Contest of Marvels II Thread 3

[Zoken]

YOu assume Fisk is just bowling them over. How about this. As Fisk runs, he's picking them up and hurling them at Mandarin. keep those nasty little rings occupied while he gets closer. once in close, Fisk is a highly adept brawler, trained in Sumo among other things. he can grapple with someone stronger than himself and faster than himself. Once he gets close, which he will do wonderfully, he will put such a hurt on Mandarin.

 

[wiegeabo]

YOu assume Fisk is just bowling them over. How about this. As Fisk runs, he's picking them up and hurling them at Mandarin. keep those nasty little rings occupied while he gets closer. once in close, Fisk is a highly adept brawler, trained in Sumo among other things. he can grapple with someone stronger than himself and faster than himself. Once he gets close, which he will do wonderfully, he will put such a hurt on Mandarin.

A nice vortex from his ring would blow all those flying people away. Or he could just disintegrate them, and Fisk with them.

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Abyss (AoA) vs Slapstick

The idea is that if Abyss can't get Slapstick to come near him (and I"m curious how Slapstick can win if he doesn't come near) then he'll force him to.

You wonder how Slapstick can beat Abyss without getting near? Good old cartoon hammerspace can take care of that. He can use to take out a multitude of projectile weapons, just like our good friends Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck.

Slapstick's heroic ways will be his downfall. Too bad for him that Abyss from the Age of Apocalypse is sadistic and doesn't mind killing kids to get what he wants.

I'm not going to dispute your strategy. It's a sound one. Thing is, knowing what kind of ruthless bastard Abyss is, I doubt Slapstick would give him much of a chance to start pulling folks in (who will be hiding in their houses anyway, so it's not like they'll instantly be sucked in, but eventually). He's going to take the kid's gloves off and hit him with all he's got. I think a rocket launcher should do it.

WINNER=SLAPSTICK

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Random vs Hisako Ichiki

If anyone is wondering, I found these two biographies that more accurately describe what Random is in fact capable of. So yes, he is capable of adapting to the mutant powers of others, but he doesn't actually have any idea of what Hisako is capable of, she's just a teenage girl to him. On the other hand, Hisako is quite capable of finding info about Random, since he was both a public figure, and she would have some access to the X-Men files.

Random may be strong, and he may be tough, and he may be able to adapt to mutant powers, but he can be taken by surprise (such as in X-Men #112, where he's taken out by a blast from Cyclops). If he's caught off guard he's not all that special.

And that's really what my argument hinges on, whether you're capable of believing that smart, probable future leader of the X-Men is capable of taking an oafish, ruled by his johnson punk by surprise. Then you need to ask yourself, can she hit hard enough to take him out? Sure she can. Cyclops' blast as employed in that issue wasn't particularly a hard-hitting one (otherwise it would have simply destroyed the wall he ricocheted the blast off) and was still capable of taking out Random.

She's got the smarts, she's got the power.

WINNER=HISAKO ICHIKI

 

[JewishHobbit]

REBUTTAL: Abyss (AoA) vs Slapstick


You wonder how Slapstick can beat Abyss without getting near? Good old cartoon hammerspace can take care of that. He can use to take out a multitude of projectile weapons, just like our good friends Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck.


I'm not going to dispute your strategy. It's a sound one. Thing is, knowing what kind of ruthless bastard Abyss is, I doubt Slapstick would give him much of a chance to start pulling folks in (who will be hiding in their houses anyway, so it's not like they'll instantly be sucked in, but eventually). He's going to take the kid's gloves off and hit him with all he's got. I think a rocket launcher should do it.

WINNER=SLAPSTICK

Thing is... the match isn't starting with everyone in their house. They go in their house after these two odd looking people show up, and so they go running and screaming. There's PLENTY of time for Abyss to start taking captives. He's not dumb, he was a horseman afterall, and he remembers the previous match. He'll start with the victoms asap, and Slapstick won't have any time to do much more than protect the innocent, resaulting in his victory.

And those projectile weapons are no good if Granny Gumdrops and Little Lilly are in danger of being sucked into a Hell-Like demention, being waved in the way of danger. It's gotta be up close and personal.

