The Amazing Spider-Man 2 The Amazing Spider-Man 2 General Discussion - - Part 86

[DX]

But he quipped so he waz teh best Spider-Man evah

AND HE HAZ TEH WEBSHOOTURZ!!!!!,!!one!!,!11!onehundredandeleven!

 

[Daltonio]

Here we go again with the people who just assume that quips & webshooters were the absolute only things that people liked about Garfield as Spidey. I guess they'll never learn.

Honestly I'm usually talking more about his version of Peter, rather than Spidey, though I did like both better.

 

[Lantern Venom]

Here we go again with the people who just assume that quips & webshooters were the absolute only things that people liked about Garfield as Spidey. I guess they'll never learn.

Honestly I'm usually talking more about his version of Peter, rather than Spidey, though I did like both better.

I rewatched all 5 movies in the last year and Garfield was certainly the better Spider-man in terms of physicality. He had some advancements in CGI to aid him, but he was quicker and more coordinated than Tobey. I knew instantly that AG had an athletic background before I even did a web search on the subject.

 

[Keehar]

Garfield was the worst Spider-Man. Like George Clooney bad. He looked like CGI man most of the time. His fight scenes were all dullsville forgettable. The action in both movies was crap.

AND HE HAZ TEH WEBSHOOTURZ!!!!!,!!one!!,!11!onehundredandeleven!

Oh yezzzz teh webshoorterz. Quippy man and teh webshooterz is Spideh-Man 4evah!!!!

Here we go again with the people who just assume that quips & webshooters were the absolute only things that people liked about Garfield as Spidey. I guess they'll never learn.

Nothing to learn. When you see defences for that crap scene like it felt very Spider-Man then you're the one who ain't learning pal. That's the lame defence people use for a-hole Garfield Spider-Man.

Just be glad he can never soil Spider-Man's name again. We can all take solace in that.

 

[Lantern Venom]

Garfield was the worst Spider-Man. Like George Clooney bad. He looked like CGI man most of the time. His fight scenes were all dullsville forgettable. The action in both movies was crap.

.

It was the carjacker scene that gave use the first glance into Garfield's athleticism. When he was firing the webs, he did so in a very efficient fashion. He moved in the same way a fighter would throw a combination: his swiveled his hips without his feet leaving the ground, he kept his elbows tight to his body, and he followed his lead hand with his reverse in rapid succession.

Those kind of details might not mean much to you personally, but they certainly weren't lost on everyone. Garfield's methods of locomotion were simply superior to those of Tobey.

 

[The Joker]

Just be glad he can never soil Spider-Man's name again. We can all take solace in that.

So true. Even the powers that be like Amy Pascal had no faith in the TASM franchise any more.

Those leaked emails were a real eye opener. And not to gloat over the people who actually liked the TASM movies, but it personally makes me very happy to have seen that even Sony knew their franchise was weak. That's the truth of it.

 

[Lantern Venom]

So true. Even the powers that be like Amy Pascal had no faith in the TASM franchise any more.

Those leaked emails were a real eye opener. And not to gloat over the people who actually liked the TASM movies, but it personally makes me very happy to have seen that even Sony knew their franchise was weak. That's the truth of it.

The truth of those emails was that Pascal was clueless about a lot of things, and comic book history is one of them. I can appreciate the role that she had in putting out solid works like A League of Their Own and Awakenings, but her words about the Spider-man were spoken like someone who knew next to nothing about the Spider-man mythos and what little she knew came by osmosis when Sony began working on Raimi's trilogy.

 

[titansupes]

It's got nothing to do with comic book history, but ASM2 as a movie. Her thoughts on ASM2 perfectly (minus the spelling) pinpoint all the problems with that movie.

 

[The Joker]

^ Exactly. The many, many, MANY mess ups in the comic book characterizations is down to the poor understanding the people writing the sorry excuse for scripts had.

 

[Keehar]

Yep. Since we're all on a roll here showing Lantern Venom how wrong he is. I got another one.

