare her in an illusion, she will know something's up. His illusions usually involve things like fancy galas and crap like that, so she will know it isn't real, and start blindly firing her flames everywhere. While, this probably won't hit Mastermind, this royally screws him. He is surrounded by a dense wooded area being doused in flames. Whether or not her flames hit him directly or not doesn't matter, those flames are gonna come to him. he will either burn, or most liekly just pass out form teh smoke. And until they do, she will simply bebe standign there confused and still firing flames. He has absolutely no way to actually hurt her, he can only mess with her mind.

Because of this, Mastermind is very dangerous when in a group like the Hellfire Club, but on his own, he poses very little threat.


Winner- Sunfire
 
Match 2:

Durok The Demolisher (AHURA MAZDA) bio

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vs.

Gravitron (HARLEKIN) bio

th_Graviton.jpg

Now this is an interesting battle. One with 2 marvel heavyweights. Durok is a creature who bested Thor and put down the Silver Surfer for awhile. He is super strong, relentless, extremely durable and projects concussive bolts.

Prep time will help neither opponent here.

Gravitron is extremely difficult to beat but I came across this letttle gem in his profile:

Graviton can use his power at maximum capacity for up to eight hours before mental fatigue significantly impairs his performance, and considerably longer (up to eighteen hours) if he conserves his energy during that time.

His powers are limited in time.

Also, let us not forget that Iron Man (before he got the extremis virus) almost killed him.

Therefore, he has his weaknesses.

This battle will be difficult and arduous. Let us not forget that Durok never tires and that his concussive blasts were able to penetrate the Silver Surfer's defenses. He also is superhumanly fast.

Now the reality is that Durok is at least a class 75 meaning there was no way to know his upper level of strength. And he was able to break the Surfer's board when the Surfer tried to hold him with it.

This battle is going to end up being one of endurance. Graviton will have the upper hand at first but he will tire whereas Durok never does. He has limitless energy. He will be able to hold out and strike some blows of his own and his concussive blasts come with tremendous force. Graviton will be using close to his maximum capacity to hold Durok off and at the same time trying to protect from the blasts Durok sends him.

This battle will not be aeasy but give there is no end to Durok's endurance and there is one to Graviton's, Durok will end up on top even if it takes him 19 hours to do it.

Winner - Durok
 
Rebuttal - Graviton vs Durok the Demolisher

Graviton is one of the most powerful characters Marvel has to offer, who has complete and utter control of the gravitational forces, while Durok the Demolisher has simple super strength and endurance. He's a class 75 at minimum, so he'll definitely give most powerhouses a run for their money. I'm going to borrow a page from my Power Princess debate, since Graviton's opponent is quite similar here.[/b]

Except that Durok is considerably more powerful, has limitless endurance and can shoot concussive blasts that penetrated all of the Silver Surfer's defenses.

In this case prep-time is not useful for either really. The element of surprise however is Graviton's. He's got such a versatility of powers, and that makes it much easier for him to deal with Durok than the other way around. The advantage of flight is also great, as that way, Graviton can easily locate Durok.

I will not argue there as I agree with the above even though Durok will know when he is around him.

Lest we forget, Graviton schooled the Avengers in his first appearance, all the while holding a piece of land in the air. He was only defeated because he, at that time, did not yet know the limits of his powers, and he went too far after thinking his love killed herself. Over the years, he has learned those limits, and was able to add the name of the Thunderbolts to his list of ass-kickings.

Lest we forget, the same Graviton got bested by Iron Man solo and was almost killed by him.

There is literally nothing Durok can do to hurt Graviton:

Let me take these one by one and by the way if he can hurt the SILVER SURFER, I think he can hurt Graviton.

- Graviton can manipulate the Savage Land against his opponent, protecting him.

This will not stop Durok from trying and while he keeps it up, Graviton will tire and eventually Durok will break through.

- He can increase the gravity upon Durok, bringing him to the ground.

Well that depends on how much energy that takes and no one knows Durok's upper limits. This is not to say Graviton cannot do it just that this will not hold Durok indefinitely and eventually Graviton will tire.

- His forcefield has withstood the blows of Thor, so he can take punches from Durok.

Yes tehy withstood Thor for a time but they did not withstand Iron Man's and Durok did knock out Thor so maybe he hits harder then him.

