The Rise of Skywalker General Star Wars Episode IX News/Speculation Thread - Part 1

[TheVileOne]

It is, but I suppose it's the only way to shake things up for the better considering the way TLJ ended.

Fair I suppose, but not really buying these rumors yet.

Making Star Wars is usually the best at this. However, that report was sort of garbled. Also they are not always right. They did falsely predict that there was going to be a Knights of Ren fight scene on Achto.

Star Wars: Episode VIII & The Knights of Ren

There might even be kernels of truth to what's being reported. But we have to keep in mind the rumors could be based on dated information or story information that's being rewritten.

There were a lot of rumors for Force Awakens that didn't pan out because someone probably saw some Lucasfilm concept art and reported on it. But that concept artwork eventually got tossed out or the narrative they had in mind was rewritten.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

A lot of the speculation on the web I've seen is some bad pro-wrestling booking or bad video game writing.

Spoiler

TFA: Here's this mysterious final boss for the hero to defeat: Snoke!
TLJ: Ahaha got ya! His underling Kylo Ren defeats him and replaces him as the final boss instead! We don't even explain anything new about him before he's gone!
IX: Ahaha got ya again! There's this other secret true final final boss that the previous final boss Kylo Ren has to pursue and fight now.

Meanwhile all the other characters might as well be deleted from the script because this plot doesn't care about them anyway.

 

[OtherwiseKnownAs]

Spoiler

If the threat from the Beyond is true, the only way I can see it working without it being shoehorned is if its some kind of resurrected/reincarnated Snoke.

Again, who knows what's true or not, but it's fun to speculate.

 

[godisawesome]

Spoiler

If the threat from the Beyond is true, the only way I can see it working without it being shoehorned is if its some kind of resurrected/reincarnated Snoke.

Again, who knows what's true or not, but it's fun to speculate.

That’s about the only way to have a bigger, badder villain than Kylo without it feeling like a stupid, tacked on element. We’ve got two movies building up Kylo as the main villain, and his ascension to Supreme Leader in TLJ is one of the few things even most critics think was a great idea in concept, even if the execution was banal.

That villain getting a return ties the story into the overall ST format, provides an excuse to uncover obligatory answers to question that RJ left untouched in the past. Just make sure hepis return is different entirely from what they did with Palpatine back in Dark Horse comics.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

I think the best idea is to tie it back the Plagueis.

Spoiler

Make it so Plagueis died and got reborn as Snoke, and now Snoke died and got reborn as this new Big Bad. Not only does that keep Ep 9 from feeling tacked on to the rest of the sequel trilogy, but it makes the sequel trilogy feel less tacked on to the main saga.

 

[OtherwiseKnownAs]

Gonna have to say no to anything that leads to any Sith coming back. I’d prefer it if the Sith remain dead and gone.

 

[RocketsNutz]

Doesn't the Thrawn novel or one of the other novels of the past couple years that takes place after ROTS mention something about Palpatine sensing something from The Beyond? Don't know if it's explicitly stated he sees it as a threat, but I could have sworn I've seen people reference it. But for all I know it could have just been someone referencing something from Reddit or even old EU/Legends (I never ready much of that other than the Thrawn Series).

If that is true, to go back to that for IX would be fantastic, it's just that they've done a **** job of setting that up within the ST so far.

As for the whole Sith thing and Chosen One thing. Is it ever said that The Chosen one destroys the Sith explicitly "forever"? I'm 99% sure in ROTS that isn't stated (Obi-wan tells Anakin he was supposed to destroy the Sith... doesn't say "forever", even if that's what they believed). Can't remember if TCW series mentions it either way, or other canon books. And even in George's comments on the subject, does he even explicitly say 'forever'? Just wonder if it's possible to interpret the prophecy as the chosen one will destroy (the current) sith (threat). Ya know?

