Endgame Hulk/Bruce Banner - Mark Ruffalo

Well...your point works for Hulk, since the regular Hulk would not have been smart enough to make proper use of the Infinity Gauntlet. But how exactly was fat Thor beneficial in the fight against Thanos? Thor abandoned the mission to get the reality stone, and then was weaker when fighting Thanos than he had been at the end of Infinity War. If Thor was still his Infinity War self, the heroes would have had a much easier victory.

Alpha Thor proved the limitations of his usefulness when he killed current Thanos when he could have been easily taken prisoner. Dude Thor allowed himself to be brought down, vulnerable and introspective, and gained important insights from his mother. Alpha Thor would have gone into past Asgard like a bull in a china shop and most likely would have failed (in the same way that Tony couldn't get the cosmic cube the first time, except Thor likely wouldn't have been smart enough to pull an audible and go deeper into the past to find the ether). The heroes won the day because every hero in the galaxy came back, so there was no shortage of power. Lateral thinking was how this conflict was won by the good guys.
 
Alpha Thor proved the limitations of his usefulness when he killed current Thanos when he could have been easily taken prisoner. Dude Thor allowed himself to be brought down, vulnerable and introspective, and gained important insights from his mother. Alpha Thor would have gone into past Asgard like a bull in a china shop and most likely would have failed (in the same way that Tony couldn't get the cosmic cube the first time, except Thor likely wouldn't have been smart enough to pull an audible and go deeper into the past to find the ether). The heroes won the day because every hero in the galaxy came back, so there was no shortage of power. Lateral thinking was how this conflict was won by the good guys.

That's a huuuuuge stretch. I can't think of any way IW Thor would've screwed up the mission to get the Reality Stone. There was no immediate threat, just the issue of Jane's cooperation/distraction, which wasn't ultimately necessary but would have made things easier.

You make it sound like Thor is some idiot who constantly screws things up, but that's not the case at all. He got sloppy with Thanos, yeah, but that's because he wanted Thanos to suffer, rather than just die a quick and painless death. He does not regularly screw up simple missions by charging in like a bull in a china shop.

And yeah, while the heroes did win, it was at the cost of Tony's life. I think Tony would have appreciated it if Thor was still fit enough to defeat Thanos on his own, thus removing the need for Tony to sacrifice himself.
 
That's a huuuuuge stretch. I can't think of any way IW Thor would've screwed up the mission to get the Reality Stone. There was no immediate threat, just the issue of Jane's cooperation/distraction, which wasn't ultimately necessary but would have made things easier.

You make it sound like Thor is some idiot who constantly screws things up, but that's not the case at all. He got sloppy with Thanos, yeah, but that's because he wanted Thanos to suffer, rather than just die a quick and painless death. He does not regularly screw up simple missions by charging in like a bull in a china shop.

And yeah, while the heroes did win, it was at the cost of Tony's life. I think Tony would have appreciated it if Thor was still fit enough to defeat Thanos on his own, thus removing the need for Tony to sacrifice himself.

No guarantee that Alpha Thor would have beaten Thanos that easily. The first time he beat Thanos was in the middle of a forest, Thanos was by himself and was running through the rest of the available Avengers, and was taken by surprise even with the Infinity Gauntlet. This time, Thanos is coming in hot and just nuked Avengers HQ.
 
No guarantee that Alpha Thor would have beaten Thanos that easily. The first time he beat Thanos was in the middle of a forest, Thanos was by himself and was running through the rest of the available Avengers, and was taken by surprise even with the Infinity Gauntlet. This time, Thanos is coming in hot and just nuked Avengers HQ.

Well, my point doesn't rely on Thor beating Thanos easily. It relies on the idea that Thor wouldn't somehow be worse off if he had still been in peak shape during the events of Endgame.
 
I'm fine with Banner being a technobabble guy but I need Hulk in action too. When he says best of both worlds, it's more best of Banner rather than best of Hulk.
Also wasn't it strange that...
...his arm didn't heal? If I know my Hulk lore his arm should have regenerated instantly. Especially by the time he attended Tony's funeral. That's more than 24 hours. Ok you could argue that the injury was magical in nature so it could have screwed up his healing, but after a few day's I would expect for him to be out of a sling.
 