- He can manipulate the gravity in such a way that he can blow him away with pure energy.

Given the Silver Surfer could not, how can Graviton....

- Furthermore, he can use his powers to halt him in his tracks and just keep him floating immobile. He has done this to a group of Avengers, regulating his gravity powers in such a fine matter that it would keep them down, but would not kill them.

Durok will fight aganist this and eventually...I know I am repeating myself...but Graviton will tire. He can fight from 9 to 18 hours depending on the level of energy he expends and as such Durok will eventually get to him.

- Although his blasts have hurt the Silver Surfer (after a while), Graviton won't allow them to come anywhere near him. He can deflect them using his gravity powers (they are concussive force, not some fancy light beam or anything), and his force field has withstood class 100 blows.

Yes he can hold off Durok for awhile but Durok is limitless in his endurance and as such will evntually get to Graviton. And if the blasts could penetrate the Surfer's shields it is likely he can penetrate Graviton's. Plus the shields will get weaker as the hours advance.

On the other side, all of these powers can be used offensively as well, and Graviton just needs to keep going until Durok is knocked out, which considering the easy manner that he took down both Beast and Wonder Man, should grant Graviton a rather quick win.

Durok has never been knocked out and as such Graviton wil not be the first to do it. The way he ws defeated was by placing him in an alternate future.

On the other hand, Iron Man left Graviton for dead. There will be nothing quick about this battle and the limited endurance of Graviton will be his downfall. Durok has never tired and is relentless.

WINNER=Durok
 
REBUTTAL: Graviton vs Durok
His powers are limited in time.
Eight hours. Do you know how long that is? He won't need that kind of time.

Also, let us not forget that Iron Man (before he got the extremis virus) almost killed him.
Let's also not forget that afterwards, he went and completely owned the Avengers and the Thunderbolts, and his defeat at the hands of Iron Man was when he was weaker and Iron Man was aided by the West Coast Avengers. He had owned the Avengers (including Iron Man) some time before that.

This battle will be difficult and arduous. Let us not forget that Durok never tires and that his concussive blasts were able to penetrate the Silver Surfer's defenses. He also is superhumanly fast.
I've only read about him having incredible strength and endurance, but nothing stating superspeed. Could be I missed that however.

Now the reality is that Durok is at least a class 75 meaning there was no way to know his upper level of strength. And he was able to break the Surfer's board when the Surfer tried to hold him with it.
At least class 75 means he's around that area. If we didn't know his upper strength, he'd be at least class 100. We know he's a minimal class 75, and his max at best would be class 100, something Graviton has withstood with ease.

This battle is going to end up being one of endurance. Graviton will have the upper hand at first but he will tire whereas Durok never does. He has limitless energy. He will be able to hold out and strike some blows of his own and his concussive blasts come with tremendous force. Graviton will be using close to his maximum capacity to hold Durok off and at the same time trying to protect from the blasts Durok sends him.
He's shown to be able to do simultaneous things, and his maximum capacity is obviously greater than holding up an entire island and still owning the Avengers. If he can hold that for eight hours... Wow. He only needs to keep Durok immobile for long enough to get him disqualified.

Lest we forget, the same Graviton got bested by Iron Man solo and was almost killed by him.
When, exactly? I don't recall this incident, truthfully here. I thought you were referring to his fight with Iron Man while he was with the West Coast Avengers. Besides that, he owned the Thunderbolts and Avengers after that, so really, that doesn't matter much.

Heck, he's literally held most superheroes in the air, levitated dozens of cities across the globe AND fought the Thunderbolts. He has unlimited power over gravity. He was capable of hurling a pebble from China to Australia, killing one single person. That's the magnitude and refinement of his powers.

Let me take these one by one and by the way if he can hurt the SILVER SURFER, I think he can hurt Graviton.
Of course he can hurt Graviton, but it's doubtful he'll hit him. Lest we also forget, Durok never actually beat the Surfer, and the Surfer was able to stand up to him quite well.

This will not stop Durok from trying and while he keeps it up, Graviton will tire and eventually Durok will break through.
Graviton doesn't tire as easily as you think. Besides, manipulating the Savage Land would cost little energy from Graviton.

