Apocalypse Jennifer Lawrence Could Be... Anybody? - The Mystique Thread - Part 1

[JJLong]

I don't really see a problem with Mystique leading the X-Men in Charles's absence, particularly against Apocalypse. If it was Magneto in the position, I would be fine with it as well.

 

[BeholdMe]

Both Romijn and Lawrence have enriched this character in their own way. Romijn's look is superior, but I wouldn't say JLaw's look is so bad it distracts me from the movie/story. I think she looked great in that kitchen scene in FC, right before she talks to Charles, and also when she's sneaking around in Trask's office in DOFP.

Her look in FC was absolutely dreadful I mean it looked really looked bad but in DOFP it was just so shiny like her face that it did distract me a little and I hate the bodysuit which is why I'm glad they are just covering her up and giving her a uniform.

 

[xmanzo]

Her look in FC was absolutely dreadful I mean it looked really looked bad but in DOFP it was just so shiny like her face that it did distract me a little and I hate the bodysuit which is why I'm glad they are just covering her up and giving her a uniform.

romijn's whole body is shiny and scaly while the only shiny part of jlaw's body is her face bec her bodysuit is matte.

 

[BeholdMe]

romijn's whole body is shiny and scaly while the only shiny part of jlaw's body is her face bec her bodysuit is matte.

Mixed with the scales they used in the OT it looks a lot better, being that it's a bodysuit currently the shine indeed stands out because the scales don't protrude as much.

 

[Havok83]

I don't really see a problem with Mystique leading the X-Men in Charles's absence, particularly against Apocalypse. If it was Magneto in the position, I would be fine with it as well.

If anyone should lead, then Beast would be more appropriate

 

[Young Superman]

I love Jennifer Lawrence as Mystique.

 

[JJLong]

If anyone should lead, then Beast would be more appropriate

Against Apocalypse, I like the idea of it being someone that isn't normally associated with being the leader of the team.

Things become more polarizing with someone like Apocalypse on one end of the spectrum.

 

[BeholdMe]

Against Apocalypse, I like the idea of it being someone that isn't normally associated with being the leader of the team.

Things become more polarizing with someone like Apocalypse on one end of the spectrum.

What?

 

[GuestStar2004]

If anyone should lead, then Beast would be more appropriate

In terms of him pulling off tough leader whose gonna put some kids into danger he probably hasn't got the personality for that

 

[JJLong]

What?

What I'm trying to say is, when you've got a threat like that it can make some people put aside any differences they might have in order to combat said threat.

 

[Havok83]

In terms of him pulling off tough leader whose gonna put some kids into danger he probably hasn't got the personality for that

He would be fitting. Not only is he an original X-man in the books, he is one in this film series. As Xavier's closest confidante and there with him from the beginning with the school, he's a worthy successor to take up for the new crop of students. Id rather he lead than Mystique. I dont like it, but I can accept her as an ally. Leader though is a bit much

What I'm trying to say is, when you've got a threat like that it can make some people put aside any differences they might have in order to combat said threat.

She can do that as an ally without being the actual leader of the X-men

 

[GuestStar2004]

He would be fitting. Not only is he an original X-man in the books, he is one in this film series. As Xavier's closest confidante and there with him from the beginning with the school, he's a worthy successor to take up for the new crop of students. Id rather he lead than Mystique. I dont like it, but I can accept her as an ally. Leader though is a bit much

Him being an original x-men in the books is really the only reason or even excuse to make him a leader, he probably wouldn't have the right personality for it though.

 

[Logan0327]

who cares if she did'nt lead x men in the comics these aren't the comics just watch superhero movies as else-world tales of the source material

 

[kevork89]

Beast has never really been much of a leader though. I know Mystique hasn't been the leader of the X-Men but she's led teams before and she's an authoritarian. She fits perfectly with it. Beast isn't really a leader. He isn't a follower either just more of a mentor. I've said this before but what they've done with Mystique in these films is similar to what they've done with Emma Frost in the comics.

 

[BeholdMe]

What I'm trying to say is, when you've got a threat like that it can make some people put aside any differences they might have in order to combat said threat.

Ohk thanks for clarifying.

 

[BeholdMe]

Beast has never really been much of a leader though. I know Mystique hasn't been the leader of the X-Men but she's led teams before and she's an authoritarian. She fits perfectly with it. Beast isn't really a leader. He isn't a follower either just more of a mentor. I've said this before but what they've done with Mystique in these films is similar to what they've done with Emma Frost in the comics.

