Comics The SUPERIOR Spider-Man - Part 1

[Spider-Gnome]

Oh, and I think I share THUNDERSTRIKE's disdain for the Amazing Spider-Man movie as well.

 

[Doc Ock]

No worries... I think he gets kicked off the team around issue #6...

Hmm, intriguing. I really wish Marvel would stop this double shipping business though. Or I'm gonna end up only buying Spider-Man and X-Men related titles and nothing more.

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

Oh, and I think I share THUNDERSTRIKE's disdain for the Amazing Spider-Man movie as well.

you've got a good memory for my hatreds there, son...

I must've really made a memorable impression with my orneriness...

and you know, you're the first person that's ever referred me as being that...

you make me sound like Gran Torino Clint Eastwood...

I LIKE it... t:

though I DO prefer "that old bastard"... LOL...

 

[Mr. Dent]

I would say The Spectacular Spider-Man was to Spider-Man what Batman The Animated Series was to Batman. I think they were on par. To me, Spectacular was better than the Raimi trilogy and The Amazing Spider-Man movie from last year.

Thankfully I think TASM2 will be a lot closer to TSSM than the first movie was.

 

[Spider-Gnome]

you've got a good memory for my hatreds there, son...

I must've really made a memorable impression with my orneriness...

and you know, you're the first person that's ever referred me as being that...

you make me sound like Gran Torino Clint Eastwood...

I LIKE it... t:

though I DO prefer "that old bastard"... LOL...

I figured you would...


Yes, you are one of the posters that I remember, mainly because you're one of the few that are actually older than me and have been a Spidey fan longer than me (I started around '72/'73). And we don't seem to agree on many things (you stated a disdain for Andru that had me and TMOB like ). So, I do notice on those rare times when we agree.

I think you also said you liked Spectacular, which is another thing we would agree on...

 

[Spider-Gnome]

Thankfully I think TASM2 will be a lot closer to TSSM than the first movie was.

TASM just left a bad taste in my mouth, I'd just wish Marvel could get a hold of the property and get a movie on par with the current Marvel movie universe and eventually have Spidey in Avengers 3.

I will probably end up seeing TASM2, but I'm not looking forward to it...

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

I figured you would...


Yes, you are one of the posters that I remember, mainly because you're one of the few that are actually older than me and have been a Spidey fan longer than me (I started around '72/'73). And we don't seem to agree on many things (you stated a disdain for Andru that had me and TMOB like ). So, I do notice on those rare times when we agree.

I think you also said you liked Spectacular, which is another thing we would agree on...

yeah, I can take Ross at certain times back in the day... you gotta remember that I grew up on Ditko and Romita... never liked Kane's stuff when he came on and then Romita returned... so when Andru came on, I was like aw HELL, because I remembered that MSH #14 issue with his art, so I always had that ish in my memory banks... but I grew to accept him in a fashion... though I was happy when Pollard, JRJR and then Frenz followed...

yeah, I despise the first ASM movie... that's in no way Peter Parker or Spidey that we know...

and the less said about the USM cartoon, the better... I highly agree that SSM is the BTAS of Marvel for a quality animated...

as for the titles themselves, I really can't get into a lot of today's artists... I just find some of them... messy and ugly, to be honest... and storywise, Slott to ME, is not the be-all and end-all of Spidey writers... he's pretty much a roller coaster scribe in MY book... he can be good and then he falters...

in the case of the Superior title, I have NO idea WHAT to make of it all... it has SOME good points and then I'll find I don't like some of it... I'm really on the fence...

so that's what I'M allabout when it comes to being a Spidey fan since '64... opinionated as hell, but trying to ride thru the good and the bad and sometimes the ugly, LOL...

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

TASM just left a bad taste in my mouth, I'd just wish Marvel could get a hold of the property and get a movie on par with the current Marvel movie universe and eventually have Spidey in Avengers 3.

I will probably end up seeing TASM2, but I'm not looking forward to it...

same here...

