Iron Fist Iron Fist General Discussion Thread - Part 3

[2kt09]

I feel like a lot of people, on both sides of the argument, don't understand that white savior complex. The Iron Fist and Strange arguments are weak for and against. It won't be fixed with race changes if the underlining writing is weak and will fall in stereotype.

Because the white leads literally adopt the culture. Not only that, they then need to be shown as being better at understanding and living by this cultural code than the people who were born into it.

I'm assuming Dr Strange doesn't count because the culture he's adapting to is diverse...albeit the culture actually in question is that which revolves around the mystic/magic arts.

I see Iron Fist's "white savior complex" as being not that far off from Snake Eyes.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

I'm assuming Dr Strange doesn't count because the culture he's adapting to is diverse...albeit the culture actually in question is that which revolves around the mystic/magic arts.

I see Iron Fist's "white savior complex" as being not that far off from Snake Eyes.

Strange's problem was in changing the race of the Ancient One to avoid a stereotype. Marvel was basically admitting they were going to write a weak character. They recognized it was going to be a "Legend of Bagger Vance" and they only needed the character for one movie.

Marvel did the best they could, but in the end, the movie really doesn't avoid the Asians know mysticism inherent to the character. Lots of cultures have mysticism but there's an unfortunate connotation with "Eastern mysticism" where Tibet can be swapped with Philippines, China, or Thailand and most people wouldn't be like they could tell the difference. People use the idea of Karma incorrectly cause you know, it's exotic and means whatever we need it to.

 

[Darepool]

I'm a working reporter and I regularly review film and TV shows. I also reviewed the first six episodes of Iron Fist. Spoiler free so no worries on that.

Netflix has been gracious enough to let me watch the screeners for many of their original programming. However, I could not comment I had seen them or talk about what I saw in general until March 8.

My Iron Fist review

Just to clarify, I'm not taking back any of what I said. The show has a slow start and a meandering plot, but it does pick up toward the middle section and it does get really good. Mileage may vary. I maintain my belief that Scott Buck was the wrong guy to run the show and I'm annoyed with how it rejects a lot of the cooler aspects of Danny's origin, the costume, etc.

I think Finn Jones is likable as Danny. He's a good sort of young, upstart and immature Danny, but we still don't know what the whole story is with him. Do I have reservations? Yes, but I'm willing to see where the rest of the season takes it.

Jessica Henwick is great as Colleen Wing.

I think the show's greatest sin is that it just doesn't grab you right off the bat. Additionally, earlier on it sort of lacks its own unique style that gave Jessica Jones, Daredevil and Luke Cage all their own flavor. But again it does pick up toward the middle and gets into cooler more comic book style action.

How did I miss this review before? It definitely makes me more optimistic despite the critiques. Doesn't sound too bad at all, especially considering it's from an IF fan.

 

[rogue trooper]

The original inspiration was David Carradine in the Kung Fu TV show.

I know Shang-Chi was primarily inspired by Kung-Fu and Kwai Chang Caine, and I'm sure it had an impact on Iron Fist, although I can't seem to find anything that states that specifically. Roy Thomas does state that he was inspired by, "my first kung fu movie, even before a Bruce Lee one came out, and it had a thing called 'the ceremony of the Iron Fist' in it".

 

[Dasher10]

I'm a working reporter and I regularly review film and TV shows. I also reviewed the first six episodes of Iron Fist. Spoiler free so no worries on that.

Netflix has been gracious enough to let me watch the screeners for many of their original programming. However, I could not comment I had seen them or talk about what I saw in general until March 8.

My Iron Fist review

Just to clarify, I'm not taking back any of what I said. The show has a slow start and a meandering plot, but it does pick up toward the middle section and it does get really good. Mileage may vary. I maintain my belief that Scott Buck was the wrong guy to run the show and I'm annoyed with how it rejects a lot of the cooler aspects of Danny's origin, the costume, etc.

I think Finn Jones is likable as Danny. He's a good sort of young, upstart and immature Danny, but we still don't know what the whole story is with him. Do I have reservations? Yes, but I'm willing to see where the rest of the season takes it.

Jessica Henwick is great as Colleen Wing.

I think the show's greatest sin is that it just doesn't grab you right off the bat. Additionally, earlier on it sort of lacks its own unique style that gave Jessica Jones, Daredevil and Luke Cage all their own flavor. But again it does pick up toward the middle and gets into cooler more comic book style action.

Does it develop a strong tone towards the middle that differentiates itself from previous Netflix series?

 

[TheVileOne]

This might sound non-committal, but it kind of does. But...not quite enough to my liking. I get the sense it might be getting more toward a strong tone to give the show its own voice, but I will have to see if they stick the landing on the back seven.

The opening sequence is also uninspired IMHO compared to Daredevil's. Jessica Jones also IMHO has a really cool opening with that jazzy film noir music and the artwork that's reminiscent of the Alias comic.

Luke Cage's opening also has that really cool like 70s Jazz/blaxploitation-style riff along with all those Harlem streets.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Remember that scene in Wolf of Wall Street when Belfort explains that if you take a Quaalude and resist the urge to fall asleep you get a kick-ass high? Does the same apply here - if you sit through six episodes of board meetings without falling asleep do you then get some kick-ass martial arts episodes later on?

Essentially, is Iron Fist a Quaalude?

 

[Mike Murdock]

I seem to be the only person who wants Black Knight in the MCU (and I will confess that a Black Knight film would be mostly flashbacks of previous Black Knights with no sequel) and honestly, that one presumably won't happen.