The franchise didn't fail as much as it came to a premature halt like its predecessor.

No siree Bob that isn't how it is.

Raimi franchise did not come to a premature halt. Spider-Man 3 did not leave any big loose plot points, or sequel bait. TASM 2 did. Raimi's movies feel like a trilogy. TASM 2 was mega desperately trying to set up an expansive universe, spin offs and all that, which is now never going to happen. Huzzah.

TASM 2 was a mega financial disappointment. Sony made peanuts off it, and is the only Spidey movie to get a rotten critic rating. They were losing the audiences. Raimi's franchise never had that problem. Sony wouldn't have jumped into bed with Marvel less than a year after it's release, and we know by the emails that they were already really worried about the franchise before the movies even got released, and with good reason, if the franchise was not a failure. They were up the poop creek without a paddle. Marvel saved them big.

That's the way it is. No ifs, ands or buts.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

It's got nothing to do with comic book history, but ASM2 as a movie. Her thoughts on ASM2 perfectly (minus the spelling) pinpoint all the problems with that movie.

Yep. What she criticized in the email are things that critics and filmgoers complained about after the film was released. She was right!

 

[Daltonio]

Yep. Since we're all on a roll here showing Lantern Venom how wrong he is. I got another one.

You are? Where? All I see from you is basically, "My opinion is right and your opinion is wrong. Na na na na na na."

 

[Keehar]

Then you ain't been reading the facts we've been saying pal. Selective reading is bad for you. Only gives you half the picture

 

[Lantern Venom]

It's got nothing to do with comic book history, but ASM2 as a movie. Her thoughts on ASM2 perfectly (minus the spelling) pinpoint all the problems with that movie.

When I read her concerns with the movie, I rolled my eyes. Not only does she come off like someone who doesn't know comic book history, there seems to be an underlying condescension toward comics. To top it off, she reached out to a former director whose prior movies faced many of the same criticisms. I laughed heartily thinking about her exchanging emails with Sam Raimi because she was concerned about crying scenes in the movie.

Yep. Since we're all on a roll here showing Lantern Venom how wrong he is. I got another one.




No siree Bob that isn't how it is.

Raimi franchise did not come to a premature halt. Spider-Man 3 did not leave any big loose plot points, or sequel bait. TASM 2 did. Raimi's movies feel like a trilogy. TASM 2 was mega desperately trying to set up an expansive universe, spin offs and all that, which is now never going to happen. Huzzah.

TASM 2 was a mega financial disappointment. Sony made peanuts off it, and is the only Spidey movie to get a rotten critic rating. They were losing the audiences. Raimi's franchise never had that problem. Sony wouldn't have jumped into bed with Marvel less than a year after it's release, and we know by the emails that they were already really worried about the franchise before the movies even got released, and with good reason, if the franchise was not a failure. They were up the poop creek without a paddle. Marvel saved them big.

That's the way it is. No ifs, ands or buts.

The Raimi trilogy left major storylines in flux. The only thing that truly came to a resolution was the Harry-Peter relationship. The franchise was obviously heading toward a Peter-MJ marriage, but were left without knowing any details about their relationship she cheated on Peter. We don't know how his symbiote-led actions at the Bugle influenced his professional future or if there were future problems with Aunt May after Peter's admission. There were widespread reports of Sony trying to shoot a 4th and 5th movie simultaneously, so it's a fact that Raimi didn't intend the story to come to a halt with so many loose ends.

The Sony emails proved that the studio didn't understand the changing landscape of comic book films. As good as TASM and TASM2 are, they came at a time when insular universes are contributing to franchise fatigue. Sony waited too late to open up the Spider-verse after using the same basic formula since 2002. Had they been more aware of how the panoramic storytelling of X-men and the MCU had increased audiences' expectations, they wouldn't have been in the same situation they were in 2007. They actually trailed Warner Bumbles in their plans for a valuable comic book franchise, which tells you all you need to know.

