MV: I didn't want to ruin X-Men

[X-Maniac]

Sorry no, but SR was not even NEAR in the same category as X3. X3 was the final installment in a franchise that people had been waiting for, X3 was coming off of the back of two very successful and very high thought off 2 movies. SR was both a franchise starter and a continuiation of a franchise began over 20 years before, ther is a BIG difference my friend. Plus, did you see the SR vs X3 thread on here? SR won by more than 100 votes, not to mention people who hated SR still thought it was better than X3.

Who cares about a thread on here!? The general public doesn't. I spoke to a woman I know about X3 and as soon as I said the death of Cyclops had caused uproar online, she was stunned. She had no idea of that reaction, and she didn't share that reaction. She was shocked Xavier had died, but she didn't hate it. For her, the deaths and the curing of two characters worked within the dramatic context of the story.

As for SR, I think it is better than X3 in some ways - there is more thoughtfulness in it (you can 'feel' Bryan's sense of craft and purpose) and the technical quality is better, and it does have some beautiful scenes, and there is suspense in the plane rescue (I was gripping my seat during that part) but I find it less exciting and entertaining than X3. I find the absence of the Krypton sequence a glaring mistake, I didn't like the opening scene with Lex, I didn't like the reuse of the original theme - in fact I didn't like the nostalgia and remake quality in it. Bryan stuck too closely to the original movie, instead of being more daring and dynamic. I think it was a shaky move to include Richard White as Lois's new partner as the point of Lois and Superman is the 'will they, won't they' love factor, the possibility of him being with her and telling her everything... the movie just made him seem terribly alone, it pushed him out of the way, it gave no real possibility of him being happy. I wanted to see the love and chemistry between Lois and Superman, not Superman acting the way he did.

I was excited when I saw X3, disappointed when I saw SR - I knew SR wouldn't do hugely well because it wasn't what people expected and it was a bit long and flawed in places. I heard a crowd of people talking about it afterwards as I left.. one young woman in her 20s liked it, the other women and the guys didn't like it and they were quite definite about that.

I liked SR more when I saw it at home on DVD - I got sent a free copy of the ultimate collection.

Bryan is a talented director. I think he was better suited to the X-Men franchise and should definitely have fought like mad to stay on and finish his story the way he wanted. But he didn't. So we got different people who finished the way they, and the studio, wanted. Most of the choices made by those different people still make sense. The cure is the perfect way to bring in Angel and Beast and the Morlocks, to incite Magneto into a full-on assault, to show Storm's views, the use of Leech as the source of it was an inspired choice rather than making it some anonymous serum, and connecting Phoenix to Magneto and the cure fight was a good idea too. Not all those ideas worked out perfectly for sure - I know this. I didn't like the Danger Room sequence that much, I didn't like the quick way Cyclops was killed off, I didn't like Colossus's screentime, I wanted at least another scene with Angel. BUT I still enjoyed the movie. It delivered the Phoenix and the Magneto war that the previous movies had promised. It may not have delivered them in the way Bryan had intended, but he wasn't there so that shouldn't need to be stated. Only Bryan could have seamlessly finished off the stories in his two movies... but he wasn't there so we got another interpretation of how the story ended.

Of course there is point in wishing and wondering something else, otherwise the studio's will never learn, are you that naive to accept any **** a studio will put out with the X-Name on it?

Which means you are bashing just for the sake of bashing and just for the sake of irritating people on this forum. That's stupid. Fox isn't sitting there reading your posts and Rothamn isn't weeping at how sorry it is and how right you are. Don't be so ridiculously arrogant and political. Ratner wasn't asked to do X4 or any spin-offs, Singer was asked about Wolverine - Fox is fully aware of exactly how the movie did, and why, and what they are doing. Ratner was needed to get the film made to meet its deadline. He wasn't picked as the next golden child of the movie industry. Rothman even said he loved SR as a first-class movie. So what's the point of your vile attitude? People are entitled to love X3. You are taking it on yourself as a personal crusade to discredit people who like the movie in order to create what you think is some kind of campaign against Fox. And that's out of order.

Fox liked SR, Fox aren't rehiring Ratner, Fox wanted Singer back to do Wolverine at first, Fox has now asked other directors to do Wolverine and Magneto. So what's your problem? Drop your bad attitude againt me and others who liked the movie - we are entitled to do so and you are not going to make me change my mind. As I said before, buzz off.