I want BBC America to co-produce a Captain Britain series and maybe that could have Black Knight in it.

I think maybe they should wait until the current shows all get off the ground, though, just to be on the safe side.

 

[Brian Braddock]

Goes without saying that I would LOVE that.

 

[Mike Murdock]

Batman takes elements of fighting from an organization in Asia...a secret organization lead by a white man (in this version), that is apparently world wide and tries to destroy cities. Not quite the same thing.

And K'un Lun isn't even in Asia, it's in an alien world/dimension.

I'm assuming Dr Strange doesn't count because the culture he's adapting to is diverse...albeit the culture actually in question is that which revolves around the mystic/magic arts.

Except that was a massive source of controversy in Doctor Strange when it came to the Ancient One. Like I just said, K'un Lun isn't on Earth. They could easily make it a multi-ethnic community. But I doubt it will solve the problem to hire fewer Asian actors.

 

[RaidenX]

This might sound non-committal, but it kind of does. But...not quite enough to my liking. I get the sense it might be getting more toward a strong tone to give the show its own voice, but I will have to see if they stick the landing on the back seven.

The opening sequence is also uninspired IMHO compared to Daredevil's. Jessica Jones also IMHO has a really cool opening with that jazzy film noir music and the artwork that's reminiscent of the Alias comic.

Luke Cage's opening also has that really cool like 70s Jazz/blaxploitation-style riff along with all those Harlem streets.

are first 6 episodes as bad as Luce Cages Second Half?

 

[Dark Raven]

are first 6 episodes as bad as Luce Cages Second Half?

Marvel/ Netflix should edit a special "Power Man and Iron Fist" edition together: the first 6 episodes of Iron Fist followed by the last half of Luke Cage.

But I didn't find Luke Cage's 2nd half so bad. There were parts in the first half which really dragged too.

If they really want a special edition of Power Man and Iron Fist, they can edit together all the board room scenes and all the barbershop scenes and every other boring bit into a single show.

 

[Endeavor]

Nothing all that memorable that really stood out. Daredevil and Jessica Jones have cool themes at least. The theme opening here isn't memorable. Luke Cage had that fantastic soundtrack.

Ugh..

Ok, this Scott Buck guy needs to go work on something else. Somebody pull him off Inhumans before it's too late.

 

[guyisnotcool]

Ugh..

Ok, this Scott Buck guy needs to go work on something else. Somebody pull him off Inhumans before it's too late.

To fair this for the fans! Only critics like music!

 

[Zarex]

I know Shang-Chi was primarily inspired by Kung-Fu and Kwai Chang Caine, and I'm sure it had an impact on Iron Fist, although I can't seem to find anything that states that specifically. Roy Thomas does state that he was inspired by, "my first kung fu movie, even before a Bruce Lee one came out, and it had a thing called 'the ceremony of the Iron Fist' in it".

Kung Fu was one of the highest rated programs on American Television when the Iron Fist character was created, and it certainly appears as though that was a strong motivation for Marvel expanding their stable of martial arts characters. I can't find anything definite stating that was the case.

 

[Endeavor]

No, Killian should have been played by an Asian actor.

While I whole heartedly agree, you know there are people who would've then complained that you can't make the Asian guy the bad guy.

 

[terry78]

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. I think Hollywood is getting better about it now, as they're starting to cast more black folks as villains.

 

[Dark Raven]

Imagine if Luke Cage had all white villains in its series.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Finn Jones is not a smart person.

 

[legendkillin]

are first 6 episodes as bad as Luce Cages Second Half?

Or the last half of Daredevil season 2.

Outside of maybe DD1 the others shows did have a bad 3-4 episode stretch. IF just happens to have it at the start.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Marvel/ Netflix should edit a special "Power Man and Iron Fist" edition together: the first 6 episodes of Iron Fist followed by the last half of Luke Cage.

But I didn't find Luke Cage's 2nd half so bad. There were parts in the first half which really dragged too.

If they really want a special edition of Power Man and Iron Fist, they can edit together all the board room scenes and all the barbershop scenes and every other boring bit into a single show.

Luke Cage had its moments in the second half, but overall it is vastly inferior to the 1st half

 

[Brian Braddock]

Cottonmouth was much more interesting than Diamondback to me.

 

[guyisnotcool]

Imagine if Luke Cage had all white villains in its series.

Luke Cage certainly was a show that didn't care if people considered it "too black"
One has to wonder Iron Fist was a show were the creators were scared of it being too____ blank of something.

 

[RaidenX]

WARNING! Spoilers!!!

There's a Detailed review of all 6 Episodes separately..


Things doesn't looks bad at all

3,5,6 episodes are good and second half of the season looks interesting

http://fanboyfactor.com

 

[Dasher10]

Imagine if Luke Cage had all white villains in its series.

Considering that Atlas and Captain Hero are literally his only white villains...

Let's look at who his other enemies are who haven't been on the show yet, not counting Coldfire since he was merged into Diamondback.

Warhawk - has granite skin but he's black
Chemistro - black guy
Hardcore - black guy
Nightshade - black woman
Power Master - black guy
Tombstone - albino but still African-American

And Priapus is a horrible villain so I'm not counting him in any sort of tally since I never expect him to show up on a future season of Luke Cage. Point being, Luke Cage's world is a heavily black one since he lives in Harlem.