Arrow Dinah Laurel Lance/Katie Cassidy Thread - Part 2

[Nathan]

It would be cool if they put her up against Nyssa or someone of similar standing and the feud played out similar to how it did between Oliver and Ra's, with Nyssa or whoever winning the first fight easy and Laurel coming back and winning the second one. That would be great to see IMO.

It really, really wouldn't. She still gets knocked down by the occasional Ghost. Seeing her win against Nyssa, would just insult our intelligence. Unless she opens up with the Canary Cry and knocks her out cold. In a proper fight? Nyssa should annihilate her each and every single time.

 

[Loki882]

Killing is killing, excusing it as 'bad guys' doesn't make it any less of a death.

No, it's not the same thing. "Killing is killing," no that's not how it works. You ignore the type of victim, the context for it, the psychology of the killer, the motivation for it, etc. People kill different people for very different reasons. And Oliver killing a bunch of bad guys in a misguided attempt to "save his city," while not good per se, is still very different from say, Huntress slaughtering honest cops on a mission of petty vengeance against her dad. Trying to pretend like they're comparable is ludicrous.

Ditto on comparing it to the Thea/Sara situation. They're almost completely different.

 

[Primal Slayer]

At least Ollie had no idea how the Pit would affect Thea. But now everyone does. You'd think Laurel would give her sister a heads up. "Oh, btw, after I brought you back from the dead, with the help of the Lazarus Pit, you might feel a little edgy. Try not to kill anyone."

But then charecters wouldn't be shocked to see her go into beserk mode.

 

[Loki882]

It really, really wouldn't. She still gets knocked down by the occasional Ghost. Seeing her win against Nyssa, would just insult our intelligence. Unless she opens up with the Canary Cry and knocks her out cold. In a proper fight? Nyssa should annihilate her each and every single time.

I still don't buy that Oliver could beat Nyssa as easily as the show depicts him doing (it annoys me every single time that I see it). I don't necessarily buy Sara beating her either. And if I don't buy those two doing it, then I sure as heck don't buy Laurel being able to either.

Plus, Nyssa overpowered Malcolm last season only moments after he'd just gotten done fending off Laurel with extreme ease. So that right there shows you difference in skill between them.

 

[Nathan]

Sigh... it's so frustrating when writers drop logic, for cheap shock value.

 

[SpideyVille]

I think what people don't like about her character is that they keep teasing like she's progressing/improving, only for them to turn around an regress her. I was kind of into her character in the latter half of Season 3, she got much better once she put on the costume (as rushed/unconvincing as it was, but oh well). But the, they pull this crap and it's all like "oh here we go again."

My biggest issue last season was all of her "progress" happened off-screen. I've seen more progress from Katie Cassidy on her Instagram feed than I did all of last season and this, in terms of her working at getting better. But of course, Arrow has no problem violating the whole "Show don't tell" adage.

 

[Primal Slayer]

It really, really wouldn't. She still gets knocked down by the occasional Ghost. Seeing her win against Nyssa, would just insult our intelligence. Unless she opens up with the Canary Cry and knocks her out cold. In a proper fight? Nyssa should annihilate her each and every single time.

They let Malcolm/Oliver defeat Nyssa with ease so i wouldn't be surprised. But I don't Nyssa to become Laurels enemy, they were the best thing that came out of s3. They have plenty to choose from the BoP catalog.

 

[Slade W]

It really, really wouldn't. She still gets knocked down by the occasional Ghost. Seeing her win against Nyssa, would just insult our intelligence. Unless she opens up with the Canary Cry and knocks her out cold. In a proper fight? Nyssa should annihilate her each and every single time.

You take this stuff really, really seriously. Oliver was getting beaten by Slade last season and needed Thea's help to beat him. He was then able to go up against Ra's (who is on a different level to Slade) and win and this season he has been losing fights regularly (ie Damien, the cop and Anarky) despite the fact that he should be on a different level to them after beating Ra's (he should definitely be on a different level to the cop and Anarky). Technically Oliver shouldn't have been able to beat Ra's who had hundreds of years of training on him but in the end he was able to. That is how TV, movies, books etc work. The hero always comes back and wins against the odds. The vast majority of the audience wont care as long as it is entertaining and makes some sense. The fact that Laurel has always been a good fighter after training under her dad, doing self-defence classes, as well as being taught by Wildcat and Nyssa and has been able to defeat members of the LOA and HIVE would make it believable enough for most. Only the weird, obsessive, nit-picky types with too much time on their hands would be complaining and who cares what they think.

If you think that the idea of a character winning against the odds which is something that almost every comic, superhero movie, superhero tv show as well as lots of other books, tv shows and movies which have a hero (but not necessarily one with powers) does would just "insult our intelligence" then you are probably too smart for this silly superhero stuff and should probably watch something else which is consistently written and more realistic and thought-provoking. You aren't going to get that with this silly superhero stuff, I am sad to say (and that is coming from a fan of the genre).

 

[Rowsdower!]

Ugh, the costumes in this show, other than Oliver's new suit, just suck. Laurel looks like some sort of dominatrix and Diggle looks like he needs to go do some welding.