 

[DACrowe]

Well it was terrible, good for Vaughn for stating the obvious.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Who cares about a thread on here!? The general public doesn't. I spoke to a woman I know about X3 and as soon as I said the death of Cyclops had caused uproar online, she was stunned. She had no idea of that reaction, and she didn't share that reaction. She was shocked Xavier had died, but she didn't hate it. For her, the deaths and the curing of two characters worked within the dramatic context of the story.

As for SR, I think it is better than X3 in some ways - there is more thoughtfulness in it (you can 'feel' Bryan's sense of craft and purpose) and the technical quality is better, and it does have some beautiful scenes, and there is suspense in the plane rescue (I was gripping my seat during that part) but I find it less exciting and entertaining than X3. I find the absence of the Krypton sequence a glaring mistake, I didn't like the opening scene with Lex, I didn't like the reuse of the original theme - in fact I didn't like the nostalgia and remake quality in it. Bryan stuck too closely to the original movie, instead of being more daring and dynamic. I think it was a shaky move to include Richard White as Lois's new partner as the point of Lois and Superman is the 'will they, won't they' love factor, the possibility of him being with her and telling her everything... the movie just made him seem terribly alone, it pushed him out of the way, it gave no real possibility of him being happy. I wanted to see the love and chemistry between Lois and Superman, not Superman acting the way he did.

I was excited when I saw X3, disappointed when I saw SR - I knew SR wouldn't do hugely well because it wasn't what people expected and it was a bit long and flawed in places. I heard a crowd of people talking about it afterwards as I left.. one young woman in her 20s liked it, the other women and the guys didn't like it and they were quite definite about that.

I liked SR more when I saw it at home on DVD - I got sent a free copy of the ultimate collection.

Bryan is a talented director. I think he was better suited to the X-Men franchise and should definitely have fought like mad to stay on and finish his story the way he wanted. But he didn't. So we got different people who finished the way they, and the studio, wanted. Most of the choices made by those different people still make sense. The cure is the perfect way to bring in Angel and Beast and the Morlocks, to incite Magneto into a full-on assault, to show Storm's views, the use of Leech as the source of it was an inspired choice rather than making it some anonymous serum, and connecting Phoenix to Magneto and the cure fight was a good idea too. Not all those ideas worked out perfectly for sure - I know this. I didn't like the Danger Room sequence that much, I didn't like the quick way Cyclops was killed off, I didn't like Colossus's screentime, I wanted at least another scene with Angel. BUT I still enjoyed the movie. It delivered the Phoenix and the Magneto war that the previous movies had promised. It may not have delivered them in the way Bryan had intended, but he wasn't there so that shouldn't need to be stated. Only Bryan could have seamlessly finished off the stories in his two movies... but he wasn't there so we got another interpretation of how the story ended.




Which means you are bashing just for the sake of bashing and just for the sake of irritating people on this forum. That's stupid. Fox isn't sitting there reading your posts and Rothamn isn't weeping at how sorry it is and how right you are. Don't be so ridiculously arrogant and political. Ratner wasn't asked to do X4 or any spin-offs, Singer was asked about Wolverine - Fox is fully aware of exactly how the movie did, and why, and what they are doing. Ratner was needed to get the film made to meet its deadline. He wasn't picked as the next golden child of the movie industry. Rothman even said he loved SR as a first-class movie. So what's the point of your vile attitude? People are entitled to love X3. You are taking it on yourself as a personal crusade to discredit people who like the movie in order to create what you think is some kind of campaign against Fox. And that's out of order.

Fox liked SR, Fox aren't rehiring Ratner, Fox wanted Singer back to do Wolverine at first, Fox has now asked other directors to do Wolverine and Magneto. So what's your problem? Drop your bad attitude againt me and others who liked the movie - we are entitled to do so and you are not going to make me change my mind. As I said before, buzz off.

NO, I am bashing in the hope that it leads to us as X-Fans getting something better in the future, is there something wrong with wanting more and not just accepting any trash they throw at us? Its been shown that many writers, directors and actor have visited these boards and they are the one's i intend to influence, not people like yourself who i genuinly couldnt give a **** about.