And for that matter has it been established in either canon material or even in interviews with George when the balance in the force (that the chosen one will restore) went out of whack? Like what caused it to go out of whack to be restored? I know in TCW series the episodes where Yoda discovers an implication for the balance within. I just wish George had kinda established the framework for things a little better and cut a speed chase here or there, or the droid factory by a minute or two.

Edit: Guess I wasn't going nuts - https://nerdist.com/article/star-wars-unknown-regions/

 

[Brother Jack]

Gonna have to say no to anything that leads to any Sith coming back. I’d prefer it if the Sith remain dead and gone.

I can't think of a way for them or Palpatine in the flesh to come back without harming the ending to ROTJ. Vader fulfilled the chosen one prophecy when he killed Palpatine and himself, destroying the Sith. The dark side obviously still exists, but they should be other denominations of dark side adherents.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

Easy solution to that. Just make Plagueis/Snoke something that existed before the Sith. An outside entity that revived the Sith order to spread the influence of the dark side in the galaxy.

Or just make the entity separate from Plagueis, but have it be what trained Plagueis in the ways of the dark side (who then went on to become a Sith and revive the Sith order), and trained Snoke.

 

[titansupes]

I mean, for years we've been hearing about this "Beyond", via books and encyclopedias, and speculating that it would tie into Snoke and the finale... But considering Snoke's death... I dunno. I feel like he has to come back in some way, however small (red Force Ghost? A voice in Kylo's head?) for it to link back properly.

I can't think of a way for them or Palpatine in the flesh to come back without harming the ending to ROTJ. Vader fulfilled the chosen one prophecy when he killed Palpatine and himself, destroying the Sith. The dark side obviously still exists, but they should be other denominations of dark side adherents.

I wished they'd changed up Snoke and Kylo's versions of Dark Siders a bit more. They can say they're not Sith in interviews or whatever, but at the end of the day they're still baddies dressed in black with red lightsabers, Force Lightning and the exact same rhetoric about the Force, the Jedi, the galaxy etc.

 

[Silver Surfer]

All about the Sith making a comeback. As far the prophecy of the Sith being ultimately "destroyed":

 

[Silver Surfer]

Isn't it kind of late in the game to introduce a new threat from Beyond?

It really is, but they are boxed into a corner and need a new credible threat. Rian unceremoniously killed off Snoke, and we already saw Rey defeat Kylo.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

Or the prophecy could have just been a bunch of baloney all along. Personally, I love the idea of Anakin being created by the Sith to fool the Jedi into thinking he was the Chosen One, as it gives him back his agency when he returns to the light side. Instead of being preordained to return to the light side, it would now be the opposite, as he'd have been created specifically to be an agent of the dark side, manipulated his whole life for that purpose, yet still he managed to resist it in the end.

 

[TheVileOne]

Whatever it is, JJ Abrams better come up with something amazing and let go of the mystery box setup garbage.

 

[Marvolo]

I thik it's the Sith Empire that's making a return. In the Legends there was a Lost tribe of Sith that had set up their own civilization, culture, army etc in the Unknown Reguons. They returned and conquered Coruscant Ffs urging the Fate of the Jedi book series. If the Knight of Red have been in the Unknown Regions then it's not a leap that they could have joined up and are leading the Sith navy and army back to conquer the scraps of the Republic and Kylo's First Order. Could see the Rebellion and the First Order having to become allies, forming the Galactic Alliance, to fight the Sith Empire.

It would also fit with the rest of the trilogy. Rey wants the Jedi to come back in TFA. Luke spends most of TLJ trying to stop that, but in the end he realizes the Jedi must return. In TLJ Kylo tells Rey to forget the Jedi and the Sith. To let them die and he and her will do their own thing. I think episode 9 is going to show Kylo having to understand that the Sith arent gone and forgotten. They like the Jedi will return. Their must be balance. Hence the rumored title: Balance of the Force.

