Suicide Squad: General Discussion and Speculation - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 34

[The Joker]

Stealing someone else's observation here; DCEU - DC Extended Universe. Suddenly it all makes sense now

Adding 13 minutes onto this mess won't make it into a good movie. It needs more reworking than 13 minutes of new footage. WB needs to come up with a new gimmick. This is getting old.

 

[Angel0fDeath]

Ah
Marvel trolls

Nah, you DC apologist. It's just pure coincidence that the same clowns show up every time a bit of "controversial" news comes out and somehow are never to be seen on any other day for a normal conversation.

 

[TeeKay]

Stealing someone else's observation here; DCEU - DC Extended Universe. Suddenly it all makes sense now

Adding 13 minutes onto this mess won't make it into a good movie. It needs more reworking than 13 minutes of new footage. WB needs to come up with a new gimmick. This is getting old.

Troll.

 

[Sleiek]

Except, Marvel also gave in to fan demands and retconned Mandarin in Marvel One-Shots ("All hail the King")

That was kind of apology to fans for "Mandarin Twist".

That's not the same thing. Can't you see the truth? Marvel rules. They don't make mistakes.

That's not the same thing.

 

[The Joker]

Troll.

Correction; Marvel troll. Rule 101; you don't like these movies you are automatically a Marvel troll.

 

[Micromind]

I enjoyed the hell out of this film. I can't wait to own it.

The movie has had good Box Office collections worldwide, so I don't think that the extra 13 minutes were added to sell Blurays .

I'm not complaining getting those extra 13 minutes, I doubt it will be an issue for those who liked the theatrical version.

 

[Sleiek]

Amazing how every time DC announces an extended cut, the same comments pop up.

 

[Talion]

Very insightful response, it's actually hilarious that the haters have chosen the extended edition announcement to jump on the film. After all you all abandoned the Box Office thread when it was clear it was doing gang busters at the Box Office.

I think the box office for this film is fantastic. I think there is an obvious demand for superhero films, both DC and Marvel, and I'm a huge fan of both properties. There are parts of Suicide Squad that I like, but I can't help the jarring feeling of what could have been. Imagine how big both BvS and Squad would be if they were actually honest to Rao great films?


I still enjoyed this more than the TC for BvS, but somehow given the whole situation that surrounded this film, I don't think yet another extended cut will make this film any better. BvS becomes an watchable film with the UC, but that's not entirely the problem with Squad. I'm obviously hoping for the best, but it's past beyond silly right now when it comes to the DCEU having different TC and home releases. Let's hope that Geoff can rebirth the DCEU too.

 

[-JKR-]

JKR, I was talking about the theatrical cut. The movies problems stem from a script PoV rather than an editing one. Remember, Ayer had six weeks to write the script. Btw, Props to David Ayer, who said the thing we saw in theathers was his cut. It's the DC Extended Universe indeed.

It's not like this was announced as a Director's cut. And, as it seems, it won't even be Ayer's original director's cut, but an extended version of the Director's cut.

And aside from the chunky inclusion of The Flash and the tease at the other Justice League members, I don't have much of a problem with the Batman V Superman script after having seen the Ultimate Edition. Sure, the final fight vs Doomsday is kinda cliche, but it has a nice conclusion, and I have more of a problem with the over-abundance of CGI in that sequence, rather than with how it's written.

And regarding Suicide Squad, David Ayer may have written his script in six weeks (he still did additional rewrites), but unfortunately there's no way to read the script. And the movie's biggest problem - IMO - is the way the studio tinkered with it, by completely reshuffling and fracturing the narrative, getting rid of the darker and more somber aspects of the movie, reducing many scenes to tiny 30 second snippets, and almost completely reworking the final fight. That's my main complaint, that it felt like a fractured look at something much more fleshed out and more organic.

So it's more of a case of heavy studio intervention. There's no way to really judge the script, considering that the movie is a pastiche of many different cuts of the movie, made by different people. You may have a problem with the storyline being about the Enchantress. But even then, you have no clue about how it actually played out and worked in the script and original cuts vs what ended up on the big screen.

 

[The Joker]

Amazing how every time DC announces an extended cut, the same comments pop up.

I know. Its like people have these valid opinions about studios stupidly hacking up movies for theater releases, then not standing by their TC cuts by pulling the gimmick of an extended cut for the DVD release. Three movies in and already the DCEU has done this twice.