I see the similarities between Mystique in the movie verse and Emma's spot in the comics at one time, I was happy Emma kept the sarcastic icy demeanor even as a hero.

 

[Mystique's Leg]

With Charles being kidnapped, Mystique is the most experienced one left. Though she ages slowly, she's as old as Charles and Eric (maybe even older). She's also more battle hardened compared to Beast.

We still don't know exactly the context of her supposed leadership. Who knows how it'll play out? Will she be good or bad leader? A reluctant leader? An agressive leader?

 

[Havok83]

Beast has never really been much of a leader though. I know Mystique hasn't been the leader of the X-Men but she's led teams before and she's an authoritarian. She fits perfectly with it. Beast isn't really a leader. He isn't a follower either just more of a mentor. I've said this before but what they've done with Mystique in these films is similar to what they've done with Emma Frost in the comics.

What teams has Mystique led? Her actions in the books are irrelevant and cant be used as experience for movie verse Raven. She and Beast are on the same level here

Nah its not similar to Emma. They didnt change Emma's past to fit her into the X-men from the beginning as a hero. She had an actual redemption arc and had a transition from villian to hero. That made it easier to take and came across more beleivable. Bc of the nature of the films, they skipped over all that and Mystique never had a redemption arc. That was made irrelevant as they started from the beginning and made her a hero from the start ignoring anything that came before bc it doesnt matter

With Charles being kidnapped, Mystique is the most experienced one left. Though she ages slowly, she's as old as Charles and Eric (maybe even older). She's also more battle hardened compared to Beast.

We still don't know exactly the context of her supposed leadership. Who knows how it'll play out? Will she be good or bad leader? A reluctant leader? An agressive leader?

She's like 10 years older than Beast and she started out as a student/trainee at the same time as him. She may be as old as Charles but she's not that much more experienced than Hank

 

[kevork89]

I don't know how you don't think all of DoFP was essentially a redemption arc for Mystique. Maybe not so much 70s Mystique but it sure was a redemption for the future character. That's why it worked so much. Rebecca's non emotive femme fatale was the future to which Jennifer's Mystique would eventually become had they not saved her from killing Trask. That in itself qualifies. The original point of FC was for the characters to go to where they would eventually end up in the future. DoFP changed that. So I think Mystique saving the president and being a mutant freedom fighter is a pretty decent way of making her a leader and taking over to help guide the X-Men to save Charles. Also to me it still seems like her and a Beast are a duo when it comes to leading the team. The marketing is just more focused on Mystique.

 

[Havok83]

I don't know how you don't think all of DoFP was essentially a redemption arc for Mystique. Maybe not so much 70s Mystique but it sure was a redemption for the future character. That's why it worked so much. Rebecca's non emotive femme fatale was the future to which Jennifer's Mystique would eventually become had they not saved her from killing Trask. That in itself qualifies. The original point of FC was for the characters to go to where they would eventually end up in the future. DoFP changed that. So I think Mystique saving the president and being a mutant freedom fighter is a pretty decent way of making her a leader and taking over to help guide the X-Men to save Charles. Also to me it still seems like her and a Beast are a duo when it comes to leading the team. The marketing is just more focused on Mystique.

How is it a redemption arc when Mystique was never an evil villian? The stuff done with Rebecca is completely irrelevant bc that was not a part of Raven's history that JL played and thanks to the timeline change, it likely never will be her future. Mystique never had a true redemption arc. They skipped that. She could have gone down a very dark path after FC but she was "saved' so to speak before that could happen. She didnt need redemption bc the core of her character was not evil. Again how they handle her and Emma Frost in the books is completely different. They dont really compare to me

 

[iacobusleo]

She's like 10 years older than Beast and she started out as a student/trainee at the same time as him. She may be as old as Charles but she's not that much more experienced than Hank

Wait huh was it established that she was 10 years older than Beast? I don't recall this at all.

Mystique spent 10 years being an international terrorist in the time between FC and DOFP. Beast in contrast spent those 10 years first as a teacher, then as a recluse enabling Xavier's destructive tendencies.

I think the gulf of experience is pretty stark in between them IMO. And in any case, Mystique and Beast seem to be co-leading the team anyway as kevork89 pointed out.