But if that's what Abrams intends to do he needs to make it very different from the secular Empire in the OT and the First Order. The Sith Empire needs to be like a cult. With worshipping the Dark Side the official Imperial religion. Blood sacrifices. Sadistic and masochistic rituals. Dark priests. Rigid caste systems. Many dark Lords of the Sith controlling the Empire. Basically, the Sith Emoire needs to be as dark and twisted as the Yuuzan Vong without the Vong's animal body mods and aversion to technology.

 

[Silver Surfer]

As awesome as introducing the Sith Empire would be, and believe me it would be F'in awesome, there just isn't enough time in a 2.5+ hr movie to do all the world building that would be required, along with everything else that needs to be featured and resolved. My best guess is 1 big bad from the Beyond, who takes over the First Order and kicks out Kylo. We then see a team-up of Kylo and our heroes to bring him down.

 

[Marvolo]

As awesome as introducing the Sith Empire would be, and believe me it would be F'in awesome, there just isn't enough time in a 2.5+ hr movie to do all the world building that would be required, along with everything else that needs to be featured and resolved. My best guess is 1 big bad from the Beyond, who takes over the First Order and kicks out Kylo. We then see a team-up of Kylo and our heroes to bring him down.

You're looking at it needing to be contained to this single film. The Skywaller saga ends with 9 but the films will continue after 9. The Sith Empire only need to be introduced as a large military and Force threat. This would be their first attempt to set up a beach head. So all they'd need to show in this film would be the Sith Navy and warriors. The knights bring in their ships and the first wave. The Rebellion and maybe the First Order together beat them back into a retreat. The film would end with the Jedi and the government knowing the Sith Empire is still out there and will return again. This would make Rey and the government to fully support a New Jedi Order.

I dont think itd require a lot of world building in this first film.

 

[henzINNIT]

Ancient Sith army could be fun. A larger, more wholly evil force would certainly shift Kylo's place in this story. The First Order is essentially an army of slaves too, so maybe they can be "redeemed" and repurposed. I'm not sure what will happen, but I've enjoyed the shades of grey this trilogy has hinted at and think a new form of "balance" being achieved could be a nice way to wrap this story up.

I love our new heroes. I've seen a lot of people complain that we don't know them well enough. I don't agree really, though I wish Finn had more to do. I know TLJ is the go-to target for this, but I think Disney accelerating the film releases has harmed things there too.

 

[TheVileOne]

You're looking at it needing to be contained to this single film. The Skywaller saga ends with 9 but the films will continue after 9. The Sith Empire only need to be introduced as a large military and Force threat. This would be their first attempt to set up a beach head. So all they'd need to show in this film would be the Sith Navy and warriors. The knights bring in their ships and the first wave. The Rebellion and maybe the First Order together beat them back into a retreat. The film would end with the Jedi and the government knowing the Sith Empire is still out there and will return again. This would make Rey and the government to fully support a New Jedi Order.

I dont think itd require a lot of world building in this first film.

That'd be a terrible way to end the trilogy.

 

[Closerframe]

I hope to god the Skywalker trilogy doesn’t end with a new threat being introduced that was secretly pulling the strings the entire time nor do a I want some big army from “the beyond” to come out of nowhere forcing the First Order and what’s left of the Resistance to band together to fight a common enemy. It just screams lazy writing and doesn’t sound like a well thought out trilogy. Just because it’s s the third film doesn't mean it has to necessarily be the biggest. Make it a personal story with the Knights of Ren being the big baddie and Kylo’s control/sanity is continuing to slip which puts him in this position that forces him to confront Rey once more but with some help this time. But even in this scenario, this seems anticlimatic because if Rey beat Ren in TFA, and with neither really receiving any training from their respective masters, what would be the point of them fighting again?

Johnson should have shown Ren and Rey’s training in parallel instead of focusing on a gambling planet plot line. The end result could have still had Ren kill Snoke thereby completing his training and Luke could have still chosen not to join the fight but at least prepared Rey in some capacity.