 

[Mr. Dent]

TASM just left a bad taste in my mouth, I'd just wish Marvel could get a hold of the property and get a movie on par with the current Marvel movie universe and eventually have Spidey in Avengers 3.

I will probably end up seeing TASM2, but I'm not looking forward to it...

I don't think it would be any better at Marvel. It might be worst. Sony has already proven they can make good Spider-Man films, SM3 and TASM were just unavoidable hiccups. TASM2 should be great.

 

[Themanofbat]

I really did NOT like The Amazing Spider-Man movie...

It had a few good points... like the fight scenes in the school... but everything else seemed so bad... bad writing, bad acting, and an over-all piss-poor story...

I could get into specifics... but I'm in a good mood right now.

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

you know what just pissed the hell out of me about the ASM movie?... from Day One, I just DID NOT like the look of the costume and the way it was tampered with...

there's just so many other points about the movie that pissed me off, as well, but the movie is history now and I never look back...

 

[Spider-Gnome]

yeah, I can take Ross at certain times back in the day... you gotta remember that I grew up on Ditko and Romita... never liked Kane's stuff when he came on and then Romita returned... so when Andru came on, I was like aw HELL,

I hear you. When I started it was Kane's pencils and Romita's inks, so that was my vision after discovering the comic after watching re-runs of the 60's cartoon. But, soon afterward Andru took over for the bulk of my childhood. So, I really like all four just mentioned, Ditko, Romita, Kane, & Andru. I prefer Romita's later work (early 70's) to earlier work.

because I remembered that MSH #14 issue with his art, so I always had that ish in my memory banks...

I know the issue of which you speak, because I have it in one of those big Treasury Editions (remember those?) of Spider-Man. Yeah, I didn't like the art, and years later when I bothered to look at who the artist was, I was surprised it was Andru. So, I guess it was one of his earlier stuff.

but I grew to accept him in a fashion... though I was happy when Pollard, JRJR and then Frenz followed...

Wasn't a big Pollard fan, a bit bland. But, I did like JRJR and Frenz. I prefer JRJR when he came back during JMS's run. Those 80's issues looked like he was coping his father's style, but since he's come back, he has his own style which I reall dig.

yeah, I despise the first ASM movie... that's in no way Peter Parker or Spidey that we know...

Thank you. Never understood posters that said Garfield finally got the character right. I mean, are they reading the same book?

as for the titles themselves, I really can't get into a lot of today's artists... I just find some of them... messy and ugly, to be honest... and storywise, Slott to ME, is not the be-all and end-all of Spidey writers... he's pretty much a roller coaster scribe in MY book... he can be good and then he falters...

in the case of the Superior title, I have NO idea WHAT to make of it all... it has SOME good points and then I'll find I don't like some of it... I'm really on the fence...

so that's what I'M allabout when it comes to being a Spidey fan since '64... opinionated as hell, but trying to ride thru the good and the bad and sometimes the ugly, LOL...

I can see how someone like Ramos's art can be off putting, particularly for someone use to classic comic book arc. I just like artist that have a certain style, whether it's Ramos, JRJR, Campbell, Ditko, or Wieringo. Part of me that gets defensive about Ramos's art was I heard the same sort of thing about 'Ringo when he came to the title. Now I'm not saying people were ripping apart his anatomy, but they complained he was too cartoony. 'Ringo is one of my favorite artist to draw Spidey.

As for Slott, I think he has been the best writer of Spidey in a loooong time. I think he has an excellent grasp of the character, great knowledge of his history and continuity, and I enjoy his plotting of all the details.

And as for Superior, I'm just enjoying the ride, not worrying about status quo, because you know eventually Pete will win and return.

I don't think it would be any better at Marvel. It might be worst. Sony has already proven they can make good Spider-Man films, SM3 and TASM were just unavoidable hiccups. TASM2 should be great.

Yes, I enjoyed Spidey 1 & 2, but I want something more in line of Spectacular, and I want it integrated with the rest of the movie universe.

you know what just pissed the hell out of me about the ASM movie?... from Day One, I just DID NOT like the look of the costume and the way it was tampered with...

there's just so many other points about the movie that pissed me off, as well, but the movie is history now and I never look back...

