Mass Effect 3

[SpideyVille]

I'm sure it was mentioned before, but the ending really does remind me of [BLACKOUT]The Matrix, with all the cyclical speak and Neo trying to change that.[/BLACKOUT]

Spoiler

After the Reapers saw that Synthetics and Organics could live together without destroying each other because of what Shepard did they allowed Shepard to break the cycle and allow them to live together at the cost of his life. I'm not all that bother with their motivation or the ending in general. The only thing that bothers me is there's no real happy ending, where Shepard defeats the Reapers and gets to see his crew again.

I agree. That's what bother me too. But then again,

Spoiler

That whole last buildup to the final assault really made it clear that Shephard was likely to not survive or see anyone again, making that his final farewell. But I was also upset, even with that ending that hints Shep survives. But they have to end his story somehow.

 

[smashmode]

Spoiler

lol yup to be indoctrinated is just brain washed .simple as that.

not sure why it's appealing ether.

Because it makes sense of the non-sensical endings.

 

[zenith16]

Spoiler

so in other words it's a lose -lose situation.

well that's sucks then.

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

That I agree with the indoctrination ending is dumb.

It also doesn't make any sense that you get the true ending with lowest amount of war assets and that for whatever reason Shepard doesn't wake up unless you have the highest assets.

 

[Balthus Dire]

Spoiler

It's just a bad ending to the series. Being indoctrinated means it's not actually your decision, you were controlled by the reapers. The whole series was based on making decisions and you take that away with indoctrination. In the game's final moments you have to choose how the galaxy will exist in the future by either destroying, controlling or synthesis. If you're indoctrinated then the reapers win. They take away any free will that organic and synthetic life have.

Spoiler

I think you're misunderstanding somethin' here. The Indoctrination ending theory relies on Bioware releasing the "real" ending via DLC, where you'd presumably wake up on earth after beating indoctrination.

I don't think anybody is suggesting that the true ending to the ME franchise should be Shep getting indoctrinated and that's it.

 

[taskmaster]

Spoiler

In the synthesis ending Shep forces all organic and synthetic life in the galaxy to become a merger of the two, like the Husks. How is that possibly a "good" ending?

Spoiler

Because they're obviously not husks. You can see that just judging from the scene with EDI and Joker at the end. They've still retained their personalities and still love each other. They're not just mindless things. It's just a way to remove their differences so there's no threat of them wiping out each other.

 

[smashmode]

Spoiler

But he did do that in the synthesis ending where both forms of life become one form.

But in the end that

Spoiler

is still conforming, so that synths and organics don't go at each other. What happened to free determination and free will? Reapers win

 

[Balthus Dire]

Spoiler

Because they're obviously not husks. You can see that just judging from the scene with EDI and Joker at the end. They've still retained their personalities and still love each other. They're not just mindless things. It's just a way to remove their differences so there's no threat of them wiping out each other.

Spoiler

But both Shep and Casper specifically refer to the action of uniting the two as "like the Husks." Also, even if you wipe out all synthetic life but still have EDI in your party, she still steps off the ship at the end.

The ending cutscene you mentioned is just one of the many problems and inconsistencies with this garbage ending.

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

Like the ending or not,I think the game deserves to get finished!!

Sequel?!

 

[taskmaster]

Spoiler

I think you're misunderstanding somethin' here. The Indoctrination ending theory relies on Bioware releasing the "real" ending via DLC, where you'd presumably wake up on earth after beating indoctrination.

I don't think anybody is suggesting that the true ending to the ME franchise should be Shep getting indoctrinated and that's it.

Spoiler

That's even worse. I was pissed about the day one DLC but a move like that would actually have me lose a lot of respect for Bioware. Any DLC should be wrapping up characters stories, seeing what happens to your crewmates. Not, "oh man the fans are super pissed, quick change it."

 

[Upset Spideyfan]

Spoiler

Do they say "Husks"? I haven't heard that.

 

[TX85]

In the last page I posted my frustrations on a mission I can't have access too..despite being in my Journal

Any ways that you know of that could help?It's my last side-mission and also helps me on a last side-quest for the Citadel

 

[Master Chief]

Spoiler

It's just a bad ending to the series. Being indoctrinated means it's not actually your decision, you were controlled by the reapers. The whole series was based on making decisions and you take that away with indoctrination. In the game's final moments you have to choose how the galaxy will exist in the future by either destroying, controlling or synthesis. If you're indoctrinated then the reapers win. They take away any free will that organic and synthetic life have.

