BvS Henry Cavill IS Superman - - - - - - - - - - - Part 25

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[CaptainWagner]

I honestly think Snyder doesn't "get" Superman. The most telling aspect of it was that he didn't let Clark save Pa in Man of Steel.

However, Henry Cavill acted his ass off given the dialogue and scenes given, and you can always tell what he's thinking or getting ready to do.

Superman smiled plenty in this film, he had his doubts, but he comes around fully at the end.

The most Superman moments of all, were

Spoiler

the montage of him saving people,

and finally,

Spoiler

"THIS is my world. YOU'RE my world."

It's funny, because I agree with all your points but I think Snyder has given a great Superman rendition.

When he comes back, I think he's going to be changed a lot. This is the perfect opportunity to transform him fully into the more familiar version. And it's likely Warner Brothers will be strongly encouraging Snyder to wrap up that arc, because apparently the critics and a lot of fans don't like Superman having any sort of character path.

 

[lukebrodyg]

"I'll raise you a right on with another right on, haha. In my eyes, if we would have got a Superman in BvS that was all of a sudden fully developed into the classic Superman with no more room to grow, then that would tell me the vision for the longterm Superman story has been givin' up on and that Superman's arc as a character and mindset would have been settled on.

I would have been upset about that. It would have gave me nothing to look forward to. Seeing that dirt rise shows me Superman's arc is FAR from over and I'm excited to see where this could be going. Some people act like they are all in on a wider Universe, but refuse to believe that there are rules into building the story. These aren't solo movies in one self contained universe. We must allow the story to develop and Superman shouldn't be the exception. If he was the exception? That means they have NO plans for him.

The ending told me otherwise. They have a plan with Supes. That's all I can ask for. Talk to me when the DCEU is over; not 2 films in."

Tra-El, absolutely. That's why I'm glad I fell on the side of enjoying and appreciating what Snyder and Co. are attempting to do with this universe. It has flaws but what doesn't? The important thing for me as a Superman fan first was that we saw more progression to his character and that the film largely revolved around him.

The ending was icing on the cake for me.

 

[BlueLanternKal]

The Man of Steel Will Return in Justice League...

https://youtu.be/7kzKJL6TfnM

 

[Tra-El]

Cav-EL with that beard? OHMYESSSSS. The Black and Silver is happening. The casket was foreshadowing.

 

[lukebrodyg]

The Man of Steel Will Return in Justice League...

https://youtu.be/7kzKJL6TfnM

Now wouldn't that be something!

 

[Bren]

Some people didn't like Superman in MOS because he was young, reckless, inexperienced, angry and maybe a little bitter. The payoff would be in BvS where we see some growth; he's better, he is more concerned, careful, more hopeful....

Err wait, hold the phone folks... The payoff has been postponed, in the interests of... Well, you'll see in JL. Well, maybe the 3rd act, when he is somehow resurrected.
It's possible this Superman's greatest character growth towards 'The Finished Article' will occur in the 2/3rds of the movie he's still dead.

 

[Tobias]

It's funny, because I agree with all your points but I think Snyder has given a great Superman rendition.

When he comes back, I think he's going to be changed a lot. This is the perfect opportunity to transform him fully into the more familiar version. And it's likely Warner Brothers will be strongly encouraging Snyder to wrap up that arc, because apparently the critics and a lot of fans don't like Superman having any sort of character path.

I disagree that fans don't want character growth. But that did not happen in BvS. It was almost a regression IMO.

Dark characters work, lighter characters do too. The biggest takeaway from BvS is the positive reaction Batfleck and WW/Gadot got. One dark, one light.

Another takeaway is Supes does not seem to have gotten much of a positive response from the GA so ...

... when WB sits Snyder down I am sure he will be told to lighten the character up. The point is to appeal to GA expectations and not force a version of Supes most don't seem to like.

Wrap up the arc pronto - especially given Snyder's comment about who knows what Supes will be when he returns. I think he wants to go full throttle evil Supes based on that and the visions.

At this point I don't see WB allowing that to happen.

 

[lukebrodyg]

I think to characterize Superman as "dark" is lazy. I see him as flawed and more relatable to the frustrations of life; not dark. A dark character doesn't save the man who tried to kill both the women you love and then sacrifice himself knowing he'll lose those women in doing so.

Batman is flawed and dark.

 

[CaptainWagner]

Some people didn't like Superman in MOS because he was young, reckless, inexperienced, angry and maybe a little bitter. The payoff would be in BvS where we see some growth; he's better, he is more concerned, careful, more hopeful....

Err wait, hold the phone folks... The payoff has been postponed, in the interests of... Well, you'll see in JL. Well, maybe the 3rd act, when he is somehow resurrected.
It's possible this Superman's greatest character growth towards 'The Finished Article' will occur in the 2/3rds of the movie he's still dead.

Again, certain fanboy groups just have no patience. BvS was the next obvious step. In MOS, Clark came out of the shadows. In BvS he is dealing with the personal challenges of being Superman and finally comes to grip with what that really means. This primes him to be resurrected as the unyielding beacon of hope we all know and love.

 

[Vartha]

Again, certain fanboy groups just have no patience. BvS was the next obvious step. In MOS, Clark came out of the shadows. In BvS he is dealing with the personal challenges of being Superman and finally comes to grip with what that really means. This primes him to be resurrected as the unyielding beacon of hope we all know and love.

