The Dark Knight Non-fan reactions to Heath as Joker/TDK trailer

[The Sage]

Thats my biggest concern as well. Nolan seems so stuck on his idea of realism he seems to have toned down the over-the-top aspects of the Joker quite a bit in an effort to distance himself as much as possible from Nicholson/Romero. I sort of like my Joker over-the-top. He is an over-the-top villain. There is no need to change him to make him realistic in a fantasy movie. Of course, thats just my thoughts on a 2 minute trailer. Hopefully I am entirely wrong.

Especially since it is the over-top-nature of the Joker that made him popular in the first place. Though I think Ledger will nail that aspect but bring in a darker edge that hasn't been seen in previous live action incarnations.

 

[Matt]

Especially since it is the over-top-nature of the Joker that made him popular in the first place. Though I think Ledger will nail that aspect but bring in a darker edge that hasn't been seen in previous live action incarnations.

I hope so. I think Hamill's joker got it perfectly. The sick, dark, twisted humor (though it was a kid's show...so it was limited...but it was there, albeit usually off screen, but watch the unrated cut of Batman Beyond Return of the Joker to see it in its full glory) combined with the elaborate theatricallity of Nicholson or Romero's joker. It was a great middle ground. I fear Ledger will be too far to the the polar opposite of Nicholson and Romero. Neither extreme is good. The middle ground is the perfect Joker.

I mean, look at The Killing Joke (which I think 90 % of us can agree is the definitive Joker). When you really stop and think about what he did to Gordon, you can see how, in a sick way...it is funny. Well, not funny, but you can see the attempt at humor behind it. And that is what the Joker needs. To do something entirely sick...but the audience can still understand how in his demented mind, he finds it humorous.

 

[Solidus]

Ra's broke into Wayne's House during a party and used a train to try to launch a virus on Gotham. It is the typical meglomanical things you would expect of a villain. The Joker is unique because of his sense of humor. And I haven't felt it at all in the trailers.

Well we do know some over the top things. If you do not want to be spoiled please do not read on:

Spoiler

The Joker implants a bomb in one of his own crazy dumb thugs stomach to help him escape.

He dresses up in a pink nurses dress/skirt when he goes to blow up the hospital

He dances around crazy like with Rachael at the party.

Those are just some but those scream over the top. Not...normal.

 

[Matt]

while i think Joker will have laugh out loud gags during the film, i do believe they'll be few and far between. Which works IMO, as long as they're there. I'd rather have him crazy/killer 95% of the time and then suddenly out of left field catches me off guard with a quip. Shows up to his final showdown with batman wearing a tee shirt that says "I killed a District Attorney and all I got was this lousy tee-shirt"

- Jow

I think you're missing my point. Its not quips that I am looking for.

 

[Matt]

Well we do know some over the top things. If you do not want to be spoiled please do not read on:

Spoiler

The Joker implants a bomb in one of his own crazy dumb thugs stomach to help him escape.

He dresses up in a pink nurses dress/skirt when he goes to blow up the hospital

He dances around crazy like with Rachael at the party.

Those are just some but those scream over the top. Not...normal.

Hmm, I suppose not. And you're right...they aren't normal...but none of them really scream Joker to me (except maybe the nurses skirt)

 

[Solidus]

I hope so. I think Hamill's joker got it perfectly. The sick, dark, twisted humor (though it was a kid's show...so it was limited...but it was there, albeit usually off screen, but watch the unrated cut of Batman Beyond Return of the Joker to see it in its full glory) combined with the elaborate theatricallity of Nicholson or Romero's joker. It was a great middle ground. I fear Ledger will be too far to the the polar opposite of Nicholson and Romero. Neither extreme is good. The middle ground is the perfect Joker.

I mean, look at The Killing Joke (which I think 90 % of us can agree is the definitive Joker). When you really stop and think about what he did to Gordon, you can see how, in a sick way...it is funny. Well, not funny, but you can see the attempt at humor behind it. And that is what the Joker needs. To do something entirely sick...but the audience can still understand how in his demented mind, he finds it humorous.

Though I love Hamil's Joker have volume 1-3 of the TAS on DVD. I still always thought it was a tad more kid friendly. Though ROTJ was not too bad.

Yet one thing some of us hypers came to a while back. There is no "definitive Joker" There just is not. If we are to say that the only definitive Joker is Kane's original, who was more of a zodiac killer then a prankster. Since it was Kane who created him.

To me there will always be so many interpertations of the Joker and that is the beauty of it. Art is flexible, as long as some essence of the Joker remains.

