Dark of the Moon Michael Bay has killed Transformers for me - Part 1

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

I'm not sure the Beast Wars era characters are described as "Cyborgs", or at least the argument is more or less semantics.

No, they werent described as Cyborgs, but its not a semantics argument because they were depicted as cyborgs.

They adopted organic forms, and not by way of just putting on a pair of pants.

Their organic forms became part of their systems.We even saw them eating fruits to maintain those forms.

SUGGESTIONS. Show actual proof not SUGGESTIONS.

Either way you were incorrect when you claimed there was "NO EVIDENCE" that they reproduce sexually.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

No, they werent described as Cyborgs, but its not a semantics argument because they were depicted as cyborgs.

Well it is semantics because you're just arguing over definitions (which is what semantics is). Whether they're robots or cyborgs when they're actually classified as Transformers and that doesn't change whether you think they are or aren't Cyborgs. For the record though they do fit the definition of a cyborg since the Terminator was a cyborg and had a similar make-up (robot underneath organic tissue). They also fit the definition of robot, but as I say, that's all kind of moot.

Either way you were incorrect when you claimed there was "NO EVIDENCE" that they reproduce sexually.

There is no evidence they reproduce sexually (no evidence against it though). They've never delved into the "feminine" and "masculine" bot relations deep enough to know for sure whether there is a sexual component to it. There is evidence they reproduce asexually because that's precisely what they are depicted as doing in the above pictures.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

They also fit the definition of robot, but as I say, that's all kind of moot.

The definition of robot is not precise enough a definition to describe the Beast era characters.

There is no evidence they reproduce sexually (no evidence against it though).

There is some evidence to "suggest" they do.

As I pointed out with [one of] G1 Wheelie's back stories and with the DinoForces children.

Its not proof positive, but is is evidence to suggest its possible.

They've never delved into the "feminine" and "masculine" bot relations deep enough to know for sure whether there is a sexual component to it. There is evidence they reproduce asexually because that's precisely what they are depicted as doing in the above pictures.

True enough

 

[TheVileOne]

Proof of what? Transformers reproducing? (These are both canon)
- In the image below it's been suggested that the yellow robot must be Prima.

Liege Maximo describes Megatron as an "offspring"

This is not proof of robots mating and having robot pregnancies and robot babies.

EXCUSE ME CYBORGS.

Whatever.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

This is not proof of robots mating and having robot pregnancies and robot babies.

Well they don't have robot pregnancies, why would they, that's not how they do it? They do reproduce and it's never been ruled out that they mate, in fact the fiction (as Stov) says does seem to suggest they could or do but never actually offers any hard evidence for it. I'd say the presence of "feminine" Transformers, especially the awkward Prime-Elita scene (In The Hunt for Alpha Trion), do suggest something is going on. There has also been strong suggestions that Primes are technically the "female" of the species, like an Ant Queen.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

This is not proof of robots mating and having robot pregnancies and robot babies.

EXCUSE ME CYBORGS.

Whatever.

Ahh, but you didnt ask for "proof positive".Here are the claims you made.

" It's not like robots freaking mate and have robot babies. "

There is some evidence that TF's mate....althou it may not be for reproduction.
There is evidence of "robot babies".

"Even by these alternate sources there is no evidence to support that the robots mate and make robot babies from robot pregnancies".

In both the American and Japanese G1 continuities there is some evidence that some TF's have parent

1 of the US G1 Wheelies back stories states he had parents, not just 1 parent but 2.....which suggest a family unit not much different then those from Earth.

The Japanese Dinoforce team had children.

So, both of your claims were incorrect.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

Well they don't have robot pregnancies, why would they, that's not how they do it? They do reproduce and it's never been ruled out that they mate, in fact the fiction (as Stov) says does seem to suggest they could or do but never actually offers any hard evidence for it. I'd say the presence of "feminine" Transformers, especially the awkward Prime-Elita scene (In The Hunt for Alpha Trion), do suggest something is going on. There has also been strong suggestions that Primes are technically the "female" of the species, like an Ant Queen.

