The Dark Knight Rises Nolan...add Robin!!!!!!

[GlasgowBat]

point is, there is no reason to assume the movies are not building blocks for bringing in more...."fantastical"(doesn't feel right but will have to do) elements to the franchise. Hasn't the theme of escalation been central to the progression of the narrative, and the characters?

even if nolan's third is not a completely "fantastical" rendition of the mythos, there is every possibility that it will have an open-ending which can be built upon by someone new, who takes advantage of the break to amp up the fantasy levels. Indeed, it only seems logical for that to be the case.

however, if the next film is largely amped up fantasy wise, it would feel very sudden and terribly unnatural; the escalation theme, form that meeting atop police headquarters in BB, has always read to me as such; batman has begun, and now we are going to see slowly but surely the progression from crime-ridden mob city to haven of super-criminals and flamboyant lunatics- perhaps inspired by the hero himself.

isn't that precisely what year one served as? the starting point for the batman story, after which we would see the "freaks" subsume and take the power from the mob element? certainly, year one-the long halloween-dark victory(cited as sources of inspiration by nolan et al) took this overarching concept.

why would we not assume that this is going to be the case, seeing as BB and TDK have delivered just that so far? the parallels are fairly obvious.

 

[El Payaso]

I doubt it will progress that way. It could happen but so far Nolan's realism has been both financial and critically successful. In fact the effect of this is on the contrary; other franchises are being driven into this style. The Nolans are making Superman.

 

[Two-Face=Badass]

You thought that was absurd? Well, according to me... it wasn't.

No, lol. It was my mistake, I meant "Fiction doesn't automatically equal absurd" as someone suggested.

Ha, there you go. I'm so happy, usually everyone is correcting me

 

[Mr. Earle]

To be fair, Dick wouldn't have invented Brother Eye or given Ra's al Ghul the protocols to kill the JLA, either. Bruce is like a tragic hero- his strengths are sometimes his undoing.

I agree.

 

[Eros]

I doubt it will progress that way. It could happen but so far Nolan's realism has been both financial and critically successful. In fact the effect of this is on the contrary; other franchises are being driven into this style. The Nolans are making Superman.

But thats just it, its not realistic, None of it is. Their no realism in the movies, its just not as flamboyant as previous movies, You seem to think their realsim in TDK. tell me what part of the movie is realistic and not upsurd?

 

[Crook]

A multibillionaire flying via helicopter to a party in his penthouse, carrying 3 women on his side.

 

[DarkKnight FTW]

Hearing about it and reading it are two different things. If you had followed the comics you'd be itching to see Dick claim his birthright. Bruce is and will always be THE Batman, but others can step in and keep the legend alive when he is gone. Dick Grayson has proven himself a worthy successor. He has made some really crappy mistakes that he wouldnt have made as Nightwing but i think that they re trying to convey that he is different than Bruce and he doesnt plan like him. He is an acrobat and he jumps over whatever comes his way.

That is wrong. There are plenty of people who are not interested in Dick as Batman who read the comics, Myself being one of them. I wish they had gone in a different direction because once Dick created Nightwing, he became his own man. This is not like passing down the mantle of the Flash or something. Batman was created through Bruce's unique experiences and therefore no one else can truly be Batman. They're just imposters like Harvey Dent said. I like Jean Paul Valley's attempt at Batman because he changed it. Dick, while being more light hearted, seems to be imitating Bruce. Not good, he was a much better Nightwing because that's who HE is.

 

[Mr. Earle]

But thats just it, its not realistic, None of it is. Their no realism in the movies, its just not as flamboyant as previous movies, You seem to think their realsim in TDK. tell me what part of the movie is realistic and not upsurd?

You re missing the point. Casino Royale was unrealistic too, but not "Die another day" unrealistic. Equally, Nolan's films are unrealistic, but fall short from the unrealism of the comics. Notify me when Nolan's Batman is teleported to the past by an evil god's eye beams.

