Fant4stic: Reborn! - - - - Part 23

[moviedoors]

Im a little biased. I watched the 2 back to back. And just got annoyed because i felt like i was watching the same thing but on acid. But they're also two very different films... one horror, one comedy

That kinda sounds like a compliment!

 

[TheComicbookKid]

I think you're not quite understanding... the amazing spider-man 2 had the death of a love interest but was still a relatively light film. You can have dark and serious things in a light film just as you can have a dark film with humor (the black comedy) that doesnt suddenly change a films over-all tone either. Doctor who has some dark stories, but its still a light hearted show

No. We're mostly saying the same thing. Death happens in a lot of films. Marvel had the Avengers fight in a city. MOS had the same. But only one of them is described as dark.

Light doesn't mean absence of pain.

Dark doesn't mean absence of light.

So why is the FF movie dark? Cause they aren't wearing bright uniforms? Cause it looks like Interstellar instead of NuWho?

That's saying what it's not. Not what it is.


If you tell me it's dark because Reed is experimenting on humans or Sue is banging Reed's nemesis, Domashev to cause a riff between them. That's dark.

 

[RAE072]

That's playing it serious. No doubt.

But comedies have serious stuff, too.

And some dramas have comedic elements? What's your point?

Changing the tone of something completely isn't "playing it serious" or a matter of "a comedy with serious stuff."

A Fantastic Four film can still take itself seriously, have elements of drama and comedy, AND still look like a Fantastic Four film.

THIS pile does not look like a Fantastic Four film.

Early UFF looked more like the FF(barely) than this thing and THAT wasn't even good either.

 

[wobbly]

Serious? I agree. That's not the same as dark and gritty though.

So you don't agree that "Glum, moody voiceover and utterly humourless" are accurate descriptions of the FF trailer?

Matt Murdock is a humorous guy even in dark times. Just because the trailer has no humor doesn't mean they missed the mark.

Later trailers should show us something else but we can only go by what they have chosen to show us so far. And going by the trailer they have missed the mark (imo).

 

[TheComicbookKid]

And some dramas have comedic elements? What's your point?

Changing the tone of something completely isn't "playing it serious" or a matter of "a comedy with serious stuff."

A Fantastic Four film can still take itself seriously, have elements of drama and comedy, AND still look like a Fantastic Four film.

THIS pile does not look like a Fantastic Four film.

Early UFF looked more like the FF(barely) than this thing and THAT wasn't even good either.

Well, If by looking like a Fantastic Four you mean 616 then yeah. It's not a 616 movie.

But it I was being that narrow, then Ultimate Nick Fury or Ultimate Falcon would be blasphemy. First Avenger making the classic costume look stupid in favor of it's Ultimate version would have pissed me off.

 

[moviedoors]

Honestly, I take the tone of trailer with a grain of salt. It's a trailer! I think of how the Pacific Rim trailers played vs. how the movie played. I think we're gonna get something in that ballpark. I predict more levity than we all initially may think we'll get. Chronicle showed a strong command of tone, and I trust Trank to bring that same balance of tone to this project.

I like this guy. I'm rooting for him.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

So you don't agree that "Glum, moody voiceover and utterly humourless" are accurate descriptions of the FF trailer?

beige, bland, average,redundant. Yeah.

The problem is that people were pushing so many ideas that the trailer ended up not supporting that it got extra points for defying expectations.

I kept waiting for found footage cause that's what people were pushing it as. Then it comes out with no found footage and looks like Interstellar instead of Project Almanac.

The bland black outfits weren't the "grounded" bee keeper/flight suits people thought they were going to have. They do have a function.

Later trailers should show us something else but we can only go by what they have chosen to show us so far. And going by the trailer they have missed the mark (imo).

I can't argue with you on this. You're being consistent.

How dare you be consistent on the internet!!!

 

[spideyboy_1111]

No. We're mostly saying the same thing. Death happens in a lot of films. Marvel had the Avengers fight in a city. MOS had the same. But only one of them is described as dark.

Light doesn't mean absence of pain.

Dark doesn't mean absence of light.

So why is the FF movie dark? Cause they aren't wearing bright uniforms? Cause it looks like Interstellar instead of NuWho?

That's saying what it's not. Not what it is.


If you tell me it's dark because Reed is experimenting on humans or Sue is banging Reed's nemesis, Domashev to cause a riff between them. That's dark.

Im talking physical look, feel, and tone. .. and the fact the cast and crew HAVE CONFIRMED that this film is dark, gritty, and grounded. Its not really open for debate

 

[moviedoors]

Its not really open for debate

It's open for debate until the film opens. And then beyond, in it's own context.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Im talking physical look, feel, and tone. .. and the fact the cast and crew HAVE CONFIRMED that this film is dark, gritty, and grounded. Its not really open for debate

That's what my original problem was. Dark, gritty, and grounded don't mean anything anymore.

Croenberg isn't the realm of grounded. A man turning into a fly?

Dark Amblin? Goonies is what you compare your gritty film to?

That's like saying Depp's Lone Ranger is like 3:10 to Yuma cause they both involve trains.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

It's open for debate until the film opens. And then beyond, in it's own context.

Yeah... um.. you do that

 

[moviedoors]

Dark Amblin? Goonies is what you compare your gritty film to?