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Kind of disappointing
we didn’t get to see how General Ross would react to seeing Professor Hulk since they were both at Tony’s funeral, but guess they couldn’t find a place for it to happen
 
How is Dr. Hulk in the film compared to in the comics?

There's obviously more build up towards the merging in the comics, quite a bit more complexity but again, that was the culmination of years worth of stories by the legendary Hulk scribe Peter David.

In the MCU we just have Banner and Hulk. But in the comics it was Green Hulk, childlike, easily angered, low IQ, wants to be left alone. Banner, brilliant scientist that always keeps his emotions in check who fears what he can do to the world now. But then there's the Gray Hulk. Gray Hulk was a sensualist. He was Banner's passions. Anger? Sure, but also lust and the arrogance and sense of superiority that Banner felt deep down. He was also selfish and self serving to a large degree. And he wasn't bestial or unintelligent. He could be quite crafty and cunning.

For years David basically built up to the idea that what Banner had was MPD, Multiple Personality Disorder, that manifested itself via the mutation he went under by the exposure to the gamma rays. A character called Doc Samson, sort of the super psychologist went about helping Bruce to come to terms with what caused this split. It was the murder of his mother at the hands of his father. Identifying the trauma and confronting it allowed the three sides to come to terms and unite. This wasn't a cure for Banner's mutation though. It just got his head together and thus emerged a new Hulk/Banner. One that was mostly Bruce in his personality and memories etc. but now he was Hulked out in green all the time. He had the ability to access the rage and anger of the Green Hulk but also had the darker elements the Gray Hulk exhibited, but also the positive sides, as a for insstance when making love to his wife Betty, she herself said she could see aspects of the Gray Hulk in Bruce. Now well rounded the Hulk/Banner was more formidable on the battlefield. He could employ more tactics and strategy or use the scientific acumen Bruce has at his fingertips.

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This wasn't the first time that Bruce had established control over the Hulk powers though. During the Secret War era, long before Peter David's run on the title, they came up with another way for Bruce to control the transformation. The key difference was that this was simply the Bruce Banner mind, separate from Green Hulk and Gray Hulk, in the Hulk body. This Hulk did not have as ready access to the rage strength increasing ability of the traditional Green Hulk and he certainly didn't have the cunning and mean streak of the Gray Hulk. The fear of losing this control is what caused this version of the Hulk's downfall, as the Banner personality was deeply worried about becoming savage and uncontrollable again, even more so than ever before. Looking to use Hulk against Doctor Strange one of the Sorcerer Supreme's enemies, Nightmare, used his dream powers to torture Bruce to the point that eventually the Banner personality suffered a "mind death". Now what was in charge of the Hulk's body was neither the simply minded and child like classic Green Hulk, and as this was before the explanation of the MPD aspect, there was no Gray Hulk either. This was a purely bestial Savage Hulk. A rage filled animal. After rampaging across NYC and ripping through a host of heroes from Spidey, Powerman And Iron Fist to finally the Mighty Avengers with Thor as the only one with a chance of stopping him Dr. Strange made the decision to banish Hulk from the Earthly dimension via his magic.

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Now in the MCU whatever solution Banner came up with we don't see. But for myself, on further thought, this wasn't really the merged Hulk of Peter David's run. Not really... this was the Hulk squarely with the mind of "Banner" in charge and nothing else. Thus, why it just seems like Bruce who's happy to be in control but no other side of his personas. Certainly we don't see the Green Hulk side that refused to come out in IW. I'm now going with this was just a physiological solution Bruce came up with as in the comics, but MCU Bruce still hasn't come to terms with the underlying psychological issues that make him a man with more than one personality running around inside his mind.
 
Also wasn't it strange that...
...his arm didn't heal? If I know my Hulk lore he arm should have regenerated instantly. Especially by the time he attended Tony's funeral. That's more than 24 hours. Ok you could argue that the injure was magical in nature so it could have screwed up his healing, after a few day's I would expect for him to be out of a sling.
We always have to keep in mind the differences between comics and films I think. Not everything lines up. Besides... This was the Infinity Gauntlet we are talking about. They had established that Thanos himself got hobbled quite a bit from using the Stones in such short order, once to decimate all life and the second almost a month later to destroy the stones. It's not a big leap for me to see Hulk still dealing with the after affects of something that pretty much killed Tony in an instant.
 
