Contest of Marvels II Thread 4

[Hellstormer]

CH'OD!!!
Storm (I really like Reaper)
Cyclops
Mondo (really hard)

 

[JewishHobbit]

Is this example from the very recent Annihilation: Heralds of Galactus? If it is, it cannot be used as an example.

This was actually from the Drax mini just prior to Annihilation (it's own story aside from Annihilation, so we dubbed it okay). This example is good to go.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Mondo
Cyclops
Storm
Paibok

 

[Ahura Mazda]

Thor - too powerful given the strategy, he could call down lightnening and level the whole area

Cyclops

Paibok

Storm - well done

 

[Phaedrus45]

Results So Far:

Thor currently beating Mondo-AoA 4-3
Cyclops currently beating Death's Head II 6-1
Paibok currently beating Ch'od 6-1
Storm currently beating Reaper 6-1

 

[wiegeabo]

Thor
Death's Head II (I just think Cyclops is overpowered here)
Paibok the Power Skrull
Storm

 

[POWdER-man]

Death's Head (I just don't think Cyclops could beat him)
Storm
Paibok
...Tough call
Thor (although the debate almost swayed me)

 

[hippy fascist]

Cyclops: Debate = win, also vibranium + concussive blasts = genius!)
Paibok
Storm: She will know the area since the 6 issue storm mini is seperate from the black panther arc in question, plus she's just too powerful
Thor: using rain to change mondo's component elements was really creative well debated by JH and the argument made me want to vote for him but thor takes this...just

 

[primemover]

Thor
Cyclops
Paibok
Storm

 

[Phaedrus45]

Final Results:

Thor beast Mondo-AoA 8-3
Cyclops beat Death's Head II 8-3
Paibok beat Ch'od 10-1
Storm beat Reaper 10-1

 

[Phaedrus45]

BRACKET 7,

Match 11:

Diablo (MIDNIGHT ICE) bio

vs.

Titania (MIDNIGHT ICE) bio

Match 12:

Empath (AHURA MAZDA) bio

vs.

Nick Fury (WIEGEABO) bio

 

[Phaedrus45]

BRACKET 8,

Match 11:

Prodigy II - X-Men (ZOKEN) bio

vs.

Justice (HARLEKIN) bio

Match 12:

Valkyrie (AHURA MAZDA) bio

vs.

Clea (WIEGEABO) bio

 

[Phaedrus45]

LOCATION: THE RAFT

The Raft is a fictional prison facility for super-human criminals (predominantly supervillians) in the Marvel Universe. It first appeared in Alias #26 as the "Maximum-Maximum Security" facility of the Ryker's Island Maximum Security Penitentiary, a fictionalised version of New York's Riker's Island.

As revealed in New Avengers #1, The Raft is on an island separate from Ryker's Island. The Raft has eight underwater levels of cells. Each cell is surrounded by thick steel and lined with adamantium. The cells have no windows, instead each cell door has a video camera monitoring the inmate it houses. The video surveillance is two-way, allowing for the inmates to see who is looking at them. The inmates' powers are neutralized and they are allowed no human contact.

(The Raft will be empty, except for the two combatants. Anything that would otherwise be inside of The Raft, except for individuals, will be there. That would include such things as whatever weapons or devices that are normally present to keep the inmates in order.)

 

[Harlekin]

OPENING COMMENTS: Justice vs Prodigy

This is an interesting match, but one I fear Prodigy has no hope of winning. I love Prodigy, don't get me wrong, but he works best in a team structure. Thanks to his abilities, he's perfect for normal prep-time and strategic advise in the field. Thing is, this isn't normal prep-time. It involves only the character and their own resources, so no outsiders. That means he can't absorb any knowledge that would help him against Justice.
In the field, he'd have the same problem. While in the Raft, there would also be no one he could absorb info from on how to operate the systems to help him against Justice. Even absorbing knowledge from Justice won't be much help either.

Thing is however, that, against Justice's powerful telekinetic abilities, Prodigy has no defense. Justice can immobilize him, but he can also gently knock him out. Prodigy's lack of effective offensive powers hurt him a lot against a foe that has much more experience, a great degree of control over already impressive power, oddly enough a knowledge advantage and whose powers can be used both offensively and defensively.

