Days of Future Past So, It's official now? Wiped out from existence?

[xii22_loop]

that comment "Did Tom Rothman die" makes me so happy.

 

[huzzah]

Honestly the Wolverine cameo is the simplest to get around. Yeah he was distinctive and it was a a "hey cool its Wolverine!" moment for fans, but to X and Erik he wouldn't have been that distinctive. They never really even MET him. They walked in the bar and before they could finish their sentence Wolvie cut them off. He didn't even turn all the way around. With all that the two of them were involved in during that period of time and in the future there's no reason to remember Wolvie. Hell that be like asking you to remember the guy who held the door open for you at Wal Mart.

This why I think they should remember him after all those years, because it was such a distinctive moment, if not just the face then the combination of cigar smoking and the rough attitude. Even I can remember people from years ago not just because of the face but the circumstances surrounding the meeting.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

This why I think they should remember him after all those years, because it was such a distinctive moment, if not just the face then the combination of cigar smoking and the rough attitude. Even I can remember people from years ago not just because of the face but the circumstances surrounding the meeting.

A guy in a bar with a rough attitude and a cigar isn't distinctive. It's kinda cliche actually.

Xavier and Magneto ended up with 4 recruits - Banshee, Havok, Angel, and Darwin. I'm sure Logan wasn't the only guy who rejected them.

 

[ALP]

Rebooting the series with this film would have been perfect but that's just not the case.


Anyone saying X3 and Wolvie doesn't exist is simply being silly. The fact is that they are there. Some of you are acting as if X3 is the equivalent of the Star Wars Christmas special which will never see the light of day to the general audience- thus it has the ability to be non-existent.

 

[GREEN =w= DAY]

hopefully after all the positive buzz surrounding First Class, Fox just lets Vaughn and Singer do their thing and not get in the way. and maybe then we will get an official X3 directed by Singer. and it doesn't even have to be called X3. just call it X-Men: Rise of the Phoenix or something

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Rebooting the series with this film would have been perfect but that's just not the case.


Anyone saying X3 and Wolvie doesn't exist is simply being silly. The fact is that they are there. Some of you are acting as if X3 is the equivalent of the Star Wars Christmas special which will never see the light of day to the general audience- thus it has the ability to be non-existent.

I feel that way too.

Don't get me wrong - X-Men: The Last Stand is extremely flawed, on both an adaptation, and and film making level. It is the most bittersweet film of the series to me. Some elements of it, are just incredible - best of the entire franchise. Taken in a direction it probably should have been taken in the first place. Other elements make me facepalm over how badly they got it wrong.

But more than any other movie in the franchise, X-Men: The Last Stand feels to me like a bunch of fanboys mad because they didn't get the movie they built up in their minds.

I've followed 2 X-Men movies on here; The Last Stand and X-Men Origins: Wolverine, and even occasionally popped in for X-Men: First Class. More than any of those films, The Last Stand was filled with wishlist after wishlist of what the fans wanted in the movie. And when those things that they built up in their head didn't come true, they absolutely ripped it.

Then you actually do stupid things like kill off Cyclops, cure Rogue, and turn Wolverine into the Cyclops-esque leader, and people are figuratively jumping off bridges.

In many ways, I rate X-Men: The Last Stand as the best of the bunch, but I'll be the first one to point out it's flaws. They are there. They can't be ignored or glossed over. And there were scenes cut from the movie that, if left in, or not replaced with alternate versions of those scenes, would have made the movie more powerful. But while it's flawed, it's certainly not the atrocity that it's made out to be. Wolverine was more flawed than The Last Stand, and even that wasn't *that* bad. You fix the element of the adamantium bullets (which those could even be explained if they kept the original mind wipe sequence that's on the DVD) and you've got a pretty solid movie on your hands. Butchering one character in Deadpool isn't enough to ruin an entire movie.

That said, I don't see this movie as a reboot to the franchise in any way. Just like the other 4 movies, it succeeds at many things, and lacks in others. Overall I think it's a good movie. I'd prefer a different director going forward, because Vaughn's style took me out of the movie quite a few times, and I didn't feel like I was watching an X-Men movie at times. But like I've said before, when he let it be an X-Men movie, and not his misguided attempt at a James Bond movie, it was incredible.

 

[ALP]

hopefully after all the positive buzz surrounding First Class, Fox just lets Vaughn and Singer do their thing and not get in the way. and maybe then we will get an official X3 directed by Singer. and it doesn't even have to be called X3. just call it X-Men: Rise of the Phoenix or something

So we're going to have Famke Janssen start off the film as the Phoenix with Stewart as X, Marsden as Cy, and so on, etc. Sorry but that's nothing but a fanboy wet dream that will NEVER work. The general audience have all seen X3. Making another film that takes it's place is ridiculous, stupid, and would confuse everyone on earth who doesn't follow these films on the internet. Or maybe we can just bypass that with a little intro by Bryan Singer.