Is it any wonder people are jaded by this.

 

[-JKR-]

I know. Its like people have these valid opinions about studios stupidly hacking up movies for theater releases, then not standing by their TC cuts by pulling the gimmick of an extended cut for the DVD release.

The Batman V Superman Ultimat Edition didn't seem like much of a gimmick to me. It seemed more like Zack Snyder's original cut, and one which makes the story flow much better. So I thank Warner Bros for that gimmick, instead of them insisting on the theatrical cut being the only version to exist.

Unfortunately, in the case of Suicide Squad, the studio won't fully restore David Ayer's original vision for the movie, and will stand by the changes they've made for it (except, now with 13 minutes of new footage).

And I repeat, thank God for studios not 'standing by their TC cuts' and instead being shady scammers, by releasing Director's cuts for Blade Runner, The Abyss, True Romance, Once Upon a Time in America, etc.

 

[Flint Marko]

That's not the same thing. Can't you see the truth? Marvel rules. They don't make mistakes.

My statement you quoted is true. A 13 minute short film included on a blu-ray is very different from changes that happen to the actual film once it leaves theaters.

 

[The Joker]

The Batman V Superman Ultimat Edition didn't seem like much of a gimmick to me. It seemed more like Zack Snyder's original cut, and one which makes the story flow much better. So I thank Warner Bros for that gimmick, instead of them insisting on the theatrical cut being the only version to exist.

Well to each their own, but for me that cut didn't do anything to fix the real problems of the movie, and was like slapping a band aid on a gaping wound. At the end of the day it just made a weak movie nearly 3 hours long.

Unfortunately, in the case of Suicide Squad, the studio won't fully restore David Ayer's original vision for the movie, and will stand by the changes they've made for it (except, now with 13 minutes of new footage).

Indeed. Which makes it even worse.

And I repeat, thank God for studios not 'standing by their TC cuts' even in the past, and releasing Director's cuts for Blade Runner, The Abyss, True Romance, Once Upon a Time in America, etc.

Scant examples though spread over decades worth of movies. In the case of the DCEU they've pulled this gimmick with two out of their three released movies so far in the same year.

At this stage it's almost an expectation for all of them to get one.

 

[Talion]

The Batman V Superman Ultimat Edition didn't seem like much of a gimmick to me. It seemed more like Zack Snyder's original cut, and one which makes the story flow much better. So I thank Warner Bros for that gimmick, instead of them insisting on the theatrical cut being the only version to exist.

Unfortunately, in the case of Suicide Squad, the studio won't fully restore David Ayer's original vision for the movie, and will stand by the changes they've made for it (except, now with 13 minutes of new footage).

And I repeat, thank God for studios not 'standing by their TC cuts' and instead being shady scammers, by releasing Director's cuts for Blade Runner, The Abyss, True Romance, Once Upon a Time in America, etc.

The problem tho is that when it comes to stuff like cinematic universes, different cuts cause more confusion and harm than good. By all means, if WB has a better cut of Squad like they did with BvS, release that. But this needs to stop, and it needs to stop with Wonder Woman and Justice League. WB is literally becoming Ubisoft when it comes to releasing an unfinished product, those who used to play Assassin's Creed know what I mean. That's not a good rep to have, so I'm hoping they have all this sorted out by the time that Wonder Woman and the League is out.

 

[BH/HHH]

I think the box office for this film is fantastic. I think there is an obvious demand for superhero films, both DC and Marvel, and I'm a huge fan of both properties. There are parts of Suicide Squad that I like, but I can't help the jarring feeling of what could have been. Imagine how big both BvS and Squad would be if they were actually honest to Rao great films?


I still enjoyed this more than the TC for BvS, but somehow given the whole situation that surrounded this film, I don't think yet another extended cut will make this film any better. BvS becomes an watchable film with the UC, but that's not entirely the problem with Squad. I'm obviously hoping for the best, but it's past beyond silly right now when it comes to the DCEU having different TC and home releases. Let's hope that Geoff can rebirth the DCEU too.