Winner - Abyss (AoA)

 

[hippy fascist]

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/1486/******edcatvt1.jpg

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Abyss (AoA) vs Slapstick

Yeah, it's really about whether you believe that Slapstick could take care of Abyss before there are any serious casualties. It's also the question if he can save an innocent and shoot Abyss at the same time, and I'd say yes. Really, similar to the last time, it's about what people believe about our characters in this particular instance. If the first thing Abyss is faced with is a cartoon rocket to his face, I doubt he has much time to start tendrilling victims.

I say he can do it.

What do you believe?

WINNER=SLAPSTICK

 

[Iceman]

Opening Comments: Microbe Vs Maxam

The only way Maxam can lose this fight is if people vote against him for not being a well known name. To give those who are unfamiliar with the character an indication of his pedigree, Maxam was a member of the Infinity Watch alongside the likes of Adam Warlock, Drax the Destroyer and Thanos (a secret member). He only ever fights alongside the likes of Dr Strange, Silver Surfer, Hulk, Thor, Beta Ray Bill…. (check bio if unsure).

A basic level of intelligence will allow anyone reading the name Microbe to hazard a guess as to the primary tactics of their opponent. Maxam has class 100 strength, is both physically invulnerable and immune to telepathic assault, all of which are barely relevant here.

The Watch tested Maxam's strength, finding him "near Drax's non-adrenalined peak...in a class with the Hulk.

I mention them to indicate the general resilience of the guy (resistance to disease of cosmic characters is obviously assumed rather than specifically mentioned) and unless Microbe can create germs/viruses on a cosmic level capable of taking down the likes of the people mentioned above, my boy will take this one in his sleep. Microbe has never shown this level of potential and has only ever proven himself as a small time operator.

Additionally, Maxam can grow exponentially in size to help find his target more quickly. The Transian villagers are more likely to help an extremely large cosmic fellow than a strange looking guy carrying disease. In any event, he can also fly to evade the effects of any virus and also to find Microbe (who is unlikely to be able to effectively blend in with the Transians) quickly without taking any risks. Maxam also has knowledge of sophisticated technology although this should not be necessary for this match.

If you need further convincing, please refer to the bios of the two characters which provide extensive proof that there is only one possible conclusion.

WINNER = MAXAM

 

[Trigger]

Opening Comments: Microbe Vs Maxam

The only way Maxam can lose this fight is if people vote against him for not being a well known name. To give those who are unfamiliar with the character an indication of his pedigree, Maxam was a member of the Infinity Watch alongside the likes of Adam Warlock, Drax the Destroyer and Thanos (a secret member). He only ever fights alongside the likes of Dr Strange, Silver Surfer, Hulk, Thor, Beta Ray Bill…. (check bio if unsure).

I'd blame my amazing charm.

A basic level of intelligence will allow anyone reading the name Microbe to hazard a guess as to the primary tactics of their opponent. Maxam has class 100 strength, is both physically invulnerable and immune to telepathic assault, all of which are barely relevant here.

A name like Microbe could mean anything. Maybe he shrinks? Maybe he has a microscopic penis? Unless I misread, isn't his class 100 strength only really reached when he's at full height? I'd imagine he won't be at full height during this entire encounter unless he just loves provoking villagers.

I mention them to indicate the general resilience of the guy (resistance to disease of cosmic characters is obviously assumed rather than specifically mentioned) and unless Microbe can create germs/viruses on a cosmic level capable of taking down the likes of the people mentioned above, my boy will take this one in his sleep. Microbe has never shown this level of potential and has only ever proven himself as a small time operator.

Assuming he functions in any way similar to that of a normal human, who's to say that Microbe couldn't just research a virus that could slip past a body's natural immune system? Or, give Maxam cancer by tricking his white blood cells into attacking his own body's cells?

Additionally, Maxam can grow exponentially in size to help find his target more quickly. The Transian villagers are more likely to help an extremely large cosmic fellow than a strange looking guy carrying disease.

Maxam has, in the past, gone psycho during a fight, and assuming he encountered Microbe what's to stop him from doing it again. I'd also imagine that a cosmic being would scare them more than a seemingly innocent traveler.

In any event, he can also fly to evade the effects of any virus and also to find Microbe (who is unlikely to be able to effectively blend in with the Transians) quickly without taking any risks. Maxam also has knowledge of sophisticated technology although this should not be necessary for this match.

Viruses can be transmitted through the air. Flying wouldn't help much if someone coughed in his direction, and without medical training, how would he know the differemce between someone who just had a case of the flu and someone who had the beginning stages of the Ebola virus or something? Furthermore, how could Maxam find lil' old Microbe without mingingly with the villagers? I seriously doubt he'd just wait out in the open, and I'm sure Transia has a few inns.