WINNER=JUSTICE

 

[Zoken]

Justice Vs. Prodigy

Okay, prep-time isn't as wasteful as we think. Prodigy has a visor that gives him a HUD link to the X-Men's computer that is shown to contain profiles. surely he would be able to identify Justice if only because he went out with a former X-Man. He'll know to expect Telekinetic attacks and prepare himself to remain at a distance to avoid being pinned down.

Secondly; he doesn't need someone else's brains all of the time. People forget that Alleyne is brilliant in his own right. Prodigy doesn't describe his powers, it describes him. He was able to build a miniature Danger-Room on his own without help from anyone. So once in the Raft all he'll have to do is a spend a few minutes hiding from Justices to figure out how the controls work.

THirdly; Prodigy is a brilliant strategist. setting a trap once he knows how to operate the Raft's systems would be all too easy. A audio/visual feed of Prodigy panting out of breath in one of the cells (It was stated that the feeds went two ways) and Justice would be caught as he tries to put the kid down.

Fourthly; Prodigy's powers CAN be used defensively. He has shown that he can use his powers to anticipate his opponent's attacks even to the point where he dodged bolts of electricity. Dodging a telekinetic grasp would be child's play.

Fifthly; all of the skill and experience that Justice has can be turned against him in an instant to play on his every weakness and shortcoming. Your skill and experience is HIS skill and experience too.

It might not be easy, but it's far from inconcievable that Prodigy could emerge victorious.

Winner: PRODIGY!

 

[Zoken]

OPENING COMMENTS: Justice vs Prodigy

This is an interesting match, but one I fear Prodigy has no hope of winning. I love Prodigy, don't get me wrong, but he works best in a team structure. Thanks to his abilities, he's perfect for normal prep-time and strategic advise in the field. Thing is, this isn't normal prep-time. It involves only the character and their own resources, so no outsiders. That means he can't absorb any knowledge that would help him against Justice.
In the field, he'd have the same problem. While in the Raft, there would also be no one he could absorb info from on how to operate the systems to help him against Justice.

as stated he could figure out for himself, or even download the instructions on his visor

Even absorbing knowledge from Justice won't be much help either.

as stated, you forget that he can use his powers to anticipate his attacks.

Thing is however, that, against Justice's powerful telekinetic abilities, Prodigy has no defense.

Prodigy has proven that he has a good deal of skill on his own as a martial artist

Justice can immobilize him, but he can also gently knock him out. Prodigy's lack of effective offensive powers hurt him a lot against a foe that has much more experience,

experience that becomes his enemy's

a great degree of control over already impressive power, oddly enough a knowledge advantage and whose powers can be used both offensively and defensively.

WINNER=PRODIGY!

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

Okay, prep-time isn't as wasteful as we think. Prodigy has a visor that gives him a HUD link to the X-Men's computer that is shown to contain profiles. surely he would be able to identify Justice if only because he went out with a former X-Man. He'll know to expect Telekinetic attacks and prepare himself to remain at a distance to avoid being pinned down.

Firestar was never a member of the X-Men.

Secondly; he doesn't need someone else's brains all of the time. People forget that Alleyne is brilliant in his own right. Prodigy doesn't describe his powers, it describes him. He was able to build a miniature Danger-Room on his own without help from anyone. So once in the Raft all he'll have to do is a spend a few minutes hiding from Justices to figure out how the controls work.

He'd have to get to those controls first. Justice has an incredible speed advantage in this case, being capable of zipping through the jail looking for Prodigy. Lest we forget, Justice is quite familiar with prisons. There's little chance of him running into anything. Besides, he can look up info on the Raft before he heads into the battle.

THirdly; Prodigy is a brilliant strategist. setting a trap once he knows how to operate the Raft's systems would be all too easy. A audio/visual feed of Prodigy panting out of breath in one of the cells (It was stated that the feeds went two ways) and Justice would be caught as he tries to put the kid down.

Not only is Justice quite the leader and tactician himself, he's also quite good with computers. Not only is the chance of him finding Prodigy before Prodigy can make it to the control room (which Prodigy would have to find a way to enter, anyway, security logically being intact), the chance of Prodigy being able to lure a seasoned veteran like Justice into a trap is slim. It would also be useless to fake the video feed (which would be hard to do anyway in a matter of minutes), since Justice would have to pass that cell at that moment to even notice it.

Fourthly; Prodigy's powers CAN be used defensively. He has shown that he can use his powers to anticipate his opponent's attacks even to the point where he dodged bolts of electricity. Dodging a telekinetic grasp would be child's play.

