The Joker Thread - Part 1

[Captain Tired]

I rank Ledger about fourth or fifth, personally.

Heresy, I know.

 

[Boom]

Ledger's still the bar for me.

I loved Phoenix as a unique, one-off take on the character, but I have zero desire to see that Joker inhabiting an actual Batman film.

 

[Schlosser85]

Ledger is easily my favorite live-action Joker so far, but that doesn’t preclude me being welcoming of another.

 

[AndyTrevino]

I think both Ledger and Phoenix gave terrific, Oscar-worthy performances.

I also think it’s silly to act like that makes Phoenix some kind of gatekeeper of a character that’s been around since 1940 and act like Reeves somehow “has” to cast Phoenix who gave a very specific interpretation of a proto-Joker that might not fit at all with what Reeves has in mind, if he even has The Joker in mind at all.

Yeah. Phoenix and Ledger both deserved their Oscar, but I wouldn't consider either of their Jokers to be the "definitive" version.

It's the classic bleached-skin-with-tuxedo Joker for me. That's the bar, and that version is pretty much exclusive to the comics (for now at least).

 

[Schlosser85]

Yeah. Phoenix and Ledger both deserved their Oscar, but I wouldn't consider either of their Jokers to be the "definitive" version. It's the classic bleach-skin-with-tuxedo Joker for me.

This. I love Ledger’s Joker and have zero problem with him in the movie he inhabits, but I’d still really like to get the classic permawhite and debonair Joker onscreen in live-action.

 

[shauner111]

Yeah. Phoenix and Ledger both deserved their Oscar, but I wouldn't consider either of their Jokers to be the "definitive" version.

It's the classic bleached-skin-with-tuxedo Joker for me. That's the bar, and that version is pretty much exclusive to the comics (for now at least).

So Leto is the bar?

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I always want to see new, radically different versions of these characters. The superhero genre is built upon constant reinvention.

 

[AndyTrevino]

So Leto is the bar?

If the performance and look had been better, then sure.

 

[AndyTrevino]

I always want to see new, radically different versions of these characters. The superhero genre is built upon constant reinvention.

I'm not opposed to more reinventions, but after seeing reinvention after reinvention, it kinda makes you want something a bit more traditional, even if it's just design-wise.

 

[Eddie Dean]

I agree, if he had given a good performance and his makeup was actually good, he would have been good.

 

[Captain Tired]

There's only so many dead rats and used condoms you can send to your co-stars before that sweet smell of Oscar gold rears its tiny head again.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

While superficially good casting (he was an uncontroversial choice, yeah? I wasn't actively paying attention to DC fandom around then but from casual observation I don't recall any serious blow-back) I do wonder if Leto would have been good even in a movie that wasn't absolute swill. The obnoxious design didn't help matters but he went so hard on trying to transparently recapture the mystique around Ledger's performances, especially all the bull**** rumors about him going 'crazy' circulating after his death as opposed to the fairly lowkey bits of method acting Heath was actually doing, that he might have gone down that weird insufferable route regardless.

Part of me wants to see the scenes we know were cut of him because they sound hysterical. Especially his deal with Echantress.

 

[Captain Tired]

Yeah I think it was misconceived and flawed right from the start. And that's on both Leto and Ayer.

 

[Schlosser85]

While superficially good casting (he was an uncontroversial choice, yeah? I wasn't actively paying attention to DC fandom around then but from casual observation I don't recall any serious blow-back) I do wonder if Leto would have been good even in a movie that wasn't absolute swill. The obnoxious design didn't help matters but he went so hard on trying to transparently recapture the mystique around Ledger's performances, especially all the bull**** rumors about him going 'crazy' circulating after his death as opposed to the fairly lowkey bits of method acting Heath was actually doing, that he might have gone down that weird insufferable route regardless.

Part of me wants to see the scenes we know were cut of him because they sound hysterical. Especially his deal with Echantress.

Personally I think Leto's Oscar went to his head and inflated his already-present pretentiousness, which both his roles in Suicide Squad and Blade Runner dripped of.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I think the overt narcissism wound up working for Blade Runner.

 

[Schlosser85]

I think the overt narcissism wound up working for Blade Runner.

You could make that case. That he’s playing a profound narcissist/megalomanic with a god complex anyway.

 

[Captain Tired]

I wonder if being thought of as the George Lazenby of Jokers will have given him some humility now.

 

[AndyTrevino]

I think the overt narcissism wound up working for Blade Runner.

I think he ironically seemed more Joker THERE than in the movie that had him playing the actual character. Granted, it's more Frank Miller or Grant Morrison than say, Neal Adams for instance, but still.

 

[SwordOfMorning]

I wonder if being thought of as the George Lazenby of Jokers will have given him some humility now.

Having a personal cult probably makes up for it.

 

[Schlosser85]

I wonder if being thought of as the George Lazenby of Jokers will have given him some humility now.

lol, that's a good reference

 

[Schlosser85]

I think he ironically seemed more Joker THERE than in the movie that had him playing the actual character. Granted, it's more Frank Miller or Grant Morrison than say, Neal Adams for instance, but still.

Eh, I don't think Wallace is anything like Joker, personality-wise or goal-wise.

 

[Captain Tired]

lol, that's a good reference

One that was grudgingly made, as I actually really like Lazenby as Bond.

 

[AndyTrevino]

Eh, I don't think Wallace is anything like Joker, personality-wise or goal-wise.

I was coming more from the demeanor/the way he carries himself.

 

[Eddie Dean]

The problem with Jared Leto’s Joker is that he’s a bad actor with poor instincts.

 

[Schlosser85]

Leto is not a bad actor (at least not inherently), but he does have poor instincts sometimes and I think his ego is making them poorer recently.