That being said, the TASM franchise did give the proper treatment to two of the biggest events in Spider-man's history, the deaths of the Stacys. Those were too big for Raimi to have blown a snot rocket on them like he did, so I'm glad some of the damage was undone there.

You are? Where? All I see from you is basically, "My opinion is right and your opinion is wrong. Na na na na na na."

I can certainly say that anyone using Amy Pascal as a way of validating their opinions missed the crux of that situation. She brought a huge amount of heat to Sony and almost lost her job. Even without the hack, I'm astonished that anyone in her position would be clueless enough to put some of those insensitive remarks in writing. Comic books aren't the only area that she doesn't quite understand.

 

[Doctor Octopus]

It's got nothing to do with comic book history, but ASM2 as a movie. Her thoughts on ASM2 perfectly (minus the spelling) pinpoint all the problems with that movie.

Yep. What she criticized in the email are things that critics and filmgoers complained about after the film was released. She was right!

Agreed. Amy Pascal was very smart. She saw movie was going to be a problem before it even come out. She predicted the criticism it would get.

When I read her concerns with the movie, I rolled my eyes. Not only does she come off like someone who doesn't know comic book history, there seems to be an underlying condescension toward comics. To top it off, she reached out to a former director whose prior movies faced many of the same criticisms. I laughed heartily thinking about her exchanging emails with Sam Raimi because she was concerned about crying scenes in the movie.

Disagreed. She sound like she understand better than Marc Webb and Avi Arad. She knew the problems of ASM 2 everyone would have with it before it came out.

Asking Sam Raimi was smartest move because his Spider-Man movies were great, very successful financial and critical, and did not fail like ASM movies. That is fact.

The Raimi trilogy left major storylines in flux. The only thing that truly came to a resolution was the Harry-Peter relationship. The franchise was obviously heading toward a Peter-MJ marriage, but were left without knowing any details about their relationship she cheated on Peter. We don't know how his symbiote-led actions at the Bugle influenced his professional future or if there were future problems with Aunt May after Peter's admission. There were widespread reports of Sony trying to shoot a 4th and 5th movie simultaneously, so it's a fact that Raimi didn't intend the story to come to a halt with so many loose ends.

Disagreed. There was no major storylines in flux. They did not leave Peter/MJ marriage in flux because it never happen. They just got back together at end of Spider-Man 3.

There was no effect of symbiote led actions on Bugle. All he did was get Brock fired which he deserved and get staff job because he took great photos of black suit Spider-Man. Nothing else to resolve there.

There was no problems with Aunt May either. Last time she saw him she was giving him good advice to forgive himself and then make it up with MJ.

Just because Sony want to do two more movies does not mean Raimi had loose ends. He say he want to do one more because he wanted to make best Spider-Man movie yet because he feel he not get to make the movie he wanted with Spider-Man 3.

No loose ends left to tie. You are wrong Lantern Venom. That is why you never see these things you say named as loose ends in reviews about Raimi movies. You just make them up.

The Sony emails proved that the studio didn't understand the changing landscape of comic book films. As good as TASM and TASM2 are, they came at a time when insular universes are contributing to franchise fatigue. Sony waited too late to open up the Spider-verse after using the same basic formula since 2002. Had they been more aware of how the panoramic storytelling of X-men and the MCU had increased audiences' expectations, they wouldn't have been in the same situation they were in 2007. They actually trailed Warner Bumbles in their plans for a valuable comic book franchise, which tells you all you need to know.

ASM and ASM 2 were not good. They were bad. Especially ASM 2. That is why it fail. Sony emails prove that they understood that because Amy Pascal saw problems with movie before it even come out.

If movie was good then it would not matter about landscape of comic book movies. It is Spider-Man. He is big enough to sell himself. But ASM 2 so terrible that it fail and end franchise.

That is what really happen. Not what you make up there.

That being said, the TASM franchise did give the proper treatment to two of the biggest events in Spider-man's history, the deaths of the Stacys. Those were too big for Raimi to have blown a snot rocket on them like he did, so I'm glad some of the damage was undone there.

