Days of Future Past Is this movie going to write the original trilogy out of existence?

[DigificWriter]

But if someone goes back in time and changes history then a new reality is spawned. That's how things work.

The only way for the reality to remain the same is if nothing changes. But it will change since Wolverine is meeting Xavier earlier, breaking Magneto out of Prison, introducing Quicksilver to a prof X and Magneto (they wouldn't have met without Wolverine)

That automatically creates a timeline different to the OT where Xavier met Logan for the first time years later.

Changes can be big or small. Going back in time and making someone late for work who would've been on-time creates a new reality where they wear late.

There's no 'rule' that says this.

No-one who believes that DoFP is going to create an alternate timeline has yet been able to explain why nearly every single statement that Singer and others have made consistently point to everything that has happened thus far remaining in continuity with DoFP even after the time travel that occurs in it, nor have they yet been able to explain why Singer and Co. would waste their time creating explicit connections to/fixes for things that are supposedly no longer going to matter.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

There's no 'rule' that says this.

Time-travel by very nature is the rule that says this. I doubt there is any time-travel fiction where the traveller returns to a world identical as it was. Every tine-travel piece of fiction delves into the outcome of changing events.

The whole premise of the show Sliders deals with alternate histories. The Sliders travel to worlds where history occurred differently and thus visit worlds where Americans lost the civil war, where the women took power from men and society pecking order was different, where men had become sterile due to a disease, where the meteor missed the Earth and Dinosaurs weren't extinct ect...

Let's say someone goes back in time and kills Hitler as a Baby. WWII most likely wouldn't have happened. So when that person returns to the future he'll be returning to an alternate future to the one he grew up in that had WWII, the would around him would be different.

There's no way around it if Singer and Co. think they can defies the laws of Time-Travel then the movie is ****ed.

The only way do do time-travel that doesn't create a new reality is to have Logan travel back into the body of his younger self, do exactly the same thing his younger would've done and then return to the future. It's already been proven he does things different to what he would've done.

They can't have Logan change history then have a world exactly the same as it was as there'd have been no point in sending him back if it was going to affect nothing.

Nor have they yet been able to explain why Singer and Co. would waste their time creating explicit connections to/fixes for things that are supposedly no longer going to matter.

Fanservice. Plus it corrects other movies by removing inconsistencies (like Xavier walking in Origins & X3).

The other movies will still count as canon as Wolverine lived through them, went back in time, changed time and returned to a new timeline without Sentinel dystopia and where the OT happened differently

That would make Wolverine's mission pointless.

The future of the new timeline won't have the Sentinels killing everybody.

Mcavoys Xavier will grow into Stewarts Xavier and not experience the MK-X Sentinels since they prevented that future by changing events in 1973

Mission accomplished

 

[DigificWriter]

^ That's not how alternate timelines/continuities work. If you create a new continuity for something, whatever happened in the old continuity has zero bearing on or relevance to what happens in the new continuity even if the very existence of the new continuity was spawned by things that happened in the old continuity. For all intents and purposes, the old continuity doesn't exist.

As far as there being time travel stories where the time traveler returned to a world where things were more or less the same as before the time travel, I can think of several: the Terminator films, Star Trek First Contact, TNG's Yesterday's Enterprise, and Back to the Future Parts 1 and 2.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

In BTTF Marty Family is different though.

I was reading up on Time-Travel and it wasn't as clear cut as I thought. There are numerous theories.

Some say that changes will ripple in to the future thus changing that timeline, others say that the time-travellers timeline remains and a new timeline exists parallel alongside it.

Some say that the time-traveller initiates the events of his own future, some say that the future is set and no matter what the time-traveller does he will fail and things will turn out the same.

As on now I've no clue what will happen in DOFP.

I think there'll either be a new alternate timeline where events don't have to be the same as the OT or a new timeline that exists side by side with the OT or Wolverines actions facilitate the Sentinel future but perhaps change some events from happening or have them happening differently.

It would be a huge missed opportunity to keep everything the same.

As for Xavier's legs. Since [blackout]the treatment so he can walk again[/blackout] happens before the point of divergence (the point in time that Future Logan travels back and changes event), it becomes canon for the Origins and X3 that we know, and any timeline thereafter that has Xavier walking in those eras.

It's been good discussing this with ya Digfic

 

[BMM]

(Heads up, I don't know anything about X-Men comics)

Is DOFP going to make it so the original movies never happened? Is this like a reboot for the franchise similar to Star Trek and Star Trek: Into Darkness?

I'll be really sad if that's the case because I love the original cast so much.

Yes and no. The events of the original trilogy lead to the dystopian future featured in Days of Future Past, so, in that way, X-Men, X2, and The Last Stand are still tied to the overall franchise timeline. Once Wolverine travels back into the past, however, things will most likely change moving forward, allowing for a clean slate, as this is a movie about correcting past mistakes--not repeating them.

 

[psylockolussus]

Not at all!