Which is just plain illogical. The grasp of a telekinetic is not like bolts of electricity. Imagine a great big invisible hand scooping you up. There's really little in the way of being able to avoid that when you've got the average speed and strength of a teenager.

Fifthly; all of the skill and experience that Justice has can be turned against him in an instant to play on his every weakness and shortcoming. Your skill and experience is HIS skill and experience too.

I don't recall that giving Prodigy insight into one's fears and shortcomings as well. Besides the fact that he isn't really the type to play dirty by harping on Justice like that, Justice won't really be intimidated by a 17-year old spouting off some stuff about dear old dad beating him. The copying of his skill (not necessarily his experience) is useless since it relates directly to his power. Something Prodigy doesn't have. He can't really avoid the telekinetics.

WINNER=JUSTICE

 

[Zoken]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

Firestar was never a member of the X-Men.

My mistake, he'd still be able to find information on Justice. he'd still have sufficient prep info.

He'd have to get to those controls first. Justice has an incredible speed advantage in this case, being capable of zipping through the jail looking for Prodigy. Lest we forget, Justice is quite familiar with prisons. There's little chance of him running into anything. Besides, he can look up info on the Raft before he heads into the battle.

he may be familiar with prisons, but not the Raft. which is an enclosed environment where flight is next to useless. going too fast will cause him to collide with things, so he'd only be going about as fast as the average person could run (as he is used to expercizing his telekinetic muscles and not his physical ones).

Not only is Justice quite the leader and tactician himself, he's also quite good with computers. Not only is the chance of him finding Prodigy before Prodigy can make it to the control room (which Prodigy would have to find a way to enter, anyway, security logically being intact), the chance of Prodigy being able to lure a seasoned veteran like Justice into a trap is slim. It would also be useless to fake the video feed (which would be hard to do anyway in a matter of minutes), since Justice would have to pass that cell at that moment to even notice it.

Prodigy uses a small head mounted computer (his visor) constantly. I'm betting he's better with contemporary computers and electronics than Justice is. he would quite probably be able to make it into the control room, seal it against Justice. and faking the transmission wouldn't be a matter of chance, it would involve knowing which rooms Justice was near and playing something that sounds convincing and credible, not some flimsy excuse of a trap.

Which is just plain illogical. The grasp of a telekinetic is not like bolts of electricity. Imagine a great big invisible hand scooping you up. There's really little in the way of being able to avoid that when you've got the average speed and strength of a teenager.

his ability to dodge isn't based on seeing the attack, it's based on knowing where his enemy will attack. besides, his telekinesis has a blue-ish glow last I saw. and besides, he doesn't have the speed and strength of an average teenager. He is physically well trained and an excellent martial artist.

I don't recall that giving Prodigy insight into one's fears and shortcomings as well. Besides the fact that he isn't really the type to play dirty by harping on Justice like that, Justice won't really be intimidated by a 17-year old spouting off some stuff about dear old dad beating him. The copying of his skill (not necessarily his experience) is useless since it relates directly to his power. Something Prodigy doesn't have. He can't really avoid the telekinetics.

I must have misspoke in there, my apology. I didn't mean to intimate that he could know his fears. I'm saying he would be able to analyze Justice's experience and skill and know where he is weak, and where it would be best to out do him. I don't think he could psyche Justice out or anything like that.

WINNER=PRODIGY

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

My mistake, he'd still be able to find information on Justice. he'd still have sufficient prep info.

He'd have bits and pieces, I'll grant you that.

he may be familiar with prisons, but not the Raft. which is an enclosed environment where flight is next to useless. going too fast will cause him to collide with things, so he'd only be going about as fast as the average person could run (as he is used to expercizing his telekinetic muscles and not his physical ones).

The Raft is your typical prison but for supervillains. They are easily navigable. He's not going top speed, but he's going a lot faster than running speed.

Prodigy uses a small head mounted computer (his visor) constantly. I'm betting he's better with contemporary computers and electronics than Justice is. he would quite probably be able to make it into the control room, seal it against Justice. and faking the transmission wouldn't be a matter of chance, it would involve knowing which rooms Justice was near and playing something that sounds convincing and credible, not some flimsy excuse of a trap.