And i am arrogant? Have you read your own posts? I'm not the one who attacks people for disagreeing with me!

 

[KenK]

NO, I am bashing in the hope that it leads to us as X-Fans getting something better in the future, is there something wrong with wanting more and not just accepting any trash they throw at us?

Well, the problem is that you're dellusional to think that your bashing of X3 is really going to make any difference. Critically speaking, the film was nowhere near as bad as other franchise killers like Superman IV or Batman and Robin (no matter how many people try to compare X3 with the latter film). Commercially speaking, the film was another record-breaking success, so the idea that studio executives are going to be influenced by a handful of fans on a message board moreso than the bushels of cash the film ultimately made, is ridiculous. It's not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing with your point of view, it's just logic.

 

[X-Maniac]

NO, I am bashing in the hope that it leads to us as X-Fans getting something better in the future, is there something wrong with wanting more and not just accepting any trash they throw at us? Its been shown that many writers, directors and actor have visited these boards and they are the one's i intend to influence, not people like yourself who i genuinly couldnt give a **** about.

And i am arrogant? Have you read your own posts? I'm not the one who attacks people for disagreeing with me!

Apart from the fact that you are continually derailing the thread away from Vaughn's comments, your strategy is a bit over the top and doesn't make things on here very pleasant for the rest of us. So, you want to keep turning every thread possible into an X3 bashfest simply in the hope that writers, directors and other industry bods who might happen to read your threads will be influenced. That is not sensible. Most of them don't come on here. And fanboy overreaction on the internet is not seen as sensible critique. It simply isn't in order to keep creating bitter responses on here just because you want Fox to say you are so right and they were so wrong. That's not how it happens. I think the X3 haters have made their point. And they should take comfort in the fact that Ratner isn't doing X4 or any other X-movies, and in the way the Wolverine spin-off is being handled.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Well, the problem is that you're dellusional to think that your bashing of X3 is really going to make any difference. Critically speaking, the film was nowhere near as bad as other franchise killers like Superman IV or Batman and Robin (no matter how many people try to compare X3 with the latter film). Commercially speaking, the film was another record-breaking success, so the idea that studio executives are going to be influenced by a handful of fans on a message board moreso than the bushels of cash the film ultimately made, is ridiculous. It's not a matter of agreeing or disagreeing with your point of view, it's just logic.

I'll say this straight, X3 is not as bad as Batman & Robin, anyone who claims that is simply wrong, i'll agree. Superman 4 i havent seen in so long i honestly couldnt say.

Apart from the fact that you are continually derailing the thread away from Vaughn's comments, your strategy is a bit over the top and doesn't make things on here very pleasant for the rest of us. So, you want to keep turning every thread possible into an X3 bashfest simply in the hope that writers, directors and other industry bods who might happen to read your threads will be influenced. That is not sensible. Most of them don't come on here. And fanboy overreaction on the internet is not seen as sensible critique. It simply isn't in order to keep creating bitter responses on here just because you want Fox to say you are so right and they were so wrong. That's not how it happens. I think the X3 haters have made their point. And they should take comfort in the fact that Ratner isn't doing X4 or any other X-movies, and in the way the Wolverine spin-off is being handled.

People like you constantly defend it yet get the hump when people like me constantly bash it? Sorry, X-M but i will continuilly speak my mind about that movie because i was so disgusted with what we got compared to what we could have.

And you and Kenk are saying people like me bashing the movie doesnt make any difference, yet in the same post/s point out that Ratner most likely wont be coming near any future X-Movies and that Wolverine is (currently) seemingly being handled well. What do you think has made Fox make those decisions? For me the most likely answer is fan response.

 

[X-Maniac]

People like you constantly defend it yet get the hump when people like me constantly bash it? Sorry, X-M but i will continuilly speak my mind about that movie because i was so disgusted with what we got compared to what we could have.

And you and Kenk are saying people like me bashing the movie doesnt make any difference, yet in the same post/s point out that Ratner most likely wont be coming near any future X-Movies and that Wolverine is (currently) seemingly being handled well. What do you think has made Fox make those decisions? For me the most likely answer is fan response.

I get the hump when you try to dominate every X-related discussion with your vileness.

Fan response to X3 may be part of it, it may not. And if it is, then why continue your bitter attacks that make forum life unpleasant for the rest of us?