It would be a big mistake to erase them out! I would rather have a full reboot.

 

[EnDz0n3]

Once Wolverine travels back into the past, however, things will most likely change moving forward, allowing for a clean slate, as this is a movie about correcting past mistakes--not repeating them.

Be careful with that "moving forward" line. DigiticWriter might think you are in agreement with his "those movies occur later than they would have otherwise" statements that he seems to be so sure about.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

Edit

 

[BMM]

Be careful with that "moving forward" line. DigiticWriter might think you are in agreement with his "those movies occur later than they would have otherwise" statements that he seems to be so sure about.

No, I'm not in the camp that thinks Singer's discussions about lamenting Cyclops death, fixing s---, and multiverses is another way of saying, "kick the can down the road another 10 years." When they write dialogue like, "end this war before it ever begins," I think they mean it.

 

[Lord]

It's probably just going to make the following films tighter in continuity. I'm glad X-Men hasn't made a 100% reboot yet, i know the continuity can be a mess, but it's sad when studios keep rebooting superhero films that aren't all that old. Batman Begins was supposed to be the exception, and they still needed to make something exceptional with The Dark Knight, Fantastic Four is another that deserves one that is closer to the comics, but the gap between reboots should be longer, and when they start rebooting franchises that aren't all that broken or old yet like Spider-Man, it just feels forced and may alienate old fans.

 

[X-Maniac]

I'm amused by the claims in here that 'this is how time travel works.'

According to whom? Have you tried it?

Time travel is not a theory (not in scientific terms). It's a concept.

A theory - in science terms - is an explanation or model based on observation, experimentation and reasoning. A scientific theory summarises a hypothesis (a proposed explanation) or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing.

If enough evidence is gathered to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next stage - which is then called a theory - and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.

Professor Stephen Hawking has proposed that time travel is not even possible. He says the laws of the universe would not allow it.

But since there are no proposed explanations, let alone observations or experiments, then we cannot move time travel beyond being a concept. There are no 'theories' for how it works because no testing has been done!

Bottom line is that sci-fi writers can do whatever they like. There are no 'rules' for what is just a fancy idea at the moment. The important thing is for a movie or novel or TV show to establish its own rules for internal consistency.

 

[Mutant 77]

There are MANY, MANY MODELS of time-travelling... in science fiction, you know.

1) The Predestination Paradox/12 Monkeys/First Terminator Model
2) The Back To The Future Model
3) The Star Trek 2009 Model


Singer - and I mean Brian Singer - confirmed that Wolverine comes back to the past in order to change the future of the one and only timeline that exists. Talking about one continuum. NO parallel universes or "spawned timelines" (like Star Trek 2009) involved. Otherwise his mission would be pointless.

But if someone goes back in time and changes history then a new reality is spawned. That's how things work.

No. It depends on the writer and the "rules" he sets up for his fictional universe.

DOFP establishes a Back To The Future Model. Case closed.

 

[darkcajld]

I'm amused by the claims in here that 'this is how time travel works.'

According to whom? Have you tried it?

Time travel is not a theory (not in scientific terms). It's a concept.

A theory - in science terms - is an explanation or model based on observation, experimentation and reasoning. A scientific theory summarises a hypothesis (a proposed explanation) or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing.

If enough evidence is gathered to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next stage - which is then called a theory - and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.

Professor Stephen Hawking has proposed that time travel is not even possible. He says the laws of the universe would not allow it.

But since there are no proposed explanations, let alone observations or experiments, then we cannot move time travel beyond being a concept. There are no 'theories' for how it works because no testing has been done!

Bottom line is that sci-fi writers can do whatever they like. There are no 'rules' for what is just a fancy idea at the moment. The important thing is for a movie or novel or TV show to establish its own rules for internal consistency.

Tell 'em!

 

[DigificWriter]

Be careful with that "moving forward" line. DigiticWriter might think you are in agreement with his "those movies occur later than they would have otherwise" statements that he seems to be so sure about.

It's not a theory; it's an analysis of the facts at hand.

Honestly, though, I really don't even know why I bothered to put myself in the position of arguing with people about this again.

Also, for the record, we know Singer looked to the Terminator movies for inspiration and talked directly to James Cameron, so everything points to the story using a combination of BttF-style time travel and Terminator-style time travel.

 

[GuestStar2004]

No you can't compare this to back to the future because it was physical time travel and basically for the most part in back to the future it was them messing up and trying to put things back on the right direction, the 2nd back to the future shows what time travel can do and things change because of it if changes in the past impact the future, and it was also only the main time traveling characters that were aware of the future and past

Now I said this before wolverine has gone back to the past and pretty much tells the characters their future, and I don't just mean the dark future I mean what what direction they go

Magneto: so you spend years trying to make me down... How did that go?

