New WSJ article on WB movies and DC franchises.

[The Major]

And somebody writing and directing with some god damn sense.

That should be mandatory.

 

[04nbod]

i'd say green arrow all but has the greenlight. Green Arrow in prison is the darkness they will search for

Shazam however, needs to be taken seriously. The fawcett stuff was dark, Captain Nazi kills a man and cripples a little boy who are innocently fishing after all. It shouldn't be aimed at 8-14 year olds, rather all ages.

 

[TheVileOne]

"Along those lines, we have been developing every DC character that we own," Mr. Robinov says.

No, you really haven't.

 

[04nbod]

No, you really haven't.

Give them a break, they have been exploring everyone at one point or another its just they've never taken it seriously. They even ordered a Teen Titans script which is something I would love to see done

 

[The Major]

Shazam however, needs to be taken seriously. The fawcett stuff was dark, Captain Nazi kills a man and cripples a little boy who are innocently fishing after all. It shouldn't be aimed at 8-14 year olds, rather all ages.

From what I've heard, which isn't much, is that the movie will be serious.

 

[The Major]

Give them a break, they have been exploring everyone at one point

I doubt it. There are literately thousands of franchises they have to choose from. The numbers are increasing every few years.

I've never heard of them doing anything in live action with Kate Spencer Manhunter, Helena Bertinelli Huntress, The Demon, Shadowpact, the Outsiders, Black Alice etc.

Those are just from the DCU. There's also the Vertigo and WildStorm brands.

Its their animated devision that's been exploring the DCU the most and doing a good job with it.

or another its just they've never taken it seriously.

They even ordered a Teen Titans script which is something I would love to see done

Agreed.

 

[TheVileOne]

Give them a break, they have been exploring everyone at one point or another its just they've never taken it seriously. They even ordered a Teen Titans script which is something I would love to see done

I mean it's all just talk really. We've gotten two really great Batman films in the last 3 years, and a disappointing Superman movie. A ****ty Constantine movie that will never see a sequel. And a Catwoman movie.

Now if they want to start doing more solo-movies and build up to a multi-character film that will actually connect the movies and have the same actors, great, but you know . . . get the lead out.

They should've been developing a Hal Jordan GL film or a Flash movie instead of wasting all that stupid time on JL. Which was a waste of time and money.

GL and Flash should've been top priorities.

 

[OwlBoy]

Shazam however, needs to be taken seriously. The fawcett stuff was dark, Captain Nazi kills a man and cripples a little boy who are innocently fishing after all. It shouldn't be aimed at 8-14 year olds, rather all ages.

I posted this in the main Shazam! thread a while back

The right way to do this movie is to look at what Disney and Pixar have been doing for years. All those great movies that have come out of their camps have been kid oriented family friendly fairs that have huge notes of seriousness.

The fact that Billy is an orphan is serious.
The fact that Billy is going to have to realize that his powers aren't just fun and games and that people might die if he doesn't do the wise and right thing is serious.
Black Adam and his overall presence is deadly serious. He doesn't need to be killing people left and right but the way he's been written recently they'd do well to tap into his desire to impose his order onto the world and the fact that he's willing to accept the cost of doing so. He's a fascist; a superpowered Mussolini in a way.

 

[04nbod]

I doubt it. There are literately thousands of franchises they have to choose from. The numbers are increasing every few years.

I've never heard of them doing anything in live action with Kate Spencer Manhunter, Helena Bertinelli Huntress, The Demon, Shadowpact, the Outsiders, Black Alice etc.

Those are just from the DCU. There's also the Vertigo and WildStorm brands.

Kate Spencer is way too new she needs the source material behind her first. Huntress comes under the bat banner and should be in Birds of Prey movie. The problem is that Barbara is a possibility for the bat franchise. I don't read The Demon, Black Alice or Shadowpact so can't really comment on whether they are viable. As for the outsiders, again its Batman orientated and failing that when Nightwing led the team but he's more integral to Titans.

I mean it's all just talk really. We've gotten two really great Batman films in the last 3 years, and a disappointing Superman movie. A ****ty Constantine movie that will never see a sequel. And a Catwoman movie.