He's definitely better in computers, but he'd have to make his way to the control room first, get in, and THEN hack the computers in order to use the video feeds. Then he'd still have to fake a video feed. This isn't something you do in just 5 minutes. Justice will have found him long by then. Even if he's gotten into the control room, Justice can break that down pretty easily.

his ability to dodge isn't based on seeing the attack, it's based on knowing where his enemy will attack. besides, his telekinesis has a blue-ish glow last I saw. and besides, he doesn't have the speed and strength of an average teenager. He is physically well trained and an excellent martial artist.

The blue-ish glow is artistic license in order to show the telekinetics. It's like the Invisible Woman, of which we see a transparent outline, even though she should be completely invisible. Even if you know where he's going to attack, Justice has such fine control over his powers, he can not only use it to expand into an area large enough to trap Prodigy, he can also apply it a lot faster than Prodigy can dodge. Martial arts aren't going to be of any use here either, since Justice won't be coming anywhere close to him.

I must have misspoke in there, my apology. I didn't mean to intimate that he could know his fears. I'm saying he would be able to analyze Justice's experience and skill and know where he is weak, and where it would be best to out do him. I don't think he could psyche Justice out or anything like that.

And where would he be weak exactly? He'd have to be in Justice's vicinity anyway, and then it's already too late to do anything. It's not like he can do any hit and run tactics or the like. Prodigy is just a little too out of his league.

WINNER=JUSTICE

 

[Zoken]

The Raft is your typical prison but for supervillains. They are easily navigable. He's not going top speed, but he's going a lot faster than running speed.

Not in the cramped conditions we saw in NA#1 that place was dimly lit, and the corridors were tight. He won't be able to operate at any sort of accelerated speed. he'd be better off running than flying.

He's definitely better in computers, but he'd have to make his way to the control room first, get in, and THEN hack the computers in order to use the video feeds. Then he'd still have to fake a video feed. This isn't something you do in just 5 minutes. Justice will have found him long by then. Even if he's gotten into the control room, Justice can break that down pretty easily.

how exactly does Justice find him so quickly? you haven't explained that yet. Justice has no special abilities to track or sense. he just has telekinesis and happens to be from the future. Prodigy however has been trained by Wolverine and other X-Men. and while he doesn't retain their skills, he is a fast learner and has picked up a great deal of stealth and survival abilities. also, it probably would be something HE could do in five minutes. again this is a kid with the technical expertise to build his own mini-dangerroom in a cave under the grounds. and no he wouldn't be able to break in easily because the prison is designed to resist meta-human prisoners. Prodigy would be able to turn the defenses on Justice and put him down easily. (If you are going to counter with what happened during the break-out, I remind you that only happened because Electro powered the prison down first)

The blue-ish glow is artistic license in order to show the telekinetics. It's like the Invisible Woman, of which we see a transparent outline, even though she should be completely invisible. Even if you know where he's going to attack, Justice has such fine control over his powers, he can not only use it to expand into an area large enough to trap Prodigy, he can also apply it a lot faster than Prodigy can dodge. Martial arts aren't going to be of any use here either, since Justice won't be coming anywhere close to him.

for starters the blue-ish glow thing was a joke, but I didn't make that very clear, so bad on me. next, Prodigy will know what Justice's next move is. what part of that is unclear? he can anticipate Justice's every move and dodge and get in close enough where the telekinetic power is useless. and in a close in hand to hand fight, Prodigy wins. the power levels you are describing where no one could dodge them, are ridiculous. he may have control over his power, but Prodigy will be a step ahead of him literally knowing every move Justice will make as soon as he does.

And where would he be weak exactly? He'd have to be in Justice's vicinity anyway, and then it's already too late to do anything. It's not like he can do any hit and run tactics or the like. Prodigy is just a little too out of his league.

I don't know, I'm not Prodigy facing Justice. I don't have the mutant power, nor am I an expert in the character of Justice. Prodigy would know. he would know where Justice is weack, and exactly where to strike. and just be cause he's close doesn't mean he's hopeless. as I said before he would be able to dodge any attack Justice sent at him. He has dodged lighting using his powers. let me state this again. He has dodge lightning (Which moves at the speed of light) using his telepathic ablities. and as soon as it is an up-close fight, Prodigy has the advantage of being a trained martial artist. Besides, who says Prodigy doesn't hack the prison's defense systems and shut down telekinetic powers? heck, even if he has to shut down all mutant powers, he still has the advantage as those martial arts skills and training are his own. Out of his league? I don't think so. He can outclass Justice anyday of the week.