I wouldn't think it's solely fan response. X3 became problematic because Singer and Vaughn walked and they had to move fast to meet a deadline. It was not a typical example of moviemaking. Fox hasn't treated every movie in the same way.

 

[Docker2.0]

I get the hump when you try to dominate every X-related discussion with your vileness.

Fan response to X3 may be part of it, it may not. And if it is, then why continue your bitter attacks that make forum life unpleasant for the rest of us?
I wouldn't think it's solely fan response. X3 became problematic because Singer and Vaughn walked and they had to move fast to meet a deadline. It was not a typical example of moviemaking. Fox hasn't treated every movie in the same way.

x2000!

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I get the hump when you try to dominate every X-related discussion with your vileness.

Fan response to X3 may be part of it, it may not. And if it is, then why continue your bitter attacks that make forum life unpleasant for the rest of us?

I wouldn't think it's solely fan response. X3 became problematic because Singer and Vaughn walked and they had to move fast to meet a deadline. It was not a typical example of moviemaking. Fox hasn't treated every movie in the same way.

Erm, X-Men, BOTH FF movies, AvP, Eragon, and seemingly The Dark Is Rising also? No not every movie but plenty of them.

And i get the hump when you jump on me for stating my opinions when i couldnt have made it more obvious to you that my opinion will never change. Yet you still do it. In most X3 threads i onlt ever intend to make my one comment and then leave, but you feel the need to try and patheticly 'correct' my opinions on the movie.

Funny thing is, if you just left the **** alone like i have told you, in most threads i would most likely just say my peice and leave, but you always want to take it one step further.

 

[Dotten]

X-Men 3 did not ruin anything. It was a blast. I really don't give a crap if the movie ruinede the franchise for someone else then me. For me I loved it and all the hatred will never change that. I'm happy I'm on the loving side, cause it really is depressing when one ends up on the hating side. All in all it's my opinion that decides whether something is good or bad, that's just the way opinions go.

So i feel for the ones hating the movie, but other then that I don't care. I hope they can be happy for us that liked the movie, but I fear the hate is in the way. But I hope I'm proven wrong. Peace out and speak your mind

 

[tdeverea]

I'm sorry but the Blade movies are lame B-movies. Not any better than The Mortal Kombat movies or any number of dark uber gothic movies created in the late 90s "black is cool" phase.

I respectfully disagree. The first two Blade movies were good action movies and the acting was on par. I prefer both of them to Supes Return, X3, Daredevil, definitely Ghost Rider, FF I and II, and Elektra (although i don't know why people bashed this one so much... i've seen MUCH worse).

 

[KenK]

And you and Kenk are saying people like me bashing the movie doesnt make any difference, yet in the same post/s point out that Ratner most likely wont be coming near any future X-Movies and that Wolverine is (currently) seemingly being handled well. What do you think has made Fox make those decisions? For me the most likely answer is fan response.

If you apply that logic to Ratner, you'd have to apply it to Singer as well. The fact of the matter is, Fox left Singer out in the cold for a whole year after X2 solidified the franchise. The movie hit all bases from the general public, to critics, and the fans. Are you going to sit there and tell me fan reaction to X2 was bad, and that's why Singer's contract wasn't renewed?

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

X-Men 3 did not ruin anything. It was a blast. I really don't give a crap if the movie ruinede the franchise for someone else then me. For me I loved it and all the hatred will never change that. I'm happy I'm on the loving side, cause it really is depressing when one ends up on the hating side. All in all it's my opinion that decides whether something is good or bad, that's just the way opinions go.

So i feel for the ones hating the movie, but other then that I don't care. I hope they can be happy for us that liked the movie, but I fear the hate is in the way. But I hope I'm proven wrong. Peace out and speak your mind

Cool, i am honestly glad you enjoyed it .

If you apply that logic to Ratner, you'd have to apply it to Singer as well. The fact of the matter is, Fox left Singer out in the cold for a whole year after X2 solidified the franchise. The movie hit all bases from the general public, to critics, and the fans. Are you going to sit there and tell me fan reaction to X2 was bad, and that's why Singer's contract wasn't renewed?

With Singer it was different though, Singer was asking for more money (for both himself and the movie) and freedom, and wanted to do X3 and X4 back-to-back and as usual, Fox were trying to be cheap about it, so i dont blame Singer for jumping ship, especially the way he was treated during the 1st 2 movies.