Now if they want to start doing more solo-movies and build up to a multi-character film that will actually connect the movies and have the same actors, great, but you know . . . get the lead out.

They should've been developing a Hal Jordan GL film or a Flash movie instead of wasting all that stupid time on JL. Which was a waste of time and money.

GL and Flash should've been top priorities.

Absolutely I agree. There is no denying though that they put producers or scriptwriters on 70% of their big names. They went nowhere because WB didn't seem to care.

I posted this in the main Shazam! thread a while back

Thats perfect. Also Black Adam as Captain Marvel's dark side and the contrast between innocence and experience would make for an excellent movie. Dare I say its a better option for a satisfying movie that superman has ever been?

 

[The Major]

Kate Spencer is way too new she needs the source material behind her first.

Not sure what you're getting at here.

Exactly why doesn't she have enough source material to work in film?

They could make plenty of good films just from the story lines already published.

WB could make a decent tv show from it, too.

Huntress comes under the bat banner

Shouldn't be under the Bat-banner be a good thing? Helena can be useful both attached to it and operate outside of it like Catwoman can.

Bertinelli would fit in Nolan's universe easily.

and should be in Birds of Prey movie.

She can't be in both?

Birds of Prey is like Justice League. It's primary characters are good enough to go solo, as well. Excluding Oracle.

Since the BOP franchise isn't going to be revived soon there's no reason Huntress or Black Canary shouldn't be off-limits. The characters on the show were so different people would barely notice they were meant to be the same. In Helena's case she had more in common with Dark Angel then Bertinelli.

BA would be better off being introduced in a Green Arrow movie first. Bertinelli can strike out on her in film own fine. Huntress: Year One and Cry For Blood are bibles for her origin film. She could make a great tv show. Get Mutant Enemy to make it.

Huntress and Black Canary getting solo films, or in BCs case appearing in a GA film as a supporting character, could set up a Birds of Prey movie, as well.

The problem is that Barbara is a possibility for the bat franchise.

That didn't stop them making a Birds of Prey tv show before.

They should do it again only this time actually be faithful and make good entertainment.

Or make a cartoon series, animated films and direct to dvd live action movies. Good ones.

This time actually read the comics, research the characters heavily, read interviews about the franchise with Dixon and Simone and talk to them directly. Unlike the previous tv show's creators they know what they're doing with the franchise.

I don't read The Demon, Black Alice or Shadowpact so can't really comment on whether they are viable.

Black Alice doesn't have a comic title but she does have enough material to make at least one movie from her. BA did get one special a while ago called Helmet of Fate: Black Alice. She could also join the Birds of Prey franchise as a member or enemy.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Alice_(comics)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadowpact

Etrigan's origin epsiode on JLU:

http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=a+knight+of+shadows&search_type=&aq=f

As for the outsiders, again its Batman orientated and failing that when Nightwing led the team but he's more integral to Titans.

Outsiders can function without Batman or Nightwing on the team.

 

[The Major]

Idk But does WB just go what is bringing in the money?

That only works if the properties theyre adapting suit the same conditions like Bertinelli's Huntress or Spencer's Manhunter. What makes them money on Batman won't on Green Lantern.

Lets wind the clock back to Batman Returns.......people complained that it was to dark and blah blah blah.....Then Batman Forever comes around and since they went the more lighter route it was a more succesfull film but we know what happend after that.......

Moderation and understanding the franchise correctly is the key.

Going to extremes doesn't work unless you do it very, very well. Nolan can do this, Burton can go overboard and Schumacher went in the wrong direction.

Now The Dark Knight is a some what dark film.....and that brought in the money making it WB's most successfull film.....

What works for Batman doesn't mean it'll work for every adaption.

Ironically they didn't do this on franchises which would actually benefit from it, like Catwoman and Constantine.

So now does is WB going to be taking the "Darker" route with whatever films they come out with?

Darker works with certain franchises, just as being light does. It depends on the franchise they're adapting.

WB needs to get out of thinking in their little box.

Super-hero films are more then simple line wide formula. What works on Superman won't work on GL which won't work on Catwoman. The more WB realizes that the better off they'll be. They need to tailor specific formulas to specific adaptions which fit them.

