arachnid-guy
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I love a bit of Noir, me.
Comics Spider-Man Noir
- Thread starter SpideyZERO
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Galactus
Devourer of Worlds
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BY JENNIFER M. CONTINO
How different would the concept of Spider-Man be if it was envisioned during the Depression and set in the '30s? That's one of the things we'll get a chance to see as David Hine, Fabrice Sapolsky and Carmine Di Giandomenico explore the norms of the era through the eyes of Peter Parker in Spider-Man: Noir. This Spider-Man has powers, but it isn't due to a radioactive spider-bite. Hine told THE PULSE, "[He] acquires them in a very Pulp way that has more to do with the supernatural than with science. The story would have been very different if he didn’t have the powers. We could have done it as a straight crime story, but it works better with that weird, nightmarish element to it."
THE PULSE: A lot of people, who have just heard the term "noir" but don't really know much about it, might be wondering just what this Noir line is about? What is it that sets a Noir story apart from a regular Marvel U tale?
DAVID HINE: “Noir” is a term that I associate with film noir of the nineteen- forties and fifties. Although most of the movies were black-and-white, the term is now applied to any movie that uses the hard-boiled style of writing, moral ambiguity of the characters; a bleakness and loss of innocence that was born out of the Great Depression. We have all that in Spider-Man Noir and we’re setting it right in the depths of the Depression. With the current economic climate it may be even more appropriate than we thought when we started on this project.
Although the book is in full colour, Carmine di Giandomenica has created an art style that oozes noir atmosphere. It’s all to do with camera-angles and lighting. And with characters - square-jawed, streetwise guys and sexy streetwise dames.
It’s all a bit harsher and more brutal than the regular Marvel books. These Noir books have their roots in the pulp magazines, more than in comics.
THE PULSE: It sounds very intriguing .... How did you become one of the writers involved in this reimagining of some classic Marvel Icons?
HINE: Fabrice Sapolsky came to me with an idea for a Spider-Man story set in the nineteen-thirties. This was at the end of 2006 and we put together a pitch for Marvel early in 2007. Co-incidentally there were a couple of other Pulp/Noir ideas floating around the Marvel offices at the time and Joe Quesada gave us the green light to develop the series. We had no idea that the X-Men were also being developed at the same time. The Noir books are essentially a group of similarly themed stories, rather than an integrated event. There’s no cross-over as such and I think that’s very healthy. Each of the teams has its own creative voice.
THE PULSE: What were the challenges of taking the story of Peter Parker and integrating it into the '30s with other elements that were predominant at the time?
HINE: It works perfectly. I saw that the background of the Depression would work very well with the way I saw Aunt May and Uncle Ben. They have always been depicted as a couple with incredibly high moral standards, and I immediately saw them as socialist activists, working with the unemployed and homeless. They run a welfare center that helps to feed and house the poor, but they also use it as a center to politically educate and motivate the victims of the Depression. Aunt May literally stands up on a soapbox and preaches revolution to the people who lost their jobs because of the greed of the bankers and businessmen. Like I said, with each passing month, the story is looking increasingly relevant to current events.
Peter gets a job assisting photojournalist Ben Urich, as he goes around New York looking for the human interest stories behind the headlines and he soon comes up against the Goblin, a mobster who is hand-in-glove with the corrupt cops and businessmen of New York. The mob activities include prostitution, bootleg whisky and gambling, but they are also involved in strike breaking. Peter’s first encounter with the Goblin’s men is when they try to silence Aunt May, as she lectures the occupants of New York’s shanty town on the rights of the workers.
THE PULSE: Does Peter Parker have powers here? Because the X Men Noir series doesn't have any super powers. If Peter still has his Spider powers, what does that add to the mix? If he doesn't, what skills aid him in avenging the death of his beloved uncle?
HINE: He does actually have powers although, as you’ll see when you read the first issue, he acquires them in a very Pulp way that has more to do with the supernatural than with science. The story would have been very different if he didn’t have the powers. We could have done it as a straight crime story, but it works better with that weird, nightmarish element to it. I always get the feeling, looking at those pulp magazines of the thirties that they were always one step away from inventing the superhero.
