The Defenders The Defenders Discussion Thread (NO SPOILER TAGS NECESSARY!)

[flickchick85]

Discuss the full first season of The Defenders here.

Beware, spoilers galore!
​

 

[TheVileOne]

OK so to summarize:

* Elektra apparently destroyed K'un L'un and all the Elders, or said she did.
* Jessica Jones, Claire, and Luke Cage are all free of any legal issues for now
* Misty DID lose her arm this time. Recovering in a hospital owned by Danny.
* No potential romantic development between Danny and Misty at all
* Danny now sees New York as his home and will "protect it" but he still won't wear a ****ing costume
* Stick is dead apparently
* The Chaste are the army of the Iron Fist for some reason. That's all Stick knew, and Danny never knew about it.
* All of the Chaste are dead, except possibly Stick. Elektra probably killed him, but he wasn't beheaded, and he might've had some of the Hand's life extending substance as well. Stone from S1 of Daredevil never shows up. So he's likely dead as well.
* The Defenders dropped a building down on The Hand to stop them...and the leaders could still be alive
* A long drawn out ending to bait and switch that Matt/Daredevil is dead...but he's not dead and recovering in a church while a nun summons his mother, "Maggie," clearly in reference to Maggie Murdock. But everyone else still thinks he's dead.
* Luke and Jessica made amends with each other over their past.
* What was the Hand's master plan? They dug a big hole in New York to find the remains of Shao Lao, or at least one incarnation of Shao Lao. Why did they want Shao Lao? His fossilized remains are what they use to extend their lives. All they wanted was to keep extending their lives in the hope of maybe returning to K'un L'un someday. So that's it. All they wanted was Shao Lao's bones. Excavating his bones would apparently weaken the bedrock of NYC and cause it to collapse.
* Black Sky's purpose was no freaking idea. Kinda pointless. They didn't develop this Black Sky business very well.
* Alexandra turned out to not really be anyone special other than that The Hand have five fingers (leaders) and she was apparently their biggest finger. Elektra takes her out before the end. What are Alexandra and the fingers? Apparently former Elders of K'un L'un who rejected the Elders' ways and left the city.
* Since Matt IS still alive at the end and survived the explosion, that means Elektra, Murakami, and Gao could all still be alive as well.
* No Punisher, thank God. He would've been remarkably out of place here.
* Bakuto returns. His conflict with Gao is basically lampshaded with, "Are we no longer on speaking terms." Colleen gets to have a final fight with him and kill him, after Misty basically sacrifices her arm to give her an opening.
* Matt fails in redeeming Elektra and turning her back to the side of good. The impression is Elektra is doing what she wants. However, she and Matt do embrace and kiss at the end of the fight so maybe there is hope for her if she survived. Considering Matt is still alive, she is likely alive as well.
* As for The Defenders, no one calls them the Defenders, and they never refer to themselves as The Defenders. Murakami does call Daredevil "Daredevil" though in Japanese, which was funny.

So quick wrap-up. Danny and Colleen still together and a couple. Misty loses her arm. Jessica and Luke apologize to each other. Luke is back in Harlem with Claire. Karen and Foggy are grieving over Matt, who they think is dead. But Matt is definitely not dead and recovering in a church under the care of his biological mother Maggie. The Hand's base of operations has been collapsed, but if non-immortal Matt is still alive, then some of their leaders (Murakami and Gao and maybe Elektra) could still be alive as well.

To be perfectly honest, I was somewhat disappointed with the Hand's master plan. I mean I get them wanting to not die and it was a matter of running out of their resources. However, the whole Black Sky thing had no real payoff.

The perfect ending would've been Iron Fist taking on the mantle of becoming Hell's Kitchen new superhero and wearing a costume and doing as Matt asked of him, "Protect my city." Sorry Marco Ramirez. You failed to deliver there.

 

[Homem-Aranha]

Does Danny get a suit or anything that points to a possible suit up?

 

[chicagodave]

Just finished it. Was amazing gonna get some sleep then watch it again. Fyi theres a quick punisher teaser at the end.

 

[flickchick85]

General thoughts:

-Got off to a slow start, but once episode 3 came along, I was loving it. 3 & 4, then 6-8 were its peaks, imo. At least it finished strong, which is something these shows usually struggle with.