They need to do what is best for the property, not themselves. This means they have to understand whatever they're making or hire people who do. They did this for Batman. Now they need to do it for everyone else.

Some franchises can work with both extremes like Green Arrow and JLA. But they are exceptions to the rule.

At the end of the day for them its about the money......not about sending a message

Yet they have no idea how to do it correctly most of the time. So they don't get the money they desire.

 

[04nbod]

Not sure what you're getting at here.

Exactly why doesn't she have enough source material to work in film?

They could make plenty of good films just from the story lines already published.

WB could make a decent tv show from it, too.

She is a relatively new ongoing character in the DCU and the comic book she features is on the brink of cancellation. Thats not to say a good movie can't be made about her stories so far but the original concept needs a firmer footing. If they made a movie how would WB promote it? It was so good it got cancelled isn't the best hype. The movie could be stellar and reinvigorate the comic but you have to understand the hesitation.

Shouldn't be under the Bat-banner be a good thing? Helena can be useful both attached to it and operate outside of it like Catwoman can.

Bertinelli would fit in Nolan's universe easily.

I agree but he doesn't seem open to other costumed heroes in his movies.

She can't be in both?

Birds of Prey is like Justice League. It's primary characters are good enough to go solo, as well. Excluding Oracle.

Since the BOP franchise isn't going to be revived soon there's no reason Huntress or Black Canary shouldn't be off-limits. The characters on the show were so different people would barely notice they were meant to be the same. In Helena's case she had more in common with Dark Angel then Bertinelli.

it depends on whether DC sees The dark Knight as the start of its Live Action universe that all these characters inhabit. You never know, BB3 could have Barbara shot before she even becomes Batgirl and start Birds of Prey as a movie but that is in Nolan's hands. He has to decide if he will use her or Huntress.

Outsiders can function without Batman or Nightwing on the team.

Look at the current roster. A few big names that could get their own movies and the rest are nobodies. Who would be the hook?

 

[The Major]

She is a relatively new ongoing character in the DCU and the comic book she features is on the brink of cancellation.

WB uses new characters in new franchises in their media form their tv shows to movies to cartoons all the time. ****, the characters used in the Catwoman movie never appeared in any format before that.

Her comic is doing better then Blade. He had 3 hit movies.

Her comic does have several potential story lines which could be made into entertaining movies or tv episodes given the right execution.

Thats not to say a good movie can't be made about her stories so far but the original concept needs a firmer footing.

Exactly what is she lacking creatively here? I'm not sure what she's missing that Hellboy or Blade don't.

If they made a movie how would WB promote it?

She's a prosecutor who believes in justice so much she wants to take it into her own hands if criminals abuse the justice system to avoid fair trials.

Kate has a young kid, is divorced with an ex-husband who she has a rocky relationship with, fights terrifying villains, looks mighty fine in her costume, uses a retired ex-henchman of super-villains to maintain her equipment and has access to technology that would make Batman jealous.

It was so good it got cancelled isn't the best hype.

Blade's recent series didn't reach issue 12 after the movies where released IIRC. The previous one didn't reach double digits.

Manhunter's concept could be easy to make into a good film or tv show with today's technology with talented people in front of and behind the camera.

The movie could be stellar and reinvigorate the comic

True.

but you have to understand the hesitation.

I understand the hesitation, I don’t get why they wouldn’t see the potential. Shows with female super-heroes who fight evil can be very successful.

I agree but he doesn't seem open to other costumed heroes in his movies.

They could add them when he leaves.

I never said they would have be in his movies, either. Bertinelli can work in the same universe, not meet Batman to know of him but not meet him and still function properly as a franchise.

They don't need to tie Huntress into Nolan's universe its just an option if they did a film.

They could get away with less of a connection with a tv show or animated films.

it depends on whether DC sees The dark Knight as the start of its Live Action universe that all these characters inhabit. You never know, BB3 could have Barbara shot before she even becomes Batgirl and start Birds of Prey as a movie but that is in Nolan's hands. He has to decide if he will use her or Huntress.

True.

Why would this stop them from using BOP, Huntress and BC animated movies, tv shows and cartoon shows?