 

[Docker2.0]

Please! the only reason Fox got rid of Singer is becuase he wanted to Marvel's main competition movies, when he was under contract to do the Xmen film. Would I be pissed off? yep! I know people are saying that Fox was wrong, but I honestly understand why they did it.

 

[BMM]

Please! the only reason Fox got rid of Singer is becuase he wanted to Marvel's main competition movies, when he was under contract to do the Xmen film. Would I be pissed off? yep! I know people are saying that Fox was wrong, but I honestly understand why they did it.

Very true, although Singer was never contracted to film X-Men 3.

 

[Docker2.0]

Yeah but..................he and Fox expected him to work on that movie at that time. He wanted to do a movie about a gorgeous guy in red panties with a red cape.

 

[BMM]

You're right, but, if they didn't want him to leave, they should have contracted him sooner than the end of summer '04, especially when production was originally looking at a summer '05 release date. In the end, it probably would have saved the studio time and money, especially after the Vaughn debacle. Oh well, it's all over now... may as well look forward to the spin-offs.

 

[KenK]

With Singer it was different though, Singer was asking for more money (for both himself and the movie) and freedom, and wanted to do X3 and X4 back-to-back and as usual, Fox were trying to be cheap about it, so i dont blame Singer for jumping ship, especially the way he was treated during the 1st 2 movies.

That just goes to Fox's stupidity and bad business practices. This wouldn't like other back-to-back films where the decision to do them was based on just the success of the first film. X-Men had solidified itself as a quality franchise after the second film. The likelihood of critical decline or failure was pretty slim compared to franchises like The Matrix and Pirates of the Caribbean. X2 ended with enough closure as to not frustrate fans, but clearly left a door open for continuation, as Singer had always planned. Commercially, even if Singer's back-to-back sequels hadn't been critically well-received, they'd have still made plenty of money, as is evident with the commercial success of X3. Fox's stupidity in not capitalizing on all this far outweighs any damage Ratner-haters perceive he caused by directing X3.

You're right, but, if they didn't want him to leave, they should have contracted him sooner than the end of summer '04, especially when production was originally looking at a summer '05 release date. In the end, it probably would have saved the studio time and money, especially after the Vaughn debacle. Oh well, it's all over now... may as well look forward to the spin-offs.

Exactly. Fox had plenty of time after the cash started rolling in from X2 to snag Singer for the third film.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

That just goes to Fox's stupidity and bad business practices. This wouldn't like other back-to-back films where the decision to do them was based on just the success of the first film. X-Men had solidified itself as a quality franchise after the second film. The likelihood of critical decline or failure was pretty slim compared to franchises like The Matrix and Pirates of the Caribbean. X2 ended with enough closure as to not frustrate fans, but clearly left a door open for continuation, as Singer had always planned. Commercially, even if Singer's back-to-back sequels hadn't been critically well-received, they'd have still made plenty of money, as is evident with the commercial success of X3. Fox's stupidity in not capitalizing on all this far outweighs any damage Ratner-haters perceive he caused by directing X3.

Exactly. Fox had plenty of time after the cash started rolling in from X2 to snag Singer for the third film.

Oh dont get me wrong, please, i blame Fox for the outcome of X3 more than i blame Ratner, or the writers, etc.

But those party's still didnt help themselves with some things. But yeah, Fox is definately the main culprit.

 

[X-Maniac]

It's also interesting to wonder exactly what was happening with Singer and Fox after X2 came out.

It's my feeling that Singer does not always use money very wisely or expertly - SR doesn't feel like $270m, an $11m Krypton sequence was cut, lots of other sets were built but never used.... and a lot of money was wasted in X2 (such as dinosaur relics loaned and shipped in from around the world for the museum sequence, only for virtually none of that expensive museum set to appear on screen apart from the head of a sabretooth tiger).

And yet Transformers was made for $150m, 300 for just $65m, LotR: Return of the King for $94m.

It's also my feeling that Fox wanted Beast, Angel and other characters to make an appearance from the very beginning and that Singer kept cutting them out when he could probably have got them in if the budget had been used more economically.