WINNER=PRODIGY

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

Not in the cramped conditions we saw in NA#1 that place was dimly lit, and the corridors were tight. He won't be able to operate at any sort of accelerated speed. he'd be better off running than flying.

Cramped enough for 3 people to basically walk next to one another. Long stretches of corridors are easily flown through. That's a hell of an advantage over having to run the same distance.

how exactly does Justice find him so quickly? you haven't explained that yet. Justice has no special abilities to track or sense. he just has telekinesis and happens to be from the future.

From the future? You're thinking of his Guardians of the Galaxy analogue. And like I've said, Justice can more easily navigate through the prison than Prodigy can. There's long stretches of corridors that Justice can quickly fly through.

Prodigy however has been trained by Wolverine and other X-Men. and while he doesn't retain their skills, he is a fast learner and has picked up a great deal of stealth and survival abilities. also, it probably would be something HE could do in five minutes. again this is a kid with the technical expertise to build his own mini-dangerroom in a cave under the grounds. and no he wouldn't be able to break in easily because the prison is designed to resist meta-human prisoners. Prodigy would be able to turn the defenses on Justice and put him down easily.

- Justice is trained by Captain America and has more than tenfold the experience in the business than Prodigy has.
- He didn't build that mini-Danger Room in five minutes. Besides the fact you can't use that as an example (this is pre-House of M Prodigy), it also took him quite a while to build, and it still had a few glitches. He's not some Kitty Pryde with computers. He's good, but not five minutes good.
- Justice has shown the strength to be able to bust through a few walls or enforced doors. Easily is an overstatement, but it wouldn't take long at all.

for starters the blue-ish glow thing was a joke, but I didn't make that very clear, so bad on me. next, Prodigy will know what Justice's next move is. what part of that is unclear? he can anticipate Justice's every move and dodge and get in close enough where the telekinetic power is useless.

Telekinetics are useful right up to a milimeter of the body. I don't think you have a good idea of Justice's capabilities. Telekinetics aren't like bolts of energy. He can form like a hand and scoop up Prodigy using his telekinetics powers. It's quite similar to constructs somebody like Quasar makes, but not cosmically powered. You can't avoid something that blanket the entire area. What part of that is unclear?

and in a close in hand to hand fight, Prodigy wins.

It'd never come down to that because Justice wouldn't allow Prodigy to get anywhere near him.

the power levels you are describing where no one could dodge them, are ridiculous. he may have control over his power, but Prodigy will be a step ahead of him literally knowing every move Justice will make as soon as he does.

That's not level of power. That's degree of fine control over your power. Like I said, you can't stop something that can blanket an entire area. If one can put a telekinetic forcefield like construct around you, how are you going to dodge that? He could start at the edges of the area and just enclose around Prodigy. You're severely underestimating the amount of control he has over his power.

So Prodigy will know there's a contruct enclosing around him, how's he going to avoid it exactly? He has no superspeed, no superstrength. He's as powerful as an ordinary human. That's like saying Prodigy would be able to dodge one of Cyclops' broad blasts because he knows it's coming.

I don't know, I'm not Prodigy facing Justice. I don't have the mutant power, nor am I an expert in the character of Justice. Prodigy would know. he would know where Justice is weack, and exactly where to strike. and just be cause he's close doesn't mean he's hopeless. as I said before he would be able to dodge any attack Justice sent at him.

How? Let me post Justice's powers for you:

Justice has the power of telekinesis, which allows him to move, lift, and manipulate matter using only the power of his mind. By using his powers to lift himself, he can levitate and fly at high speed. He can also channel his powers into concussive psionic force blasts, or focus his telekinetic powers into psychic shields to protect himself and others. Justice is quite adept at using his powers. He has shown the ability to hold a large number of people in individual telekinetic energy "tendrils" and detect when a person is lying though said tendril, like a lie detector would.

So he'll dodge a telekinetic bolt or two, and then Justice switches tactics and scoops up Prodigy just like that. Even if he were able to dodge such an initial assault (I don't see how, but what the hey), Justice could just enlarge the telekinetic hand and make sure he can't dodge. That's not necessarily power, that's skill. Yes, Prodigy will know that skill but will be able to do nothing to avoid it.