Spoiler

It was your decision to give in to their indoctrination.

Do you understand the concept here? You're choosing to give in.

They are masters of manipulation. Sovereign had his hooks in Saren just enough so that Saren thought he had free will, and could bargain with the reapers for helping them... until it was too late.

Throughout the game TIM is saying Shepard will stick to his ideals. Shepard doubts himself in front of Hackett, asking him if maybe TIM is right and you can control them. Hackett shoots that idea down and says there are no alternatives: Destroy them.

But oh, magically, that kid from your nightmares is giving you 2 options that result in peacefully removing them. And another option that sounds absolutely terrible compared to the first 2? So much so that it could lead to your own death? Hahahah. Yeah. Sounds like manipulation to me.

edit: Here, read what Balthus posted.

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9861052/1

It sounds so much better than the s**t we got.

 

[Balthus Dire]

Spoiler

That's even worse. I was pissed about the day one DLC but a move like that would actually have me lose a lot of respect for Bioware. Any DLC should be wrapping up characters stories, seeing what happens to your crewmates. Not, "oh man the fans are super pissed, quick change it."

Spoiler

Well, the the theory is that the indoctrination was the plan all along, so it wouldn't be "Oh crap the fans are mad change it!" There's tons of hints to it throughout the last part of the game, which can be seen in this thread that I mentioned to you twice:
http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9861052/1

Also, I fully agree that if Bioware chose this route and we had to pay for the "true ending" DLC I'd lose all respect for them. But, if it was free, I'd think it was absolutely brilliant.

 

[taskmaster]

But in the end that

Spoiler

is still conforming, so that synths and organics don't go at each other. What happened to free determination and free will? Reapers win

Spoiler

Who said that their wouldn't be war anymore? That's wrong. Just because they're all merged doesn't mean they'd stop fighting. It doesn't stop humans, it damn sure wouldn't stop a Krogan from killing a Salarian

 

[zenith16]

In the last page I posted my frustrations on a mission I can't have access too..despite being in my Journal

Any ways that you know of that could help?It's my last side-mission and also helps me on a last side-quest for the Citadel

let's just hope some one else besides you has mentioned it on the bioware forum half of the site and it'll be fixed during the patch/dlc. Or you can go there and mention it your self.

 

[Master Chief]

Spoiler

Well, the the theory is that the indoctrination was the plan all along, so it wouldn't be "Oh crap the fans are mad change it!" There's tons of hints to it throughout the last part of the game, which can be seen in this thread that I mentioned to you twice:
http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9861052/1

Also, I fully agree that if Bioware chose this route and we had to pay for the "true ending" DLC I'd lose all respect for them. But, if it was free, I'd think it was absolutely brilliant.

Spoiler

It would take the interactive platform to a new level. By not having it on disc and released as DLC for free later, that would keep the experience pure for every player, too. I mentioned it before but the only reason I don't write off the theory like so many others is because I believe these writers have more in them than what we were presented with.

 

[taskmaster]

Spoiler

It was your decision to give in to their indoctrination.

Do you understand the concept here? You're choosing to give in.

They are masters of manipulation. Sovereign had his hooks in Saren just enough so that Saren thought he had free will, and could bargain with the reapers for helping them... until it was too late.

Throughout the game TIM is saying Shepard will stick to his ideals. Shepard doubts himself in front of Hackett, asking him if maybe TIM is right and you can control them. Hackett shoots that idea down and says there are no alternatives: Destroy them.

But oh, magically, that kid from your nightmares is giving you 2 options that result in peacefully removing them. And another option that sounds absolutely terrible compared to the first 2? So much so that it could lead to your own death? Hahahah. Yeah. Sounds like manipulation to me.

edit: Here, read what Balthus posted.

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/9861052/1

It sounds so much better than the s**t we got.

Spoiler

These hints that your suggesting are just wishful thinking because you didn't like the ending. The fact that it's not actually suggested after you make your choices makes it a bad ending. It's the same type of non-closure.

 

[X Knight]

ok, here's how I would have done the endings:

Spoiler

First, let me say that I have not played the game myself. I actually cancelled my preorder after having spoiled myself of the endings in the days leading up to the game's release ( I was also not too impressed with the demo ).