Disagreed. It ruin both Stacy deaths. No father/son relationship with Peter and George. They not even like each other. Then Peter break promise to George right after he died lol.

Gwen death worse because she die because her own fault. Her fault Goblin learn Peter is Spider-Man too. Also ruined because Harry killed her instead of Norman. Ruined greatest death in Spider-Man stories. No respect for comics.

They not get any deaths right in ASM movies. Like Uncle Ben's death too, Peter not learn with great power comes great responsibility from his death either. They ruin Spider-Man origin as well.

They ruin everything great about Spider-Man. This is why they so terrible and movies fail. Bad movies and bad Spider-Man movies.

I can certainly say that anyone using Amy Pascal as a way of validating their opinions missed the crux of that situation. She brought a huge amount of heat to Sony and almost lost her job. Even without the hack, I'm astonished that anyone in her position would be clueless enough to put some of those insensitive remarks in writing. Comic books aren't the only area that she doesn't quite understand.

I can certainly say that wrong because Amy Pascal smarter than the rest because she saw all problems that everyone would have with ASM 2 and she wanted changes. It pity that happen too late and we could have not had such terrible movie like ASM 2.

But Amy was smart. She know bad movie when she see it.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

SM3 was a suitable ending. The series could have continued further into marriage and parenthood for Peter, but it didn't have to for the story to make sense and feel complete.

With the ASM series it really felt like we were being cut off in the middle, much like the ending to the Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon, where future storylines were setup, plot threads were left hanging, and there was no satisfactory conclusion.

Now my feelings on those two series are completely different, SSM left me wanting more and I am still angry that we never got it, whereas with ASM I had no interest in seeing how it played out, but neither feels 'complete' the way the Raimi trilogy does.

 

[The Joker]

Lantern Venom, in all my years on this forum, and the internet in general, I say this hand on heart, you are the only person I have ever seen who thinks those Spider-Man 3 elements were "major storylines" left in flux.

Total opposite. People have often felt content that at least Raimi's trio of movies feel like a complete trilogy, and he didn't leave before he had some big plot elements to resolve, like TASM 2 did. None of those things you mentioned were dangling plot lines that needed a resolution. If it had ended at 2 with Harry finding the Goblin lair, and Peter and MJ finally becoming a couple, then it would have felt incomplete with unresolved big plots.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Or if it ended after SM1, with Harry swearing revenge on Spider-Man and Peter walking away from MJ.

 

[Nemeres]

SM3 was a suitable ending.

It's an ending. If it renders characters you spent the first two movies rooting for unlikable and laughable, I don't know about suitable.

 

[Keehar]

Way to go on that post Octopus.

It's an ending. If it renders characters you spent the first two movies rooting for unlikable and laughable, I don't know about suitable.

Good thing it didn't do that then eh t:

 

[Nemeres]

Just a teensy bit? *does the finger thing*

 

[Frodo]

For a trilogy, it wrapped things up. The major storylines from one were now resolved , and in the end Peter and MJ make a step towards reconciliation. No, its not a good or satisfying ending because it retcons alot of what made the first film great and it leaves the two protagonists who are quite unlikable. That said, its at least closure, even if its not the type everyone wanted.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

ASM and ASM 2 were not good. They were bad. Especially ASM 2. That is why it fail. Sony emails prove that they understood that because Amy Pascal saw problems with movie before it even come out.

The first one is pretty good.
For the second one I understand the hate, I personally like it, but I understand the hate (a big chunk of it) it gets. Even studio heads look at it dismissively.

 

[Frodo]

The first one had good performances but a okay to lackluster story and script. The second one was bad. Not as bad as Spiderman 3, but not good. They wrote themselves into a corner in only the second film and made it alot harder to move forward with that version. They would have either had to go the loose sequel route ala Batman Forever, or just rebooted it out and out , which was what eventually happened.

 

[titansupes]

I think ASM2 was worse than SM3. While SM3 is really bad, ASM2 is both really bad and really boring.