 

[Batsfan1]

At least Ollie had no idea how the Pit would affect Thea. But now everyone does. You'd think Laurel would give her sister a heads up. "Oh, btw, after I brought you back from the dead, with the help of the Lazarus Pit, you might feel a little edgy. Try not to kill anyone."

Considering she was an unrepentant murderer anyway, it shouldn't be an issue for her. But it makes me wonder why no one else told her?

God bless you! God bless your family and everyone else in your life!

 

[zenith16]

so I saw peep's want laurel to have her own personal villian I just saw batman unlimited to night monster madness with joker scare crow solomon Grundy and silver Bansshee


the very latter of whichI think would make the perfect fit for laurel 's arch enemy . it could be a story line where silver banshee has other cops on black canry's tale cause htye both us sonic cry's . onlu siilver banshee's using it for murder she has a cry syndicate backing her too as a crime wave. and they should laurel it too.

 

[Adanu]

No, it's not the same thing. "Killing is killing," no that's not how it works. You ignore the type of victim, the context for it, the psychology of the killer, the motivation for it, etc. People kill different people for very different reasons. And Oliver killing a bunch of bad guys in a misguided attempt to "save his city," while not good per se, is still very different from say, Huntress slaughtering honest cops on a mission of petty vengeance against her dad. Trying to pretend like they're comparable is ludicrous.

Ditto on comparing it to the Thea/Sara situation. They're almost completely different.

While I do agree intent is important in principle, that doesn't mean you get to ignore the act itself as if it never happened.

 

[zenith16]

some of those action's Oliver has taken have been seen that way with him self at times too. He act's as if some thing's didn't happen at times him self ,with his own actions and has gotten away with them.

He was trying to help the city, yeah but still went about it in the worst way possible and yeah he has guilt which they been showing of late and some of that was last season last but other times after the act is done it's pretty much forgotten to a certain degree. til it bite him in the ass and he goes to guilt trip mode and that when all comes out of him .

 

[luis4u]

 

[Primal Slayer]

Writers need to bring back the more sensible Laurel this season. Apart from majority of S3 it seems like the writers just go backwards. AK/GB need to reign in MGs take on the character.

 

[Infinity9999x]

I don't mind the reasoning behind Laurel doing what she's doing this season, but the issue Ive been having lately is how they write her reactions to the actions she takes.

They have Laurel talking almost casually about bringing Sara back. When she has her chained up, we never once see Laurel conflicted on her choice to bring her back, questioning what she did, feeling guilty that Sara killed people etc. It's all much to flippant and acting almost as if she has no blame in this decision. And again, I really don't think it's Katie's fault...I just don't think the dialogue is very good. They really need to work on it.

 

[Primal Slayer]

The storyline should've been a lot more fleshed out and not take 20mins to tell between 3 episodes.

 

[Infinity9999x]

The storyline should've been a lot more fleshed out and not take 20mins to tell between 3 episodes.

Yeah. And show the conflict. Let us see Laurel struggle with the decision, and then struggle with the consequences. It should have been Laurel debating to pull the trigger on Sara, not her dad. By having her impulsively take her sisters corpse to the pit, and then act like everything is going to be fine while she keeps her sis chained up in a basement just makes her seem like someone who was both overly impulsive and not prone to being realistic.

It's fine to show her fight for her sister to bring her back, but let her be somewhat conflicted about what she's doing, because then she comes off like a logical adult, and less like a petulant child refusing to admit that she did anything wrong.

And again, none of this is really Katie's fault. They wrote her that way.

 

[Primal Slayer]

If they wanted Laurel to pull the gun on Sara, I at least wish they written it more emotional. Instead of having her go "she has no soul! this isn't Sara!", have Laurel crying/weeping and saying something like "I am so sorry that I did this to you, I wish I knew how to save you but at least now you can rest in piece again, im so sorry"

 

[Nathan]

That scene, and the scene in the Hospital. Like I said in the other Thread, if there was one moment where I would have been ok with Laurel getting all emotional again, it should have been when she saw what happened to Thea. And not being strangely calm like she was. But Thea nearly getting killed by Sara is apparently not that big a deal. A much bigger deal is that Oliver doesn't view her as an equal.

 

[Boy Scout]

Writers need to bring back the more sensible Laurel this season. Apart from majority of S3 it seems like the writers just go backwards. AK/GB need to reign in MGs take on the character.

They both look so different now.

 

[Primal Slayer]

I didn't even realize how good looking PB/Quentin was until he shaved his head. KC/Laurel matured a lot more and I love her with blonde hair even though she looked great as a brunette.

 

[Boy Scout]

I always thought Blackthorne was a good looking dude. Cassidy can pull off both styles, but personally, I think she looks better as a brunette.

 

[Infinity9999x]

That scene, and the scene in the Hospital. Like I said in the other Thread, if there was one moment where I would have been ok with Laurel getting all emotional again, it should have been when she saw what happened to Thea. And not being strangely calm like she was. But Thea nearly getting killed by Sara is apparently not that big a deal. A much bigger deal is that Oliver doesn't view her as an equal.

Yeah. That was really weird. The fact that we didn't see any kind of actual feelings of guilt for what was happening...it was just very odd.

 

[Primal Slayer]

This season has everything on fastfoward and it needs to slow down a bit.