Our Spider-Man is a kind of prototype superhero. Even his costume is a home-made thing he rigs up out of his Uncle Ben’s world war one pilot’s gear. And he also carries a gun, which is one of the more controversial elements, because his Uncle Ben and Aunt May are opposed to guns and vigilantism. He’s pushed towards becoming as brutal as the thugs he’s up against, and that creates the dynamic tension of the story.
THE PULSE: How is this Peter Parker different from the "nerd" version first introduced in the '60s?
HINE: Our Peter Parker is more streetwise. He’s thrown into a very tough world, much harsher than the [Stan] Lee/[Steve] Ditko version, who mostly had to contend with bullying and getting his science homework done. And he only had to worry about Aunt May having a heart attack. Our Aunt May faces a far worse fate than that. The Marvel U Parker photographs Spider-Man punching bad guys, our Parker is photographing kids burned to death in arson attacks, homeless people freezing to death on the streets, unemployed men becoming so desperate they’re committing suicide. He has a slightly nerdish element to him but he gets toughened up fast.
THE PULSE: Sounds like you'd almost have to in that situation. How are the two characters similar?
HINE: He still has to keep his secret identity secret from Aunty May. The death of his Uncle Ben still hangs over him. And he still has problems with J. Jonah Jameson, although in our version Jameson is a liberal who uses The Daily Bugle to expose corruption. The key to the character is still the struggle to live up to the standards of integrity set by his Aunt and Uncle. The maxim that with great power comes great responsibility, still holds true.
THE PULSE: What was it like getting to take Peter Parker from his familiar surroundings, and envision him in the grim and gritty '30s when corruption seemed to be the flavor of the day?
HINE: I feel like we’re putting the Spider-Man in the context he belongs. I always liked Spider-Man best when he was in the shadows. The greater the corruption around him, the greater the chance for a hero to shine through. The question is whether Peter Parker has what it takes to be that hero.
THE PULSE: How did you research the era you wanted to set this story? I mean, how authentic did you want this to be to that Depressed era?
HINE: We set out to make the background as authentic as possible. I wanted the feel of the city that Weegee photographed, so I was surrounded by those pictures while I was writing. I did quite a bit of research into the political and social background. There are cameos from characters like New York Mayor Jimmy Stryder, who is our take on real world mayor Jimmy Walker. All the gang slang is authentic. Essentially our New York is only a small side-step from the way it really was in 1933.
THE PULSE: I know there's a mob boss called "Goblin" but what other Spider-Man staples are involved in this story?
HINE: Ben Urich is modeled on a famous photojournalist called Weegee, who operated from the thirties through to the sixties. He specialized in crime and the sleazier side of New York Life. The speakeasys, the Bowery, the ****es, bums and gangsters who lived in the shadows. Urich is very much like the Urich we know, but maybe a little more disillusioned and he has a more serious monkey on his back than the tobacco addiction we’re familiar with.
Felicia Hardy is a tart with a heart, who runs a club called the Black Cat, where the nighthawks hang out drinking bootleg whisky. The club is frequented by bent cops, politicians and mobsters, including the Goblin and his crew of degenerates, recruited from the carnivals and traveling circuses. Guys like the Enforcers, Kraven and Adrian Toomes who in his previous life was a sideshow geek, known as the Vulture.
THE PULSE: How is working on this four parter different from some of your other darker projects?
HINE: We’re completely free from any kind of established continuity and we don’t need to worry about what’s happening in other books. That’s very liberating for us and for readers, who won’t have to worry about picking up other books to figure out what’s going on. It’s also more of a crime story than a superhero book, so I feel more at home. You know I have an allergy to spandex (laughs). It does share some of the darker themes that filter through to most of my writing though. I just can’t help being a miserable bastard. That’s something I seem to share with most British writers. I put it down to the climate.
THE PULSE: What's it like collaborating with Fabrice Sapolsky on a project like this? Why didn't you handle the writing of story solo?
HINE: Well this started out as Fabrice’s project, so it was always going to be a collaboration. It was very cool having someone to bounce idea off. It’s the first time I’ve shared writing and the relationship is very different to the one of writer/editor. Some of the time we’re encouraging one another, throwing ideas back and forth and getting more and more excited about the whole thing. Other times we just shout at each other. I guess it’s a bit like marriage.