"Sorry I left the X-Men after 2003 to make Superman Returns. I know Rattner made a really bad film so how about we all just act as if it doesn't exist? So without further ado, here is the real X3 as I envisioned it. And remember, that other one doesn't exist and in the future we plan to do like George Lucas and wipe it from existence as he did the Christmas special and the original editions."

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

So we're going to have Famke Janssen start off the film as the Phoenix with Stewart as X, Marsden as Cy, and so on, etc. Sorry but that's nothing but a fanboy wet dream that will NEVER work. The general audience have all seen X3. Making another film that takes it's place is ridiculous, stupid, and would confuse everyone on earth who doesn't follow these films on the internet. Or maybe we can just bypass that with a little intro by Bryan Singer.

"Sorry I left the X-Men after 2003 to make Superman Returns. I know Rattner made a really bad film so how about we all just act as if it doesn't exist. So without further ado, he is the real X3 as I envisioned it. And remember, that other one doesn't exist and in the future we plan to do like George Lucas and wipe it from existence as he did the Christmas special and the original editions."

Thank you for thinking realisically.

"rebooting" these movies and acting like they didn't happen is the biggest way to make a joke out of this franchise. The best way to go about it is to just make the best out of the situation with any future movies. First Class did a pretty good job of that.

*BATMAN BEGINS & THE DARK KNIGHT ARE THE EXCEPTION, NOT THE RULE*

It helps that Batman is one of the most recognizable characters in American pop culture. Making a new series isn't going to be seen as a problem.

People were confused by The Incredible Hulk. People I've talked to are confused about The Amazing Spiderman. Punisher and Punisher: War Zone were just irrelevant.

Reboots are such a bad trend in Hollywood currently, I can't wait until this fad passes. I can only hope that the X-Men series remains untouched by this Hollywood blight.

 

[DACrowe]

Yeah the X-Films just end on a cliffhanger in X2.

I guess we'll never know how that ends.

 

[SuperSoldier985]

Thank God, this is what we need.

Another thread talking about continuity.

 

[DoomGuy91]

All i want to know is WHY?????

Did Charles really have to get crippled at the end of the film and his relationship destroyed with Erik? Did the film need that? Couldn't the film have worked in continuity with the other ones?


Prequels SHOULD NEVER contradict the originals. The point of the prequels is to fill in history related to the originals. You destroy the concept of a prequel when it contradicts the films its a prequel of.

And i hate this ideology that just because Origins and X3 were not as good as X1 and X2, they should be thrown in front of a bus. The PT is not on par with the Star Wars OT. But just because that is true, does not mean that star wars should throw PT canon out the window if future prequels/sequels are made. For if you contradict the PT, you also affect the OT. And what if George pulled a "first class" and caused ROTS to contradict the OT....that would be lame. Imagine if George caused the suit to not be put on Anakin at the end of ROTS....therefore contradicting the OT. A lot can be said about George (i.e Jar Jar), but AT LEAST he respects the continuity of the OT when he made new Star Wars films.

This continuity issue also affects how i view the original X-men trilogy. When i rewatch X1, which backstory should i have in mind when i see Charles? To me, the flashbacks set in the 80's in X3 really affected how Erik and Charles relationship was viewed, in retrospect for X1 and X2. There were scenes throughout the trilogy which hinted that a small part of their friendship still existed. Which made sense because it did not seem a long time ago that their friendship "ended" (X1 takes place i think around 99 or 01, and their friendship could have ended in the later 80's or 90's). But having their friendship end in the 60's destroyed what has seem to be a given in the trilogy.

Also by First class contradicting the trilogy, it contradicts how jean grey entered the X-men which i have a HUGE problem with.

It's sad really....even Origins respected X3 canon...while First Class didn't. I also dislike the false marketing. The trailer said the film was even a prequel, and even showed scenes from X3....then they contradict it.

 

[cheungcheung]

X4 will be like scream 4. Scream 3 sucked and wasn't written by Kevin Williamson who was responsible for 1 and 2. Fans hated 3 and Kevin returned for scream 4 which was treated like a sequel to his own movies. 3 is still canon but not referred to at all in the 4th movie.

 

[Longshot777]

Well, Prof. X and Magneto could become friends on and off throughout 70s and 80s. like any friendships.

At the end of First Class, Magneto and Charles just parted ways but there were no animosity between them, just different factions and ideals.