I don't see how it's beyond silly when it's the second time they've done it. Many films get extended cuts, including all three films in both the LOTR and Hobbit trilogies. I think it's something they do need to be weary of if they keep doing as it may effect theatrical box office if people know a longer version is been released after on home video. Although I'm not sure it effected box office for the LOTR/Hobbit movies. People acting like its a gimmick to sell home video of a disapointing film need to face reality. It's aa succesful film getting an extended cut, which of course will appeal to more people but that is nothing new with movies in general. Suicide Squad not the first film to get this treatment and it certainly won't be the last film to get this treatment.

 

[-JKR-]

Well that's not my view on it. To me that cut didn't do anything to fix the real problems of the movie, and was like slapping a ban aid on a gaping wound. At the end of the day it just made a weak movie nearly 3 hours long.

Well, that's your opinion. I really like the UE of Batman V Superman.

At this stage it's almost an expectation for all of them to get one.

They're not robbing anyone of their money. These movies would've been released on home video anyway. And they've put an alternate cut on it. Which people can chose to watch... or not. Just like they can chose to buy these movies on blu-ray... or not!

The real problem goes back to months ago. The studio shouldn't have listened to the complaints about Batman V Superman being too dark, and should've supported David Ayer's vision for Suicide Squad.

The snarky comments about these Extended cuts don't really add anything to the discussion, and come across as way to rub the fact that they didn't like these two movies in other people's faces. Once again. And which what they think is now a new vaild reason.

The problem tho is that when it comes to stuff like cinematic universes, different cuts cause more confusion and harm than good. By all means, if WB has a better cut of Squad like they did with BvS, release that. But this needs to stop, and it needs to stop with Wonder Woman and Justice League. WB is literally becoming Ubisoft when it comes to releasing an unfinished product, those who used to play Assassin's Creed know what I mean. That's not a good rep to have, so I'm hoping they have all this sorted out by the time that Wonder Woman and the League is out.

I doubt the Director's cut of Batman V Superman will cause any confusion. It just makes the individual movie work much better, which is what I care about (the individual movies).

And it's not like they've released unfinished products, waiting for the filmmakers to finish the movies in time for the home video release. It's just a wrong statement, which doesn't reflect the truth.

 

[Greens]

We gain nothing if WB "stands by" their hack jobs. They shouldn't have been hack jobs in the first place, but if that's how it's going to be, give me an extended cut. It is the way it is.

 

[Blitzkrieg]

The 13 mins of added footage thing seems legit after all, Collider posted an article with that bit of news.

 

[TeeKay]

It's not like this was announced as a Director's cut. And, as it seems, it won't even be Ayer's original director's cut, but an extended version of the Director's cut.

And aside from the chunky inclusion of The Flash and the tease at the other Justice League members, I don't have much of a problem with the Batman V Superman script after having seen the Ultimate Edition. Sure, the final fight vs Doomsday is kinda cliche, but it has a nice conclusion, and I have more of a problem with the over-abundance of CGI in that sequence, rather than with how it's written.

The BvS UC made the film coherent and not better imo.

And regarding Suicide Squad, David Ayer may have written his script in six weeks (he still did additional rewrites), but unfortunately there's no way to read the script. And the movie's biggest problem - IMO - is the way the studio tinkered with it, by completely reshuffling and fracturing the narrative, getting rid of the darker and more somber aspects of the movie, reducing many scenes to tiny 30 second snippets, and almost completely reworking the final fight. That's my main complaint, that it felt like a fractured look at something much more fleshed out and more organic.

So it's more of a case of heavy studio intervention. There's no way to really judge the script, considering that the movie is a pastiche of many different cuts of the movie, made by different people. You may have a problem with the storyline being about the Enchantress. But even then, you have no clue about how it actually played out and worked in the script and original cuts vs what ended up on the big screen.

Because WB/DC are such a reactionary studio, we end up with situations like these. And I don't even think orginal version was going to be any better than what we got? Coherent? Yes but you still have the same problems in ragards to plot, character motivations and villain Same happened with BvS. Hence why I find this whole thing hilarious.

Correction; Marvel troll. Rule 101; you don't like these movies you are automatically a Marvel troll.

I still stand by what I said. It's not going from a bad movie to a masterpiece with 13 minutes.

 

[Greens]

The 13 mins of added footage thing seems legit after all, Collider posted an article with that bit of news.

Amazon has the runtime listed as 2h16m, so it's legit.