 

[Silver Surfer]

^ That's basically the biggest problem with the new saga movies, they're not a well thought out trilogy. They can't do Rey/Kylo II because we already saw that, and the villain lost, they killed off Snoke, so he can't fulfill the bid bad purpose. At this point they are gonna have to go with lazy writing that introduces a new threat out of nowhere, and gets resolved as an end to the Skywalker saga.

Thankfully, Lucasfilm has realized their error with this trilogy and hired D&D to write and flesh out the next trilogy beforehand.

 

[Marvolo]

With some of the info and pics we have I'm drawing the conclusion that the climax takes place at Tatooine or Jaaku and I gotta say that aggravates the **** out of me. It's such a visually bland place to have a climax when their are planets like Mustafar. And I'm frankly sick of desert planets. Lucas featured tatooine in two OT films and now JJ is featuring another desert planet in Episode 9 after he has already done Jaaku.

And I'm sure the thinking is that Tatooine holds special significance to the Skywalkers, but it's not a happy or deep significance. Anskin was only there because he was a slave, and when he escaped the place he had no desire to return. It wasnt some cherished place for him. He only returned to try to save his mother. Luke was only sent there to be hidden, and his family was slaughtered there. He only returned to save Han. That miserable dust ball shouldnt be returning in the sequel trilogy. And making it the setting for the end of the Skywalker saga is like some sort of bad joke.

 

[TheVileOne]

Jakku less so for me because it seems like a pretty significant place in the canon right now. Tatooine would be lazy yes IMO.

However, I say it all depends on execution.

 

[Marvolo]

I'm just getting tired of directors and storytellers squandering the potential locations of the Star Wars universe. It's the one area I feel star wars is extremely lacking, and in this day and age theres just really no excuse for it. Lucas went with simple planets in the OT due to lack of vfx tech. But its 2019, and the MCU has repeatedly featured very alien and even outlandish planets and locations and done it very well. And yet this sequel trilogy just repeats the same ho hum planet types we've seen in the OT: desert, snow, forests. A salt planet with red dirt was their idea of shaking things up visually.

The the cgi may not have been great but at least Lucas tried to do something interesting with the planets in the PT. And I've heard all the arguments against those cgi planets, but that argument doesnt hold water in 2019. Not after a decade of the MCU and having seen Titan, the Dark Dimension planets, Nowhere, Xandar, Sovereign, EGO, Contraxia etc, and Kronos in star trek and Pandora. There is just no damn good excuse for Star Wars to continually use such boring locations. There are so many canon planets that are interesting. And it's a fictional fantasy so they can make up any sort of planet they want to, but these damn directors and writers keep settling for mundane.

Back when the PT was being released two things I always got excited about was what cool new lightsabers the next film would show, and what new planets we'd see. But with this trilogy I've lost all interest in the planets, because there just hasnt been much creativity in that department aside from Starkiller and Crait. Canto Bight was mildly interesting because of its Mediterranean esque design, but they wasted that with the Finn/Rose plotline.

Even Star Wars Rebels settled for a mundane grassland savanna type planet as its main location. And Resistance is set on a damn water planet and a base.

One thing I've been thinking about for a while is a medieval planet. Truly medieval in dress and technology. Equivalent to 15th century England and Europe. Castles, knights, horses, steel swords and bows and arrows, royal monarchies etc. Maybe with a slight alien twist. A planet in the Unknown Regions trapped in a part of space cut off from the rest of the civilized galaxy. It evolved and developed not knowing about any of the rest of the star wars galaxy. And the rest of the galaxy not knowing about it. And what would happen if some Jedi or other star wars characters found themselves on that planet in a society and culture like that. Especially since there is no prime directive in star wars. What the outcome and interactions would be? How would the people of that world react to jedi and starships and droids? Itd be ike an Arthurian legend and a star wars mashup. I just think something like that could be a fun one off and star wars being space opera can do something bizarre like that.

 

[X Knight]

guys, the new threat from beyond is clearly

Spoiler

Rey's parents