BC and Huntress don't need Birds of Prey to exist. They could possibly relocate Huntress to a place like New York. Her established villains don't necessarily have to located in Gotham.

Look at the current roster. A few big names that could get their own movies and the rest are nobodies.

Wanted, Blade, V for Vendetta, Sin City and Hellboy.

The concept could hook people no matter who is in it. Some of the nobodies have potential to get the audience interested, too.

Most of the X-men were nobodies, too. They did well with the public. Give them versions they can enjoy and they’ll come around. Every small franchise needs to start somewhere to grow into a bigger one.

Who would be the hook?

Depends on the roster and what angle they'd use.

Metamorpho, Arsenal, Katana, Indigo, Thunder, Grace and Captain Boomerang could easily become great “hooks” to get people’s attention.

They could even use Green Arrow instead of Arsenal. He could fund the team from the shadows and/or lead missions. Or Arsenal could be the team leader while Ollie funds it fro the shadows. If they make Ollie older they could still have Arsenal around. Ollie could perhaps be retired from super-heroing as an option if Super Max isn't made. They could tie it into Super Max if it is a hit, too.

 

[jmc]

I think people are misinterpreting 'dark and deeper', what they mean is exploring more mature themes, not making the films depressing or gritty, WB have seen they don't need 12 year olds to make a truck load of cash, seems like TDK is the start of superhero films finally growing up, and it will be for the better.

 

[protocida]

I think people are misinterpreting 'dark and deeper', what they mean is exploring more mature themes, not making the films depressing or gritty, WB have seen they don't need 12 year olds to make a truck load of cash, seems like TDK is the start of superhero films finally growing up, and it will be for the better.

I Second that. People are going crazy because of a misunderstooded comment.

 

[Octoberist]

I think WB are speaking out their properties from an outsider's perspective, not using the right words and such. HOwever, they are working with DC now with the projects, so they're not THAT dumb. (but they're still ignorant)

 

[The Major]

I think WB are speaking out their properties from an outsider's perspective, not using the right words and such.

I can understand that.

However, they are working with DC now with the projects, so they're not THAT dumb. (but they're still ignorant)

That's good news.

 

[FaT_tONle]

I think WB needs to fast track BB3 for 2010 as bad as that sounds... because 2010 is too soon for a Superman reboot. I'd go:

2010 BB3, GL
2011 WW, Superman reboot
2012 Flash, Green Arrow
2013 Justice League.

 

[The Major]

Fast tracking a Batman sequel could put the franchise in jeopardy again.

Nolan could leave before making a third film and they can't get anyone off the street to direct it.

That movie would do well from TDK's reputation but after that the franchise would be in a possibly downward spiral unless they're absolutely perfect with it then they may have to reboot it again.

They're better off leaving Nolan alone until his batteries are recharged.

Batman's fine. Their lesser franchises should be a higher priority.

 

[FaT_tONle]

I don't see what else can be viewed as a tentpole if that's the case. I mean they do have a Potter film in the Holiday 2010 slot. But right now I just don't think WB is going to live up to their word. I mean four films by 2011 including the Superman reboot? I don't see it. They don't have a July 2010 movie. There won't be a Harry Potter ready to go that's for sure. Superman reboot in that slot doesn't make sense to me. Anything is possible but Batman is the only movie that is servicable of that slot.

 

[The Major]

They can create some.

They have plenty of lesser comic franchises to choose from. GL and GA are their best candidates.

 

[FaT_tONle]

Those aren't tentpoles though... we'll agree to disagree. WB does seem to have some non comic book property lined up for 2010 though... 2012 (the movie) and Robotech accoring to Showtime. So maybe those films can be the tentpoles they are looking for. Certainly not HP or Batman level but more so than a GL IMO.

 

[The Major]

Agreed.

 

[Webhead2006]

Yea the dark comment was taken a bit out of context what i was reading about it it meant to go like this: The "dark" comment is not about the characters themselves, but the universe they will be in.

 

[Octoberist]

I think that was what WB was trying to convey. Heck, they haven't announced the directors yet, so we shouldn't worry (too much) yet.