I am one who actually doesn't mind spoiling a story/ending. And, in this case, I'm glad I did, because based on what I've read and seen, I would probably be in the camp of fans who are majorly disappointed and dissatisfied with the endings. Right now, I'm going to sit back and wait and see what Bioware's response is.

Anyways, here's how I would have presented the ending choices, taking into account that Bioware constantly promised us that our choices would matter, the ending would be definitive, no 2 endings will be the same, etc.

1. Defeat

This is, obviously, the bad, worst-case scenario ending. Shepard and team lose the final battle, the Reapers win, destroy Earth and wipe out the civilizations of the galaxies.

Variations could include Shepard living or dying, but that would kind of be a moot point given the outcome......lol.

A "Renegade" variation where Shepard does live could involve Shepard siding with the Reapers ( willingly or through indoctrination ) and letting them destroy the world.

2. Bittersweet Victory

In this ending, Shepard succeeds in defeating the Reapers, but at great costs. This can include one or more of the following scenarios:

1. Shepard dies through sacrifice

2. Most/all of Shepard's Squadmates and Normandy crew die in the final battle

3. The "Allied Forces" fighting in the final London battle suffer great casualties across all the races.

4. One or more races are wiped out through sacrificial genocide ( like the Geth )

Also, in this ending, destroying the Reapers involves destroying/deactivating the Mass Relays. So, while the galaxy survives, civilizations will suffer a major technological setback.

But, they will rebuild, slowly and surely, forever remembering the heroic sacrifices of Shepard and the Normandy crew.

A "worst-case" variation of this ending would be that instead of rebuilding, the surviving civilizations fight each other for resources, the stranded ones die out, the synthetics turn on the organics, thus continuing the cycle of violence......

Another variation could be where Shepard lives but loses most/all of his crew and squadmates ( especially his LI ). He would also be racked with guilt in killing off an entire race like the Geth. After the war, Shepard retires from military service, but lives on as a broken man.

3. Peace and Hope

This would be the best, "happy," "Disney" ending.

The Reapers have been defeated, the Mass Relays have NOT been destroyed, and a new era of inter-galactic peace and cooperation has begun. Humanity itself has elevated its prominence and respect amongst the other species of the galaxy.

More importantly, Shepard's action have given the galaxy hope. Hope that synthetics and organics can coexist peacefully. Thus rejecting the Reapers' "philosophy" that the cycle is doomed to continue forever.

In the "best" variation, Shepard retires from the military and enjoys a quiet life with his LI. Perhaps Shepard is the one telling this story to his grandchild.

In the "worst" variation, Shepard dies through sacrifice and his story is being retold by his LI, Garrus, or Anderson.

So, those would be the 3 basic ending choices. Variations would arise based on the decisions and choices made by the players throughout all 3 games.

 

[TX85]

Sequel?!

Well I meant ME3,But I'd love a sequel and I already posted my ideas a few times of where I'd like to see a new trilogy go!

 

[Master Chief]

Spoiler

These hints that your suggesting are just wishful thinking because you didn't like the ending. The fact that it's not actually suggested after you make your choices makes it a bad ending. It's the same type of non-closure.

Spoiler

They're wishful thinking because the ending is full of ridiculous plotholes and is severely lacking closure.

 

[zenith16]

Well I meant ME3,But I'd love a sequel and I already posted my ideas a few times of where I'd like to see a new trilogy go!

most of us have.

 

[ChrisBaleBatman]

If they're not completely inundated with floods of hate about the ending.

And the day one dlc, although that appears to have died down.

 

[taskmaster]

Spoiler

They're wishful thinking because the ending is full of ridiculous plotholes and is severely lacking closure.

Spoiler

And I don't disagree with that. But there are better ways to end this story than your character being indoctrinated. Shepard has a good death in the end, at least from my point of view. He gives his life for the galaxy. The circumstances surrounding his sacrifice should have been better but his sacrifice shouldn't be cheapened in any way. I do hope the the DLC lets you play as squadmates figuring out what to do after the Reapers. Sure, the mass relays are gone but they still have FTL ships, all the the races will be able to meet each other again and try to rebuild.

 

[TX85]

most of us have.

Which is good,Lots of great ideas and there's still much potential to explore in the game's galaxies!!!