-Would much rather see a Daredevil/Jessica Jones show than a Luke/Iron Fist show after this. Charlie and Krysten played off each other soooo well.

-I agree with Vile that the grand "Evil Plan" was a letdown, and never really seemed to go anywhere. Sigourney played her role well, but this show didn't come close to the villains of DD and JJ. Elektra was still great, though. I went from really sympathizing one minute (when she was really starting to remember who she was), to being reminded "oh nope, she's still evil" the next. Her fight scenes with the group were A+ too.

- Every single time someone pointed out what a dumbass Danny is brought me joy.

- This show possibly has the largest and most diverse group of strong badass women I've ever seen in a TV show, and I love it.

- Enjoyed the Colleen/Misty scenes, and I'm looking forward to Misty getting her bionic arm and their eventual team-ups in the future. On another note, disappointed there were no hints at Danny/Misty, but honestly, I hate this version of Danny so much, I wouldn't really wish him on her. Which brings me to one last random thought:

-Danny still suuuuuucks. I was thrilled when they sidelined him for a hot minute. At least his fight scenes were better here.


Overall on first watch, I'd say I definitely enjoyed it more than Iron Fist and Luke Cage, but not quite as much as the best of DD or JJ.

 

[terry78]

USA Today said you know who is the weak link in the cast and the team, and they weren't wrong.

 

[Herolee10]

Is it just me or did they recton the origins of the Hand with this series? I mean it's been awhile since I watched Season 2 of Daredevil, but didn't Stick give a different recount of the Hand's origins in Season 2 than he did in Defenders?

 

[Best]

Enjoyed the whole thing on par with the first half of Luke Cage, maybe a little better. Underwhelmed with the last half of episodes but not for Netflix's usual drag, more so the plot/Hand situation. Felt it was going nowhere.

Just wanted to point out; the reddit guy who leaked information on both this show and Punisher last year, turned out to be legit. And... I couldn't agree more with his assessment of this show (8/10, same praise/criticism all around). Crazy.

He spoke very, very highly of Punisher (10/10). So... can't wait.

 

[Nathan]

Overall, the show felt underwhelming. After waiting all this time for Daredevil, Jessica Jones, Luke Cage and Iron Fist to unite, I ended the show with a general feeling of meh. There were definitely some good parts, but it felt like everything could have been told and wrapped up in 4 Episodes, instead of 8.

Oh, and is it too late to cancel Season 2 of Iron Fist? Cast at least somebody else. I gave Finn Jones 2 chances. He's just bad.

 

[Loki882]

It was, underwhelming:

-The Hand's master plan kind of sucked in the end. That's "strike three" as far as making them interesting/menacing in the MCU for me, I don't care about them anymore.
-Sigourney Weaver's character ended being really disappointing to.
-Danny still sucks.
-Wasn't a fan of what they did with Elektra.
-Certain other plot-threads/characters didn't pay off either.
-The team dynamic overall was underwhelming.
-Etc.

On the flip side, forget a Luke/Danny spinoff, I want a Matt/Jessica spinoff. Because their dynamic was actually fun.

Overall, not really worth all of the buildup imo.

 

[Nathan]

On the flip side, forget a Luke/Danny spinoff, I want a Matt/Jessica spinoff. Because their dynamic was actually fun.

Yeah, they were great together. I really hope that we'll never actually get to see a Iron Fist and Luke cage spin-off. That'd just be a waste of everybody's time.

 

[Dasher10]

Enjoyed the whole thing on par with the first half of Luke Cage, maybe a little better. Underwhelmed with the last half of episodes but not for Netflix's usual drag, more so the plot/Hand situation. Felt it was going nowhere.

Just wanted to point out; the reddit guy who leaked information on both this show and Punisher last year, turned out to be legit. And... I couldn't agree more with his assessment of this show (8/10, same praise/criticism all around). Crazy.

He spoke very, very highly of Punisher (10/10). So... can't wait.

Link?

 

[Nathan]

You know, all this talk of Elektra being a vessel, I assumed that at the every bottom of the pit they dug up, there'd be some sort of ancient evil, that would possess her and threaten to destroy the world. Actually justifying Luke Cage's and Jessica Jones's presence on the team, since they're are the only two heavy hitter who could have taken it on. Actually giving them an opponent that would challenge them.

But instead of getting that, we get Jessica Jones and Luke Cage getting tossed around by Madame Gao.

 

[TheVileOne]

I still want Matt and Jessica to hook up

And yeah there did seem to be quite a bit of retconning for The Hand this season. Also, they basically lampshaded how Bakuto tried to get rid of Madame Gao and were enemy factions on Iron Fist.

 

[Matt Mortem]

I swear to Christ if Season 3 of Daredevil deals with Murdock having amnesia or some **** I'm gonna lose it.

 

[TheVileOne]

I swear to Christ if Season 3 of Daredevil deals with Murdock having amnesia or some **** I'm gonna lose it.

You think a convent of nuns would you know report that Matt's alive and they are treating him to somebody.

 

[Matt Mortem]

You think a convent of nuns would you know report that Matt's alive and they are treating him to somebody.

Amnesia is my least favorite plot device. It's boring and tedious. There's so much more than can do with Daredevil without falling into that and I really hope they avoid it.

 

[TheVileOne]

I agree Mortem, I hope they don't do a dumb amnesia subplot either. If they do that, I will call shenanigans.

 

[Matt Mortem]

I did really enjoy when the satellite characters got to interact. Trish and Karen. Foggy and Malcolm. I loved all that stuff. I kinda wish those characters had more to do. Even if it meant adding a few more episodes to do that I'm cool with it. Eight episodes felt too short.

 

[Poppy]

-Would much rather see a Daredevil/Jessica Jones show than a Luke/Iron Fist show after this. Charlie and Krysten played off each other soooo well.

This! While the show was underwhelming, those 2 were clearly the best parts. Alone, they are the most interesting characters but when they're together they're jsut so much fun. I was hoping we would see more of them, hanging out you know? But anyway, now i'm really looking for DD s3 and JJ s2 t:.

 

[Matt Mortem]

I'm a little miffed with the lack of costumes. Daredevil and Elektra ended up sticking out like a sore thumb and I feel the lack of costumes took away from the superhero teamup this wanted to be. I mean, how hard would it have been to just have Luke Cage in the yellow t-shirt he starts in. How hard would it be to fine something costume-esque for Iron Fist. It was clear he thought Daredevil and his shtick was cool. Why wouldn't he try and do the same?

 

[TheVileOne]

I'm a little miffed with the lack of costumes. Daredevil and Elektra ended up sticking out like a sore thumb and I feel the lack of costumes took away from the superhero teamup this wanted to be. I mean, how hard would it have been to just have Luke Cage in the yellow t-shirt he starts in. How hard would it be to fine something costume-esque for Iron Fist. It was clear he thought Daredevil and his shtick was cool. Why wouldn't he try and do the same?

I agree. Once again these shows hate costumes, and it was awkward that they refuse to give Iron Fist a costume. It was weird Daredevil is the only one who would wear one.

 

[Poppy]

I'm a little miffed with the lack of costumes. Daredevil and Elektra ended up sticking out like a sore thumb and I feel the lack of costumes took away from the superhero teamup this wanted to be. I mean, how hard would it have been to just have Luke Cage in the yellow t-shirt he starts in. How hard would it be to fine something costume-esque for Iron Fist. It was clear he thought Daredevil and his shtick was cool. Why wouldn't he try and do the same?

Very true.

Since Danny is "the new daredevil", aka new protector of NY, it would have made sense to show him on the rooftop with the same ninja outfit Matt wore in Daredevil S1 but with a little bit of yellow in there.

 

[TheVileOne]

Very true.

Since Danny is "the new daredevil", aka new protector of NY, it would have made sense to show him on the rooftop with the same ninja outfit Matt wore in Daredevil S1 but with a little bit of yellow in there.

That would've been the perfect note to end on for this season. Danny assuming the role of Hell's Kitchen new Defender for his fallen friend and becoming a symbol of superheroism and donning his own costume. Instead he's wearing some polo shirt with yellow strikes. I was like DAMMIT!

 

[Matt Mortem]

Yeah that was a huge missed opportunity.