But from those things I described they scream Joker to me, the disreguard to his own thugs, how smart he is, and decieving. As well as how cold hearted.

But to eaches own. I have always seen TKJ as one of the most important comics of the Joker. But I guess I see it differently. There are so many comics/interpertations of the Joker I just could never make my self say there is a definitive one. A favorite maybe, but I don't see there ever being a "real" Joker.

 

[Crook]

Yet one thing some of us hypers came to a while back. There is no "definitive Joker" There just is not.

Maybe not for every single being on the planet. But I'd say there is undoubtedly a "definitive" take for every character, for a large majority of the fans.

I know there's the whole argument about many different interpretations over the decades, but truth be told, only one or two of them ever really lasts, and is upheld by the fans for years to come. That's how you define what is "definitive".

If we are to say that the only definitive Joker is Kane's original, who was more of a zodiac killer then a prankster. Since it was Kane who created him.

Why would you consider that the definitive? That Joker barely lasted a few years. It's been overshadowed ever since with the prankster/comedic psycho clown interpretation. Nolan has been the only one to harken back to those days.

The 70s/80s Joker is who I'd say sets the bar for who and what Joker is. Same with Hamill's take, which takes a lot from those eras too. Notice how not many people mention any other presentations of the character.

 

[Matt]

I think u missed my other post on the last page about "oh yeah, rocket launchers and breaking into a party with 7 dwarves isn't over the top"

- Jow

No, I responded to it.

 

[Solidus]

Maybe not for every single being on the planet. But I'd say there is undoubtedly a "definitive" take for every character, for a large majority of the fans.

I know there's the whole argument about many different interpretations over the decades, but truth be told, only one or two of them ever really lasts, and is upheld by the fans for years to come. That's how you define what is "definitive".

Well yes there has been some that have stood up much more then any others, but that does not really make them definitive in my mind I guess. I mean when I do all my stuff for my minor in ancient history there are some theroies in the ancient world that have been carried on for a long time, for some hundreds of years, yet they are not the true version of what happend. Poor example but I'm sure you get what I'm trying to say. Popularity I don't know if that really means definitive. Just learning so much about history latley, and how many "popular" and common ways to look at certian events are wrong, and not the definitive explanation of an event, and even the sources at hand are questionable as well.

Hope that makes sense Crook lol I'm so tired and have a horrible cold. My head is aching.


Why would you consider that the definitive? That Joker barely lasted a few years. It's been overshadowed ever since with the prankster/comedic psycho clown interpretation. Nolan has been the only one to harken back to those days.

I guess some would claim definitive to be the original concept or document. Such as I'm sure if some one found the original scrolls to what some religous prophet said, it would be seen as more the real deal. Yet again lol sorry for my history comparasions.

I guess how I see it is those comics are older, and maybe in 30 more years people will not remember TKJ as well, who knows time will tell. But sometimes I don't think lasting through time makes anything more "true" or definitive is what I guess I'm saying. But I do have a horrible cold so maybe I'm talking jibberish. If so slap me.

The 70s/80s Joker is who I'd say sets the bar for who and what Joker is. Same with Hamill's take, which takes a lot from those eras too. Notice how not many people mention any other presentations of the character.

I just put my answers in bold lol. I dunno why I just did.

 

[Mr. Socko]

Well we do know some over the top things. If you do not want to be spoiled please do not read on:

Spoiler

The Joker implants a bomb in one of his own crazy dumb thugs stomach to help him escape.

He dresses up in a pink nurses dress/skirt when he goes to blow up the hospital

He dances around crazy like with Rachael at the party.

Those are just some but those scream over the top. Not...normal.

These should be some of my favorite scenes as I like the Joker best as over the top and pulling off ridiculous yet murderous acts. I was worried at first that this Joker would be too serious for the sake of 'realism' but the prologue re-assured me a bit with the prank gas bomb part, as well as the scenes above you listed. It shows we'll definitely be getting more than Zsasz with makeup.

Now I know this Joker won't be portrayed exactly as I want him to be, but I plan on enjoying this to the fullest as I know Heath will deliver a fantastic performance. But I didn't particularly like the fact that Joker only had a pile of knives(and lint) in his pocket. I'm going to miss his deadly toys.

As Anjow said, the gags may only be 'far and few between.' Which can be good or bad depending how you look at it.

 

[Mr. Socko]

Oh and the Batman characters have been around for nearly 7 decades. There's about nothing that will be universally considered "definitive." So for that matter, what is definitive can only be left up to the viewer or reader.