Well that depends on how much energy that takes and no one knows Durok's upper limits. This is not to say Graviton cannot do it just that this will not hold Durok indefinitely and eventually Graviton will tire.
It's not necessary to hold him indefinitely. Just enough to keep him immobile long enough. He's kept class 70-100 characters this way before, for quite a time. He can do it with Durok as well. Another, kinda cheap, strategy would be to simply punt Durok into space/other side of the planet, removing him from the battlefield.

Yes tehy withstood Thor for a time but they did not withstand Iron Man's and Durok did knock out Thor so maybe he hits harder then him.
They've also withstood Iron Man's, so that doesn't hold up. It took him a while to knock out Thor, and considering he's still stated to be around the class 75 level, I doubt he'll be hitting those shields any harder than Thor did.

Given the Silver Surfer could not, how can Graviton....
No, the Surfer just didn't do it. Big difference.

Durok will fight aganist this and eventually...I know I am repeating myself...but Graviton will tire. He can fight from 9 to 18 hours depending on the level of energy he expends and as such Durok will eventually get to him.
9 to 18 hours is enough for disqualifying. Besides, if it really got out of hand, Graviton could just fling Durok into space. Again, unlimited control of gravity. Besides, there's not much for Durok to fight. It kept Wonder Man and Iron Man under control. Both of them. It required little energy from Graviton.

Yes he can hold off Durok for awhile but Durok is limitless in his endurance and as such will evntually get to Graviton. And if the blasts could penetrate the Surfer's shields it is likely he can penetrate Graviton's. Plus the shields will get weaker as the hours advance.
If Graviton even so much as gets the idea he can not simply win this, he'll take Durok and throw him away. There's no defense against this from Durok. And again, limitless endurance is useless when you're disqualified after two hours.

Durok has never been knocked out and as such Graviton wil not be the first to do it. The way he ws defeated was by placing him in an alternate future.
Durok's also had four appearances, of which three cover one arc. So, although the "never" is accurate, it isn't really relevant.

On the other hand, Iron Man left Graviton for dead. There will be nothing quick about this battle and the limited endurance of Graviton will be his downfall. Durok has never tired and is relentless.
You severely underestimate Graviton's endurance. With the feats he's pulled off? Eight hours is a lot. I've also finally found this Iron Man thing you are referring to. New Avengers apparently, where it was already shown that Graviton was severely weakened by the prison, so really, it doesn't really count. That's one weak appearance against numerous very very powerful ones.

WINNER=GRAVITON
 
REBUTTAL: Graviton vs Durok

Eight hours. Do you know how long that is? He won't need that kind of time.

I know how long that is but I did not know there was atime limit on these bouts.

Let's also not forget that afterwards, he went and completely owned the Avengers and the Thunderbolts, and his defeat at the hands of Iron Man was when he was weaker and Iron Man was aided by the West Coast Avengers. He had owned the Avengers (including Iron Man) some time before that.

I was not referring to that defeat but the one in prison. But it does go to show that Graviton is defeatable.


I've only read about him having incredible strength and endurance, but nothing stating superspeed. Could be I missed that however.

Logically, he should at least have Asgardian speed (3x) given how he was made. Plus you do not fight people with super speed without some measure of it.


At least class 75 means he's around that area. If we didn't know his upper strength, he'd be at least class 100. We know he's a minimal class 75, and his max at best would be class 100, something Graviton has withstood with ease.

That is what he is at a minimum but it is likley he is class 100 given the fights he had. Otherwise, there is not much of an explanation how he could defeat Thor.


He's shown to be able to do simultaneous things, and his maximum capacity is obviously greater than holding up an entire island and still owning the Avengers. If he can hold that for eight hours... Wow. He only needs to keep Durok immobile for long enough to get him disqualified.

Ok this is something I did not realise and had assumed that if he was kept immobile for only a period of time, and that he was struggling and attempting to break free, the battle goes on.

When, exactly? I don't recall this incident, truthfully here. I thought you were referring to his fight with Iron Man while he was with the West Coast Avengers. Besides that, he owned the Thunderbolts and Avengers after that, so really, that doesn't matter much.

The one outside the prison.