 

[JewishHobbit]

REBUTTAL: Abyss (AoA) vs Slapstick

Yeah, it's really about whether you believe that Slapstick could take care of Abyss before there are any serious casualties. It's also the question if he can save an innocent and shoot Abyss at the same time, and I'd say yes. Really, similar to the last time, it's about what people believe about our characters in this particular instance. If the first thing Abyss is faced with is a cartoon rocket to his face, I doubt he has much time to start tendrilling victims.

I say he can do it.

What do you believe?

WINNER=SLAPSTICK

No he can't!

WINNER=ABYSS

 

[Phaedrus45]

Ultimus vs. Doppleganger:

Sadly, this really is no match. While it's hard to find information on Ultimus, enough is provided to see how this outcome would play out. A list of Ultimus' powers state:

"Superhuman strength, speed, stamina, agility and reflexes, metahuman durability, besides the ability to manipulate cosmic energy "

Now, a look at Doppleganger's powers:

"Doppleganger is basically an evil counterpart to Spider-Man and his powers mimic that of Spider-Man in speed, stamina, and strength...Plus has the extra agility and use of four extra arms...He cannot talk and is basically mindless."

The main thing you should notice with Doppleganger is that he's "basically mindless." His instinct would be, when in danger, to attack. And, against the power cosmic, he'd be fried like a spider flung into a fire pit.

Now, as stated in another brief bio, Ultimus is "the only Kree Eternal still known to be alive." He's over 3000 years old, and has "metahuman durability," meaning someone like Doppleganger would be very hard-pressed to make much of an impact.

Winner: Ultimus

Still More:

I found a good bio in the Official Marvel Handbook Master Edition on Ultimus. It states the following under powers:

"Ultimus has the ability to manipulate cosmic energy to augment his life force, granting him great longevity and regenerative abilities, the projection of cosmic energy as concussive bolts from his hands, the ability to project an invisible force field about his body varying from a radius of one-inch to several yards, the ability to fly by harnessing anti-gravitons, and possibly other powers."

Also, under Strength, it says he has "Superhuman Class 90" powers, under Speed and Stamina both say "Superhuman," and under Durability it says "Metahuman."

All this shows that Doppleganger doesn't stand a chance against Ultimus. With Ultimus' force field, Doppleganger wouldn't even be able to cause a scratch, and in the end, this is really one of the most lop-sided fights yet. Just like a spider trying to scurry away from a human, this Doppleganger will be crushed under Ultimus' foot.

Winner = Ultimus

 

[Harlekin]

No he can't!

Yes, he can!

WINNER=SLAPSTICK

 

[Iceman]

Rebuttal: MAXAM Vs MICROBE

I'd blame my amazing charm.

You are so very charming t:

A name like Microbe could mean anything. Maybe he shrinks? Maybe he has a microscopic penis? Unless I misread, isn't his class 100 strength only really reached when he's at full height? I'd imagine he won't be at full height during this entire encounter unless he just loves provoking villagers.

t: I’m sure the guy does indeed have a micro penis (more evidence of your charm I see ) While any name can theoretically have any meaning, the name Microbe gives away more than most (Strong Guy might have it beat though ). The name Maxam, for example, doesn’t give away a great deal.

As for his class 100 strength being at full size, I believe you are correct. As I understand it, his strength increases proportionally with his size. I don’t think he needs to be at either full height or strength for this contest but can take the option if he sees fit. The villagers will do what someone of his size asks (if and when he chooses to ask) and Maxam won’t worry too much if they get a bit upset. He is saving them from a virus that could wipe them out after all.

Assuming he functions in any way similar to that of a normal human, who's to say that Microbe couldn't just research a virus that could slip past a body's natural immune system? Or, give Maxam cancer by tricking his white blood cells into attacking his own body's cells?

I’m not sure how safe that assumption is. Maxam has been robustly genetically enhanced by and doesn’t have the weak physiology of a regular human. Is Microbe to conduct the research mentioned above without trial (he doesn’t have any cosmic beings or villages to conduct his research on) and then be successful at first attempt within the short period of prep time available? Even in the exceptional scenario that Maxam were to somehow become infected (not something I accept) and that his immune system was unable to fight it off, even cancers do not kill regular humans on the spot. In fact they often take years to display any symptoms at all and don’t forget we are talking cosmic being here, not regular human. He would still have plenty of time to claim the victory in the knowledge that Microbe could prove no further threat to him.