I.e., for me, Brian Bolland's take is visually the definitive Joker. For someone else it may be Neal Adam's Joker.

 

[TV's Frank]

Oh and the Batman characters have been around for nearly 7 decades. There's about nothing that will be universally considered "definitive." So for that matter, what is definitive can only be left up to the viewer or reader.

I.e., for me, Brian Bolland's take is visually the definitive Joker. For someone else it may be Neal Adam's Joker.

THANK YOU! Why can't everyone have this mentality?!

I am being totally serious Mr. Socko, and I applaud you.

 

[CARNAGE-COMETH]

There's another Batman movie being made?

Cool, so whens it coming out?

 

[Crook]

Well yes there has been some that have stood up much more then any others, but that does not really make them definitive in my mind I guess. I mean when I do all my stuff for my minor in ancient history there are some theroies in the ancient world that have been carried on for a long time, for some hundreds of years, yet they are not the true version of what happend. Poor example but I'm sure you get what I'm trying to say. Popularity I don't know if that really means definitive. Just learning so much about history latley, and how many "popular" and common ways to look at certian events are wrong, and not the definitive explanation of an event, and even the sources at hand are questionable as well.

Hope that makes sense Crook lol I'm so tired and have a horrible cold. My head is aching.

Well there's a big flaw in your example. I'm talking about highly acclaimed interpretations of stories and characters, you're talking about long-sustained beliefs on historical events. You can't compare the two, because your example involves only one correct answer because of it's actual existence.

I guess some would claim definitive to be the original concept or document. Such as I'm sure if some one found the original scrolls to what some religous prophet said, it would be seen as more the real deal. Yet again lol sorry for my history comparasions.

I guess how I see it is those comics are older, and maybe in 30 more years people will not remember TKJ as well, who knows time will tell. But sometimes I don't think lasting through time makes anything more "true" or definitive is what I guess I'm saying. But I do have a horrible cold so maybe I'm talking jibberish. If so slap me.

Stories do have many variations, but definitive is defined as a conclusion reached decisively within an authority or group. Us being the latter, and a great majority being the ones representing everyone as a whole. So in that case, I'd say whichever interpretation is put on the pedestal, can safely be considered the definitive take for them or a particular range of an era.

I say that because you do have a point about time. And you're right, who knows how long this "definitive" take will last. But we're talking in the present time. *For now, it's clear to me which interpretations are considered the epitomizations of these fictional characters.

*Pre-Nolan anyway. Lord knows how many have already regarded Heath's Joker as the "real" deal despite it's glaring alterations to the classic Joker people have been praising. But I digress, that's for another discussion.

 

[Nightwing1977]

no...no he looks no different in the pics than the movie, what theater screen were you watching

Uh....a big ass theater screen, of course. I pay like $7.00, not $1.50 for a ticket, mind you. My comments still stand.

 

[indianaraiders]

Will the Joker be dead on TDK or still appearing for the third movie?

 

[DieSmiling]

Will the Joker be dead on TDK or still appearing for the third movie?

Nobody knows, but since the writers have stated before that one of the bigger mistakes of the old movies was killing off the villains the general consensus is that he won't die.

 

[Anita18]

I frequent another forum that has nothing to do with movies or comic books, and in the off-topic area, someone asked about people's most anticipated summer movies, and the consensus was TDK and Indy got people most excited.

This summer should be good.

 

[Victarion]

I think u missed my other post on the last page about "oh yeah, rocket launchers and breaking into a party with 7 dwarves isn't over the top"

- Jow

So Joker really works with midgets in this part of the movie?

 

[That'ssuper!]

Two words from my cousin after a two minute blank stare at the screen...

"That's scary."

 

[thedarks0ldier]

I wonder how many people actually recognized that the Joker was Heath Ledger.

I wouldn't have recognized him had I not been keeping up with the movie.

 

[Monster]

What we see on screen is not Heath Ledger.

It's in fact The Joker playing Heath Ledger.

 

[Stotch]

What we see on screen is not Heath Ledger.

It's in fact The Joker playing Heath Ledger.

Damn, Joker's a terrible Heath impersonator, then

 

[Monster]

Muahahaha.

 

[Boom]

My fiancee got me the "Why So Serious" poster (the cool one with The Joker) for Christmas. Here's what the tag said:

To: XXXXXX
From: Somebody who doesn't want the wedding called off because she didn't get the geek his poster.

:heart: