The Israel-Palestine Politics Thread II

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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]471731[/split]

 

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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]317021[/split]

 

[SV Fan]

As long as the Republicans in congress are... somewhat creepily obsessed with Israel, I don't see much change happening.

Obama probably won't veto an aid package to Israel.

The last president to stand up to Israel and its lobby was Bush Sr. That led to the Oslo peace accords.

The Israeli lobby used to joke that they could get congress to sign a napkin. I think that might actually be true now, with this strange Israel worship Republicans in congress have.

I'm not saying he can't do anything, but Obama does not have the sway Bush Sr. did.

While I don't see much changing in terms of congress I can see the US sort of easing up at the UN constantly putting the kibosh on all things that go against Netanyahu's wishes.

I think the last few days Bibi opened up a can of worms that can be used against him in the future for anybody looking for a good excuse to turn on him

 

[Destructus86]

I'm so sad to hear he won again...I was so sure he was going to be replaced but once again racism wins. :/

 

[Charlatan]

I think with Bibi finally admitting he was lying all those years when he said he was considering a 2 state solution and vowing to never stop with the expansion into Palestine he has not only isolated Israel more in the world but added more fuel to the Arab fire and pretty much turned all the people who said he was never interested in peace into prophets.

It will be interesting to see if Obama continues to protect Israel from UN sanctions as we have for decades.

 

[Charlatan]

I'm so sad to hear he won again...I was so sure he was going to be replaced but once again racism wins. :/

it helps when 2/3 of the Arabs in the country can't vote.

 

[Destructus86]

it helps when 2/3 of the Arabs in the country can't vote.

So true.

I find it fascinating also that when I post something on my facebook that is even the slightest negative towards Israel I receive some of the most vile comments.


People are insane.

 

[Kelly]

Yes, Bibi has been lying all of these years, but why are people surprised? you really thought a 2 state deal would ever come about? Neither party wants a 2 state deal, and they never have....well possibly Rabin, but other that anyone that thought it was/is ever going to happen is naive at best.

The simple fact that the Jewish settlements are growing should have been a clue to everyone.

The Israeli/Palestinian Peace Process is simply a business for many, and the longer they stay at each others throats their business continues.

 

[Taarna]

Obama called the president of Iran the day he won his election.

And he did the same for Russia.

Yet he won't make a phone call to a USA Ally?

Something is very wrong here... Obama when on campaign said the bonds between Israel and the USA are unbreakable. He does not act like it. It could be a lie. This is a president who went on an apology tour in the middle east.

Just like..CLOSE GITMO he says....yet it remains open. Obama can close it if he wishes.


I can't leave my church in Chicago....then he does for political expediency.

OR no more bills with earmarks, then he signs one with over 100

OR Transparency. Not even close

Or how about if you like your doctor you can keep him/her with Obama care?

It will be interesting to see Obama's pardon list.

 

[herakles]

Obama called the president of Iran the day he won his election.

And he did the same for Russia.

Yet he won't make a phone call to a USA Ally?

Something is very wrong here... Obama when on campaign said the bonds between Israel and the USA are unbreakable. He does not act like it. It could be a lie. This is a president who went on a apology tour in the middle east.

Just like..CLOSE GITMO he says....yet it remains open. Obama can close it if he wishes.

Or

I can't leave my church in Chicago....then he does for political expediency.

OR no more bills with earmarks, then he signs one with over 100

OR Transparency. Not even close

Or how about if you like your doctor you can keep him/her with Obama care?

It will be interesting to see Obama's pardon list.

IF/When Obama bypasses the Constitution (Since He needs 2/3 of the Senate to sign Treaties) and signs a treaty with Iran you will see a huge political shift in the powerful US Jewish lobby. Billions will be spend to topple as many Democrats as possible in the 2016 elections.!

OR Transparency. Not even close

It will be interesting to see Obama's pardon list.

I know so much for Transparency but we both that Marxist Socialism doesn't care about Transparency unless it effects them!

I bet that list will include a former IRS director, Holder, and Al Sharpton.

 

[Destructus86]

Obama called the president of Iran the day he won his election.

And he did the same for Russia.

Yet he won't make a phone call to a USA Ally?

Something is very wrong here... Obama when on campaign said the bonds between Israel and the USA are unbreakable. He does not act like it. It could be a lie. This is a president who went on an apology tour in the middle east.

Just like..CLOSE GITMO he says....yet it remains open. Obama can close it if he wishes.


I can't leave my church in Chicago....then he does for political expediency.

OR no more bills with earmarks, then he signs one with over 100

OR Transparency. Not even close

Or how about if you like your doctor you can keep him/her with Obama care?

It will be interesting to see Obama's pardon list.

It could be he just doesn't want to call a leader that's incredibly racist and helping to lead the charge for racial hatred and violence.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Of course it's a lie. You really think Obama gives a **** about Israel? I wouldn't say he's anti-Israeli per se, but why would he have any love for it? It's not his country. He's never lived there. It's been nothing but a thorn in his side his entire presidency. Saying how super awesome Israel is and how great the US' relationship with it is, has become standard rhetoric in DC. It's like saying you regularly go to church, when you only really started going a week before formally announcing your presidential campaign.

The relationship is pretty bad, actually. Borderline abusive now.

 

[SV Fan]

Saying how super awesome Israel is and how great the US' relationship with it is, has become standard rhetoric in DC.

I honestly get annoyed with Netanyahu constantly shoving in our face how they are our number 1 ally. I am sorry I have to think there is many countries that I would consider a better ally then Israel. Canada and the UK come to mind near the top. The whole number one ally talking point from Netanyahu or Republicans just feels like something I would expect from a used car salesman who is trying to sell me a lemon and is trying to make me feel good.

 

[dony2012]

I really don't get it, you know.

The people of Israel hates him just as much as we hates him.

I just don't get why they've voted for him again :/

 

[regwec]

What evidence do you have that Israelis hate him that counterbalances the fact that they just voted for him?

 

[Kelly]

I really don't get it, you know.

The people of Israel just as much as we hates him.

I just don't get why they've voted for him again :/

And your evidence of this is?

 

[dony2012]

And your evidence of this is?

I know people from Israel, I have family in Israel, I'm in Israel RIGHT NOW.

So yeah, believe me I would know.

 

[regwec]

No, you just agree with your friends.

A general election is a better measurement of national mood.

 

[dony2012]

No, you just agree with your friends.

A general election is a better measurement of national mood.

I also watch Israeli news, read in Israeli forums. Believe me, most Israelis hates him. His votes came from the extremists and there are a lot of extremists in Israel.

 

[regwec]

But their votes outweigh the moderates, based on your assessment, so it is obviously wrong to say that most Israelis hate Netanyahu.

 

[SV Fan]

But their votes outweigh the moderates, based on your assessment, so it is obviously wrong to say that most Israelis hate Netanyahu.

I am not claiming I know much about Israel but I am guessing it's like any other country where you have your extremely liberal pockets and extremely conservative pockets. It's easy to get a false sense of what the country thinks as a whole if you just base it on one area.

 

[dony2012]

But their votes outweigh the moderates, based on your assessment, so it is obviously wrong to say that most Israelis hate Netanyahu.

I agree with you, what I meant is... how do I say it gently... the NORMAL, everyday, middle class Israeli hates him, unfortunately there are too many religious extremists in Israel who wants him as prime minister because they hate Muslims.

And yeah, what SV Fan said.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I don't think it's unreasonable to say that there has been a political shift in Israel towards the right, but it shouldn't be overstated.

The election turn out was "only" 72%, and Likud "only" won 23% of the vote. Israel isn't a two party state like the United States. Everyone and their brother has a party.

So considering there, are something like 8.2 million people in Israel (6.2 million being Jewish), it's not like the entire Israeli population has gone full blown right wing.

And even those who vote for Likud aren't necessarily all voting because its anti-Arab. Most probably are though. Some smaller parties are much more extreme, like the The Jewish Home. Think the Israeli Tea Party, only not quite as pro-Israel.

 

[SV Fan]

And even those who vote for Likud aren't necessarily all voting because its anti-Arab. Most probably are though.

I don't think most voted Lukud because they are racists, i think they just held a blind eye to how racist Netanyahu's comments were. Basically the racists Arab comments he made was to try win over people in the far right to vote him instead of the far right (more racist) parties.

 

[dony2012]

Another thing that's interesting is the fact that the Zionist Union who won second is pro-Arab and the Joint List who were in third place ARE Arabs, and together they have more votes than the Likud.