Disney's Frozen - Part 3

[slumcat]

whether or not Frozen can be considered a "masterpiece." whether or not Frozen's screenplay won certain awards or scored high on critics polls. one thing is certain.

Frozen has HUGE mainstream appeal, on a level that other Disney animated films have not achieved ( probably not since Lion King or Toy Story ).

It has achieved $400m domestic and $1b worldwide.

The soundtrack was successful.

Frozen merchandise is popular and sold out.

Elsa and Let It Go have made their way into SNL and Jimmy Fallon comedy skits.

Elsa is already making her way into an ABC tv show next season.

The numbers and overall reactions don't lie. If Frozen had merely been a mediocre/so-so movie, it would not have had the same BO, merchandising, and mainstream appeal success.

Transformers series has equal or perhaps even more success with BO, merchandising, and mainstream appeal success. And yet...

I don't think BO, merchandising, and mainstream appeal success equal great quality. Avatar is the most successful movie ever made but I think it is garbage.

 

[Nathan]

I tried not to mention Transformers, because I didn't want to put Frozen down. But they have proven that you can be mediocre and still have huge success.

 

[Raiden]

I absolutely respect your opinion, but I will just point out one statistic. All those 4 films got Oscar nominations for screenplay - and they were all shoo-ins, meaning widely expected to get nominations. Frozen was not even discussed as a possibility.

All those 4 movies became some of the most acclaimed films of their respect years with numerous nominations from many critics groups for best Picture and other categories and not just Best Animated Film. There are critics polls every year, all 4 were heartily represented towards the top end, Wall-E even won quite a few and even won many Best Picture awards, one from a group as major as the Los Angeles Film Critics Association. It is now regarded as one of the greatest films ever made, ranked 202nd greatest film ever made in the vastly influential Sight and Sound poll that takes place once a decade.

I saw none of these things for Frozen and saw it receive a token Best Animated Picture nomination every where and it did not feature in any critics poll of any kind in any capacity.

So I think Frozen definitely made far less noise and did not truly present a case to be considered as a great piece of cinema.

Frozen won every award for Best Animation, except Golden Globe. It won Oscar, Annie, and other prestigious awards. Are you going to discount them just because you don't like the movie?

 

[slumcat]

Frozen won every award for Best Animation, except Golden Globe. It won Oscar, Annie, and other prestigious awards. Are you going to discount them just because you don't like the movie?

Did you read the content of my post?? I say that it got Best Animation film mentions - where do I say it didn't??

Like one animated film every year - of course it won all industry awards for animations.

But besides that ghetto award?

And with the critics as a piece of cinema and not just animation?

Those were the points I was trying to make and were the gist of my argument that it is just one of those ordinary yearly animated films.

 

[X Knight]

I think Transformers is the exception to the rule.

I think, in general, if a film is widely considered mediocre/so-so, it's not going to break records at the BO or perform so well.

also, Transformers appeals to a different target audience than Frozen. one could argue that Transformers has wider appeal, because it's not just for kids but also for the teens and young adults.

whereas Frozen's primary audience skews much youngers ( even though people of all ages can enjoy it ).

 

[X Knight]

Did you read the content of my post?? I say that it got Best Animation film mentions - where do I say it didn't??

Like one animated film every year - of course it won all industry awards for animations.

But besides that ghetto award?

And with the critics as a piece of cinema and not just animation?

Those were the points I was trying to make and were the gist of my argument that it is just one of those ordinary yearly animated films.

well, in terms of Best Animation, it's usually the Pixar film that wins that award. Frozen finally bucked that trend.

I think that's an accomplishment.

 

[Raiden]

I tried not to mention Transformers, because I didn't want to put Frozen down. But they have proven that you can be mediocre and still have huge success.

Did Transformers have 89% RT and non-technical Oscar to validate its quality?

 

[slumcat]

well, in terms of Best Animation, it's usually the Pixar film that wins that award. Frozen finally bucked that trend.

I think that's an accomplishment.

The biggest point in its favor for its supposed claim to be a masterpiece of cinema is that it beat a Pixar film (that wasn't even nominated) for a ghetto award doesn't sound very appetizing. And Rango had already been a non-Pixar film to win the award just two years ago.

 

[X Knight]

what ghetto award are you talking about?

 

[Incarnadine]

whether or not Frozen can be considered a "masterpiece." whether or not Frozen's screenplay won certain awards or scored high on critics polls. one thing is certain.

Frozen has HUGE mainstream appeal, on a level that other Disney animated films have not achieved ( probably not since Lion King or Toy Story ).

It has achieved $400m domestic and $1b worldwide.

The soundtrack was successful.

Frozen merchandise is popular and sold out.

Elsa and Let It Go have made their way into SNL and Jimmy Fallon comedy skits.

Elsa is already making her way into an ABC tv show next season.

The numbers and overall reactions don't lie. If Frozen had merely been a mediocre/so-so movie, it would not have had the same BO, merchandising, and mainstream appeal success.

I'll add to the numbers game.

All time highest grossing animated movie, soon to be #5 all time among all movies.

