Contest of Marvels II Thread 4

Harlekin said:
Why would I not be able to rebut? I put up an opening argument first, and then went about rebutting.

I'll get to your recent bit later.


Im just being my normal ******* self.
 
Ah, yeah, I was debating between you being a dick or trying to make a point. I had to take a chance on the idea that you were being serious.

Won't happen again. ;)
 
Harlekin said:
Except he's been able to take control of an entire group of X-Men before, including folks like Wolverine. He doesn't cast illusions, he controls your mind. A reckless guy like John Walker is even more susceptible than that than others. All Mesmero needs is eye-contact and it's done.
Sorry he doesn't cast illusions, my bad. My point is though Walker will have info on his powers he'd go in there avoid eye-contact and get the job doen as fast as possible. He won't hold back as long as he think the ends justify the means. He'd go in there thrash him up a bit probaly get something over his eyes or into his eyes and porbaly end up killing him.


Harlekin said:
Except John Walker is also the kind of guy that likes a fight and also isn't the brightest guy to have ever lived.
No he's not but he isn't stupid either. He was trained by the goverment and he was obviously good enough to take Captain America's place. I don't think this'll be an easy battle for him but he'd manage.

Winner= Walker!
 
REBUTTAL: Karma vs Damask

Darthphere said:
Karma, I gotta give it to her, shes one tough cookie, but Damask has a mean streak in her and will go all the way on Karma, same cant be said for her. Damask would be willing to go to any extreme to get the job done, and if that means bringing down the whole goddamn building, she will do that.
Except she won't be given the chance to do so. The first instinct for Damask would still be to engage Karma in a fight. If Karma can hold Damask long enough to work the compound to her advantage, it's all over for Damask.

Karma can spend all day looking for guns and finding codes and stuff, but what good will that do when a whole complex is coming down on you. Damask is willing to get the job done, anyway possible. That gives her the edge. But I sure love me some girl fights.
Ruthlessness is certainly an advantage, but so is knowing your environment. Karma is going to focus herself on trapping Damask into one of the compound's cells, or use the technology of the prison to take Damask out. Damask may be ruthless, but unless she brings down the building (which coincidentally would just hurt her as well, since the players can't leave the prison), there's nothing she can do to stop Karma.

karmawf2.jpg


WINNER=KARMA
 
Hellstormer said:
Sorry he doesn't cast illusions, my bad. My point is though Walker will have info on his powers he'd go in there avoid eye-contact and get the job doen as fast as possible. He won't hold back as long as he think the ends justify the means. He'd go in there thrash him up a bit probaly get something over his eyes or into his eyes and porbaly end up killing him.
Except Mesmero's a smart fellow and would make sure that if it came down to fisticuffs, he'd be ensured that Walker would look in his eyes. Both would have info on the Project Pegasus complex, but really only Mesmero would use it to his advantage. Stringing the Agent along untill he can make him look in his eyes. That's all that's needed, eye contact.

No he's not but he isn't stupid either. He was trained by the goverment and he was obviously good enough to take Captain America's place. I don't think this'll be an easy battle for him but he'd manage.
Physically, he was certainly good enough to be Captain America, but I think we all agreed that he didn't exactly make a good Captain America. The man is led by his temper rather than his brain. He'd try to avoid eye contact, since, like you say, he's not completely dumb, but I doubt he will be able to.

mesmerork1.jpg


WINNER=MESMERO
 
Harlekin said:
Physically, he was certainly good enough to be Captain America, but I think we all agreed that he didn't exactly make a good Captain America. The man is led by his temper rather than his brain. He'd try to avoid eye contact, since, like you say, he's not completely dumb, but I doubt he will be able to.
But in a fight like this I tihnk he would need his temper. He needs to be able to give into his rage to the point where he's blind to anything else giving him that edge where even if he did get eye contact it wouldn't effect him.
 
Hellstormer said:
But in a fight like this I tihnk he would need his temper. He needs to be able to give into his rage to the point where he's blind to anything else giving him that edge where even if he did get eye contact it wouldn't effect him.
It doesn't matter how enraged is. Eye contact means he's done for. Becoming pissed at Mesmero would just be playing into his hands.

WINNER=MESMERO
 
Match 8:

Fixer (WOLVERINE25TH) bio



vs.

Firebird (POWDERMAN) bio



Yeah my first debate!!!!

Prep-Time
Being an Avengers reservist would enable her to access their files in her prep time. During this time she will learn, as his name should suggest, that he has the ability to build and construct mechanical weapons and devices. (Although I wouldn't downplay his abilities or genious I haven't seen him create anything that would compare with Forge, Reed, or many more characters.)

Learning about him she notes that he relies on this technological ability solely and has no actual powers. She also learns about the Prison and studies the compounds blueprints to give her a strategy of attack.

Going into this match my character will have a good understanding of her opponent. However, correct me if I am wrong, I don't believe these characters have encountered each other and Fixer wouldn't have access to a database. He will probably figure by her name that she has some powers that relate to fire but not to it's incredible extent.