Did anyone involved with this production actually invoke The Goonies?

 

[moviedoors]

Yeah... um.. you do that

I think it's plainly evident that I already am!

 

[spideyboy_1111]

That's what my original problem was. Dark, gritty, and grounded don't mean anything anymore.

Croenberg isn't the realm of grounded. A man turning into a fly?

Dark Amblin? Goonies is what you compare your gritty film to?

That's like saying Depp's Lone Ranger is like 3:10 to Yuma cause they both involve trains.

I think you're taking the phrase too literally. .

Basically just means "as realistic as possible, dark visual tones, brooding drama, serious events, emotional" it doesn't mean literally everything is serious and completely realistic.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I think it's plainly evident that I already am!

Sounds like denial. But you are more than welcome to feel that way

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Did anyone involved with this production actually invoke The Goonies?

I'm projecting slightly.

Trank compared it to the Amblin movie style just darker.

Trank knows his film history I'm guessing. Nothing in those trailers looked Amblin. So i have to assume I'm missing something or Trank is exaggerating, or he missed the mark on what he thought he was inspired by.

 

[Paradox1]

Did anyone involved with this production actually invoke The Goonies?

I don't know about the Goonies but Amblin surely. As a kid I loved E.T. but as an adult I realize that film is extremely dark in tone. It seemed to be aimed at kids but it really was not.

 

[moviedoors]

I'm still giddy that David Cronenberg is being invoked in reference to this project. He's one of the great filmmakers. If Trank can co-opt some of that quintessentially Cronenberg-tackling-existentialism-in-a-pop-culture-context mojo, I'll be a happy man.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I'm projecting slightly.

Trank compared it to the Amblin movie style just darker.

Trank knows his film history I'm guessing. Nothing in those trailers looked Amblin. So i have to assume I'm missing something or Trank is exaggerating, or he missed the mark on what he thought he was inspired by.

Well... youth and sci-fi = amblin for the most part. Which we are getting... but a bit older, and darker

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I'm still giddy that David Cronenberg is being invoked in reference to this project. He's one of the great filmmakers. If Trank can co-opt some of that quintessentially Cronenberg-tackling-existentialism-in-a-pop-culture-context mojo, I'll be a happy man.

Because you know, when i think of "the fly" i think of the fantastic four ......

 

[moviedoors]

I'm projecting slightly.

Trank compared it to the Amblin movie style just darker.

Trank knows his film history I'm guessing. Nothing in those trailers looked Amblin. So i have to assume I'm missing something or Trank is exaggerating, or he missed the mark on what he thought he was inspired by.

I think invoking Amblin is stretching things as far as the trailer is concerned, but calling The Goonies "dark Amblin" is way off the mark. That movie is like an 8 year old boy's subconscious translated directly to 35mm. It's lightness and adventure incarnate.

 

[moviedoors]

Because you know, when i think of "the fly" i think of the fantastic four ......

I think it could work. Cronenberg was able to smuggle all these heady ideas about living and disease and watching your spouse be wrecked by physical change into a genre horror flick that more easily resonated with audiences than a straight up AIDS movie or cancer movie would have. It's why I like genre. If a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down, than genre can be that sugar. I don't expect Fantastic Four to operate on that same level of thematic tragedy that Cronenberg can achieve, but I can't complain about the ambition either. I welcome the challenge and I maintain an optimism that Trank can tap into that meaty subtext that he so clearly wants to present.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

I think you're taking the phrase too literally. .

Basically just means "as realistic as possible, dark visual tones, brooding drama, serious events, emotional" it doesn't mean literally everything is serious and completely realistic.

I don't think I'm taking it too literally.

I took it to mean I'm not sure how exactly Trank took those inspirations.

The trailer didn't look Croenbergian in body horror. Amblin isn't the word anyone here used when seeing that trailer. Heck, the scene of the two kids and the machine may be Back to the Future inspired as his Amblin influence.


Basically, the trailer didn't do anything except be serious and withhold info.

I'm not sure why people were shocked Sue can fly other than the fact it was the only thing to visually pull from the comics.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

I think invoking Amblin is stretching things as far as the trailer is concerned, but calling The Goonies "dark Amblin" is way off the mark. That movie is like an 8 year old boy's subconscious translated directly to 35mm. It's lightness and adventure incarnate.

That's what I mean. Trank may be inspired by Amblin cause he like the scene from UFF of Reed as a kid. So the overlap is that the hero starts as a kid?

I don't know. I draw, people can have influence without overtly copying. Hitch is obviously influenced by Neal Adams but their art wouldn't be mistaken for one another.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

I think it could work. Cronenberg was able to smuggle all these heady ideas about living and disease and watching your spouse be wrecked by physical change into a genre horror flick that more easily resonated with audiences than a straight up AIDS movie or cancer movie would have. It's why I like genre. If a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down, than genre can be that sugar. I don't expect Fantastic Four to operate on that same level of thematic tragedy that Cronenberg can achieve, but I can't complain about the ambition either. I welcome the challenge and I maintain an optimism that Trank can tap into that meaty subtext that he so clearly wants to present.

oh you are making my head hurt. I don't want the fantastic four treating themselves like they're diseased