That is wrong. There are plenty of people who are not interested in Dick as Batman who read the comics, Myself being one of them. I wish they had gone in a different direction because once Dick created Nightwing, he became his own man. This is not like passing down the mantle of the Flash or something. Batman was created through Bruce's unique experiences and therefore no one else can truly be Batman. They're just imposters like Harvey Dent said. I like Jean Paul Valley's attempt at Batman because he changed it. Dick, while being more light hearted, seems to be imitating Bruce. Not good, he was a much better Nightwing because that's who HE is.

You'll notice that every person in the bat family has been scarred by tragedy, Dick Grayson included. And while he is very different from Bruce, he is Bruce's first son, he has every right to wear the cowl, even if he was his own man as Nightwing. Furthermore, the fact that he is a different Batman than Bruce makes him interesting. There is no point in replacing Bruce with another Bruce. And that's why while i respect Tim and think he deserves the cowl too, i have no interest in reading any stories with him as Batman. He's too much like Bruce.

 

[weezerspider]

I respect your argument and your opinions you have on the subject of Robin; but I would like to share my views on why I think Robin is much more important than The Joker.

Of course the rivalry between Joker and Batman is a great one and does in fact give us some great reading and viewing, but I was just using the character of him as an example to how Robin is an important part of the mythos. This is probably the lamest excuse so I get this one out first, but Robin has been appearing in Batman comics longer than Mr. J has (Robin appeared in Detective Comics 38, I believe before the arrival of Batman 1). The other thing I have to say is, Joker is just another part of the Batman's mythology and is his greatest enemy, but the character has done so much damage and has had a massive impact that if the story was really well written I wouldn't worry for the final Joker story, of course I would rather he stayed alive because he is my favourite comic book villain.

Robin on the other hand? He is possibly one of the most vital characters to Batman and cannot think of a DC Universe without him- especially Dick Grayson whom has proved to be Bruce Wayne's near equal and holds the title of being as important to comics as Batman is.

As for realism, I've said it once and I'll say it again- you're watching a billionaire playboy whom was trained by ninjas, dressed as a Bat fighting a nut-case in make-up. If Nolan's world was really that realistic, Bruce wouldn't wear a cape and cowl, he would just wear black covert operations style camouflage and just call himself "Batman", and every time he glided and landed into windows and stuff- how did he not break a single bone or his eyeballs fell out of his sockets on impact; because IT'S A MOVIE!!!!!!!!!

Also, Nolan is currently on-board for helping the direction of the Superman franchise; a character whose powers are not only god-like, take away most of the laws of physics out the window. So, hopefully a kid trained by Batman wouldn't be that bad; and Bruce is too young? In Batman Begins I believe he turned 30, so that would mean in The Dark Knight he is now 31- in the comics Bruce became Batman when he was around 18-25 and adopted Dick Grayson within those years, plus Nolan's Batman is in it's own universe so he can easily change Dick's age to that of 16 years old; I admit casting an actor who can portray Robin well will be hard, but all great roles are.

Nolan could make Robin work, it's not that implausible and this trilogy is about Batman's early years where Robin marked the beginning of a new era. All that matters is if Nolan chooses to use him.

ehhhhh..... you are not getting my point. I'm looking at it from a story-telling perspective. Let me put this as simple as possible, and here we gooo:

Ok, lets start off by looking at the trilogy as one long story. BB and TDK have grounded an unrealistic character(Batman) in a some-what realistic world. Watching Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, there is no way you can see a teenager fighting crime. Its a gritty, hellish world full of gangsters running the streets. These gangsters are grown men that have killed cops and literally brought Gotham to its knees. One man has fought back.... Batman. Based off Batman Begins, Bruce trained almost his WHOLE LIFE and still couldn't handle the likes of Ras men without being trained by them. Now, you've focused Part 1 and Part 2 on creating this hellish world that a man who has trained HIS WHOLE LIFE can barely survive in. Now explain to me, as a story-teller, why you would go 180 in PART 3 and have some kid be able to take down these criminals that a guy who's trained his whole life struggles with. This kid would have AT MOST a couple months of training. That there is BAD storytelling. TERRIBLE storytelling. There is no continuity. It makes no sense in the world that you have created! If Christopher Nolan had Robin in Batman Begins, your "Batman's not realistic either" case would apply. However, Christopher Nolan has spent 4 hours of screen-time developing a fairly realistic world where Batman can exist. However, based on previous films(BB, TDK) There is no plausible way Robin could exist. That would be like having Batman grow wings in Batman 3. Its not plausible in the universe Nolan has created through the first two films. Oh and your point on Superman, thats not in this universe. Nolan's made it clear, Batman is the only hero in his BB/TDK universe. What Nolan does with other films has nothing to do with his Bat-films. According to that^ logic, George Lucas should have aliens in American Graffiti.

 

[Eros]

ehhhhh..... you are not getting my point. I'm looking at it from a story-telling perspective. Let me put this as simple as possible, and here we gooo:

Ok, lets start off by looking at the trilogy as one long story. BB and TDK have grounded an unrealistic character(Batman) in a some-what realistic world. Watching Batman Begins and The Dark Knight, there is no way you can see a teenager fighting crime. Its a gritty, hellish world full of gangsters running the streets. These gangsters are grown men that have killed cops and literally brought Gotham to its knees. One man has fought back.... Batman. Based off Batman Begins, Bruce trained almost his WHOLE LIFE and still couldn't handle the likes of Ras men without being trained by them. Now, you've focused Part 1 and Part 2 on creating this hellish world that a man who has trained HIS WHOLE LIFE can barely survive in. Now explain to me, as a story-teller, why you would go 180 in PART 3 and have some kid be able to take down these criminals that a guy who's trained his whole life struggles with. This kid would have AT MOST a couple months of training. That there is BAD storytelling. TERRIBLE storytelling. There is no continuity. It makes no sense in the world that you have created! If Christopher Nolan had Robin in Batman Begins, your "Batman's not realistic either" case would apply. However, Christopher Nolan has spent 4 hours of screen-time developing a fairly realistic world where Batman can exist. However, based on previous films(BB, TDK) There is no plausible way Robin could exist. That would be like having Batman grow wings in Batman 3. Its not plausible in the universe Nolan has created through the first two films. Oh and your point on Superman, thats not in this universe. Nolan's made it clear, Batman is the only hero in his BB/TDK universe. What Nolan does with other films has nothing to do with his Bat-films. According to that^ logic, George Lucas should have aliens in American Graffiti.

Um first, In begins Bruce doesnt train or do jack **** until hes 22, after he runs away he begins traveling an training for only 7 years. You keep saying his whole life, despite the fact he was a grown man when he started training in Begins LOL. If you think a A man training with a centries old secret League of ninjas and killers, who have sacked numerous cities in in a realistic world, your nuts. or a Machine thats vaporizes all water, except the water in the human body, or a Billionaire vanished for 7 years, and no one wonder or even asks where this guy was. In what world is a secret League of super Ninja assasins with a water vaporizing machine realsitic?

 

[weezerspider]

Um first, In begins Bruce doesnt train or do jack **** until hes 22, after he runs away he begins traveling an training for only 7 years. You keep saying his whole life, despite the fact he was a grown man when he started training in Begins LOL. If you think a A man training with a centries old secret League of ninjas and killers, who have sacked numerous cities in in a realistic world, your nuts. or a Machine thats vaporizes all water, except the water in the human body, or a Billionaire vanished for 7 years, and no one wonder or even asks where this guy was. In what world is a secret League of super Ninja assasins with a water vaporizing machine realsitic?

