Superman Returns John Ottman on Superman Returns score

Stewie Griffin said:
Well I am flattered that you took the time... I apologize for being a dick... but, when people think Ottman is anything but a mediocre composer it gets me going for some reason.

I'm the same way with music. I'm such an elitist that if someone tells me they like a particular band or artist that I think is a hack, I will go all out and will not rest until they've been crushed by my musical superiority.

There may not be a way to prove a certain opinion right or wrong, but you can damn well prove if someone's opinion is uninformed.
 
Mr. Socko said:
Yes, Ottman is good but a Williams, he is not.

Yeah, I don't think you'll find anyone to argue that.

Oh, and "musical elitists"... :down:down
 
SolidSnakeMGS said:
"During one of the bigger days, the original prologue and main titles were recorded. At the time, it was planned to be basically a re-creation of the original opening from the 1978 film, with the curtain opening, comic book intro, and then flying through space as the John Williams march played. (Things have changed now, and a new prologue will be recorded instead.)"

Yeah, that's kinda...disturbing. Hmmmm....

I think their talking more about the fact that the time will be off and beats will not sync up with whats on screen. Doesnt mean that they just threw it out. They may have had to just rearrange it. Or perhaps the opening is a bit different and that would require a number of changes.
 
SolidSnakeMGS said:
Yeah, I don't think you'll find anyone to argue that.

Oh, and "musical elitists"... :down:down


I can tell you from experience that there is no such thing as a musical elitist. Anyone that claims to be an "elitist" needs to look at what the purpose of music is and not what is "cool" or acceptable.
 
Michael Corleone said:
I can tell you from experience that there is no such thing as a musical elitist. Anyone that claims to be an "elitist" needs to look at what the purpose of music is and not what is "cool" or acceptable.

Your point = :up::up:
 
mcflytrap said:
I'm the same way with music. I'm such an elitist that if someone tells me they like a particular band or artist that I think is a hack, I will go all out and will not rest until they've been crushed by my musical superiority.
Wow. Too bad that it doesn't really mean anything in the real world. But hey. You have a way to compensate for all your inadequacies.

mcflytrap said:
There may not be a way to prove a certain opinion right or wrong, but you can damn well prove if someone's opinion is uninformed.
And none of that has anything to do with taste and preference.
 
The music seems to be coming together nicely, can't wait to hear it.
 
When John Wiliams was scoring a Star wars movie, we knew the film was near completion. Wahoo!! This film is right around the corner folks!! :D
 
quote from that new article on scoring

"During one of the bigger days, the original prologue and main titles were recorded. At the time, it was planned to be basically a re-creation of the original opening from the 1978 film, with the curtain opening, comic book intro, and then flying through space as the John Williams march played. (Things have changed now, and a new prologue will be recorded instead.)"

so does that mean the opening theme is gone???? since it said a new prologue?@!?!/!?! why do I feel some what bad about this.......
 
Now that Stewie Griffin has finished informing everybody of the reality of subjective artforms, I'll chime in and say that I'll put the Usual Suspects score up against that Medal of Honor crap anyday. That MoH was so overblown it was ridiculous in the game, and reminded me of all of the worst qualities of a John Williams rip-off.

I did like his Incredibles score, but when your entire basis for praising a composer is how much he sounds like somebody else, that's automatic points off in my book.

Ottman will be cueing Williams because that score is Superman. And it's hard to mess it up, unless you turn it into a dirge or something.
 
is that the new superman "emotional" theme that Ottman is doing in the trailer, when Superman and Lois were talking at the DP rooftop? It sounded pretty good to me...
 
yeah, i liked that new theme.... very star trek 2-ish.
 
bit there was no ottman score in this trailer.
 
you sure? sounded like his style in the foot fetish scene.
 
i'm pretty sure that was Ottman's new theme in the trailer.... if the music wasn't ready, wouldn't they just use the old Lois theme from the original? using some unknown piece of music wouldn't make sense.... on the other hand, that may explain why it sounded like the work of James Horner to me.. perhaps it is.
 
I really wanna know if that was his theme during the Supes and Lois talk. It's my favourite part of the trailer!
 
If that non-Williams stuff in the trailer was indeed new material for the film, it bodes quite well for where Ottman is heading with the music. It's majestic and etheral, a little...supernatural, even.
 