Yes, I'm a stickler for costumes and I hated what they did. The worse thing I can say about the film was I didn't feel engaged with the character or story, which is bad because it's Spider-Man, my favorite superhero.

 

[runawayboulder]

I've yet to see the ASM movie. The reason being is that is was waaaaaay too soon between that movie and the Raimi trilogy. There needs to be more of a gap. Perfect example, I loved the Nolan Batman movies but I was ecstatic to hear that the new movies is now in developmental hell now that the JLA movie fell apart this week.

It's over-saturation. It killed comics in the 90's now the comic movies are creeping into that same territory if they're not careful.

 

[VenomSpawn]

As much as I hate Ramos' art.... at least he isn't as bad as the guy doing the Alpha mini. Holy ****. I can't believe something that horrible could even be printed.

 

[Mr. Dent]

Yes, I enjoyed Spidey 1 & 2, but I want something more in line of Spectacular, and I want it integrated with the rest of the movie universe.

You know Sony made Spectacular right?

 

[Themanofbat]

I hated the movie costume.

I hated that Peter Parker made a promise to Captain Stacy only to say "F%$#k it!" five minutes later (yes... I know it might have been a week or two in the movie), but that's a *****e bag manoeuvre, not a Peter Parker manoeuvre. If they had waited until the mid-way point of the second movie where his raging hormones would have kicked in, I might have bought it.

I hated that he walks into a room with tens of thousands of spiders where ONE of them gives him powers... what? nobody else ever get bitten? I know they're trying to set up the fact that Peter was probably genetically "altered" by his father, but that wasn't clear to me, and I can't imagine what the casual movie goer thought...

I hated that after he shows up at Gwen's practically torn to shreds, they then go swinging merrily through the city, nary a scratch on his costume.

I hated the basketball scene... I hated the football goalpost scene... which btw, would have destroyed the ball before actually bending a steel post.

I hated the scene where Peter shows up almost beaten to death, and Aunt May just hugs him... no questions asked...

I hated that his spider-sense didn't work in the sewers...

I hated that after we get all this tension with that Osborn right-hand man, he disappears after the bridge scene... never to be heard of again.

I hated that he got shot in the leg... again, Spider-Sense?

I hated how he gets to sneak into Osborn without any security knowing? Seriously?

I hated that he didn't "invent" his webbing... he buys it from Osborn off the internet. Fack!

I hated how the whole story didn't flow at all... it was too choppy and poorly edited...

And finally, I hated how I could have gave two ****s about his parents' even though they're supposed to be pivotal to the story.

There's more stuff... but that's a fair summary.

I was also not a big fan of Kane's arta AT THE TIME... every panel seemed to show a guy's face looking up his nose... with that weird hatching... I can appreciate the storytelling aspects of it now, but it was weird to me as a kid.

And Gnomie... tell me it ain't so that you didn't like Pollard's art... I personally LOVED it, really made Wolfman's story come to life... but I really have a tremendous rose-coloured love affair with ASM #185 to 200.

 

[runawayboulder]

Geez.....some of that sounds really awful. Buying webbing off the internet....seriously?

 

[THUNDERSTRIKE]

I hated the movie costume.

I hated that Peter Parker made a promise to Captain Stacy only to say "F%$#k it!" five minutes later (yes... I know it might have been a week or two in the movie), but that's a *****e bag manoeuvre, not a Peter Parker manoeuvre. If they had waited until the mid-way point of the second movie where his raging hormones would have kicked in, I might have bought it.

I hated that he walks into a room with tens of thousands of spiders where ONE of them gives him powers... what? nobody else ever get bitten? I know they're trying to set up the fact that Peter was probably genetically "altered" by his father, but that wasn't clear to me, and I can't imagine what the casual movie goer thought...

I hated that after he shows up at Gwen's practically torn to shreds, they then go swinging merrily through the city, nary a scratch on his costume.