Massive DVD/Blue Ray sales. Sold 3.8 million units it's first day, has been #1 in sales for 7 of 8 weeks.

Soundtrack has been number 1 in sales for 13 non consecutive weeks, dropping to #2 this week after 7 consecutive weeks at #1. It has just been certified triple platinum (3 million sold). It is the #1 album of 2014 so far, almost triple the sales of #2.

Merchandise is insane. Disney stores sell out, literally, before a new shipment arrives. People are allocated 1 or 2 items from a shipment.

General fan stuff. Just go on tumbler and youtube, fans are working overtime creating stuff, and for once Disney is pretty much letting them run with it.

Also, 2 Academy Awards, not to mention it cleaned up during the entire awards season.

 

[X Knight]

I'll add to the numbers game.

All time highest grossing animated movie, soon to be #5 all time among all movies.

Massive DVD/Blue Ray sales. Sold 3.8 million units it's first day, has been #1 in sales for 7 of 8 weeks.

Soundtrack has been number 1 in sales for 13 non consecutive weeks, dropping to #2 this week after 7 consecutive weeks at #1. It has just been certified triple platinum (3 million sold). It is the #1 album of 2014 so far, almost triple the sales of #2.

Merchandise is insane. Disney stores sell out, literally, before a new shipment arrives. People are allocated 1 or 2 items from a shipment.

General fan stuff. Just go on tumbler and youtube, fans are working overtime creating stuff, and for once Disney is pretty much letting them run with it.

Also, 2 Academy Awards, not to mention it cleaned up during the entire awards season.

all meaningless!!

 

[X Knight]

and I don't think "masterpiece" is the right word to use here. as Kelly posted above, that designation comes with time.

I think the more appropriate word to use to describe Frozen is "phenomenon".

 

[slumcat]

what ghetto award are you talking about?

Well in awards parlance, the ghetto awards are Best Documentary Feature, Best Foreign Language Feature and Best Animated Feature because they are boxed into their own category and generally not allowed to play for the big award - which is Best Picture. The Best Picture award is for the best picture and these films in the ghetto categories are pictures afterall.

Though the ghetto is breached sometimes - 8 foreign language films have been nominated for Best Picture, 3 animated and horribly, 0 documentaries.

It is not flattering to be boxed into their own category but it is what it is, the only way for these movies to get some recognition at the Oscars and other English language awards.

 

[slumcat]

I think the more appropriate word to use to describe Frozen is "phenomenon".

That would encounter no argument or dissent from me. That statement is absolutely true.

 

[X Knight]

Well in awards parlance, the ghetto awards are Best Documentary Feature, Best Foreign Language Feature and Best Animated Feature because they are boxed into their own category and generally not allowed to play for the big award - which is Best Picture. The Best Picture award is for the best picture and these films in the ghetto categories are pictures afterall.

Though the ghetto is breached sometimes - 8 foreign language films have been nominated for Best Picture, 3 animated and horribly, 0 documentaries.

It is not flattering to be boxed into their own category but it is what it is, the only way for these movies to get some recognition at the Oscars and other English language awards.

ah, I see.

I think that's more due to the nature of the industry and the Academy Awards. there's pretty much 0 chance that an animated film is going to win the Best Picture.

btw......what were the 3 films that were nominated for Best Picture?

I know BB was the 1st. and I think Up was, too. what was the 3rd?

 

[X Knight]

That would encounter no argument or dissent from me. That statement is absolutely true.

glad we agree on something!!

 

[slumcat]

ah, I see.

I think that's more due to the nature of the industry and the Academy Awards. there's pretty much 0 chance that an animated film is going to win the Best Picture.

btw......what were the 3 films that were nominated for Best Picture?

I know BB was the 1st. and I think Up was, too. what was the 3rd?

The best of them all - Toy Story 3.

Though generally speaking the two greatest animated films of past 2-3 decades are considered to be Spirited Away and Wall-E both of which won major Best Picture awards itself from important award giving bodies.

 

[X Knight]

The best of them all - Toy Story 3.

Though generally speaking the two greatest animated films of past 2-3 decades are considered to be Spirited Away and Wall-E both of which won major Best Picture awards itself from important award giving bodies.

ah, thanks.

 

[CGHulk]

 

[The Silent Traveler]

I found some funny gifs that came across Tumblr.

 

[Thoix]

^

 

[DA_Champion]

Transformers and Twilight are the stories most referred to be those making strawman arguments.

 

[Lord]

The best of them all - Toy Story 3.

Though generally speaking the two greatest animated films of past 2-3 decades are considered to be Spirited Away and Wall-E both of which won major Best Picture awards itself from important award giving bodies.

The Wind Rises is pretty good too from what i hear.

Wasn't that big of a Toy Story 3 fan, greatly prefered Up! and Wall-E

 

[Superwoman Prime]

EDIT: Meh, I'll post a full review soon.

 

[dark_b]

i liked Frozen. 9,5/10. almost a perfect movie.

but i have a problem how people on the internet are saying that it made so much money because it is a good movie.