THE PULSE: What was it like having Carmine Di Giandomenico bringing this story to life? How well does his style epitomize the effect you're going for here?
HINE: He’s perfect. I knew he’d do a great job of the period detail because I’d seen his Battlin’ Jack Murdock series. He does bleak moody stories very well. And he did a great job bringing the characters to life, particularly with the Vulture. This version is totally degenerate. It was just how we saw him, but cranked up to eleven.
THE PULSE: What other projects are you working on?
HINE: Very busy right now. I have the four-part arc on The Brave and the Bold with Dougie Braithwaite, starting in November although, like the Spidey Noir series, that’s a book that was written a while back. I’m currently writing a mini series of The Darkness, and I should also be doing a book for Top Cow’s Pilot Season next year. My biggest project right now is the FVZA vampire/zombie book for Radical Comics. I’ve just turned in the script for the first issue, which will run to 44 pages plus extras for a bargain price of $3.99. I’m very pleased with this one. Radical are a very cool bunch of people to work with. A company that is going to hit very big next year.
I also have a couple of one-shots for DC that I don’t think I can mention yet, so I won’t…
How different would the concept of Spider-Man be if it was envisioned during the Depression and set in the '30s? That's one of the things we'll get a chance to see as David Hine, Fabrice Sapolsky and Carmine Di Giandomenico explore the norms of the era through the eyes of Peter Parker in Spider-Man: Noir. This Spider-Man has powers, but it isn't due to a radioactive spider-bite. Hine told THE PULSE, "[He] acquires them in a very Pulp way that has more to do with the supernatural than with science. The story would have been very different if he didn’t have the powers. We could have done it as a straight crime story, but it works better with that weird, nightmarish element to it."
THE PULSE: A lot of people, who have just heard the term "noir" but don't really know much about it, might be wondering just what this Noir line is about? What is it that sets a Noir story apart from a regular Marvel U tale?
DAVID HINE: “Noir” is a term that I associate with film noir of the nineteen- forties and fifties. Although most of the movies were black-and-white, the term is now applied to any movie that uses the hard-boiled style of writing, moral ambiguity of the characters; a bleakness and loss of innocence that was born out of the Great Depression. We have all that in Spider-Man Noir and we’re setting it right in the depths of the Depression. With the current economic climate it may be even more appropriate than we thought when we started on this project.
Although the book is in full colour, Carmine di Giandomenica has created an art style that oozes noir atmosphere. It’s all to do with camera-angles and lighting. And with characters - square-jawed, streetwise guys and sexy streetwise dames.
It’s all a bit harsher and more brutal than the regular Marvel books. These Noir books have their roots in the pulp magazines, more than in comics.
THE PULSE: It sounds very intriguing .... How did you become one of the writers involved in this reimagining of some classic Marvel Icons?
HINE: Fabrice Sapolsky came to me with an idea for a Spider-Man story set in the nineteen-thirties. This was at the end of 2006 and we put together a pitch for Marvel early in 2007. Co-incidentally there were a couple of other Pulp/Noir ideas floating around the Marvel offices at the time and Joe Quesada gave us the green light to develop the series. We had no idea that the X-Men were also being developed at the same time. The Noir books are essentially a group of similarly themed stories, rather than an integrated event. There’s no cross-over as such and I think that’s very healthy. Each of the teams has its own creative voice.
THE PULSE: What were the challenges of taking the story of Peter Parker and integrating it into the '30s with other elements that were predominant at the time?
HINE: It works perfectly. I saw that the background of the Depression would work very well with the way I saw Aunt May and Uncle Ben. They have always been depicted as a couple with incredibly high moral standards, and I immediately saw them as socialist activists, working with the unemployed and homeless. They run a welfare center that helps to feed and house the poor, but they also use it as a center to politically educate and motivate the victims of the Depression. Aunt May literally stands up on a soapbox and preaches revolution to the people who lost their jobs because of the greed of the bankers and businessmen. Like I said, with each passing month, the story is looking increasingly relevant to current events.
Peter gets a job assisting photojournalist Ben Urich, as he goes around New York looking for the human interest stories behind the headlines and he soon comes up against the Goblin, a mobster who is hand-in-glove with the corrupt cops and businessmen of New York. The mob activities include prostitution, bootleg whisky and gambling, but they are also involved in strike breaking. Peter’s first encounter with the Goblin’s men is when they try to silence Aunt May, as she lectures the occupants of New York’s shanty town on the rights of the workers.