I hated the basketball scene... I hated the football goalpost scene... which btw, would have destroyed the ball before actually bending a steel post.

I hated the scene where Peter shows up almost beaten to death, and Aunt May just hugs him... no questions asked...

I hated that his spider-sense didn't work in the sewers...

I hated that after we get all this tension with that Osborn right-hand man, he disappears after the bridge scene... never to be heard of again.

I hated that he got shot in the leg... again, Spider-Sense?

I hated how he gets to sneak into Osborn without any security knowing? Seriously?

I hated that he didn't "invent" his webbing... he buys it from Osborn off the internet. Fack!

I hated how the whole story didn't flow at all... it was too choppy and poorly edited...

And finally, I hated how I could have gave two ****s about his parents' even though they're supposed to be pivotal to the story.

There's more stuff... but that's a fair summary.

I was also not a big fan of Kane's arta AT THE TIME... every panel seemed to show a guy's face looking up his nose... with that weird hatching... I can appreciate the storytelling aspects of it now, but it was weird to me as a kid.

And Gnomie... tell me it ain't so that you didn't like Pollard's art... I personally LOVED it, really made Wolfman's story come to life... but I really have a tremendous rose-coloured love affair with ASM #185 to 200.

GREAT overview, guy... I bow to your wisdom in these matters...

oh, and one more glaring omission in your post... the look of the Lizard absolutely sucked in this first ASM movie as much as the look of the Goblin sucked in the first SM movie...

all in all, yeah, ASM was pretty much of an asswipe of a movie...

 

[Themanofbat]

Geez.....some of that sounds really awful. Buying webbing off the internet....seriously?

And he didn't use Google... he uses Bing...

 

[Spider-Gnome]

As much as I hate Ramos' art.... at least he isn't as bad as the guy doing the Alpha mini. Holy ****. I can't believe something that horrible could even be printed.

Not sure who's doing it. But, just to show I'm not just a fan of "bad" art, I loved Ramos, but after he first came to the title, another artist, I can't remember his name, came on who had a style similar to Ramos, but I didn't care for it. It seem to copy it without capturing it. Maybe it was because it "broke" too much like what THUNDERSTRIKE complains of Ramos.

You know Sony made Spectacular right?

Yes. That's why I wish Sony was INSANE and made a deal with Marvel to keep the animation/TV rights and give up the movie rights. That way, we would have Spectacular continue and possibly get a better movie than TASM and one that tied into the movie universe (and maybe get Spidey in something like Avengers 3). Yes, I know Sony would never do that, maybe somewhere in Bizarro world...

I hated the movie costume.

I hated that Peter Parker made a promise to Captain Stacy only to say "F%$#k it!" five minutes later (yes... I know it might have been a week or two in the movie), but that's a *****e bag manoeuvre, not a Peter Parker manoeuvre. If they had waited until the mid-way point of the second movie where his raging hormones would have kicked in, I might have bought it.

I hated that he walks into a room with tens of thousands of spiders where ONE of them gives him powers... what? nobody else ever get bitten? I know they're trying to set up the fact that Peter was probably genetically "altered" by his father, but that wasn't clear to me, and I can't imagine what the casual movie goer thought...

I hated that after he shows up at Gwen's practically torn to shreds, they then go swinging merrily through the city, nary a scratch on his costume.

I hated the basketball scene... I hated the football goalpost scene... which btw, would have destroyed the ball before actually bending a steel post.

I hated the scene where Peter shows up almost beaten to death, and Aunt May just hugs him... no questions asked...

I hated that his spider-sense didn't work in the sewers...

I hated that after we get all this tension with that Osborn right-hand man, he disappears after the bridge scene... never to be heard of again.

I hated that he got shot in the leg... again, Spider-Sense?

I hated how he gets to sneak into Osborn without any security knowing? Seriously?

I hated that he didn't "invent" his webbing... he buys it from Osborn off the internet. Fack!

I hated how the whole story didn't flow at all... it was too choppy and poorly edited...