If that doesn't have some small impact I will be surprised, it doesn't seem like Logan is gonna be quiet about it

As for terminator, well the rules there has been played about with for a long time, it started with changing their future so the dark future didn't happen but how can you know things went the same in her life and not differently leading to this new future? Then the sequels decided darn if the dark future doesn't happen anyway we can't make more films

 

[Great Mind(s)]

It's most likely going to be altered, that much is a given. Otherwise, this movie is pointless and the future is doomed.

The OT is still important and exists as what leads up to the dystopian future. As is The Wolverine because hopefully Logan will remember the events of that film in a new altered timeline.

 

[henzINNIT]

There are MANY, MANY MODELS of time-travelling... in science fiction, you know.

1) The Predestination Paradox/12 Monkeys/First Terminator Model
2) The Back To The Future Model
3) The Star Trek 2009 Model


Singer - and I mean Brian Singer - confirmed that Wolverine comes back to the past in order to change the future of the one and only timeline that exists. Talking about one continuum. NO parallel universes or "spawned timelines" (like Star Trek 2009) involved. Otherwise his mission would be pointless.

No. It depends on the writer and the "rules" he sets up for his fictional universe.

DOFP establishes a Back To The Future Model. Case closed.

Yup.

There is no way in hell we're getting a neat Terminator closed loop. Not only would it be a total downer to finish this film with nothing changed, there would be too many inconsistancies with the OT for it to be feesable.

It will almost certainly be in the vein of BTTF where time travel over-writes events as we previously saw them. Terminator 2 left things open yet optimistic, and is probably the closest to how the comic dealt with time travel, but it's long been expected that we will see the outcome of the time-travel changes.

 

[CyclopsWasRight]

No you can't compare this to back to the future because it was physical time travel and basically for the most part in back to the future it was them messing up and trying to put things back on the right direction, the 2nd back to the future shows what time travel can do and things change because of it if changes in the past impact the future, and it was also only the main time traveling characters that were aware of the future and past

Now I said this before wolverine has gone back to the past and pretty much tells the characters their future, and I don't just mean the dark future I mean what what direction they go

Magneto: so you spend years trying to make me down... How did that go?

If that doesn't have some small impact I will be surprised, it doesn't seem like Logan is gonna be quiet about it

As for terminator, well the rules there has been played about with for a long time, it started with changing their future so the dark future didn't happen but how can you know things went the same in her life and not differently leading to this new future? Then the sequels decided darn if the dark future doesn't happen anyway we can't make more films

That would change Magnetos knowledge of himself who would then try to change his future for the better, thus overwriting the Magneto we know in the OT with a Magneto who had prior knowledge due to time-travel.

The only way things won't change is if the characters eventually do exactly what Logan told them they did in the future. Magneto attacks the UN in the same fashion, Xavier lets Scott go to die at Akali lake ect...

 

[Rogan525]

Okay I thought the whole point to this story was to fix one thing and that was to save mutants and mankind from the sentinels. Stop Trask! I don't see where that would change anything in OT. Obviously Xavier and Erik become friends again but to stay with the original story something goes wrong again. Meaning if they would have stopped Trask to begin with they wouldn't be dealing with it in the future. STILL THE ORIGINAL STORIES WE SAW HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SENTINELS.

 

[EnDz0n3]

But why would they *only* want to change having sentinels in the future? Are you saying that Xavier et al would be perfectly fine with having Jean and Scott stay dead when they have the opportunity to change that too?

 

[xrs13]

Whilst I think it is more of a stop the dystopian future, there really would be too many things for them to say "do this to change how this happens". Even if Xavier and crew want cyc and jean alive there is no way for them to know how to make that happen. So I guess the only thing they can do at that time and that they would be thinking about is how to fix the future they are currently in and hope it changes the whole timeline to fix all the issues along the way. Either way, I guess they wouldnt rememeber so would it really matter to them to try and alter each and every thing.

The whole concept is flawed really haha because why not just give up and have life exist if you are going to cease to exist if the timeline is changed anyway.... Mind****

 

[EnDz0n3]

I'm not necessarily saying they will do this, that and the other to change certain things but to say that Wolverine going back to the past only affects the sentinel-infested future and everything else stays the same is naive to say the least.

 

[xrs13]

Ohh! yeah that is naive. There is no way that could happen unless some serious bad writing has occured.

 

[Rogan525]

I thought Bryan said though that he wasn't going to erase theOt storyline though?

 

[psylockolussus]

There are MANY, MANY MODELS of time-travelling... in science fiction, you know.

1) The Predestination Paradox/12 Monkeys/First Terminator Model
2) The Back To The Future Model
3) The Star Trek 2009 Model

There's also the Harry Potter model, which is less confusing.

Anyway, I love when movies/TV shows do time-travel. The time travel I've seen on Lost, Heroes, Meet the Robinsons, Harry Potter 3 (The best HP movie!) were good. I think Fringe also did time-travel/alternate timeline and that was one of the most memorable of the series. I hope the time-travel of X-Men doesn't disappoint.