Kind of disappointing
we didn’t get to see how General Ross would react to seeing Professor Hulk since they were both at Tony’s funeral, but guess they couldn’t find a place for it to happen

I'm still baffled....

That we got a movie with one of the strongest versions of the Hulk yet there was no 1-on-1 fight with anyone. One of the reasons that Thanos beat Hulk so handily in IW was his superior fighting skills. Professor Hulk is a combat tactician and he's more adept at using actual weapons. He should have been tailor-made for a rematch with Thanos.
 
Not sure about that. Professor Hulk in the comics is. But clearly in Endgame, it's still the mind of Banner, who isn't a combat tactician or fighter. He just has Hulk's strength.
 
I did think it was weird that he didn’t get a rematch with Thanks. In hindsight, Hulk should’ve been able to come out and participate in the Battle of Wakanda. There really isn’t any payoff for his reluctance to assist his friends OR his beatdown. They also never really addressed exactly why Hulk refused to take over either. I’m guessing it was just...fear, but that makes him look low key pathetic if I’m being honest.
 
If there is a nitpick with Endgame I have, it is Banner's decision to become Professor Hulk should have played out on screen. But, it is a 3hr movie as it is, so I sort of understand it. What would you have cut in order to make it happen on screen? But it does make the payoff from IW feel odd. Like, yeah it was the natural progression of that story IMO, but it was like his arc happened off-screen.
 
I’d personally have cut a lot of the humor. I appreciate levity, but it seems to me that the movie was three hours long to accommodate running gags and the final act.
 
It would have been cooler if during the final battle, Banner realizes he's strong but needs Hulk's rage to really mess stuff up so agrees to let him take over again
Very very much agreed.
 
Professor Hulk, Doc Green, Mister Fixit are ok, but the savage hulk is the greatest, plus with his other egos you lose the Dr Jeckle/Mr Hide of Bruce and The Hulk
 
Kind of disappointing
we didn’t get to see how General Ross would react to seeing Professor Hulk since they were both at Tony’s funeral, but guess they couldn’t find a place for it to happen

Wow you're right that is odd...

We are to presume I guess then that in
the words of Ross himself... "All is forgiven"
I mean they did literally save the world this time.
 
We always have to keep in mind the differences between comics and films I think. Not everything lines up. Besides... This was the Infinity Gauntlet we are talking about. They had established that Thanos himself got hobbled quite a bit from using the Stones in such short order, once to decimate all life and the second almost a month later to destroy the stones. It's not a big leap for me to see Hulk still dealing with the after affects of something that pretty much killed Tony in an instant.
Yea I'm cool with that. Movies do indeed differ from the comics. I'll even add...

...Maybe Banner Hulk hasn't got the same healing strength as his more primal personas. Hulk has shown the different version of Hulk can access different strength and power levels.
 
The movie might have given the LGBTQ community a nugget of representation in the support group scene, but Bulk (Bruce+Hulk) gave gay fans EVERYTHING
 
The movie might have given the LGBTQ community a nugget of representation in the support group scene, but Bulk (Bruce+Hulk) gave gay fans EVERYTHING

I only wish they'd make Korg's sexuality like that in the comics.
 
It would have been cooler if during the final battle, Banner realizes he's strong but needs Hulk's rage to really mess stuff up so agrees to let him take over again
I would like for savage Hulk to come out whenever Banner gets hurt or if he sees one of his friends hurt.
 
I did think it was weird that he didn’t get a rematch with Thanks. In hindsight, Hulk should’ve been able to come out and participate in the Battle of Wakanda. There really isn’t any payoff for his reluctance to assist his friends OR his beatdown. They also never really addressed exactly why Hulk refused to take over either. I’m guessing it was just...fear, but that makes him look low key pathetic if I’m being honest.
Yeah.
It was absolutely not necessary to lose Hulk in the NY scene with Stark, Strange, Wong and Spider-man which he could really have added to, and of course those epic looking Wakanda shots of him. They could have just shown him struggling to bring Hulk out and it becoming less reliable, but for Hulk to still come out. The arc would be the same then IMO.
 

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