THE PULSE: Does Peter Parker have powers here? Because the X Men Noir series doesn't have any super powers. If Peter still has his Spider powers, what does that add to the mix? If he doesn't, what skills aid him in avenging the death of his beloved uncle?
HINE: He does actually have powers although, as you’ll see when you read the first issue, he acquires them in a very Pulp way that has more to do with the supernatural than with science. The story would have been very different if he didn’t have the powers. We could have done it as a straight crime story, but it works better with that weird, nightmarish element to it. I always get the feeling, looking at those pulp magazines of the thirties that they were always one step away from inventing the superhero.
Our Spider-Man is a kind of prototype superhero. Even his costume is a home-made thing he rigs up out of his Uncle Ben’s world war one pilot’s gear. And he also carries a gun, which is one of the more controversial elements, because his Uncle Ben and Aunt May are opposed to guns and vigilantism. He’s pushed towards becoming as brutal as the thugs he’s up against, and that creates the dynamic tension of the story.
THE PULSE: How is this Peter Parker different from the "nerd" version first introduced in the '60s?
HINE: Our Peter Parker is more streetwise. He’s thrown into a very tough world, much harsher than the [Stan] Lee/[Steve] Ditko version, who mostly had to contend with bullying and getting his science homework done. And he only had to worry about Aunt May having a heart attack. Our Aunt May faces a far worse fate than that. The Marvel U Parker photographs Spider-Man punching bad guys, our Parker is photographing kids burned to death in arson attacks, homeless people freezing to death on the streets, unemployed men becoming so desperate they’re committing suicide. He has a slightly nerdish element to him but he gets toughened up fast.
THE PULSE: Sounds like you'd almost have to in that situation. How are the two characters similar?
HINE: He still has to keep his secret identity secret from Aunty May. The death of his Uncle Ben still hangs over him. And he still has problems with J. Jonah Jameson, although in our version Jameson is a liberal who uses The Daily Bugle to expose corruption. The key to the character is still the struggle to live up to the standards of integrity set by his Aunt and Uncle. The maxim that with great power comes great responsibility, still holds true.
THE PULSE: What was it like getting to take Peter Parker from his familiar surroundings, and envision him in the grim and gritty '30s when corruption seemed to be the flavor of the day?
HINE: I feel like we’re putting the Spider-Man in the context he belongs. I always liked Spider-Man best when he was in the shadows. The greater the corruption around him, the greater the chance for a hero to shine through. The question is whether Peter Parker has what it takes to be that hero.
THE PULSE: How did you research the era you wanted to set this story? I mean, how authentic did you want this to be to that Depressed era?
HINE: We set out to make the background as authentic as possible. I wanted the feel of the city that Weegee photographed, so I was surrounded by those pictures while I was writing. I did quite a bit of research into the political and social background. There are cameos from characters like New York Mayor Jimmy Stryder, who is our take on real world mayor Jimmy Walker. All the gang slang is authentic. Essentially our New York is only a small side-step from the way it really was in 1933.
THE PULSE: I know there's a mob boss called "Goblin" but what other Spider-Man staples are involved in this story?
HINE: Ben Urich is modeled on a famous photojournalist called Weegee, who operated from the thirties through to the sixties. He specialized in crime and the sleazier side of New York Life. The speakeasys, the Bowery, the ****es, bums and gangsters who lived in the shadows. Urich is very much like the Urich we know, but maybe a little more disillusioned and he has a more serious monkey on his back than the tobacco addiction we’re familiar with.
Felicia Hardy is a tart with a heart, who runs a club called the Black Cat, where the nighthawks hang out drinking bootleg whisky. The club is frequented by bent cops, politicians and mobsters, including the Goblin and his crew of degenerates, recruited from the carnivals and traveling circuses. Guys like the Enforcers, Kraven and Adrian Toomes who in his previous life was a sideshow geek, known as the Vulture.
THE PULSE: How is working on this four parter different from some of your other darker projects?