 

[kevork89]

It doesn't matter the future and the past are as important. Saving Mystique was saving the future of the mutants. It went hand in hand. That's why Mystique needed to be saved. Ok she wasn't a full on villain at the point in DoFP but her being captured after killing Trask and experimented on plus working with Magneto all those years turns her into the villain she becomes. They had to save her from that future. It might not be a redemption arc but it's just as important and integral to the story. I don't see why she can't lead the X-Men without having to be redeemed for something first. She was there at the beginning. I know Beast was too. But Mytique has had more battle and field experience then Beast ever had. Remember essentially after FC, Beast was hidden in the mansion with Prof X and has still been there since teaching students. Mystique is a freedom fighter out in the world fighting and protecting mutants. If that isn't a leader then I don't know what is.

I'm not saying that Mystique and Emma are the same. The comics and movies are different and I prefer that.

 

[GuestStar2004]

How is it a redemption arc when Mystique was never an evil villian? The stuff done with Rebecca is completely irrelevant bc that was not a part of Raven's history that JL played and thanks to the timeline change, it likely never will be her future. Mystique never had a true redemption arc. They skipped that. She could have gone down a very dark path after FC but she was "saved' so to speak before that could happen. She didnt need redemption bc the core of her character was not evil. Again how they handle her and Emma Frost in the books is completely different. They dont really compare to me

Presumbaly the idea of this movie may be the turning point where these events actually make her go a different direction to what she would have if they didn't happen, aka OT, i mean thats just my guess

Mystique is likely to be more a magneto figure then what beast is.

 

[BeholdMe]

Mystique did actually leave with Magneto for a bit and went solo after FC so she indeed does have more experience in that field than Beast does. I can see why they chose Mystique she is a lot more battle hardened which you can see from DOFP the things she did as Mystique in comparison to Beast just being in the house with Prof X for those years. Beast dosent seen like he is in a good space to lead a team of XMen not everyone can be a leader he seems comfortable just being a team member to me. I said I can see the similarities between movie Mystique and comic Emma because they were both villians to some extent who had a change of heart for some reason and ended up leading the XMen(trust me I was not happy when Emma was co leader in the XMen) but it is similar.

 

[Havok83]

Wait huh was it established that she was 10 years older than Beast? I don't recall this at all.

Mystique was born in 1934 and therefore about 29 during the events of First Class. Beast is college aged. Im not sure if an age was established for him but he looked to be about 19-22ish

It doesn't matter the future and the past are as important. Saving Mystique was saving the future of the mutants. It went hand in hand. That's why Mystique needed to be saved. Ok she wasn't a full on villain at the point in DoFP but her being captured after killing Trask and experimented on plus working with Magneto all those years turns her into the villain she becomes. They had to save her from that future. It might not be a redemption arc but it's just as important and integral to the story. I don't see why she can't lead the X-Men without having to be redeemed for something first. She was there at the beginning. I know Beast was too. But Mytique has had more battle and field experience then Beast ever had. Remember essentially after FC, Beast was hidden in the mansion with Prof X and has still been there since teaching students. Mystique is a freedom fighter out in the world fighting and protecting mutants. If that isn't a leader then I don't know what is.

I'm not saying that Mystique and Emma are the same. The comics and movies are different and I prefer that.

we're debating two different things then bc I never challenged that what was done with her in DOFP wasnt important. It was. My main point was that it wasnt about a Mystique redemption arc bc you cant redeem yourself for something you either never did or arent aware of. And I never said one needs to be redeemed for sins in order to lead. As I already established, she has nothing to redeem herself for

Mystique did actually leave with Magneto for a bit and went solo after FC so she indeed does have more experience in that field than Beast does. I can see why they chose Mystique she is a lot more battle hardened which you can see from DOFP the things she did as Mystique in comparison to Beast just being in the house with Prof X for those years. Beast dosent seen like he is in a good space to lead a team of XMen not everyone can be a leader he seems comfortable just being a team member to me. I said I can see the similarities between movie Mystique and comic Emma because they were both villians to some extent who had a change of heart for some reason and ended up leading the XMen(trust me I was not happy when Emma was co leader in the XMen) but it is similar.

but again JL's Mystique was never a villian which is why the parallels dont quite match up.

I honestly dont beleive she was chosen for any other reason as this is another way to elevate the role bc its being played by Jennifer Lawrence. There have been many concessions made to make Mystique more important to the franchise and team than she should be