Then there's this fabled weakness thing. I'm not saying Justice doesn't have weaknesses, but it's not exactly like Prodigy can just strike his forcefield and the match is over. He's not Karnak. You want a weakness for Justice? Overwhelming power. He'd need somebody like Thing pounding on his shields to start sweating. Prodigy can't conjure up that kind of power.

and as soon as it is an up-close fight, Prodigy has the advantage of being a trained martial artist. Besides, who says Prodigy doesn't hack the prison's defense systems and shut down telekinetic powers? heck, even if he has to shut down all mutant powers, he still has the advantage as those martial arts skills and training are his own. Out of his league? I don't think so. He can outclass Justice anyday of the week.

Why do you think it'd actually be an up-close fight? Forcefield and levitation kinda hinder that. Even if in some odd manouvre he is capable of dampening Justice's powers, he'd still have to contend with training from Captain America and Night Trasher, both better fighters than Prodigy. Justice has the added benefit of being a few years older, so he's stronger and quicker. He's in the prime of his life. Also, your earlier comment about the flexing of muscles doesn't really apply, since members of the Avengers and Warriors were constantly trained for cases in which their powers were ineffective.

Prodigy is a good character, but not for this fight. His powers are useless until he faces Justice, at which point they are marginally useful until Justice just scoops him up. It's also doubtful he'd reach the control room before Justice does and even then he'd still have to hack the systems, which takes more time than he has.

WINNER=JUSTICE

 

[Zoken]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

Cramped enough for 3 people to basically walk next to one another. Long stretches of corridors are easily flown through. That's a hell of an advantage over having to run the same distance.

the corridors shown were narrow, two people wide. and "long stretches of corridores" not to get anywhere useful. and again, I state this is a Meta-human prison with defenses to prevent it from being taken over by meta-humans. the second Justice uses his power, he's going to trip the security systems. also, I work in prisons man. there are no long uninteruppted stretches of corridor. that's not safe.

From the future? You're thinking of his Guardians of the Galaxy analogue. And like I've said, Justice can more easily navigate through the prison than Prodigy can. There's long stretches of corridors that Justice can quickly fly through.

Why. Why will he have this awe inspiring knowledge of EVERY PRISON EVER BUILT?! Prodigy would have a better knowledge of it as he would be able to call up a HUD map giving him literal step-by-step directions to navigating it.

- Justice is trained by Captain America and has more than tenfold the experience in the business than Prodigy has.
- He didn't build that mini-Danger Room in five minutes. Besides the fact you can't use that as an example (this is pre-House of M Prodigy), it also took him quite a while to build, and it still had a few glitches. He's not some Kitty Pryde with computers. He's good, but not five minutes good.
- Justice has shown the strength to be able to bust through a few walls or enforced doors. Easily is an overstatement, but it wouldn't take long at all.

No, he didn't build a danger room in five minutes, but he was building long before HoM for it to be completed almost directly after, meaning he had the technical expertise to build and program a device that took the X-Men a good few years to build and program. okay, it wasn't perfect, but let's see you build and program a holographic training simulator to AT LEAST that standard. He's a genius. Prodigy doesn't just refer to his power. He would be able to hack the prison's security. he would be able to do it in five minutes if he needed to. and again, HOW THE HELL IS JUSTICE FINDING HIM![/quote]

Telekinetics are useful right up to a milimeter of the body. I don't think you have a good idea of Justice's capabilities. Telekinetics aren't like bolts of energy. He can form like a hand and scoop up Prodigy using his telekinetics powers. It's quite similar to constructs somebody like Quasar makes, but not cosmically powered. You can't avoid something that blanket the entire area. What part of that is unclear?

What part of can anticipate enemy's attacks is unclear. the second Justice begins to concieve the idea of attacking in any way, prodigy starts moving to avoid, which means that what Justice was going to do fails. now this whole blanketing CRAP will kill him. because it will be slamming Prodigy against metal. Justice is a good boy who doesn't kill.

It'd never come down to that because Justice wouldn't allow Prodigy to get anywhere near him.

It might not be up to Justice as the prison, which Prodigy can control, is designed to nullify powers. it would not be difficult to nullify Justice's telekinesis.

That's not level of power. That's degree of fine control over your power. Like I said, you can't stop something that can blanket an entire area. If one can put a telekinetic forcefield like construct around you, how are you going to dodge that? He could start at the edges of the area and just enclose around Prodigy. You're severely underestimating the amount of control he has over his power.

I maintain that you are underestimating the advantage Prodgy's power gives him, and Prodigy's capability to turn off the telekinesis.