Heck, he's literally held most superheroes in the air, levitated dozens of cities across the globe AND fought the Thunderbolts. He has unlimited power over gravity. He was capable of hurling a pebble from China to Australia, killing one single person. That's the magnitude and refinement of his powers.

He has also been defeated and his powers are limited in time as he cannot use them continuously.


Of course he can hurt Graviton, but it's doubtful he'll hit him. Lest we also forget, Durok never actually beat the Surfer, and the Surfer was able to stand up to him quite well.

The Surfer was knocked down by him and only recovered by reshaping his board. He then trasported Durok to a future timeline meaning he survived by battle removal and nothing else.


Graviton doesn't tire as easily as you think. Besides, manipulating the Savage Land would cost little energy from Graviton.


It's not necessary to hold him indefinitely. Just enough to keep him immobile long enough. He's kept class 70-100 characters this way before, for quite a time. He can do it with Durok as well. Another, kinda cheap, strategy would be to simply punt Durok into space/other side of the planet, removing him from the battlefield.


One thing I failed to mention here is that Graviton has no idea who Durok is and could just as easily be surprised to see Durok from a distance shoot superfast concussive blasts at him. If they connect and they would, then Graviton is out for the count.

I waqs an idiot for failing to mention it but Graviton would have no reason to put up shields from a distance if he sees Durok. Sure he would take Durok for a bruiser but there is no way he would realise the golem could shoot blasts off of his fists. And these were blasts that took the SIlver Surfer by surprise and there is no reason they would not take Graviton.

Graviton remains human and without his shields he is as vulnerable as you and I. And there is no reason for himt o keep his shields on permanently. So if Graviton came at him from a distance he would be surprised if he was blasted. Graviton has been defeated despit all his powers due to shortcomings in his planning and overconfidence. this would serve him as a disservice here.


They've also withstood Iron Man's, so that doesn't hold up. It took him a while to knock out Thor, and considering he's still stated to be around the class 75 level, I doubt he'll be hitting those shields any harder than Thor did.


No, the Surfer just didn't do it. Big difference.

Well he might hit them harder then Thor given Thor was KOed by Durok. But that will not be my startegy in any case. And the Surfer did not because maybe he could not. You just don't know.


9 to 18 hours is enough for disqualifying. Besides, if it really got out of hand, Graviton could just fling Durok into space. Again, unlimited control of gravity. Besides, there's not much for Durok to fight. It kept Wonder Man and Iron Man under control. Both of them. It required little energy from Graviton.


If Graviton even so much as gets the idea he can not simply win this, he'll take Durok and throw him away. There's no defense against this from Durok. And again, limitless endurance is useless when you're disqualified after two hours.

I did not know there was a time limit but struugling and stretching the bonds is not exactly being kept immobile.


Durok's also had four appearances, of which three cover one arc. So, although the "never" is accurate, it isn't really relevant.

He was not in those appearances because in his last appeaqrance he gets toasted by King Thor.


You severely underestimate Graviton's endurance. With the feats he's pulled off? Eight hours is a lot. I've also finally found this Iron Man thing you are referring to. New Avengers apparently, where it was already shown that Graviton was severely weakened by the prison, so really, it doesn't really count. That's one weak appearance against numerous very very powerful ones.

How am I underestimating it. I took the time provided to me. ANd in any case, this match could be over before it started as Graviton was always overconfident and Durok's concussive blasts are his trump card.

WINNER=DUROK
 
REBUTTAL: Graviton vs Durok
I know how long that is but I did not know there was atime limit on these bouts.
Not so much a time limit as there is a limit to how long a character can remain immobile before he or she is considered defeated. It's been a stickler for debate in quite a few matches, and we don't have an exact time, but considering the amount of time Graviton held the Avengers...

I was not referring to that defeat but the one in prison. But it does go to show that Graviton is defeatable.
Of course he's capable of being defeated, but it is only by preying on his innate insecurities. His first defeat was because his love interest apparently commited suicide and he pretty much went mad and lost control. His defeat against the Thunderbolts came about because of Moonstone psyching him out. It's usually Graviton himself that leads to a defeat. Unfortunately, Durok doesn't have Graviton's psych profile and he's also a completely silent character.