She puts her strategy in place and melts the steel beams in the corridors behind her, sealing access through to avoid any attack from behind. Her abilities can generate over 5,000 degrees Fahrenheit which is strong enough to boil steel.

Igniting the air around her she creates a phoenix-esque aura around her to protect her from projectile attacks.

Cotinuing to move down the hallways, she suddenly gets a glimpse of the future and she sees that her opponent is coming down a hallway around a corner. She tones down her aura and ducks into a room and closes the door. She sits and waits for her opponent to walk down the hallway. She sees a shadow start to cross at the bottom of the door. She fires off a concusive blast and blows the door into Fixer and slams him through the wall on the other side. This fazes Fixer and he needs time to get his bearings, but Firebird doesn't let up and fires off a blast with just enough heat to disable his electronic equipment. Being experience with her powers she knows how to control it well enough to know how much would be sufficient to disable him, without killing him. But you would be surprise what you can live through. Incapacitated and all his equipment disabled, Fixer is down for the count. With 3rd degree burns on 70% of his body, Fixer has a long and painful recovery ahead of him.

WINNER FIREBIRD
 
Plus in case you are not familiar with Firebird she can generate enough force which could lift 10 tons.

She could use this blast of force to hold her opponent in place without being able to move or she could use it like a strong punch and knock him out.

Firebird can generate heat and flame, controlling these with molecular precision.

Like I mentioned above she can control it with molecular precision which means she can concentrate in internally combusting Fixer's equipment without killing or severaly hurting him.

fly fast enough to achieve escape velocity.

She can fly fast enough before Fixer can react to her initial attack.

Firebird has also displayed more mysterious, possibly mystical abilities. She sometimes has visions, can sense the presence of evil (especially supernatural evil), has uncanny intuition, and seems immune to demonic possession. Most remarkably, Bonita may be immortal, having proven miraculously immune to potentially fatal conditions such as the vacuum of space, a universal poison (powerful enough to kill even the Silver Surfer) and massive radiation. The Collector believes she may be one of the few beings in the universe who cannot die.

On top of her normal powers she also has mystical powers that could protect her from fatal wounds.

WINNER FIREBIRD
 
Harlekin said:
It doesn't matter how enraged is. Eye contact means he's done for. Becoming pissed at Mesmero would just be playing into his hands.

WINNER=MESMERO
Well thsi depends, to whate extent does he need eye contact, does the other person actually have to look into his eyes and focus or can he just glance and get control? There's a big difference between getting deep visual contact and just unfocusedly glancing.
 
SILHOUETTE vs. X-23

Sil has super speed, strength, and sensory perception. She can teleport through shadows. She can become living darkness and phase through enemies, causing great pain. Not to mention the tazers and paralyzing agents built into her crutches and her martial arts training. Sil is no cripple.

Inside a complex like this, there are plenty of shadows to be found. Sil can easily manuver in and out of them or do her long range crutched attack by teleporting them through dual portals. About the only danger X can really pose are her claws. But, whenever she gets too close Sil can phase through her and slow her down enough to get in a few good shots. While X can heal any would, they all have their limits. Not to mention she could lure X into a trap with one of the cells. As they're designed to hold super powered criminals, they no doubt have failsafes and defenses that can be used against X as she tries to break out, weakening her more.

The trick is to stay ahead of X's claws and make her weak and tired, then deliver the final blow to put her down. With someone who can slip through shadows, that's no problem.

WINNER: SILHOUETTE
 
FIXER vs. FIREBIRD

Fixer is no dummy. Fixer knows how to get info about these goody goody supertypes and he knows how to plan ahead. And even if he couldn't, her power is in her name. Big duh there.

Simple modifications on his personal armaments could create enhancements to his suit to protect him from extreme heat as well as deliver some anti-flame devices. While they may not snuff her out, they can slow her down enough for him to get the drop on her.

And while she may have visions, they don't ALWAYS happen, and the chances they do right when she needs only happens in, well, comic books. Also, let's not forget Fixer would be in the middle of a technological haven. All he has to do is slow FB down enough to make use of that and turn the defenses and/or sprinklers on against her, eliminating her flames and making her vulnerable.

Fixer has no powers, but his technology is far too deadly to regard him as a pushover. Plus, with the way he handles super types but for and against the Thunderbolts, there's no doubt he can do it consistantly.

WINNER: FIXER
 
Hellstormer said:
Well thsi depends, to whate extent does he need eye contact, does the other person actually have to look into his eyes and focus or can he just glance and get control? There's a big difference between getting deep visual contact and just unfocusedly glancing.
All that's needed is a glance, especially with his power upgraded by Weapon-X.

WINNER=MESMERO
 
WOLVERINE25TH said:
SILHOUETTE vs. X-23

Sil has super speed, strength, and sensory perception.

such a vague term, in her case it simply means above average. Her reflexes/agility wouldn't even come close to x-23 but we are talking about a smaller more limber version of wolverine. It just doesn't hold weight.

