Matt Reeves To Direct The Upcoming Batman Solo - Part 2

[Micromind]

I doubt Joaquin Phoenix would want to be a part of ongoing franchise and play Joker again, and lose weight (50 lbs) again. It would seem forced inclusion as his first movie was written as one-off, stand-alone movie.

The other thing to consider here is that Matt Reeves might not want Joker in any of his Bat movies, and what will happen if the Matt Reeves Batman movies are part of DCEU ? Fans have to consider that as possibility too (as much as they don't want to).

Till the time WB announce that Leto is out as DECU Joker, technically speaking, he is still their Joker.

 

[Boom]

Phoenix is not happening in Reeves' film/s, for a variety of reasons.

 

[Micromind]

Throwing something out as soon as general audience disapproves it (Leto's Joker) and including something just because general audience likes it (Joaquin Phoenix's Joker) even if it was initially intended to be an else-worlds, stand-alone movie seems incredibly reactionary approach to running a franchise.

WB need to have a plan and not keep making course-corrections on a whim.

 

[Invader Joker]

Leto is NOT staying. He was an ******* on set and his performance was terrible, they're not keeping him.

As for Phoenix.... playing a character like Joker in both a filmmaker-driven trilogy and a filmmaker-driven movie is ridiculously different than playing a character like Doctor Strange, having to appear in his movie and then in Infinity War and Endgame. Just for the record, Phoenix has never actually said anything against sequels or franchises so that has been hugely overblown. And again, have a little imagination, he could just play a different version of Joker in Reeves movies, not Arthur Fleck.

Creating your own take on an iconic character not once, but twice, would be a tempting thing for an actor to experiment with.

I'm not saying I'll hold my breath for it happening but I don't think it's insane to at least speculate.

 

[Boom]

Given the age difference between Arthur Fleck and Bruce Wayne in Joker, if that Bruce grew up to be Robert Pattinson then that would put Arthur in his 60's/70's in Reeves' film. Nevermind the fact that Phoenix can't pass for a man that age, but why anyone would even want a Joker that old is beyond me - regardless of how great Phoenix might be in the role. And besides that, this whole rhetoric is entirely predicated on Matt Reeves even wanting to connect his movie to Joker to begin with. What if Reeves doesn't want to use the Joker in his film/s? What if he does want to use the character eventually, but he has a particular take on the character that is radically different from Phillips'? There are so many qualifiers to make this even remotely feasible. And that's without even getting into the reasons why Phoenix took on Joker in the first place, or his well-documented wariness with franchises/multi-picture deals.

Look I get it. Phoenix is getting raves, and your natural instinct is to want to see more of him. But since day one, Joker has been sold and promoted as a standalone, isolated thing. Enjoy what we are getting now, and look forward to what's to come in the future.

 

[Rocanrol]

Let’s just cast Jake Gyllenhaal and be done with it. (?)

 

[TheGuy]

I'm really digging that TDKReturns Joker approach.

 

[Invader Joker]

Given the age difference between Arthur Fleck and Bruce Wayne in Joker, if that Bruce grew up to be Robert Pattinson then that would put Arthur in his 60's/70's in Reeves' film. Nevermind the fact that Phoenix can't pass for a man that age, but why anyone would even want a Joker that old is beyond me - regardless of how great Phoenix might be in the role. And besides that, this whole rhetoric is entirely predicated on Matt Reeves even wanting to connect his movie to Joker to begin with. What if Reeves doesn't want to use the Joker in his film/s? What if he does want to use the character eventually, but he has a particular take on the character that is radically different from Phillips'? There are so many qualifiers to make this even remotely feasible. And that's without even getting into the reasons why Phoenix took on Joker in the first place, or his well-documented wariness with franchises/multi-picture deals.

Look I get it. Phoenix is getting raves, and your natural instinct is to want to see more of him. But since day one, Joker has been sold and promoted as a standalone, isolated thing. Enjoy what we are getting now, and look forward to what's to come in the future.

Sigh.


Again. I'm not talking about Phoenix playing Arthur Fleck again, I'm talking about playing a totally different Joker in a different continuity just like JK Simmons did.

That's a very, very enticing challenge.

 

[Rorschach2012]

You guys are taking the events of Joker too literally. It’s going to be revealed that a lot of the film is completely questionable and dreamlike. I’d bet money on it. Just like TKJ is somewhat canon, the timeline of Joker could be off and it could still fit. Because Joker is crazy and misremembers things.

If they want Joaquin’s Joker in Reeves’ movies it could easily work, and no one can convince me otherwise. The events of Joker aren’t set in stone.

 

[hafizbat]

Yeah, I think fans in general get too hung up on continuity and canon. Just do whatever it takes to get the best product on screen, imo. If Phoenix is willing to play the part, find a way! Everything is just "official" fan-fiction anyway.

 

[BatLobster]

Sigh.


Again. I'm not talking about Phoenix playing Arthur Fleck again, I'm talking about playing a totally different Joker in a different continuity just like JK Simmons did.

That's a very, very enticing challenge.

Exactly. Especially because the whole Joker movie could be playing with an unreliable POV thing, and it could be one of the "multiple choice" options.

Whether Phoenix wants to commit to the role and lose the weight again, etc. is another matter. But you already have Phillips talking about being down for another Joker movie.

I think it's absolutely a possibility down the road for this franchise. The Simmons/Jameson comparison is a good one to use. And with the age thing...honestly with the makeup on, the Ledger and Phoenix Jokers don't look so far apart despite one being in his late 20s and the other being 44. It could totally work. That's not to say it MUST happen, but I think it's certainly worth speculating about at this point.

