Homecoming The Zendaya is possibly someone, maybe thread - Part 3

[harryoscop]

Mary Jane in name only?

You've yet to see the movie.

You've yet to see what kind of twists or developments they'll do with her.

Also if you think MJ is just simply a modelesque beauty queen, you clearly haven't read that many versions of her or only care about her looks. It's her personality that counts.

It's also the fact that she has been a simple girl next door who later was also able to be a beautiful model type in the Ultimate Universe.

Which is just about as John Hughes as you can get and this film was always upfront that it was taking cues from Hughes.

You have no reason to hate Zendaya as MJ right now. No ground to stand on. Well, at least not ground you want to stand on, because it's shaky at best and at worst, well you know.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Yes, Harry, nice gif usage.

Very great counter point to the fact you couldn't counter at all.

Anyways, back to semi-retirement.

It's been fun, gang!

 

[Dark Raven]

Sure, but i really really really hope she's not Mary Jane.

First, she is playing a character called "Michelle", and i don't believe she will be "Michelle Jane Watson".
Second, the all black thing, i don't think Peter will have two black girls love interest in a row.

The idea alone that she is playing MJ is frighting, it's so ridiculous it's not even funny.
If that happens, it can very well be Marvel's Clone Saga, and we all know the damage is brought to the Spider-Man brand.

She won't be. Watson will probably be dropped entirely. She'll probably be something like Michelle Johnson or Michelle Jones or whatever last name you want to give her with a J. That gives you the MJ initials without her having to use the "Jane Watson" bit to complete it, and replacing Mary with Michelle entirely.

 

[YoungBlood]

I'm gonna be real here, they should have let Zendaya be Mary Jane.
All of this secret crap they're trying to pull is not helping this character.
In all honesty, we're due for Mary Jane to be back in a Spider-Man film, but I want the real Mary Jane, not this She's All That/She Cleaned Up Nicely hipster garbage.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

Anyways, back to semi-retirement.

It's been fun, gang!

Bye dude, it's nice to see an oldbie return.

 

[YoungBlood]

She won't be. Watson will probably be dropped entirely. She'll probably be something like Michelle Johnson or Michelle Jones or whatever last name you want to give her with a J. That gives you the MJ initials without her having to use the "Jane Watson" bit to complete it, and replacing Mary with Michelle entirely.

Like Robin John Blake in TDKR (all though that was an easter egg/ mythology gag).

 

[Broseph44]

This whole thing seems so complicated and unnecessary honestly, when it could've just been handled in a simpler way.

 

[harryoscop]

Yes, Harry, nice gif usage.

Very great counter point to the fact you couldn't counter at all.

Anyways, back to semi-retirement.

It's been fun, gang!

If you had seen any of the trailers/payed attention to Michelle's personality, you'd know why I used that gif

 

[Abudefduf]

Look Jen, you're awesome and all and I really wish they'd allow you to join the MCU but believe me, the situation here is a bit more complicated than it may appear at first glance. It's not just about her looks, that the least of the problems.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tb9eBo3mHoI

Reposting this video here because why not, it's cute, and a perfect example of what it could have been... well, kinda.

 

[harryoscop]

This whole thing seems so complicated and unnecessary honestly, when it could've just been handled in a simpler way.

Yeah, just let Zendaya play a comic-accurate MJ, why was that so hard for them? She would have been completely different from Dunst. Why ruin the character with this "Michelle-MJ" nonsense?

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Ah yes. The trailers.

Where Michelle speaks barely any lines in a two hour plus movie that she's sure to have more in.

Besides, there's nothing saying that MJ can't be mean either. She has the capabilities of being mean. She has been mean in the books to Peter. They didn't start off automatically in love.

And in fact one of my favorite MJ scenes is the scene after Gwen dies where Peter accuses her of not caring and that they're barely even friends before she closes the door and they grieve together.

MJ and Peter's beginnings weren't squeaky clean or nice or easy. That was only in the Ultimate Universe where they were best friends and neighbors from the get go.

 

[Broseph44]

Ah yes. The trailers.

Where Michelle speaks barely any lines in a two hour plus movie that she's sure to have more in.

Besides, there's nothing saying that MJ can't be mean either. She has the capabilities of being mean. She has been mean in the books to Peter. They didn't start off automatically in love.