:up: Yeah, the piece of music with a solemn Superman flying away was wonderful, and enriches the movie. I think that you can also hear it as the trailer begins. I am sooo ready for June 30th!
 
i think the lex theme and the lois theme are from ottoman...that's what he said before, lex never had a serious theme in the original movies, and the lois theme needed a little updating. So i can put money on the fact that those two that we heard in the trailer is new stuff, from ottoman.
 
SolidSnakeMGS said:
So I'm wrong but ONCE AGAIN you cannot back up your claim.

Well, you can't because NEITHER tracks have this "mingling".
Then You are not looking Hard enough. Listen to Chasing Rockets. Starting at 1:35 You can clearly hear the Mingling of Both Themes. I'm listening to it Right now. Next Time Do your Homework.

To further Drive My point home. On the Soundtrack Album Score Commentary, the writer seems to disagree with you and Ottman on who's theme it belongs to. He states that the theme Underscores Luthor and Not Otis. While I don't necessarily think it's strictly Luthor's Theme, that to me shows that it is not Otis's theme Either.



When arguing and you think someone is wrong, it's usually prudent to not only provide evidence, but to provide what you think is the right answer. My list is to the best of my knowledge complete AND accurate. I stand by it.
You're right. But since I have provided evidence (I'll see if there is more) That you list is missing other instances, then maybe you should stand down on this point.



Yeah, it IS relevant. Certainly is. You're saying there is the Villains theme being played when the cop is being killed. THERE ISN'T. There is no arguing this! It is not there!
I don't know if I should take you word for it. I'll just check for myself. However I do recall it being there.

If it's on the OST, so what?? That proves NOTHING. Hard to argue it's underscoring when Lex's kills the cop when it's only on the soundtrack, isn't it?
Not really. Because one can synch it up to when it would have been used.(if it was used at all, I'll have to check) Besides, that was the Composer's intent to showcase the theme in that context, to show what is happening onscreen musically. How is it irrelavent that his composition was overruled by Donner or the Producers. (who get a final say on film scoring, but you know that)






That may be possible, but since I rarely watch the credits all the way through, I wouldn't know.
It's there since I have watched the entire end credits years back. (Plus it is stated in the Album Commentary that it was used for The reason I gave) The end credits also stated that Superman 2 would coming out next Year.

Besides, I meant IN THE FILM itself, and you knew that. Listening to the end credits is like listening to the soundtrack; their is no visual to underscore.
When You said te Love Theme, I assumed you meant the Track "Love Theme From Superman". What Specifically where you talking about? For the most part, most if not all, of what was composed of the Love theme (save the alternate takes) was in the movie.





No need for the condescension, bud. I'm fully aware strings can be menacing. I don't seem to have the problem of identifying the tone of a theme here.
If I was coming off as condescending then that wasn't my intention, and I apologize.



No it isn't. EXCEPT ONE TIME, it is used exclusively for Otis. We hear it for Lex whereas it becomes sort of a victory flourish. How come we do not hear this Villains theme when...well...uh....Luthor is being a villain and killing cops and Supermen? No, we hear it when Otis is being a villain.
Seeing as how I showed that your list is incomplete (there could be more) This point is invalid and I don't really have refute it.



What?? You're trying to say the theme is downplayed? LOL. It's quite the opposite. The Villains theme is OVERBEARING until the end when we hear a not even complete and slower paced theme.
No NO NO!! You misunderstand me. I meant downplayed in the context of what I was saying.

Kroc1138 said:
It's a Villain motif. It varies from time to Time b/c we assume that Luthor shouldn't be a threat to Superman. Thus the Villain theme isn't really used in the same contrasting capacity as the Superman March. It's downplayed until Luthor takes his plan into action.
By saying "downplayed" I meant that when Contrasted (Hero vs Villain) with the Superman march it didn't come across powerfully. Just like How when we are introduced to Luthor He doesn't really seem like a Threat To Superman. Thus the theme doesn't come across as a match for the Superman March, but it really wasn't meant to a match to begin with since we always assume that Luthor shouldn't be able to match Superman, but he does.



No it isn't. Sorry, but you're wrong. It isn't there, just like it isn't there when Lex kills a cop.
I'll see for myself. Thank You!
 

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