When Charles discovered a powerful mutant he has ever detected then he called his old friend Magneto so both of them can see Jean Grey.


So X3 could still fit in.

 

[FingersMcGhee]

Sheesh, the continuity errors are so minor, yet the fanboys have to dwell on them like no other. The Star Wars prequels were covered in more continuity errors, as well as much bigger ones, but those fanboys can look past them, why can't some of you? A couple of lines here and there. You know why Singer and Vaughn didn't follow every little stitch of continuity? It was because they were trying to make a great film, in a very tight schedule. 95% of the viewing audience won't catch these errors, and that is why the creative group let them slide. So either get over it, or go back to reading comics that you know (sarcasm) have NO continuity errors and never recon themselves.

 

[FingersMcGhee]

Then you come to X1, X2 and neither Xavier or Magneto remember that distinctive cigar chomping mutant that told them to f*** off 30 years ago. Not even a hint that they personally met him before. What is this a mind wipe fest?

Then there's Mystique and her origins in First Class. Come X1, X2 and its all forgotten. Xavier says he first met Eric when they were 17 come First Class and its a completely different origin. That's why I cant see First Class in the same filmverse as X1,X2,X3 or XWO despite what Singer and Vaughn have said.

Um, lets take a look here. This takes place in 1962, and the first X-Men takes place in 2000ish. That's almost 40 years. Do you think that Xavier and Magneto remember every mutant they run accross? Let alone one they met for 5 seconds? Come on... Also, Wolverines "powers" really are not that special. He has regenerative abilities (no bone claws either, that's dumb), so did Shaw.

Charles and Mystique never cross paths in X-Men or X2. She poisons his mind in the first film, but who's to say that over 40 years, she still thought foundly of him? There's alot of time to cover still, and it's very possible that her love for him can change into dislike and even hatred over time.

Do we really need everything SPELLED OUT IN CAPS nowadays. I love it when not everything is told to us, and we have to use our brains to fill in the gaps. If this movie was not intended to be a prequel, then why make the beginning the EXACT same opening, down to the lighting, camera angles, and film grain.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Well, Prof. X and Magneto could become friends on and off throughout 70s and 80s. like any friendships.

At the end of First Class, Magneto and Charles just parted ways but there were no animosity between them, just different factions and ideals.


When Charles discovered a powerful mutant he has ever detected then he called his old friend Magneto so both of them can see Jean Grey.


So X3 could still fit in.

I like your idea for how Magneto and Xavier come back together for Jean.

I also 100% agree with you about how First Class ends. There is absolutely no "We will be lifelong enemies" coming from the end of First Class. It was absolutely 2 friends with 2 different paths going their separate ways. I completely felt that they would come together again at some point, and still work together. I can totally see the Magneto of First Class coming around to help Xavier get his school off the ground, re-build Cerebro, and once they discover Jean Grey, the 2 of them coming together to recruit her.

I mean, Xavier and Magneto have already come together as allies over the course of this series, so why is it so far fetched that they'd have done it before then?

All i want to know is WHY?????

Did Charles really have to get crippled at the end of the film and his relationship destroyed with Erik? Did the film need that? Couldn't the film have worked in continuity with the other ones?


Prequels SHOULD NEVER contradict the originals. The point of the prequels is to fill in history related to the originals. You destroy the concept of a prequel when it contradicts the films its a prequel of.

And i hate this ideology that just because Origins and X3 were not as good as X1 and X2, they should be thrown in front of a bus. The PT is not on par with the Star Wars OT. But just because that is true, does not mean that star wars should throw PT canon out the window if future prequels/sequels are made. For if you contradict the PT, you also affect the OT. And what if George pulled a "first class" and caused ROTS to contradict the OT....that would be lame. Imagine if George caused the suit to not be put on Anakin at the end of ROTS....therefore contradicting the OT. A lot can be said about George (i.e Jar Jar), but AT LEAST he respects the continuity of the OT when he made new Star Wars films.

This continuity issue also affects how i view the original X-men trilogy. When i rewatch X1, which backstory should i have in mind when i see Charles? To me, the flashbacks set in the 80's in X3 really affected how Erik and Charles relationship was viewed, in retrospect for X1 and X2. There were scenes throughout the trilogy which hinted that a small part of their friendship still existed. Which made sense because it did not seem a long time ago that their friendship "ended" (X1 takes place i think around 99 or 01, and their friendship could have ended in the later 80's or 90's). But having their friendship end in the 60's destroyed what has seem to be a given in the trilogy.

Also by First class contradicting the trilogy, it contradicts how jean grey entered the X-men which i have a HUGE problem with.

