Fant4stic: Reborn! - - Part 21

[Whiskey Tango]

What did GL need a script for when it had that snazzy million dollar cgi costume?

Man that flick was disappointing. I didn't even get my Duck Dodger cameo.

 

[Dasher10]

They announced the reboot in 2009, Dasher. I wasn't talking about shooting dates. Keep moving those goalposts.

Right but you stated that FF was slated to shoot shortly after being announced. I'm simply stating that Deadpool is right about to shoot in Vancouver.

 

[Paradox1]

Does Fox own the rights to The Watchers?

 

[psylockolussus]

Like Uatu? Its probably shared, since Fantastic Four encountered him a lot of times in the comic books.

 

[Paradox1]

Yeah, I love The Watchers for some reason. I think my obsession with Silver Surfer led to a lot of that.

 

[Urich Leeds]

now see i have a problem with RR comments. Not blaming him in any way but hearing something like this makes you wonder what in the world is going on at the studio? How in the hell does a 150 mil plus production not have a functional script? It sounds so alien to me and unbelievable.

There were alot of variables. The most important of them are:

1.) Christopher Nolan was very sensitive about multiple film universes coexisting, with a different Batman appearing. This slowed down and caused trouble for Warner's other A-list character projects (and their shared universe), and led to the cancellation (or rather, failed revival of) George Miller's JLA. Which brings me to my next point.....


2.) There was a script, written by Greg Berlanti and Marc Guggenheim (whom you know from crafting the beloved DCTV Arrowverse as we know it), that was completed. If rumors and reports from back then were true, it was fantastic; a perfect set up for the DCCU.

However, the budget for the film was cut (though it would end up skyrocketing back up anyways), and that script was trashed. And under Martin Campbell, they struggled and failed to crack an adequate rewrite.

 

[justanotherguy]

What's really interesting to me is that in everything we've seen has had both Kinberg(hot from DFOP) and Trank(whose is rumors I've heard personally about) handcuffed together as if Kinberg is somewhat taking the pressure off of Trank in these interviews and YouTube commentary. How often do you see a screenwriter right next to the director like that? Maybe I haven't seen enough of this type of stuff, but I'd almost expect Teller/Jordan and Trank.

 

[the gael]

What's really interesting to me is that in everything we've seen has had both Kinberg(hot from DFOP) and Trank(whose is rumors I've heard personally about) handcuffed together as if Kinberg is somewhat taking the pressure off of Trank in these interviews and YouTube commentary. How often do you see a screenwriter right next to the director like that? Maybe I haven't seen enough of this type of stuff, but I'd almost expect Teller/Jordan and Trank.

Well, technically Kinberg is also the producer, so he's a little more than "the writer". But it's strange to notice that Kinberg seems completely in command. This remind me of the rumors of FOX wanting to replace Trank. For me the interviews make it pretty clear that Trank is only tolerated as a yes men under Kinberg command.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Case in point, Ryan Reynolds has now said that the Green Lantern production didn't have a functional script.

By Kinberg's own admission, he was in Baton Rouge working on the script as filming was starting.

Doesn't that mean they didn't have a functional script on FF?

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

What's really interesting to me is that in everything we've seen has had both Kinberg(hot from DFOP) and Trank(whose is rumors I've heard personally about) handcuffed together as if Kinberg is somewhat taking the pressure off of Trank in these interviews and YouTube commentary. How often do you see a screenwriter right next to the director like that? Maybe I haven't seen enough of this type of stuff, but I'd almost expect Teller/Jordan and Trank.

It's been clear throughout this production that Fox wants Kinberg, rather than Trank, doing the talking.

We can speculate about what that actually means, but that's what we're seeing.

 

[Mike Murdock]

By Kinberg's own admission, he was in Baton Rouge working on the script as filming was starting.

Doesn't that mean they didn't have a functional script on FF?

While I personally think it's a terrible way to do business, I will concede that it's at least surprisingly common. Many movies are essentially written as they're filmed because, when you have everyone ready to go, you go regardless of whether there's a script there or not. You can always make the story make sense in post and do some pickup shooting to polish it.

 

[Dasher10]

Well, technically Kinberg is also the producer, so he's a little more than "the writer". But it's strange to notice that Kinberg seems completely in command. This remind me of the rumors of FOX wanting to replace Trank. For me the interviews make it pretty clear that Trank is only tolerated as a yes men under Kinberg command.

Pretty much. As the producer, he's Trank's boss. Trank shoots and edits the film but Kinberg is the guy responsible for everything else + he's now a bigshot at Fox while Trank is ultimately new to film making which gives him little clout.

 

[Kelly]

While I personally think it's a terrible way to do business, I will concede that it's at least surprisingly common. Many movies are essentially written as they're filmed because, when you have everyone ready to go, you go regardless of whether there's a script there or not. You can always make the story make sense in post and do some pickup shooting to polish it.

It happened quite a bit on the first two films as well, and the writing was horrible for those.

One of the reasons that Ioan came off so stiff at times (something I have not seen once on his new TV series because he doesn't have to do an American accent) was because he would learn lines polish it up with the American accent, and be ready to shoot. 20 minutes before a scene is to be shot he would get a fax with a new page, new lines, etc....and no time to work on the American accent. I think it hurt his performance, and certainly did not make for a strong script.

 

[Tony Stark]

It's a double edged sword. There was no functional script for Iron Man, a point which Jeff Bridges nailed home because it was the first project that he signed on where he wasn't able to read a script, just a synopsis of his character.

The film turned out great because of the great improvisational skill of Robert Downey Jr. that held the film together.

On the 2nd film they actually intentionally tried to do the improvisational thing, and in large part it backfired, although the film was still very successful, but not among the top MCU films, or even as good as the first film.

With this film, not having a script will be a disaster. You don't do that to young and up and coming actors, and the film will suffer as a result.

 

[Urich Leeds]

I think, in general, not having a finished/functional script when it comes time to shoot is bad. Plain and simply bad.

Yes, a great crew and talented actors can make it work with quick rewrites and improv, but it should never have to come to that.

 

[TheFuture]

With this film, not having a script will be a disaster. You don't do that to young and up and coming actors, and the film will suffer as a result.

Do what? They weren't forced to sign on the dotted line, so if this ends up hurting their career to can point the finger at themselves.

If someone signs up without a script, they are taking a gamble. They should be big and ugly enough to recognise it could go either way and not blame anyone else.

 

[RAE072]

I think, in general, not having a finished/functional script when it comes time to shoot is bad. Plain and simply bad.

Yes, a great crew and talented actors can make it work with quick rewrites and improv, but it should never have to come to that.

Yep. And that is definitely not every crew and most actors.

Even if you're a talented actor, you may suck at improv.

It's a very hard skill to learn/adapt. And some are just naturally gifted.

And this type of filmmaking almost never works out for the best. Almost never. It's best to have the script ready to go and modify as needed. If a scene doesn't really fit, change it or throw it out(major overhauls during or near the end of filming rarely work out either).

So yeah, if these insiders are correct, this movie will probably be a mess.

By Kinberg's own admission, he was in Baton Rouge working on the script as filming was starting.

Doesn't that mean they didn't have a functional script on FF?

Yyyyep.

And now reshoots are under way, meaning things are still a mess or they're trying to alter tone(which will make it more of a mess).

 

[Farren]

Despite there being some "lucky" films out there, I think a film always benefits from having an actual complete script. You can still have change and improvisation under those circumstances. Without a proper script you're just handicapping yourself from the start. I realize that there are timetables to meet on these productions, but if things get desperate I don't know why these studios don't just take the writer(s), the director and the producer(s) and lock them in a hotel room for a couple weeks. You can't build a good house on a *%$# foundation.

 

[Tony Stark]

Do what? They weren't forced to sign on the dotted line, so if this ends up hurting their career to can point the finger at themselves.

If someone signs up without a script, they are taking a gamble. They should be big and ugly enough to recognise it could go either way and not blame anyone else.

I agree, but the one thing I will defend is that I think Miles Teller, Kate Mara and MBJ are all terrific actors (I really haven't seen any of Jamie Bell's work to comment, but I'm sure he's fine).

Yes they signed on for the film, but I do have sympathy for actors as this is just a job for them. We've all done that in our own careers early on where you take a job you don't really want but know that it may open another opportunity. Yes it's a risk, but the studio is taking advantage of that.

I've been clear from the star of my opposition to this film, it has nothing to do with the actors, other than thinking they are miscast, and that's different from being a bad actor. Example being Kevin Costner is a great actor, but he was severely miscast as Robin Hood.

 

[justanotherguy]

Pretty much. As the producer, he's Trank's boss. Trank shoots and edits the film but Kinberg is the guy responsible for everything else + he's now a bigshot at Fox while Trank is ultimately new to film making which gives him little clout.

Just so we are clear, F4 has several producers and yes some of these are INO


Avi Arad ... executive producer
Gregory Goodman ... producer
Simon Kinberg ... producer
Cliff Lanning ... associate producer
Stan Lee ... executive producer
Mark Millar ... creative consultant
Hutch Parker ... producer
Matthew Vaughn ... producer

 

[Tony Stark]

Just so we are clear, F4 has several producers and yes some of these are INO


Avi Arad ... executive producer
Gregory Goodman ... producer
Simon Kinberg ... producer
Cliff Lanning ... associate producer
Stan Lee ... executive producer
Mark Millar ... creative consultant
Hutch Parker ... producer
Matthew Vaughn ... producer

Yeah, funny calling Arad and Lee executive producers. That must be just a hommage. Arad is only involved with Sony's Spider-man films now, and Lee is just a figure head. I bet he doesn't even get a cameo in this one.

 

[Whiskey Tango]

Exec producer credits are frequently earned just by having your name attached to a property. You don't have to actively be involved with the production or have any creative input at all.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Kinberg's stock has been rising at FOX though. I wouldn't be surprised if he has a position that some thought Millar would have in the FOX-verse. I think Singer, Vaughn and Kinberg are the "brain trust" over there these days.

 

[Flint Marko]

Yeah, funny calling Arad and Lee executive producers. That must be just a hommage. Arad is only involved with Sony's Spider-man films now, and Lee is just a figure head. I bet he doesn't even get a cameo in this one.

Yeah for some reason I feel pretty safe in saying there's no Stan cameo in this one. But Trank pinky swears he has his blessing!

Kinberg's stock has been rising at FOX though. I wouldn't be surprised if he has a position that some thought Millar would have in the FOX-verse. I think Singer, Vaughn and Kinberg are the "brain trust" over there these days.

I still kind of get a "watchdog" vibe from him whenever I see or hear him and Trank together. My money is on the fact that they don't trust Trank by himself, Kinberg is clearly the better PR guy so he's not letting Josh out of his sight.

 

[Urich Leeds]

Just so we are clear, F4 has several producers and yes some of these are INO


Avi Arad ... executive producer
Gregory Goodman ... producer
Simon Kinberg ... producer
Cliff Lanning ... associate producer
Stan Lee ... executive producer
Mark Millar ... creative consultant
Hutch Parker ... producer
Matthew Vaughn ... producer

I'll wager that they're all INO except for Kinberg.