Logically, he should at least have Asgardian speed (3x) given how he was made. Plus you do not fight people with super speed without some measure of it.
A somewhat logical speculation, I will give you that. Considering however that Graviton has fought the Avengers, among them members Iron Man and Thor, I say he matches up pretty well against superspeed.

That is what he is at a minimum but it is likley he is class 100 given the fights he had. Otherwise, there is not much of an explanation how he could defeat Thor.
Weaker characters have been known to knock out stronger. Even then, let's say he makes class 100. Graviton has stood up to that before. Heck, he took a direct blow to the head from Thor and wasn't fazed.

Ok this is something I did not realise and had assumed that if he was kept immobile for only a period of time, and that he was struggling and attempting to break free, the battle goes on.
Iron Man: "Can't move a muscle... but we'd be dead if Graviton's girl hadn't pleaded for our lives!" He was capable of keeping Iron Man immobile, and numerous other Avengers, and still had the time to keep the island afloat and yakk to the girl. If he has only one opponent to fight? Just think of the possibilities.

He has also been defeated and his powers are limited in time as he cannot use them continuously.
Sure, he can't go fighting day after day, but this eight hour time limit really isn't that big of a deal. That's a limit at maximum capacity, one which allows him to reshape and terraform the entire earth.

The Surfer was knocked down by him and only recovered by reshaping his board. He then trasported Durok to a future timeline meaning he survived by battle removal and nothing else.
He actually traded a few blows with Durok before whisking him off to an alternate future. Heck, Durok didn't even knock the Surfer unconscious, just down. Moments later, he's back up and trading blows with the guy again. From the text I'm reading at marvunapp, it didn't really tax the Surfer as much as you're suggesting.

One thing I failed to mention here is that Graviton has no idea who Durok is and could just as easily be surprised to see Durok from a distance shoot superfast concussive blasts at him. If they connect and they would, then Graviton is out for the count.

I waqs an idiot for failing to mention it but Graviton would have no reason to put up shields from a distance if he sees Durok. Sure he would take Durok for a bruiser but there is no way he would realise the golem could shoot blasts off of his fists. And these were blasts that took the SIlver Surfer by surprise and there is no reason they would not take Graviton.
Graviton is not an idiot. In fact, he's quite the genius. He's been told to do battle with this creature. He's putting up shields. It's really really doubtful Durok will be able to surprise Graviton with a blast from afar. There is no feasible reason for Graviton to not have his shields up. He is in mortal combat here.

Graviton remains human and without his shields he is as vulnerable as you and I. And there is no reason for himt o keep his shields on permanently. So if Graviton came at him from a distance he would be surprised if he was blasted. Graviton has been defeated despit all his powers due to shortcomings in his planning and overconfidence. this would serve him as a disservice here.
No reason? C'mon, Graviton is arrogant but not stupid. He knows he's fighting this big bruiser. He has no idea of what he's capable of. Graviton has every reason to have his shields up. Heck, even when he was sure he had defeated the Avengers, and Thor took him by surprise, he had his shields up.

Well he might hit them harder then Thor given Thor was KOed by Durok. But that will not be my startegy in any case. And the Surfer did not because maybe he could not. You just don't know.
And neither do you. The Surfer was able to at least stalemate Durok, and Thor was capable of such for a time as well. The Surfer simply couldn't be bothered anymore and whisked him away. Who knows what he could've done to Durok if he hadn't done that. We don't know because that's not how the story is written. It's false to say however that dropping him in an alternate future is the only way to take Durok down.

He was not in those appearances because in his last appeaqrance he gets toasted by King Thor.
That's my point. He has a total of four appearances. Three of those are the battles we're using in this debate, namely his fight with Thor and the Surfer. His last appearance was basically a cameo.

How am I underestimating it. I took the time provided to me. ANd in any case, this match could be over before it started as Graviton was always overconfident and Durok's concussive blasts are his trump card.
Again, overconfident, but never stupid. You are underestimating the magnitude of Graviton's powers and his maximum capacity. Basically being able to hold the earth in the palm of your hand and reshape it is some grand power. Power that Durok can't stand against.

Besides, as an alternative strategy to 'flinging him into an alternate universe', Graviton can pick Durok up with his powers and throw him into space/other side of earth, causing an automatic ring-out. Graviton doesn't care about anyone else but himself, and he would have no problem sticking Durok on some desolate asteroid.