It's sad really....even Origins respected X3 canon...while First Class didn't. I also dislike the false marketing. The trailer said the film was even a prequel, and even showed scenes from X3....then they contradict it.

I agree 100% with the part that I bolded. No, 200%.

However, I don't believe that First Class contradicted quite as badly as you feel it did.

Sheesh, the continuity errors are so minor, yet the fanboys have to dwell on them like no other. The Star Wars prequels were covered in more continuity errors, as well as much bigger ones, but those fanboys can look past them, why can't some of you? A couple of lines here and there. You know why Singer and Vaughn didn't follow every little stitch of continuity? It was because they were trying to make a great film, in a very tight schedule. 95% of the viewing audience won't catch these errors, and that is why the creative group let them slide. So either get over it, or go back to reading comics that you know (sarcasm) have NO continuity errors and never recon themselves.

I agree. These movies have never had a strict timeline. Details have been changed in favor of the big picture from the get go. First Class changed some details of the narrative (but not the actual big picture plot points) because it allowed them to tell the better movie. That doesn't bother me.

If they actually changed huge big picture plot points from the original films, I would have been P.O'd, but they didn't. Just the details.

Um, lets take a look here. This takes place in 1962, and the first X-Men takes place in 2000ish. That's almost 40 years. Do you think that Xavier and Magneto remember every mutant they run accross? Let alone one they met for 5 seconds? Come on... Also, Wolverines "powers" really are not that special. He has regenerative abilities (no bone claws either, that's dumb), so did Shaw.

Charles and Mystique never cross paths in X-Men or X2. She poisons his mind in the first film, but who's to say that over 40 years, she still thought foundly of him? There's alot of time to cover still, and it's very possible that her love for him can change into dislike and even hatred over time.

Do we really need everything SPELLED OUT IN CAPS nowadays. I love it when not everything is told to us, and we have to use our brains to fill in the gaps. If this movie was not intended to be a prequel, then why make the beginning the EXACT same opening, down to the lighting, camera angles, and film grain.

I totally agree with you on Wolverine. 40 years later, a guy who had an abrasive attitude in a bar isn't exactly going to stand out.

Also, your point about Mystique is very, VERY true. I can personally vouch for having a fallout with loved ones and family members over ideology. I have had falling outs and nearly lost relationships over things like politics and religion. It makes perfect sense that, over the course of 40 years or so, Mystique would truly come into her own, and have a strong mind towards what she believes in, and not let Charles stand in the way of her ideals any longer.

 

[DigificWriter]

I've said this elsewhere, but Matthew Vaughn recently made some comments that, for me, indicate that he approached the film as a reboot along the same lines as what J.J. Abrams and Co. did with their new Star Trek film; however, there is still enough 'wiggle room' for FC to serve as a prequel to at least the first two X-Men films (it can't fit in with O:W and TLS because it deliberately contradicts major elements of them).

Regarding the timeline of the first X-Men film, we actually don't know WHEN it takes place, so the amount of time that passes between the events of FC and its events is really dependent on just when you choose to see the first film as being set; regardless, however, there's a very significant period of time between the events of FC and the events of the first film (at least 38 years, if not more), which actually helps strengthen FC's ability to serve as a prequel to both the first film and X2. The only thing that doesn't completely jive with regards to FC and the first film is the age at which Erik and Charles first meet each other, but it seems clear that Singer deliberately chose to retcon that particular detail in order to accomodate the story that he wanted to tell with FC.

 

[Alexei Belyakov]

I've said this elsewhere, but Matthew Vaughn recently made some comments that, for me, indicate that he approached the film as a reboot along the same lines as what J.J. Abrams and Co. did with their new Star Trek film; however, there is still enough 'wiggle room' for FC to serve as a prequel to at least the first two X-Men films (it can't fit in with O:W and TLS because it deliberately contradicts major elements of them).

Regarding the timeline of the first X-Men film, we actually don't know WHEN it takes place, so the amount of time that passes between the events of FC and its events is really dependent on just when you choose to see the first film as being set; regardless, however, there's a very significant period of time between the events of FC and the events of the first film (at least 38 years, if not more), which actually helps strengthen FC's ability to serve as a prequel to both the first film and X2. The only thing that doesn't completely jive with regards to FC and the first film is the age at which Erik and Charles first meet each other, but it seems clear that Singer deliberately chose to retcon that particular detail in order to accomodate the story that he wanted to tell with FC.

Its a prequel to X3. Hank's entire story arc pretty much mirrors his still identical future stance on the effects of a pronounced/visible mutation.