So Prodigy will know there's a contruct enclosing around him, how's he going to avoid it exactly? He has no superspeed, no superstrength. He's as powerful as an ordinary human. That's like saying Prodigy would be able to dodge one of Cyclops' broad blasts because he knows it's coming.

YOu don't get it, it isn't "Think-it's done" Like most telekinetics, Justice has to gesture to focus himself. so first he has to think 'this is what I want to do', then he needs to gesture, then it gets done. the second we hit step one, Prodigy already knows what's going down and is messing up the plan.

So he'll dodge a telekinetic bolt or two, and then Justice switches tactics and scoops up Prodigy just like that. Even if he were able to dodge such an initial assault (I don't see how, but what the hey), Justice could just enlarge the telekinetic hand and make sure he can't dodge. That's not necessarily power, that's skill. Yes, Prodigy will know that skill but will be able to do nothing to avoid it.

We've been over this

Then there's this fabled weakness thing. I'm not saying Justice doesn't have weaknesses, but it's not exactly like Prodigy can just strike his forcefield and the match is over. He's not Karnak. You want a weakness for Justice? Overwhelming power. He'd need somebody like Thing pounding on his shields to start sweating. Prodigy can't conjure up that kind of power.

you're being too literal. I'm talking a strategic weakness. an area of combat that Justice might not be to strong in, or a strategic gap in Justice's knowledge. I'm not talking about a phsyical weakness that can be attacked, although if there is one, he would be able to exploit it if Justice knows about it, I'm talking about a weakness Justice himself would not be aware exists.

Why do you think it'd actually be an up-close fight? Forcefield and levitation kinda hinder that. Even if in some odd manouvre he is capable of dampening Justice's powers, he'd still have to contend with training from Captain America and Night Trasher, both better fighters than Prodigy. Justice has the added benefit of being a few years older, so he's stronger and quicker. He's in the prime of his life. Also, your earlier comment about the flexing of muscles doesn't really apply, since members of the Avengers and Warriors were constantly trained for cases in which their powers were ineffective.

This will come down to hand to hand because if he doesn't trap Justice outright, he will use the prison's defenses to cancel out Justice's powers. and as far as fighting skill goes, fine, so he was trained by them. when it becomes an upclose fight, Prodigy add's Justice's fighting skills to his own and is still the better fighter. He's trained in a place where he is already the underdog. He's fought multiple robot opponents with great martial arts abilities to a standstill, without the use of his powers. using his powers to add Justice skill to his own, this becomes OWNAGE of the highest callibur.

WINNER=Prodigy

 

[Ahura Mazda]

[Match 12:

Empath (AHURA MAZDA) bio

vs.

Nick Fury (WIEGEABO) bio

This at the end of the day is going to be a simple battle.

Empath possesses the ability to sense and manipulate the emotions of other sentient life forms. He can affect a large group of individuals at one time, and can exert varying levels of empathic control over them, ranging from subtle manipulations that others are generally unaware of to a complete negation of emotion that reduces others to a zombie-like state in which he can command them with little effort. His power operates by means of Empath's own brainwaves overriding the parts of the brain that govern emotion in others.

Fury is a human that no longer controls Shield .

Empath would know who Fury was and depending on Fury's access, he could get information on Empath.

Empath would arrive and sense where Fury was and simply turn him into a zombie. This would be instantaneous and there are no defences against it. The battle is then over.

Winner - Empath

 

[Harlekin]

REBUTTAL: Justice vs Prodigy

the corridors shown were narrow, two people wide. and "long stretches of corridores" not to get anywhere useful. and again, I state this is a Meta-human prison with defenses to prevent it from being taken over by meta-humans. the second Justice uses his power, he's going to trip the security systems. also, I work in prisons man. there are no long uninteruppted stretches of corridor. that's not safe.

Security will be off until it's turned on, and considering Justice is a respected member of the Avengers and New Warriors, I sincerely doubt the prison will register him as a threat. Secondly, Justice will be able to get info on the Raft, whereas I doubt Prodigy will. That means he's going to make a beeline for the control room.

I really don't recall the corridors being all that narrow, and two people wide is still enough for Justice to fly around. He's still going to cover land quicker than Prodigy will. I will agree that there won't be any long stretches of corridors, but they'll be long enough for Justice to have that little bit of extra speed.

Why. Why will he have this awe inspiring knowledge of EVERY PRISON EVER BUILT?! Prodigy would have a better knowledge of it as he would be able to call up a HUD map giving him literal step-by-step directions to navigating it.