HINE: We’re completely free from any kind of established continuity and we don’t need to worry about what’s happening in other books. That’s very liberating for us and for readers, who won’t have to worry about picking up other books to figure out what’s going on. It’s also more of a crime story than a superhero book, so I feel more at home. You know I have an allergy to spandex (laughs). It does share some of the darker themes that filter through to most of my writing though. I just can’t help being a miserable bastard. That’s something I seem to share with most British writers. I put it down to the climate.
THE PULSE: What's it like collaborating with Fabrice Sapolsky on a project like this? Why didn't you handle the writing of story solo?
HINE: Well this started out as Fabrice’s project, so it was always going to be a collaboration. It was very cool having someone to bounce idea off. It’s the first time I’ve shared writing and the relationship is very different to the one of writer/editor. Some of the time we’re encouraging one another, throwing ideas back and forth and getting more and more excited about the whole thing. Other times we just shout at each other. I guess it’s a bit like marriage.
THE PULSE: What was it like having Carmine Di Giandomenico bringing this story to life? How well does his style epitomize the effect you're going for here?
HINE: He’s perfect. I knew he’d do a great job of the period detail because I’d seen his Battlin’ Jack Murdock series. He does bleak moody stories very well. And he did a great job bringing the characters to life, particularly with the Vulture. This version is totally degenerate. It was just how we saw him, but cranked up to eleven.
THE PULSE: What other projects are you working on?
HINE: Very busy right now. I have the four-part arc on The Brave and the Bold with Dougie Braithwaite, starting in November although, like the Spidey Noir series, that’s a book that was written a while back. I’m currently writing a mini series of The Darkness, and I should also be doing a book for Top Cow’s Pilot Season next year. My biggest project right now is the FVZA vampire/zombie book for Radical Comics. I’ve just turned in the script for the first issue, which will run to 44 pages plus extras for a bargain price of $3.99. I’m very pleased with this one. Radical are a very cool bunch of people to work with. A company that is going to hit very big next year.
I also have a couple of one-shots for DC that I don’t think I can mention yet, so I won’t…
SpideyZERO
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Nice interview. I'm really looking forward for this
Ion Kenshin
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so we now have x-men noir and spidey noir...very cool
moraldeficiency
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did I hear right with the four issue point? I was hoping for eight on this.
Spider-ManHero12
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Very nice interview. From what we've heard so far, the story sounds very dark and interesting, so I'm looking foward to hearing more about this and overall reading it.
SpideyZERO
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I thought it was five issues.
Web-Head408
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Spider-ManHero12
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^^ That's simply fantastic if you ask me. The plot sounds great and the image of Spidey is really dark and gritty. This, my friends, as I said, is going to be very interesting, if you ask me. 
SpideyZERO
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I thought the mask would be red
Donald Thomas
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Is it too early to dress up like Noir Spidey for Halloween?
Aloha,
No, but only certified Spidey geeks will know who the heck you are. Have a Ball.
Spidey rules
Web-Head408
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Found these on this Italian blog. http://marvelmadeinitaly.blogspot.com/2008/09/spider-man-noir-europeo.html
These were from another post on the blog, assuming it's more from it. Mention. Willing to bet the dude in the first pic here is Vulture.
http://marvelmadeinitaly.blogspot.com/2008/02/carmine-di-giandomenico-e-spider-man.html
SpideyZERO
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Nice find! Vulture looks scary!
Web-Head408
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Don't know where this is from or if it's even official but I thought it would be worth posting.
Spider-ManHero12
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Wow, that image of Spidey looks awesome! Also, I love that Vulture image as well.
Web-Head408
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Signature looks like it's Marko Djurdjevic's. So either this was early concept art or imdaly is right in that he could change suit's later in the book.
Spider-ManHero12
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Indeed, and I'm going to have to go with him changing suits later on in the book. However, I still could be wrong.
SpideyZERO
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Cool Spidey design. The spidey suit in Noir is all black though, but it will be cool if Peter changes suit
JerseyJoker
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Nice design, i really can't wait for this mini to come out.
There is A LOT of great potential for Spidey noir stories.
There is A LOT of great potential for Spidey noir stories.
Spider-ManHero12
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One of the things that really sparks my interest is how different this seems as a Spidey story. This is unlike any Spidey series we have seen before. Hell, I don't even think Spider-Man: 2099 is as different as this is going to be.
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