The film only contradicts one scene in X3 which is the opening and we can assume a million different things as to why it does so (Xavier found a way to walk again, It was really Mystique, astral projection, etc.)

 

[Raiden]

I think when Singer made Superman Returns, he has shown that it is possible to make a prequel/sequel of previous movies that is selective of what things to keep and what to ignore. Since Singer is now the producer of XMFC and he didn't get involved with either X3 or Wolverine, he & Vaughn probably just pick the story that they'd reference and ignore the others. Personally, I think it would've been if they have a clean slate and start the continuity from scratch, but obviously they did keep enough to be accepted as a prequel and not a complete reboot.

 

[chaseter]

This movie is a prequel to the trilogy, get over it haters.

Not really...Vaughn said he was going to do his own thing and connect what he could but not let continuity issues tie him down. So it's either a psuedo reboot at this point or a direct prequel to X1 and X2.

Which ever it is, X3 and Wolverine are out of the equation.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I think when Singer made Superman Returns, he has shown that it is possible to make a prequel/sequel of previous movies that is selective of what things to keep and what to ignore. Since Singer is now the producer of XMFC and he didn't get involved with either X3 or Wolverine, he & Vaughn probably just pick the story that they'd reference and ignore the others. Personally, I think it would've been if they have a clean slate and start the continuity from scratch, but obviously they did keep enough to be accepted as a prequel and not a complete reboot.

It is possible to make one, but that doesn't mean the audience will buy it. Otherwise, we'd be getting a Superman Returns sequel. Also, Superman Returns was also great evidence of what NOT to do when reviving a series. Hence Superman getting a total reboot.

 

[chaseter]

Anyone saying X3 and Wolvie doesn't exist is simply being silly. The fact is that they are there. Some of you are acting as if X3 is the equivalent of the Star Wars Christmas special which will never see the light of day to the general audience- thus it has the ability to be non-existent.

Fantastic Four 1 and 2 are about to not exist and thankfully so. Batman Forever and Batman & Robin don't exist anymore and thankfully so. Superman III and Superman IV doesn't exist. Good riddance to all of those.

I see nothing wrong with tossing out crappy films. I usually give a studio/director/writers a second chance with a franchise before I call it quits. Fox had two shots with Fantastic Four and they failed. Fox had 2 shots with the X-Men and they failed. Luckily it seems that Fox is back on the right track so kudos to them.

 

[Timstuff]

Sheesh, the continuity errors are so minor, yet the fanboys have to dwell on them like no other. The Star Wars prequels were covered in more continuity errors, as well as much bigger ones, but those fanboys can look past them, why can't some of you? A couple of lines here and there. You know why Singer and Vaughn didn't follow every little stitch of continuity? It was because they were trying to make a great film, in a very tight schedule. 95% of the viewing audience won't catch these errors, and that is why the creative group let them slide. So either get over it, or go back to reading comics that you know (sarcasm) have NO continuity errors and never recon themselves.

The problem here is that unlike Star Wars where some fanboyss hate the prequels but all of them love the original, thus they want to ignore the prequels, with X-men we have some fanboys who hate the originals and want the prequel to wipe the original out of existence. They are desperate for a reboot and they want to fool themselves into thinking that they're getting one, no matter how futile this train of thought is.

 

[DoomGuy91]

Sheesh, the continuity errors are so minor, yet the fanboys have to dwell on them like no other. The Star Wars prequels were covered in more continuity errors, as well as much bigger ones, but those fanboys can look past them, why can't some of you? A couple of lines here and there. You know why Singer and Vaughn didn't follow every little stitch of continuity? It was because they were trying to make a great film, in a very tight schedule. 95% of the viewing audience won't catch these errors, and that is why the creative group let them slide. So either get over it, or go back to reading comics that you know (sarcasm) have NO continuity errors and never recon themselves.

Star Wars prequels had continuity errors with the originals? Plzzzzzzzzz, name me a few? I know a lot more about Star Wars then you do. And i can tell you there ARE NO continuity errors between the trilogies. If you would like, i can refute of these "supposed" errors on some PM.

 

[Timstuff]

Star Wars prequels had continuity errors with the originals? Plzzzzzzzzz, name me a few? I know a lot more about Star Wars then you do. And i can tell you there ARE NO continuity errors between the trilogies. If you would like, i can refute of these "supposed" errors on some PM.

It doesn't really matter whether there are or not, because even if there are no continuity errors that can't be explained away, the people who hate the prequels will invent new ones just like the people who hate the X-men trilogy (or at least X3) will invent reasons why First Class is actually a reboot and not a prequel (despite Vaughn and Singer saying that it is a prequel numerous times).