I loved it because of that. People don't stop and think that this IS his first years as a Hero. YES, he's had his powers most of his life, but he hasn't used them in public.
He's going to have problems in the beginning Henry's played it well IMO. It's the SCRIPT that needs alittle tweaking. MAYBE there was something cut that says a bit more about that?

 

[CaptainWagner]

I loved it because of that. People don't stop and think that this IS his first years as a Hero. YES, he's had his powers most of his life, but he hasn't used them in public.
He's going to have problems in the beginning Henry's played it well IMO. It's the SCRIPT that needs alittle tweaking. MAYBE there was something cut that says a bit more about that?

Same here.

 

[Bren]

Again, certain fanboy groups just have no patience. BvS was the next obvious step. In MOS, Clark came out of the shadows. In BvS he is dealing with the personal challenges of being Superman and finally comes to grip with what that really means. This primes him to be resurrected as the unyielding beacon of hope we all know and love.

Fool me once, it's on you.
Fool me twice is on me.

I don't want to have to wait for the 3rd film(!) to see a hopeful, more inspirational happy Superman.
Even if for just a little. Was he even happy he saved anyone? Didn't look like it.

Now you're going to call me 'entitled fanboy'?

I get it; I didn't get the movie I wanted. That in itself doesn't make a film bad. Sadly, I thought the rest of the film was bad too.

 

[Tobias]

Fool me once, it's on you.
Fool me twice is on me.

I don't want to have to wait for the 3rd film(!) to see a hopeful, more inspirational happy Superman.
Even if for just a little. Was he even happy he saved anyone? Didn't look like it.

Now you're going to call me 'entitled fanboy'?

Yup. That was a big mistake IMO - Snyder dragging it out.

And from what he says sounds like Supes appears only in the 3rd act. So how much of an heroic Superman will we get to see?

 

[Quasimod0]

Just give the man some actual long dialogue scenes. Let him tell what he thinks, let him show his natural charisma.

 

[Rapunzel]

To me, it all hinges on JL. If Supes comes back better, more confident, and loved by the people, then all is good. I am cool with it taking awhile for CK to figure out his own mind and his own place in the world. But after such a

Spoiler

big sacrifice

it needs to be over. If the end of BvS isn't Supes' final step to becoming Supes, I'll be so sad.

The central question for me: will Snyder deliver this? Or does he have other plans?

 

[Rapunzel]

The Man of Steel Will Return in Justice League...

https://youtu.be/7kzKJL6TfnM

Cavill would rock this so hard. Make it happen, Snyder.

 

[Vaibow]

I loved it because of that. People don't stop and think that this IS his first years as a Hero. YES, he's had his powers most of his life, but he hasn't used them in public.
He's going to have problems in the beginning Henry's played it well IMO. It's the SCRIPT that needs alittle tweaking. MAYBE there was something cut that says a bit more about that?

I always thought and liked, that Clark was raised as a hero, regardless of wearing tights.

Being outed to the public should not be a change or development of character.

The world is introduced to a superman not the other way round.

 

[Rapunzel]

I always thought and liked, that Clark was raised as a hero, regardless of wearing tights.

Being outed to the public should not be a change or development of character.

The world is introduced to a superman not the other way round.

Yes, and the world needs to adjust. That's why I'm cool with BvS. It shows that.

 

[Tobias]

To me, it all hinges on JL. If Supes comes back better, more confident, and loved by the people, then all is good. I am cool with it taking awhile for CK to figure out his own mind and his own place in the world. But after such a

Spoiler

big sacrifice

it needs to be over. If the end of BvS isn't Supes' final step to becoming Supes, I'll be so sad.

The central question for me: will Snyder deliver this? Or does he have other plans?

From what he said about JL it sounds like other plans. In the comment about what Superman returns as. Implying an evil Superman.

However, given the reaction to BvS's dark tone I think WB may stop him from going down that road.

 

[Rapunzel]

I'm trying not to read too much into Snyder's words. But yeah, I'm certainly 100% confident he'll deliver on the set up BvS clearly lays out.

I can't believe anyone would think evil Supes is a good choice after his

Spoiler

tear inducing death

. I mean, it's just such a bad decision. Even Snyder should see it. And WB. And everyone else associated with the production of JL.

 

[HELLilac]

To me, it all hinges on JL. If Supes comes back better, more confident, and loved by the people, then all is good. I am cool with it taking awhile for CK to figure out his own mind and his own place in the world. But after such a

Spoiler

big sacrifice

it needs to be over. If the end of BvS isn't Supes' final step to becoming Supes, I'll be so sad.

The central question for me: will Snyder deliver this? Or does he have other plans?

Anything else except a glorious return would be a big slap in the face to all Superman's fans. I know it isn't beyond Snyder to go full ******ed and make another controversial choice but I have a little faith in WB that they wouldn't want to turn anymore fans away.

 

[Tobias]

Anything else except a glorious return would be a big slap in the face to all Superman's fans. I know it isn't beyond Snyder to go full ******ed and make another controversial choice but I have a little faith in WB that they wouldn't want to turn anymore fans away.

If nothing else a test of what the GA responds to in Superman.

Even if Supes/Cavill is just seen in the 3rd act of JL1 - if Superman is portrayed as bright, hopeful, charming - that will be the test. Fan reaction to that Superman vs to the one in MOS/BvS.

 

[X Knight]

MOS and BvS aren't my ideal versions of Superman. But, I enjoyed both films and will defend them overall.

However, I WILL draw the line if they decide to go the "evil Superman" route.