 

[Talion]

I don't see how it's beyond silly when it's the second time they've done it. Many films get extended cuts, including all three films in both the LOTR and Hobbit trilogies. I think it's something they do need to be weary of if they keep doing as it may effect theatrical box office if people know a longer version is been released after on home video. Although I'm not sure it effected box office for the LOTR/Hobbit movies. People acting like its a gimmick to sell home video of a disapointing film need to face reality. It's aa succesful film getting an extended cut, which of course will appeal to more people but that is nothing new with movies in general. Suicide Squad not the first film to get this treatment and it certainly won't be the last film to get this treatment.

Of course you don't. LOTR/Hobbit isn't a cinematic universe. When your rep is that you will deliver the "real deal" later on blu-ray, don't you think that is a bad rep? If you take out your fanboy blinds off, you will get what I mean. I'm not rooting against DC and WB, I'm hoping they find their way because I love these characters as much if not more than the biggest of their fans around here and elsewhere online. But oh well. I've said my piece.

 

[Greens]

Of course you don't. LOTR/Hobbit isn't a cinematic universe. When your rep is that you will deliver the "real deal" later on blu-ray, don't you think that is a bad rep? If you take out your fanboy blinds off, you will get what I mean. I'm not rotting against DC and WB, I'm hoping they find their way because I love these characters as much if not more than the biggest of their fans around here and elsewhere online. But oh well. I've said my piece.

I see what you mean, because generally I'm not a fan of alternate cuts at all. I want to see the movie how it was intended, immediately. I make an exception for a very, very small amount of movies.

 

[-JKR-]

Because WB/DC are such a reactionary studio, we end up with situations like these. And I don't even think orginal version was going to be any better than what we got? Coherent? Yes but you still have the same problems in ragards to plot, character motivations and villain Same happened with BvS. Hence why I find this whole thing hilarious.

You don't think... But neither do you know.

And I'm the first one to say that the studio messed up by micro-managing Suicide Squad. They should've supported Ayer's vision.

But that doesn't make "this situation" hilarious.

 

[The Joker]

They're not robbing anyone of their money. These movies would've been released on home video anyway. And they've put an alternate cut on it. Which people can chose to watch... or not. Just like they can chose to buy these movies on blu-ray... or not!

The real problem goes back to months ago. The studio shouldn't have listened to the complaints about Batman V Superman being too dark, and should've supported David Ayer's vision for Suicide Squad.

The snarky comments about these Extended cuts don't really add anything to the discussion, and come across as way to rub the fact that they didn't like these two movies in other people's faces. Once again. And which what they think is now a new vaild reason.

I never said they were robbing anyone of their money. That's just silly for anyone to suggest that is what they are doing. The extended cut gimmick is just not that clever a marketing ploy. Nobody is being conned or forced to buy it. But its a gimmick to get people to buy it just because of 13 extra minutes which are likely not to even make any real difference to the movie.

The studio should listen to the complaints about BvS. They're valid and should be adhered to if they want to get a truly successful and embraced franchise. The problem is their reaction to the complaints was to interfere with a movie which didn't have the problems BvS had. Cutting out Joker's violent scenes, or lightening it up isn't the way to learn from past mistakes.

Since when is a violent Joker not embraced by audiences? Look at Ledger's Joker doing magic tricks with pencils into people's eyes and the like. WB have knee jerk reactions and think when people complain about the tone of BvS its that they don't like grim or serious tones, when its not that the tone was grim that was the problem, it was the execution of it. Its all about execution. Movies that get hammered for their humor is not a message that humor in movies is bad, its how it was executed that was the problem.

The only snarky comments that add nothing to the discussion are the ones about people being Marvel trolls because they are criticizing this stupid extended cut gimmick. Its like dealing with children calling people mean and stupid because they don't like what they like. If C. Lee sees their comments he's going to rain a s*** storm down on them.

 

[BH/HHH]

Of course you don't. LOTR/Hobbit isn't a cinematic universe. When your rep is that you will deliver the "real deal" later on blu-ray, don't you think that is a bad rep? If you take out your fanboy blinds off, you will get what I mean. I'm not rooting against DC and WB, I'm hoping they find their way because I love these characters as much if not more than the biggest of their fans around here and elsewhere online. But oh well. I've said my piece.

What exactly is the real deal though? We're talking about a financially succesful movie getting an extended cut on home video. There are many many cases of this happening with films all over.

Take off my fanboy blinders? Really? Just wow, pot kettle mate.