That's not what I'm saying at all. I'm saying Justice has been in prison, and prisons usually don't really differ much when it comes to their lay-outs. Experience in that area beats out the technology (how exactly is Prodigy going to bring up a HUD map without first hacking into the Raft's technology?). Besides, Justice will be able to acquire schematics to the Raft and use that.

No, he didn't build a danger room in five minutes, but he was building long before HoM for it to be completed almost directly after, meaning he had the technical expertise to build and program a device that took the X-Men a good few years to build and program. okay, it wasn't perfect, but let's see you build and program a holographic training simulator to AT LEAST that standard. He's a genius. Prodigy doesn't just refer to his power. He would be able to hack the prison's security. he would be able to do it in five minutes if he needed to. and again, HOW THE HELL IS JUSTICE FINDING HIM!

A) Take a chill pill. I've explained this before. Justice will make his way to the control room as well. His powers allow him to be faster. He just needs to wait Prodigy out.
B) "Building long before HoM", that means several weeks. He's a genius, I know that, and I've admitted to it. That doesn't mean he's broken into a control room in a few minutes, hacks the computer, hacks the video feed etc. etc.
C) It did not take the X-Men several years to build and program. The original Danger Room was a pretty basic one and the later Shi'ar one they had little to no hand in adapting.

What part of can anticipate enemy's attacks is unclear. the second Justice begins to concieve the idea of attacking in any way, prodigy starts moving to avoid, which means that what Justice was going to do fails. now this whole blanketing CRAP will kill him. because it will be slamming Prodigy against metal. Justice is a good boy who doesn't kill.

A) How are you avoiding such a move exactly. Get the picture in your head. Giant invisible hand scooping somebody up. Even if you know he's going for that tactic, it's hard to avoid. I'd almost say impossible.
B) I don't see how blanketing will kill him at all. It'll put him down against the ground. Justice would never use the force necessary to kill Prodigy, but he doesn't need to. I'm really befuddled on how you automatically assume this tactic kills Prodigy.

It might not be up to Justice as the prison, which Prodigy can control, is designed to nullify powers. it would not be difficult to nullify Justice's telekinesis.

Not true, actually. The cells are designed to nullify powers. There's nothing suggesting that the rest of the prison is outfitted with the same power dampening technology. That'd be horribly expensive and impractical. The prisoners aren't supposed to get out of their cells. Heck, by the way it's written, it's not actually power dampening tech anyway, it's pumping the prisoner full of drugs. Big difference.

YOu don't get it, it isn't "Think-it's done" Like most telekinetics, Justice has to gesture to focus himself. so first he has to think 'this is what I want to do', then he needs to gesture, then it gets done. the second we hit step one, Prodigy already knows what's going down and is messing up the plan.

A) That's not really how telekinetics work. It's a mind power which works almost instantly. Most telekinetics' powers are in effect the moment they think of it.
B) Again, how is he going to mess it up? He has no other powers. Then there's the fact that some strategies you simply can't avoid. Some you will need to overcome with brute strength, something Prodigy does not possess.

you're being too literal. I'm talking a strategic weakness. an area of combat that Justice might not be to strong in, or a strategic gap in Justice's knowledge. I'm not talking about a phsyical weakness that can be attacked, although if there is one, he would be able to exploit it if Justice knows about it, I'm talking about a weakness Justice himself would not be aware exists.

But Prodigy will have to apply it in the literal sense for that knowledge to be effective.

This will come down to hand to hand because if he doesn't trap Justice outright, he will use the prison's defenses to cancel out Justice's powers.

No, it won't. The prison works with drugs, not power dampening tech.

Now, as for the whole "dodge attacks thing", a little graphic I quickly whipped up to illustrate:

WINNER=JUSTICE

 

[Ahura Mazda]

Match 12:

Valkyrie (AHURA MAZDA) bio

vs.

Clea (WIEGEABO) bio

This is a battle between the most powerful Asgardian female warrior and a sorceror.

Brunhilde is class 45 and a trainned warrior. Both characters will know each other very well. Brunhilde will know of Clea's magical powers and Clea will know she is facing the fiercest female warrior of Asgard.

Both should get some information on the Raft but that would not be much help here.

Valkyrie will attempt to stalk Clea and catch her unawares. She will use her sword to and spear to indispose Clea. She is capable of doing this and with her speed, Clea will not be able to react fast enough to protect herself.

Winner - Valkyrie