WINNER=GRAVITON
 
I am not going to argue this further as we are going to circles.

My argument relies on 2 factors:

1. Durok takes him by surprise without Graviton having his shields up from afar using his concussive blasts. Without the shields Graviton is toast.

or

2. Durok is able to withstand Graviton's powers until they wear out which they surely do anywhere between 8 hours and 19 (the maximum length of which he can use his powers even conservatively). In this scenario, Graviton is again toast once he is powerless.

If you agree with any of these 2 strategies then Durok wins.
 
FINAL COMMENTS: Graviton vs Durok

I agree that it is now up to the voter. I would like to give some thoughts to keep in mind:
- Graviton is arrogant, but not stupid.
- Graviton has nigh-unlimited control of gravity.
- Durok has pretty much had only one appearance.
- Graviton has defeated both Avengers and Thunderbolts.
- He's held up most of the world's heroes up in the air like ragdolls.

WINNER=GRAVITON
 
*Iron Man

*Durok - (I went back and forth on this one. In the end, I think Gravitron will be surprised by Durok's power level. Either way, just another match-up this week that was so close, it could be a draw.)

*Sunfire - (Ok, I'm a bit peeved that I lost to Mastermind last round; mainly because I would have bet that Darth wouldn't debate him the following round. Anyway, you debate, you win.)

*Black Panther - (The biggest difference between this season and last is that someone is getting to debate Black Panther and making him just as strong as many other contestants this season. There are certain people that you have a hate/love relationship when it comes to debating, and Harlekin is just that. He's so good, you love that you'll get some great debating skills, but you hate that it sure isn't going to be easy to win a match, regardless of the character.)
 
Black Panther- Would have been a hell of a fight, but there was no debate

Sunfire

Iron Man

Graviton- real tough match, but Graviton's versatility and his ability to perform multiple tasks with his power makes me think his shields can be up while he fights Durok giving him enough time to get the victory.
 
Sunfire
Iron Man
Black Panther (I could have been persuaded, but wasn't.)
Gravitron (I had to go back and forth on this one. Good job on both sides.)
 
Iron Man (Jack could win this. And I'm not sure who will be better in the next rounds)
Graviton (I so wanted to vote for Durok, and still think Durok could win this. But there's a couple of tricks Graviton could do to pull this one out. Barely.)
Sunfire (Mastermind's a great character, but Sunfire has the distance advantage)
Black Panther (Hulk can take this. But of the few normal characters that can take down Hulk, T'Challa is one of them.)
 
Jack of Hearts
Gravitron
Sunfire
Savage Hulk- I love BP, but not even the likes of Wolvie and co have been able to down the Hulk.
 
Iron Man
Durok
Sunfire
Black Panther - if my request is not accepted by the heads of the game, then given there was no debate, then BP takes it. I am just hoping these votes will not count.
 
Final Results:

Iron Man defeats Jack Of Hearts 7-1
Gravitron defeats Durok The Demonlisher 6-2
Sunfire-Exiles defeats Mastermind 8-0
Black Panther/Hulk will be a rematch
 
CoM.jpg


BRACKET 1,

Match 3:

Tana Nile (PHAEDRUS45) bio

th_bio-tananile.jpg


vs.

Psylocke (PRIMEMOVER) bio

th_psylocke2.jpg


Match 4:

Banshee (HIPPY FASCIST) bio

th_Banshee.jpg


vs.

Damien Hellstrom (HARLEKIN) bio

th_b7_2.jpg
 
BRACKET 2,

Match 3:

Frankie Raye (PHAEDRUS45) bio

th_12v3.jpg


vs.

Cable - Telepath (HIPPY FASCIST) bio

th_cable.gif


Match 4:

Scarlet Witch (AHURA MAZDA) bio

th_scarletwitch.jpg


vs.

Georgeous George (HARLEKIN) bio

(NO PICTURE AVAILABLE)
 
NOT QUITE A REMATCH:

Black Panther (HARLEKIN) bio

th_Black-Panther.jpg


vs.

Savage Hulk (AHURA MAZDA) bio

th_hulk1.gif


(This match is delayed from last week. It will still take place in the Savage Land to make things fair. It will be as if they are fighting for the first time, so not really a rematch.)
 

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