Now thats an interesting idea.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

You may be able to point to some of what Stov and I have offered as just general continuity differences, but as of the last BotCon (it was the last one I think) they officially made it multiverse canon that the Transformers Universe(s) all started with a multiverse constant known as the 13 original Transformers. Among these were Liege Maximo, Alpha Trion, toys protoform Prime (Bayverse - repurposed as Prima), Vector Prime (of Transformers Cybertron), Nexus Prime (a gestault) and the Fallen among others. It's also be canonized that these Transformers did indeed reproduce.

 

[KalMart]

This is turning into the sexiest thread ever.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

This is turning into the sexiest thread ever.

Now, it is...

 

[Mr. Earle]

^ OMG that video is hilarious.... but it did destroy my childhood!

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Now thats an interesting idea.

If I'm not mistaken wasn't there also some conjecture that Elita-1 and Optimus Prime could mate with each other (aside from The Hunt for Alpha Trion which seems to support that).

Oh, and he wanted evidence of "Robot babies"...while not Transformers per say Kranix and the population of Lython did transform.


Oh and of course there is Rattrap's infamous throw away line "scouting the enemy huh? find any new [sexual] positions" (or at least that's pretty clearly what he was implying).

You could probably throw the whole Wheelie thing out the door since it's been known Transformers "adopt" sons (Cryotech makes reference to this in regards to Megatron), although it's not as easy to throw Deathsaurus having a wife and kids out except to say that the Japanese Transformers are really f***ing weird, and if we're going to consider their opinions on things we might as well just shoot ourselves in the heads right now -- save us a lot of trouble.

Also, Wreck-Gar clearly has a wife in both the G1 toon and comic (the comic and cartoon actually are just the same story, the comic being an out of continuity issue). It's probably reasonable to surmise that Wreck-Gar is simply mimicking a TV marriage, he even names his wife "Nancy", a very human name.

Jhaxius created Arcee in the IDW continuity after observing organics and wanting to know how females would influence the "male" Transformer population. He also pretty much says she is capable of having sex. Moreover Arcee is Rattrap's [great] Aunt, and she's a ****e since it's clear she slept with Springer, Rodimus, Bumblebee and Chromedome. Then there's the whole Daniel Witwicky relationship - and they did seem to have developed some pretty intense feelings for each other in the BotCon exclusive comic. Thankfully Daniel Witwicky died in it so we didn't have to overtly deal with the creepiness of Acree and Daniel having a "relationship" - yeah, I just threw up in my mouth.

 

[KalMart]

Thank heavens...now we can cross that off our 'things we need to find out before we die' list.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

Thank heavens...now we can cross that off our 'things we need to find out before we die' list.

It just seems whatever we create we'll eventually find a way to have sex with it.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

If I'm not mistaken wasn't there also some conjecture that Elita-1 and Optimus Prime could mate with each other (aside from The Hunt for Alpha Trion which seems to support that).

Oh, and he wanted evidence of "Robot babies"...while not Transformers per say Kranix and the population of Lython did transform.

And there good enough reason to assume that Lython was a colony of Cybertronions.

Oh and of course there is Rattrap's infamous throw away line "scouting the enemy huh? find any new [sexual] positions" (or at least that's pretty clearly what he was implying).

Rattrap made plenty of sexual jokes.

You could probably throw the whole Wheelie thing out the door since it's been known Transformers "adopt" sons

True, but the fact that he had "parents", meaning more then 1, puts him in a special class.

although it's not as easy to throw Deathsaurus having a wife and kids out except to say that the Japanese Transformers are really f***ing weird,

Thats an understatement.

and she's a ****e since it's clear she slept with Springer, Rodimus, Bumblebee and Chromedome. Then there's the whole Daniel Witwicky relationship - and they did seem to have developed some pretty intense feelings for each other in the BotCon exclusive comic. Thankfully Daniel Witwicky died in it so we didn't have to overtly deal with the creepiness of Acree and Daniel having a "relationship" - yeah, I just threw up in my mouth.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

And there good enough reason to assume that Lython was a colony of Cybertronions.