 

[Boom]

Sigh.


Again. I'm not talking about Phoenix playing Arthur Fleck again, I'm talking about playing a totally different Joker in a different continuity just like JK Simmons did.

That's a very, very enticing challenge.

Simmons was in FFH for literally one minute, and he didn't play the character any different than he had in Raimi's continuity. You can't tell me with a straight face that he changed things up with that cameo, save for the hair piece. Quite literally the only instance I can think of where an actor played two radically different versions of the same character in separate continuities is Deadpool. And considering the satirical, 4th-wall-breaking nature of the character, that's a special exception. Otherwise, this idea is unheard of as far as I can tell.

This conversation with Phoenix is the same one people had with Leto. "Well all he'd have to do is play the character completely different than what he did before!" Phoenix latched onto this particular take on the Joker, and he played it how he wanted to play it. Phillips' said it himself. He let Phoenix swing for the fences and basically cut him lose to do whatever came to him. I harbor serious doubts that Phoenix has the drive to play this character any different from what he had already put into it. He signed onto this movie because this was exactly how he wanted to approach the character. It's hard enough getting an actor like Phoenix excited enough for one take. Two is against all odds.

People can play hypotheticals if that's fun for them, but Phoenix will not play the Joker in Reeves' continuity of films. I'd bet the farm on that.

 

[Rocanrol]

Hugely unlikely that Phoenix will do another cbm.

 

[Rorschach2012]

There’s literally nothing in Joker that prevents Joaquin from returning. Joker could literally die at the end, and it wouldn’t matter. The events of that movie don’t matter because Joker is mentally unstable and remembers things wrong. I’ve been saying this from the beginning. Not sure why people aren’t grasping what I’m saying. Joaquin can easily be in Reeves’ films if he and Reeves want it to happen. No problem whatsoever.

 

[Boom]

You guys believe what you want. That's all I'll say.

 

[BatLobster]

Simmons was in FFH for literally one minute, and he didn't play the character any different than he had in Raimi's continuity. You can't tell me with a straight face that he changed things up with that cameo, save for the hair piece. Quite literally the only instance I can think of where an actor played two radically different versions of the same character in separate continuities is Deadpool. And considering the satirical, 4th-wall-breaking nature of the character, that's a special exception. Otherwise, this idea is unheard of as far as I can tell.

This conversation with Phoenix is the same one people had with Leto. "Well all he'd have to do is play the character completely different than what he did before!" Phoenix latched onto this particular take on the Joker, and he played it how he wanted to play it. Phillips' said it himself. He let Phoenix swing for the fences and basically cut him lose to do whatever came to him. I harbor serious doubts that Phoenix has the drive to play this character any different from what he had already put into it.

People can play hypotheticals if that's fun for them, but Phoenix will not play the Joker in Reeves' continuity of films. I'd bet the farm on that.

I think the Simmons comparison works.

Phoenix could still tap into his same characterization/performance. If the performance was popular, you wouldn't want to mess with that anyway. But the look could be altered for a more traditional Joker look, and the continuity doesn't have to be an issue for all the reasons mentioned above. You don't have to reference anything from the Joker film at all, and people would accept it. Probably more readily than they would ANOTHER new Joker.

Considering the slippery nature of the Joker character, I think the whole idea of doing this origin film only for it to really end up being recontextualized as just "one possible version of events" could be kind of brilliant.

Admittedly, it's all a moot point of Phoenix isn't interested and Reeves isn't interested, but at the moment it just seems like money left on the table for them not to even consider it.

 

[Boom]

Well could we perhaps move this conversation over to the Joker Thread? This one is basically our News Thread, and every time it gets bumped I end up getting excited over nothing.

 

[Rocanrol]

There’s literally nothing in Joker that prevents Joaquin from returning. Joker could literally die at the end, and it wouldn’t matter. The events of that movie don’t matter because Joker is mentally unstable and remembers things wrong. I’ve been saying this from the beginning. Not sure why people aren’t grasping what I’m saying. Joaquin can easily be in Reeves’ films if he and Reeves want it to happen. No problem whatsoever.

The biggest reason why JP wouldn’t portray Joker again is JP.

 

[Invader Joker]

The biggest reason why JP wouldn’t portray Joker again is JP.

Excepr this offer is literally unlike anything he's been pitched before. It's a ridiculously unique challenge for an actor to build two versions of the same character and it's not one many have

 

[Boy Scout]

Seems like a waste of time to me to even entertain the idea. Phoenix will more than likely play the character only once. Even if he did decide to reprise the role, it’d probably be in a direct sequel to Joker.

We’re either getting a new Joker or no Joker at all. Best to accept that now and move on.

 

[Boom]

One perk to Phoenix getting an Oscar nom for Joker is it would add that much more prestige to the role. If Reeves wanted to tackle the Joker later on down the road, he'd basically have the pick of the litter as far as actors are concerned.

 

[Travesty]

Sigh.


Again. I'm not talking about Phoenix playing Arthur Fleck again, I'm talking about playing a totally different Joker in a different continuity just like JK Simmons did.

That's a very, very enticing challenge.

What if we get Leto back, to act like JP's Joker, but it's a completely different Joker?

It's so simple.....

 

[Rorschach2012]

I can objectively say Leto is a pretty good actor, but I've never really liked him in anything I've seen

 

[TheSmoothKnight]

 

[Rocanrol]

Excepr this offer is literally unlike anything he's been pitched before. It's a ridiculously unique challenge for an actor to build two versions of the same character and it's not one many have