You can't read. Simple as that. I clearly stated IN THE WORLD NOLAN CREATED IN HIS FIRST TWO MOVIES IT WOULD BE UNREALISTIC TO SEE A KID FIGHTING CRIME! In HIS WORLD, that he created IN BATMAN BEGINS AND THE DARK KNIGHT, evil ninjas, water vapor machines work, but there is NOTHING Nolan has done through his story-telling in the first two films to suggest a kid can fight crime, but there is plenty he's done to suggest they can't, such as grown Cops being easily handled by Joker and his Goons, Ninja assassin's giving all Bruce can handle. And if Bruce trained for 7 years and still gets defeated at one point or another in both films, how in the Hell is a kid going to be able to do anything? If the kid's 14, what, did the Grayson's secretly train their kid with The League of Shadow's for half his life? I don't think so. If Batman's 30,Robin would have to be around the same age as Batman if he has half the training Bat's has. Thats not Robin. There is nothing based on BB and TDK that suggest a kid can fight crime. Is the world the most realistic world? No, I've made that pretty clear. That said, its not a comic-book world either and when Joker's killing off cops left and right, The League Of Shadow's is burning down Bruce's house, a kid is not going to be able to go fight crime. Nolan's created a realistic world with comic elements in it. He's used two films to create this world and yet you still don't get it This is NOT the Real World. This is NOT a comic book. Its something in between where kids don't fight crime.

Oh and because I know you won't comprehend this, let me just point this out: Nolan's world he's created in BB and TDK is NOT THE REAL WORLD! I get that! Its also not a comic book. Its a realistic world with many comic elements sprinkled in. Based on the previous films, a kid can not fight crime in this world.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

Whenever Robin makes it back to the big screen (it's gonna happen eventually), I'd like to see him in a costume like Damian's, maybe minus the hood.

 

[weezerspider]

Whenever Robin makes it back to the big screen (it's gonna happen eventually), I'd like to see him in a costume like Damian's, maybe minus the hood.

I agree with that! By far my favorite Robin costume.

 

[Eros]

You can't read. Simple as that. I clearly stated IN THE WORLD NOLAN CREATED IN HIS FIRST TWO MOVIES IT WOULD BE UNREALISTIC TO SEE A KID FIGHTING CRIME! In HIS WORLD, that he created IN BATMAN BEGINS AND THE DARK KNIGHT, evil ninjas, water vapor machines work, but there is NOTHING Nolan has done through his story-telling in the first two films to suggest a kid can fight crime, but there is plenty he's done to suggest they can't, such as grown Cops being easily handled by Joker and his Goons, Ninja assassin's giving all Bruce can handle. And if Bruce trained for 7 years and still gets defeated at one point or another in both films, how in the Hell is a kid going to be able to do anything? If the kid's 14, what, did the Grayson's secretly train their kid with The League of Shadow's for half his life? I don't think so. If Batman's 30,Robin would have to be around the same age as Batman if he has half the training Bat's has. Thats not Robin. There is nothing based on BB and TDK that suggest a kid can fight crime. Is the world the most realistic world? No, I've made that pretty clear. That said, its not a comic-book world either and when Joker's killing off cops left and right, The League Of Shadow's is burning down Bruce's house, a kid is not going to be able to go fight crime. Nolan's created a realistic world with comic elements in it. He's used two films to create this world and yet you still don't get it This is NOT the Real World. This is NOT a comic book. Its something in between where kids don't fight crime.

Oh and because I know you won't comprehend this, let me just point this out: Nolan's world he's created in BB and TDK is NOT THE REAL WORLD! I get that! Its also not a comic book. Its a realistic world with many comic elements sprinkled in. Based on the previous films, a kid can not fight crime in this world.

You dont seem to be makeing any sense, In a world where 6 foot 170 Pound Man glides around in a Rubber Bat suit, fighting criminals who cant fire a gun correctly, and eludes swat teams with in a Black Tank, I beleive a kid or a Teenager can fight crime. Its all about useing the same world sense established in the first 2 movies. Its not like Dick has to become Robin in the first movie, he can act as a ward or a friend to Bruce, someone Bruce can mentor and can relate to.