Yes. It's hard to tell exactly which robots "count" as Transformers in G1 sometimes, but since Unicron attack and devoured Lython I'd have to conclude he had some axe to grind with them. Considering his hatred for all things Transformers, and his connection with Primus (although he's shoehorned into that Universe much, much later) I'd say it's a safe bet there's more than an incidental connection.

Rattrap made plenty of sexual jokes.

There's really only two ways to rationalize this. Either Rattrap studied humans at some point (because he couldn't have directly interacted with them) and found their sexual practices funny enough to create an entirely new sense of humor about it OR he's personally familiar with sex (*vomits*). It's still entirely conjecture because we don't want to think about it too much. Although why would non-sexual beings have topless bars on Cybertron (yeah - they exist apparently).

True, but the fact that he had "parents", meaning more then 1, puts him in a special class.

Well, yes, in terms of having a full family unit -- still doesn't explain how his was born.

Speaking of which, Starscream watched over the "hatchlings" in Revenge of the Fallen. I guess we could either conclude he or Megatronious Prime (The Fallen) is the mother -- also adds to that Prime being an Ant Queen theory.

Thats an understatement.

Arcee basically created a generation of perverts. No wonder it took 24 years for her to get an official toy.

 

[TheVileOne]

You have all officially killed Transformers worse than Michael Bay ever did. Officially.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

Yes. It's hard to tell exactly which robots "count" as Transformers in G1 sometimes, but since Unicron attack and devoured Lython I'd have to conclude he had some axe to grind with them. Considering his hatred for all things Transformers, and his connection with Primus (although he's shoehorned into that Universe much, much later) I'd say it's a safe bet there's more than an incidental connection.

Exactly.

There's really only two ways to rationalize this. Either Rattrap studied humans at some point (because he couldn't have directly interacted with them) and found their sexual practices funny enough to create an entirely new sense of humor about it OR he's personally familiar with sex (*vomits*). It's still entirely conjecture because we don't want to think about it too much. Although why would non-sexual beings have topless bars on Cybertron (yeah - they exist apparently).

And you might remember G1 Octane looking at "sexy" pics of female robots.

Well, yes, in terms of having a full family unit -- still doesn't explain how his was born.

I wouldnt expect them to explain it

Speaking of which, Starscream watched over the "hatchlings" in Revenge of the Fallen. I guess we could either conclude he or Megatronious Prime (The Fallen) is the mother -- also adds to that Prime being an Ant Queen theory.

maybe they lay eggs.

Arcee basically created a generation of perverts. No wonder it took 24 years for her to get an official toy.

 

[sto_vo_kor_2000]

You have all officially killed Transformers worse than Michael Bay ever did. Officially.

Ever heard the saying "dont kill the messenger"???

Dont blame us, we're just reporting on the facts, not creating them.

And BTW, I dont work for Hasbro or Takara, so nothing I say can be "official".

 

[KalMart]

Frightening thread.

 

[Optimus_Prime_]

You have all officially killed Transformers worse than Michael Bay ever did. Officially.

As Stov said, I didn't make any of this up. It's all there. It's been part of the fiction for a while.

 

[Ken-Kaniff]

I think Dark Of The Moon will make up for the dissapointment that was Revenge Of The Fallen ! By the declarations so far, it seems that Bay&Co. saw the faults in the previous movies, especially in the latest one, so I am sort of confident that the 3rd part will make up for everything and the series will end with a blast!

 

[Marvin]

You have all officially killed Transformers worse than Michael Bay ever did. Officially.

Looks like KnowsBleed wins in the end.

I still think most of the hate for the series is unfounded and hypocritical.

 

[Paste Pot Pete]

Of course the transformers reproduce sexually. What do you think Devastator's balls were for?

 

[Marvin]

Of course the transformers reproduce sexually. What do you think Devastator's balls were for?

what else
tea b@gging fan boys and raping childhoods..