And finally, I hated how I could have gave two ****s about his parents' even though they're supposed to be pivotal to the story.

There's more stuff... but that's a fair summary.

Thanks for typing that so I didn't have to. There was some other stuff, but mainly it was Pete's portrayal and the need to change things that bugged me. As flawed as the Raimi movies may be, they were infinitely closer to the source material.

I was also not a big fan of Kane's arta AT THE TIME... every panel seemed to show a guy's face looking up his nose... with that weird hatching... I can appreciate the storytelling aspects of it now, but it was weird to me as a kid.

My intro was Kane's work with Romita's inks and I loved them. To me, this was real comic book Spider-Man compared to the cartoon. A few years later, I discovered back issues and got a number of Kane's "own" work and I actually loved them too. The Savage World (Gwen in a bikini!) arc and the six arm/Morbius/lizard arc are stand outs!

And Gnomie... tell me it ain't so that you didn't like Pollard's art... I personally LOVED it, really made Wolfman's story come to life... but I really have a tremendous rose-coloured love affair with ASM #185 to 200.

Hate to disappoint you, 'bats. I didn't hate the art, just not a fan, particularly coming after Andru. And I know you're a big fan of that era, but to me, that's when I drifted off comics. Andru and MJ left the title and I was getting into junior high/high school. The only thing I remember was the intro of Black Cat that I liked. It wasn't until senior year that I got back in, in part thanks to MJ's return, JRJR art, and a new character named Hobgoblin...

(and going to college near Forbidden Planet )

Geez.....some of that sounds really awful. Buying webbing off the internet....seriously?

Yeah, don't listen to those posters that TASM was closer to the comics. Listen to us old guys. t:

oh, and one more glaring omission in your post... the look of the Lizard absolutely sucked in this first ASM movie as much as the look of the Goblin sucked in the first SM movie...

Yup, I was going to say that was what TMOB missed. I'd say his look was even worse than Gobby's, and I hated Gobby's look.

 

[runawayboulder]

And he didn't use Google... he uses Bing...

That mother******

 

[Mr. Dent]

I don't agree that Spider-Man should be in the MCU or at least the Avengers. He works better by himself and it took years before he joined the Avengers anyway. Right now it doesn't even make sense for him to be a apart of the team because he's still a kid while all of the Avengers are like late 20s-early 40s and then Thor. I'm pretty sure Marvel and Sony already worked out some cross promotion clause in the deal that sent Marvel the merchandising rights back because they are able to use things like the Oscorp building and ESU name, so I'm sure they'll start dropping hints that Spidey exists in the Avengers world but just isn't apart of the Avengers or is acting before the Avengers are formed (which makes sense because not many heroes should be active when Peter first becomes Spidey other than the FF, who Marvel don't have the rights to, and Hulk.

Also, we can get a better film than TASM from Sony, and we have. SM3 was just a series of unfortunate circumstances that weren't entire Sony's fault (most of it wasn't) and TASM wasn't up to par because they had a lot of limitations on them with it being a reboot so early. It looks like they're about to kick in the door with TASM2 and it should get the Spidey film franchise back up to par.

 

[Doc Ock]

I liked TASM *runs away*

 

[Themanofbat]

I don't know... Max Dillon is sad because his Mommy forgot his birthday, and then gets mad when Spidey won't be his BFF/partner?

It sounds like we might be lucky to get a second movie that was on par with the first.... and that ain't saying much.

I'm a long time Spidey fan... maybe not as long as SG & TS... but my first exposure was the cartoon back in 1972 (it was the Scorpion one... the second one), and started getting into the comics in 1975... so I WANT TO LIKE THESE MOVIES!!!!

But unfortunately, unlike Spider-Man 1, when I walked out breathless, when I walked out of TASM, I just felt like I watched slop.... despite some decent effects... like I said before, some of the fighting scenes were awesome... but anything & everything else was lame and laughable...

... and from what I read, TASM2 doesn't sound like anything's gonna improve... but we can hope.

 

[Themanofbat]

I liked TASM *runs away*

Why you!!!!