Also, if the virus really is strong enough to infect and debilitate Maxam, the humans may be killed off extremely quickly, before they have the chance to spread the virus to him. If not, and the virus spreads like wildfire, does Microbe really want to kill the whole population of Transia in an attempt to win this fight? Anyone who isn’t a complete villain will struggle with this action, even if it costs them a match (especially one they can easily lose even after condemning all those innocent people to death). If this virus is as infectious as it needs to be and is also truly capable of taking out Maxam, we are effectively saying that it is also capable of taking out the whole world’s human population and about 97% of the world’s superhero population, even threatening the other cosmic beings. We have to ask whether Microbe is skilled enough at his craft to create something this powerful and fast-working in such a short space of time and whether he is prepared to cause an event of this scale.

Maxam has, in the past, gone psycho during a fight, and assuming he encountered Microbe what's to stop him from doing it again.

He has no need to go psycho here. Obviously, if he goes psycho the fight will be over quickly and we may have some upset villagers but this won’t bother him too much, especially as his actions could save their lives.

I'd also imagine that a cosmic being would scare them more than a seemingly innocent traveler.

That’s my point. A cosmic being will scare them into helping (if he chooses this path) while a seemingly innocent traveller will be reliant on hospitality which may or may not be given.

Viruses can be transmitted through the air. Flying wouldn't help much if someone coughed in his direction, and without medical training, how would he know the differemce between someone who just had a case of the flu and someone who had the beginning stages of the Ebola virus or something? Furthermore, how could Maxam find lil' old Microbe without mingingly with the villagers? I seriously doubt he'd just wait out in the open, and I'm sure Transia has a few inns.

They can be but they have a limited range. The further they are dispersed, the chance of infection drastically reduces. It is not that out of character for cosmic characters to fly around “in the open” surveying things from afar and then coming in when they can deal with a situation quickly. That’s what half of them spend most of their time doing anyway. I would find the image of Maxam walking in to a local Eastern European inn a lot more strange.

Initally, there is every possibility that Maxam will conduct surveillance from the skies, well out of range of the virus. He won’t be approaching the villagers until he feels he needs to and by then, things may have begun to look suspicious down below.

Maxam also has knowledge of sophisticated technology and could use this in many ways. For example, he could use a basic scanning device related to body heat in conjunction with his eyes in the sky to monitor any suspicious movements. Even if it is a dark age device and cannot for some reason differentiate between Microbe and the regular villagers (I would be embarrassed to refer to it as sophisticated if so), it will still narrow down the locations of all possible villains to the village (he would have brought this into the fight not knowing that the signal would be confused with the many humans). As soon as the humans start dropping, he knows not to get too close and the scanner becomes more effective.


End the fight quickly
Considering all the debates thus far, the only chance Microbe has would be if the two begin the contest both well hidden and far away from each other. Otherwise the fight ends in a matter of minutes as Maxam flies over to the fellow and boshes him (once will do it) before or only minutes after the virus has spread.

Not part of this debate: It is only fair that any assumption that the two combatants are well hidden and far away from each other at the start of a contest should apply equally to the Gladiator II Vs Topher match (Thread I) where my character needs to evade at the outset.


Surveillance from distance
Maxam may choose to play defensive particularly if he is worried that he is unaware of his opponent’s powers (re one of your earlier arguments). Microbe would be helpless if Maxam doesn’t show during the early stages as he watches his own virus destroy the human shield that was offering him his sole means of protection.

With the surveillance from above, Microbe needs to make a dash for a dwelling at the very beginning of the match. He has to find an accommodating villager or family and hope to Hell that he can convince them to let him stay indefinitely (I very much doubt he has the people skills for this). When someone turns ill, they normally don’t want strangers in the house to see them at their worst. I personally (being European) only want family close by and don’t even like having good friends as guests when I get ill.

If Microbe is planning on setting up camp with one particular villager for the whole duration (as soon as he moves between dwellings, he is taking the risk that Maxam sees him and takes him out) his hosts are likely to become impatient with his presence sooner or later. Europeans don’t tend to take in strangers at no notice for no personal gain and for indefinite periods. The sudden outbreak of disease would also cause them to get suspicious, especially when they realise that everyone except their new tenant is getting ill. Going by his picture and bio, Microbe does not look like or act like your ordinary guy and will be unlikely to blend in easily.