 

[weezerspider]

You dont seem to be makeing any sense, In a world where 6 foot 170 Pound Man glides around in a Rubber Bat suit, fighting criminals who cant fire a gun correctly, and eludes swat teams with in a Black Tank, I beleive a kid or a Teenager can fight crime. Its all about useing the same world sense established in the first 2 movies. Its not like Dick has to become Robin in the first movie, he can act as a ward or a friend to Bruce, someone Bruce can mentor and can relate to.

Okay, well in Nolan's Universe a man in a rubber suit works, but like I said, the threats in both films have been depicted as being a true match to this guy in a rubber suit who's trained for years. I don't think a kid can take down these guys if Rubber-Suit man has trouble doing it. The only way they could do it is if Dick was his ward, but really, what is the point? To nodd to the comics? There's nothing that a kid living with Bruce is going to add to the movie except for the teenagers in the back row making pedophile jokes.

 

[Rodrigo90]

This is how Im including Dick in my story.

He is 12 and not a gymnast like his parents. John Grayson and Bruce knew each other from their private school. So the family are already friendly with Bruce.

With Rupert Thorne needing to demolish the Narrows in order to build a new prison, merely to gain public devotion,and also for Roman Sionis to build his company so that when elections for mayor are due,he will receive full financial backing from Sionis. Sionis also needs his facilities to be developed in order to stabilise his crumbling business.

But with Bruce fighting Thorne in his campaign,they cant risk him winning. So Thorne hires Tony Zucco to kill him and others at the Circus,make it look like a robbery gone bad,

Zucco only injures Bruce,but kills Dick's parents as he watches from the audience. As Bruce is a family friend,he takes Dick in as social services make arrangements.

Dick helps Bruce identify Zucco as the killer,which Zucco in turn reveals to Batman that it was Thorne who was responsible

 

[IBRAH08]

You dont seem to be makeing any sense, In a world where 6 foot 170 Pound Man glides around in a Rubber Bat suit, fighting criminals who cant fire a gun correctly, and eludes swat teams with in a Black Tank, I beleive a kid or a Teenager can fight crime. Its all about useing the same world sense established in the first 2 movies. Its not like Dick has to become Robin in the first movie, he can act as a ward or a friend to Bruce, someone Bruce can mentor and can relate to.

HE's closer to 200 actually (In Batman Begins at least)t:

 

[Two-Face]

Whenever Robin makes it back to the big screen (it's gonna happen eventually), I'd like to see him in a costume like Damian's, maybe minus the hood.

No, wouldn't work. If Batman is given rubber suit so Robin should have one.

 

[IBRAH08]

Anyone who says Robin should never be in another Batman movie EVER, probably doesn't read comics or hasn't watched BTAS and doesn't really know anything about Robin.

 

[IBRAH08]

No, wouldn't work. If Batman is given rubber suit so Robin should have one.

Yeah but he may not have a rubber suit in future future films. so...... who knows?

 

[El Payaso]

Anyone who says Robin should never be in another Batman movie EVER, probably doesn't read comics or hasn't watched BTAS and doesn't really know anything about Robin.

Or think that animation and comics are different media or have read comics and don't like the character.

 

[weezerspider]

Or think that animation and comics are different media or have read comics and don't like the character.

Or a mixture of all of them. Chances are if you don't like a character, you don't want them in the movie.

 

[Mr. Earle]

But someone who has read quite a few comics will realise that Robin is quintessential and you cant have Batman without him. Not for long anyway. Its Batman & Robin. Enough with the grimdark and the crime drama bullcrap.

 

[Blitzkrieg Bop]

I think it works either way. I like the idea that Batman has help right beside him but I also like the lone vigilante.

 

[Rodrigo90]

I believe Dick is an important character to Bruce, Robin is irrelevant to Batman however.