And in fact one of my favorite MJ scenes is the scene after Gwen dies where Peter accuses her of not caring and that they're barely even friends before she closes the door and they grieve together.

MJ and Peter's beginnings weren't squeaky clean or nice. That was only in the Ultimate Universe where they were best friends and neighbors from the get go.

Zendaya herself I just am not on board with in general as an actress. But that aside, from the spoilers I've read in the spoiler thread my main thing is why not just handle this all in a simpler way? Just make her MJ. Why this whole weird she's Michelle J something and that equals "MJ". Just make the girl MJ. Why do this weird thing?

 

[Dark Raven]

Yeah, just let Zendaya play a comic-accurate MJ, why was that so hard for them? She would have been completely different from Dunst. Why ruin the character with this "Michelle-MJ" nonsense?

If they wanted to introduce MJ secretly, then just don't even announce Zendaya as part of the cast if she's MJ (the real MJ - Mary Jane Watson). Just have the running joke that Aunt May wants to set Peter up with someone and Mary Jane only appears at the very end of the movie and we see her for the very first time.

Don't have some switcheroo that we've seen this girl all movie but never realised it was MJ all along. First of all, we do all know so no-one is falling for that crap. And second, it just doesn't fit at all with her character. If personality is supposed to be what is important, well they've completely gotten that bit wrong.

 

[Broseph44]

If they wanted to introduce MJ secretly, then just don't even announce Zendaya as part of the cast if she's MJ (the real MJ - Mary Jane Watson). Just have the running joke that Aunt May wants to set Peter up with someone and Mary Jane only appears at the very end of the movie and we see her for the very first time.

Don't have some switcheroo that we've seen this girl all movie but never realised it was MJ all along. First of all, we do all know so no-one is falling for that crap. And second, it just doesn't fit at all with her character. If personality is supposed to be what is important, well they've completely gotten that bit wrong.

This

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Peter begins to date her, much to the annoyance of Gwen Stacy. However, they eventually become irritated with each other and Peter subsequently chooses to date Gwen. Mary Jane, who becomes Harry Osborn's love interest and girlfriend, remains a close friend to Peter and Gwen.

Mary Jane attempts to comfort Peter. Peter, who is distraught over the loss of Gwen Stacy, angrily confronts MJ about her seemingly flighty and carefree attitude. He questions her ability to ever care about people like him and Gwen, and states "You wouldn't be sorry if your own mother died," unaware that her mother had actually died. Mary Jane is hurt by Peter's comments. She attempts to leave, but hesitates as she approaches the door, and ultimately chooses to stay with him.[15] This served as a turning point in their relationship, and over the next couple of years, she and Peter become very close friends. Eventually, upon realizing the feelings that they share for one another, they decide to take their relationship to the next level. Their relationship has a few initial hurdles, such as MJ's hot temper and Peter's always dashing off to be Spider-Man.

Sigh. I swear it's like you all don't even know the character you're talking about. Peter and MJ could not stand one another when they first met. They were not a love at first sight, best friends forever thing in the main universe.

If anything Michelle being annoyed by him and secretly harboring some feelings is probably more accurate than actually starting out with her being a beautiful red head who is automatically in love with him.

 

[Broseph44]

Sigh. I swear it's like you all don't even know the character you're talking about. Peter and MJ could not stand one another when they first met. They were not a love at first sight, best friends forever thing in the main universe.

If anything Michelle being annoyed by him and secretly harboring some feelings is probably more accurate than actually starting out with her being a beautiful red head who is automatically in love with him.

I myself am simply asking why didn't they just make her Mary Jane from the start. Why this Michelle "MJ" stuff? Just make her Mary Jane from the get go.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

I myself am simply asking why didn't they just make her Mary Jane from the start. Why this Michelle "MJ" stuff? Just make her Mary Jane from the get go.

That is puzzling to even me. I don't know why they named her Michelle. I really don't. But it's not the end of the world if her name is changed, as long as she eventually gets red hair it's fine by me.

Most people call her MJ anyways instead of her full name.

 

[Dark Raven]

Even if this weren't Zendaya who had been cast but someone who looked the spitting image of Mary Jane in the comics and they still decided to call her Michelle and have her go through a "She's All That" transformation arc, that would still be pretty terrible.