She can teleport through shadows. She can become living darkness and phase through enemies, causing great pain.

the teleport thing is handy but with reflexes like x-23's you can't sneak up on her even if you teleport.

Great pain, like the great pain involved in the brutal regime endured by weapon x candidates. Like being poked and prodded and beaten since you first opened your eyes. Silhouette will be able to hurt x-23 with this but she's got the mental toughness and overall conditioning to allow her not to suffer this as a hinderence, more an inconvenience.

Not to mention the tazers and paralyzing agents built into her crutches and her martial arts training. Sil is no cripple.

STRONGER HEALING FACTOR THAT WOLVERINE'S! Simple toxins and tazer's aren't going to bring her down, don't you think anyone tried that when she first escaped?

Inside a complex like this, there are plenty of shadows to be found. Sil can easily manuver in and out of them or do her long range crutched attack by teleporting them through dual portals.
with access to the x-men's database x-23 will know all about this (they will have files if nothing else due to the similarity between her powers and nightcralwers. Also she is extremely limited as she can only teleport between shadows. There will be some lights in the building so all x-23 has to do is avoid the shadows. Also you act as if she just zips around teleporting all over the place. She's not even as powerful as cloak. Teleporting puts a MASSIVE strain on her so after she' done it a few times she'd have to stop to catch her breath giving x-23 ample chance to take the kill

About the only danger X can really pose are her claws. But, whenever she gets too close Sil can phase through her and slow her down enough to get in a few good shots.
with regards slow her down see above.

Also x-23 is a survivalist who relies heavily on instinct, give a monkey an electrically charged banana and after 2-3 shocks it doesn't **** with the banana anymore. X-23 has the speed and agility to make a fair few hit and run attacks and just one slice from that adamantium and sil's done for.

While X can heal any would, they all have their limits.

Tell that to the writers of any title with wolverine in it, and x-23's is MORE POWERFULL

Not to mention she could lure X into a trap with one of the cells. As they're designed to hold super powered criminals, they no doubt have failsafes and defenses that can be used against X as she tries to break out, weakening her more.

Again are you familiar with the complex weapon x operated out of. I don't doubt it was slightly more difficult to break out of than this place. Also she did that BEFORE she had her X-men training.

A) She wouldn't fall for such a simple trap
B) There will only be one or two cells she can't simply carve her way out of (adamantium claws aren't exactly standard equipment in the marvel U)
c) She'd smell sil a mile off and be on the lookout for a trap the second she entered her visicinity.

The trick is to stay ahead of X's claws and make her weak and tired, then deliver the final blow to put her down. With someone who can slip through shadows, that's no problem.

WINNER: SILHOUETTE

Slipping through shadows endlessly would simply weaken sil

X-23 has insane ammounts of stamina on account of the brutal training regime of weapon x, the x-men training she is STILL recieving. Her advanced reflexes/agility/stamina/healing factor.

Finally X-23 will be an unknown factor for sil as she has been out of the picture for a while whereas x-23 has only been around for a few years. Prep time/info would be non-existent for sil whereas X-23 will know every last detail about sil on account of her being in the new warriors/alpha flight. This is one case where even the name tells her nothing (she'll probably think it's some kind of android)

Clear cut win for the wolvie clone!

WINNER:X-23!
 
I didn't say taken down, I said weaken. If yer gonna rebuttle make it the right damn argument.
 
A little less hard with two matches being my own ;), but nicely debated anyway.

X-23
Mesmero
Karma
Fixer
 
X-23
Mesmero (Just too powerful)
Damask(Sorry Harlekin but I agree with darth RE karma's abilities)
Fixer (W25th's debate won this for me but good try powder :up: )st
 
*X-23 - (I love X-23, especially her miniseries that came out last year. But, I considered voting for Silhouette because of one statement: "(T)his is supposed to be about who would win in a fight, not the "Contest of Popular Marvels.'" Didn't someone I know vote against Iron Man simply because they didn't like his character?)

*Mesmero

*Karma - (Wow, what a match, when two character's abilities shut each other out.)

*Firebird
 
Phaedrus45 said:
*X-23 - (I love X-23, especially her miniseries that came out last year. But, I considered voting for Silhouette because of one statement: "(T)his is supposed to be about who would win in a fight, not the "Contest of Popular Marvels.'" Didn't someone I know vote against Iron Man simply because they didn't like his character?)

No I voted against stark cause he's a b***h :oldrazz:
 
X-23 (Just a bit stronger and a little more effective)

US AGENT!!! (He's mine)

Damask (Ummm yea this is kinda a stalemate IMO so whatever)

Fixer (Its the prep-time part that really swayed me)
 
Results So Far:

X-23 currently beating Silhouette 6-1
Mesmero currently beating US Agent 6-1
Damask currently beating Karma 5-2
Fixer currently beating Firebird 6-1
 

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