I don't think he was as handicapped by budget as we are led to believe. After all, he had $270m for SR and that does not show in the movie. Singer shies away from the more fantastical elements... it kind of works, it kind of doesn't sometimes. He teases without delivering on occasion.

Fox didn't want Phoenix for X3 (had it not been for the very ending of X2 with the voiceover and firebird, then we could have moved on from the saga easily and the mainstream at least would have been quite happy. i think i would have been too). Fox also wanted something more dynamic, they probably didn't want to invest in a lengthy, two-part character drama full of subtexts and emotional undercurrents...

Personally, I think an X3 and X4 from Singer could have worked out well, but to want huge amounts of money and only promise Phoenix, Gambit and Emma Frost doesn't sound like a good use of huge amounts of money for two more movies.

Singer needs to learn more from other directors about the careful use of budgets.

So does Vaughn, whose Thor would have cost $300m but must now be made for $180m.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

It's also interesting to wonder exactly what was happening with Singer and Fox after X2 came out.

It's my feeling that Singer does not always use money very wisely or expertly - SR doesn't feel like $270m, an $11m Krypton sequence was cut, lots of other sets were built but never used.... and a lot of money was wasted in X2 (such as dinosaur relics loaned and shipped in from around the world for the museum sequence, only for virtually none of that expensive museum set to appear on screen apart from the head of a sabretooth tiger).

And yet Transformers was made for $150m, 300 for just $65m, LotR: Return of the King for $94m.

It's also my feeling that Fox wanted Beast, Angel and other characters to make an appearance from the very beginning and that Singer kept cutting them out when he could probably have got them in if the budget had been used more economically.

I don't think he was as handicapped by budget as we are led to believe. After all, he had $270m for SR and that does not show in the movie. Singer shies away from the more fantastical elements... it kind of works, it kind of doesn't sometimes. He teases without delivering on occasion.

Fox didn't want Phoenix for X3 (had it not been for the very ending of X2 with the voiceover and firebird, then we could have moved on from the saga easily and the mainstream at least would have been quite happy. i think i would have been too). Fox also wanted something more dynamic, they probably didn't want to invest in a lengthy, two-part character drama full of subtexts and emotional undercurrents...

Personally, I think an X3 and X4 from Singer could have worked out well, but to want huge amounts of money and only promise Phoenix, Gambit and Emma Frost doesn't sound like a good use of huge amounts of money for two more movies.

Singer needs to learn more from other directors about the careful use of budgets.

So does Vaughn, whose Thor would have cost $300m but must now be made for $180m.

While i agree that Singer had too much money to spend on SR (the budget for which was only actually $204 million) I dont believe that was the case with the first 2 X-Movies.

However, on SR i agree, he wasted a lot of money which could have been used to make the movie more mainstream.

 

[Damiean Dark]

I really dont think X3 is as bad as some make out Kelsey Grammer as beast is one of the most perfect castings ever in a hero movie imo, Stewert and Mckellen will always be great and Jackman as wolvie is amazing as always and the star of the show. the story at its core is good and the special effects have advanced greatly since X1 (particularly storms power effects). i agree in comparison to X1 and X2 (with X2 being the best superhero movie ever IMO) it is a dissapointment Juggernaut my favourite x-villain was terribly executed, mystiqe turning on magneto was bad storytelling and the final confrontation between 6 Xmen and several dozen mutants led by magneto was stupid and completely unrealistic. Again a dissapointment compared to the other movies but i can live with it.

 

[Damiean Dark]

But i did think SR was better then X3.

 

[ant3ros]

X3 was definitely bad as a movie. Sure you can sit through it eating popcorn, but that's only because it's X-Men and X-Men are cool. Direction, plot, cinematography, action, every aspect about a film was flawed with X3. Everything could have been done better, and you can say that about every movie, but X3 makes you aware of it right while your watching. I remember loving Kelsey Grammer as Beast, but near the end he does a lame ass jump that was clearly done with strings killing what little I liked about it. X3 = cheap thrills. Of course, some people like cheap thrills because it is what it is.

 

[Chaos Bringer]

There's hardly any integrity within the current state of the comics. What makes you think integrity will be attributed to the movies?? As it stands, I'm not very impressed with marvel's movies besides blade and blade 2....and the only DC movie I'm feeling is, BB.

while i've been entertained with the SM films i am in total agreeance with you.