Zendaya has said very specifically that she's not Mary Jane Watson and has even emphasised that she's not lying and asked how many times she needs to keep saying this. But while that might be technically accurate what she's saying, she's just omitting the fact that she will be Michelle J who will become MJ by initials only. She hasn't said she's not MJ, only she's not Mary Jane Watson.

 

[Spider-man95]

Remember that this all stems from one guy on reddit. :P

Just saying....

For some reason I'm not sure if it would be getting constant positive reviews if something this silly and controversial to a beloved Spider-Man character ends up in the film, I dunno. I'm probably wrong and maybe the critics just don't care about the change as much as some of us.

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Remember that this all stems from one guy on reddit. :P

Just saying....

For some reason I'm not sure if it would be getting constant positive reviews if something this silly and controversial to a beloved Spider-Man character ends up in the film, I dunno. I'm probably wrong and maybe the critics just don't care about the change as much as some of us.

I mean he was backed up by multiple people as having seen the movie.

So I'm leaning towards truth. He also revealed the Glover as Aaron Davis thing before it was common knowledge I believe. Could be wrong about that, but I believe that's true.

 

[Spider-man95]

I mean he was backed up by multiple people as having seen the movie.

So I'm leaning towards truth. He also revealed the Glover as Aaron Davis thing before it was common knowledge I believe. Could be wrong about that, but I believe that's true.

I don't think it was difficult to predict who Glover was playing. The people who backed this guy are other random people on reddit were they not?

 

[harryoscop]

Sigh. I swear it's like you all don't even know the character you're talking about. Peter and MJ could not stand one another when they first met. They were not a love at first sight, best friends forever thing in the main universe.

If anything Michelle being annoyed by him and secretly harboring some feelings is probably more accurate than actually starting out with her being a beautiful red head who is automatically in love with him.

Michelle shares zero traits with comic Mary Jane. She's the exact opposite of her. Show me an example when MJ was ever a frumpy, unpopular, lonely brooding bookworm who has no friends? MJ was NEVER like that. She was always the life of the Party, she was always fun, fabulous & exciting-- to the point where it angered Peter (in the scene you posted) become she didn't know how to turn it off. MJ never started off like Michelle in any version.

 

[spideyboy_1111]

Personally, i never understood the people that want Daniel Rand to be Asian.

An Asian that knows martial arts....stereotypical much?

i lost a friend of 23 years over this.... what was more confusing is she wouldn't explain (as a white woman) what actually offended her... I asked if it was a white man knowing kung-fu, hand ninjas, madame gao, ... and she couldn't give any examples.. just kept screaming "cultural appropriation"

to me i treat everything fairly.. cultural appropriation is inevitable. we can't ask the world to be inclusive but then shout "this is mine only" what we can do, it teach equality, fairness.. and how not to generalize races, cultures, nationalities, religions, and sexualities and make fun of them or in general be an a-hole to people. Tropes are real, stereotypes are real.. its just offensive if you assume all of a people are said way.

Personally i think most of the IF hate came from heels of alot of ridiculous white washing in hollywood.. such as Ghost in the Shell and the odd choice of matt damon in The Wall, and it got wrapped up into that tsunami (That and while i personally enjoyed it) it didn't offer anything original or separate itself all to far from the Daredevil series.. and felt a bit too similar.

But yes.. i know people like my friend i loss.. would outright be offended by 2 WOC being reduced to love interests for spider-man... and possibly even use the word "fetishizing" of WOC.

I see alot of people these days combatting racism with racism... and i don't think that's right either.. we live in a world where everyone is angry right now.. and unfortunately i think alot is getting lost along the way of that..

 

[spideyboy_1111]

This whole thing seems so complicated and unnecessary honestly, when it could've just been handled in a simpler way.

that i agree with

 

[Jennifer Walters]

Frumpy is subjective. Ya'll really are acting like Zendaya has been turned into some hideous monster. When it reminds me of that line Etta has in Wonder Woman ''Like putting a pair of glasses isn't going to make her the most beautiful woman in the world."

We don't know if she's truly unpopular, in fact I'm pretty sure she has FRIENDS, considering one of of her lines we've actually heard is ''My friend is up there!".

The bookworm thing is new however.

You've pre-conditioned yourself to not like this development, so you're reaching mostly to justify your hatred.