This one will be a lot easier than the extended debates make it sound. This is probably due to solid debating on your part.

WINNER = MAXAM

 

[wiegeabo]

REBUTTAL: Random vs Hisako Ichiki

If anyone is wondering, I found these two biographies that more accurately describe what Random is in fact capable of. So yes, he is capable of adapting to the mutant powers of others, but he doesn't actually have any idea of what Hisako is capable of, she's just a teenage girl to him. On the other hand, Hisako is quite capable of finding info about Random, since he was both a public figure, and she would have some access to the X-Men files.

Random may be strong, and he may be tough, and he may be able to adapt to mutant powers, but he can be taken by surprise (such as in X-Men #112, where he's taken out by a blast from Cyclops). If he's caught off guard he's not all that special.

And that's really what my argument hinges on, whether you're capable of believing that smart, probable future leader of the X-Men is capable of taking an oafish, ruled by his johnson punk by surprise. Then you need to ask yourself, can she hit hard enough to take him out? Sure she can. Cyclops' blast as employed in that issue wasn't particularly a hard-hitting one (otherwise it would have simply destroyed the wall he ricocheted the blast off) and was still capable of taking out Random.

She's got the smarts, she's got the power.

Sorry about the lateness, it's been that kind of week.


Random's no fool. Well, maybe depending on who you ask. But he's not an idiot...trust me.

Random probably will come up with some smart remarks while trying to get into Hisako's pants. But the second that armor comes up, it's going to be all business (because he wouldn't feel like getting smashed into goop).

So Hisako tries to punch or kick him, and what does Random do, adapt. All of the sudden his body can pass through her armor, and her blow does nothing to him. Then he develops the ability to disrupt her mind with telepathy or somekind of neural attack. Hisako's armor falls, she's defenseless, and Random finishes the fight up.

Random wins

 

[Phaedrus45]

Voting May Begin!

 

[Phaedrus45]

*Mandarin

*Random

*Microbe - (In the end, I don't think Maxam would realize what he's going up against. And, that initial edge, along with Microbe's slovenly appearance, would give Microbe an initial advantage.)

*Ultimus

*Abyss - (In the end, the villagers swayed my decision.)

 

[JewishHobbit]

Mandarin
Ultimus
Abyss (AoA)
Random - (Close one, but Random came out on top)
Microbe - (Man, I went back and forth on this one, and I originally thought that Microbe had NO chance)

 

[hippy fascist]

Mandarin (Flexibility was what won this one for me)

Ultimus (i'd made my mind up the second I heard who was fighting...)

Abyss (AoA) (Funny doesn't win fights )

Hisako- (Hisako's power has something to it makes me think there's more to come, stressfull situations like this bring that kind of thing out...it's a
small glimer of hope, but it was the only thing between them.)

Maxam - (Swung to microbe initially but I/P's debate swung it back Props to my chilly G!)

 

[wiegeabo]

Mandarin
Ultimus
Random
Maxam (although the debates made me very close to picking Microbe even though I had written him off)

Abyss (this is still a tough call)

 

[Darthphere]

Mandarin
Ultimus
Abyss
Hisako
Maxam

 

[Phaedrus45]

Results So Far:

Mandarin currently beating Kingpin 5-0
Random currently beating Hisako Ichiki 3-2
Maxam currently beating Microbe 3-2
Ultimus currently beating Doppleganger 5-0
Abyss currently beating Slapstick 5-0

 

[WOLVERINE25TH]

Mandarin
Hisako
Maxam
Ultimus
Slapstick

 

[kytrigger]

Mandarin
Random
Maxam
Ultimus
Abyss

 

[Harlekin]

Mandarin - Kingpin's outclassed
Hisako Ichiki - For obvious reasons
Microbe - It's a strategy that I feel could work
Ultimus - Doppleganger got a bad luck of the draw here
Slapstick - C'mon now, it's obvious

 

[Ahura Mazda]

Mandarin - the rings are superiour to a peak human
Random - His powers are too flexible for Hisako
Maxam - I think he would be impervious to virus' and I have not been shown information to the contrary
Ultimus - pretty obvious
Abyss - The use of villagers swayed my decision