The Dark Knight Rises Adapting Robin

They've already shown that Batman needs plenty of help. He sent, Lucius, Alfred and Rachel on errands throughout Batman Begins, and had his life saved by them, and his spirits borne up by them on multiple occasions. He was not a loner in any real sense of the word. He had sidekicks... they just didn't wear costumes... didn't need to.

Batman still needs a runner, a surveillance guy and someone to train to take over for him when he inevitably bites it. That's why he should/would take on someone like Dick Grayson, especially if Grayson was the prime witness in a big case and needed to protected anyway.

As for titles, I'd suggest "Gotham" or something equally simple to round out a trilogy, it'd be a great excuse to breathe a little more life and character into Batman's world.
 
"Gotham Knights" sounds good to me.
 
Oh! Yes! Gotham Knights. I like.

  • Flash forward about 5-7 years. Dick is now comparable to a "former child star" and though he received a small fortune through donations and trusts, he is now rebellious. Maybe have him be a smoker, too, just as a consequence of his own inner turmoil.
  • By this time, Wayne Manor is rebuilt, so Bruce offers Grayson his Gotham penthouse. Grudgingly, Grayson accepts the offer ("I'm no charity case, Wayne.")
  • Grayson someow inadvertently discovers the "backup headquarders) below the penthouse. There he finds spare Nomex Mark I suits (the first suit Bruce wore in Begins, complete with a spare climbing belt, in its original form.) He also fabricates his own mask.
  • Grayson uses these to become his own vigilante.
  • Over the course of the film Grayson continually modifies the Mark I suit (spraypainting it burgundy or some other dark matte shade of red) I like the idea that he keeps the climbing harness on the belt, if anything for aesthetic reasons. No cape, though. At least not yet.
  • Bruce is no idiot (obviously)..He quickly figures out Dick's ruse, and confronts him about it. This addresses the central theme of the movie, the difference between justice and revenge (as addressed in the first film) and the search for a father figure, as well as the pain of loss.

I think your ideas would be very cool for an original character. I personally dislike them because, to me, that's not Robin. Putting that aside, these particular points turn Grayson from a supporting character to the central conflict of the movie. Not a good idea... the central conflict should be between Batman and a villain, and you can't do that if Robin has to be an adult and an independent vigilante. I suppose in theory it's possible to have another adult independent vigilante in a Batman movie not steal the show, but I can't imagine how, or how that's faithful to comics in any way.
 
I'll probably get some flak for this:

- Have the murder of the Graysons casually introduced at some point in the third film, as in a news report or something similar. Also, have something said like, "the body of young Richard Grayson has yet to be found."

- At the end of the movie (or even as an after-credits scene), show the boy from the first film ("Everyone's been talking about you.") mourning his loss in his old home, when he notices the grappling hook given to him by Bats on his bookshelf or desk or whatever, walk over to it, and fade out just as he picks it up.

Implied Robin, leaving room for him in the sequel if another director picks things up from the end of Nolan's trilogy. Plus, he's still young enough, and has already been established as a "character."
 
Robin will probably be the next step after this trilogy. Batman Begins had the Joker card at the end so I'm sure the third movie will have something similar involving Robin like Bruce Wayne deciding to go to the circus or a report of this boy's dead parents or Wayne taking him in or something.
 
Eh.. I guess if you want that. I will balance this out by saying simply. I am against Robin or any sidekick of Batman to appear.

Agreed. Robin is a bad character for the screen (IMO) and he definitely does not fit in Nolan's dark and real vision for the franchise.
 
It could work, under good writers, costume designers, and director. We seem to have all of those things. Just make sure Robin isn't taller than Batman this time around.
 
The one thing that has always bothered me was the age issue. There arnt many 12 year old actors I could see take the role but there are some who could pull of a 16 yr old Robin.

Last night I was watching Zathura and I thought Josh Hutcherson could pull of the younger Robin, but now hes 16 and I could still see him as Robin

josh-hutcherson-rv-los-angeles-premiere-0AYYEc.jpg
 
Personally, I'd prefer a complete unknown to play the role of Robin.

To me, Robin shouldn't be used as a Batman junior, ie he shouldn't be going in and beating up the criminals. IMO, he should be used as a scout. He is, by his nature as a boy, much lighter and wouldn't have staying power in combat. Much the same can be said of Batgirl (should they try to introduce her), or at least according to more comic-accurate interpretations (and this is where Shumacher fell down).

So, I see Robin more providing a scouting role. He'd still be going out into the field, but he wouldn't be doing much fighting. He could tag hotspots for the Bat (covering more ground on patrol), misdirect opponents (like a stand-in for Batman, only to dissapear and leave them easy prey for Batman), etc. I could also see him as being much like what someone on this thread proposed earlier; the colourful squire of a knight, becoming something of a poster boy, and perhaps also running messages between Batman and Gordon (which would work well with his role in pinpointing criminal activity).

Opinions?
 
Would that role be the most practical in Nolan's Batverse? Yes. Would it be entertaining on film? Probably not.
 
Nolan will never put robin in any of his films but when he hands the reigns over i think robin would be a great addition but only if done right,personally I'd like an unknown actor and keep his origin pretty much the same,and make him young the best aspect of bruces relationship with Grayson is he becomes a father figure to him and they become family,best age would be 10 or 11'ish,don't make him robin straight away get a young actor and let him grow into the role,(like harry potter)I've always hated how people think he should be out fighting crime straight away,after all how long did bruce train?over the course of a few films you could see bruce training him and have him back at the cave in an oracle capacity,and when he's a better age say 15 or 16 then have bruce promote him to robin.
 
I always thought Robin was done really well in TDKR.
Obviously in a new Bat film Robin would have to be Grayson, and thus not female, but the way the role was played out in that book was really cool.
 
I dont get why people dont think Robin wouldnt fit with Nolans direction. Because its too dark? Tim was introduced when bats was at his darkest. Thats the function of Robin. And realism? If fear gas and electro-hanggliders can come of as realistic so can a kid in a cape.
 
I dont get why people dont think Robin wouldnt fit with Nolans direction. Because its too dark? Tim was introduced when bats was at his darkest. Thats the function of Robin. And realism? If fear gas and electro-hanggliders can come of as realistic so can a kid in a cape.
Wait what? no no no not because it is too dark. It is just kind of silly that he would endanger a kid like that and Robin softens Batman up from being a lone hero to someone that needs more on the spot back up. Also the idea that Bruce Wayne gets a ward which is kind of odd to begin with (in the publics eyes) and then there comes a new...super...hero...teamed..up...with..batman..
 
Thats still stupid. Robin has been an important part to Batman for a long time. You think the audience wont buy that Wayne gets a ward at the same time that Batman gets a sidekick. That is definitely something the general audience has thought of over the years of tv shows and movies and pretty much are over that slight suspension of disbelief.

and dont act like no one is saying that Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movies.
 
I could see one possible way of making Robin/Dick Grayson work for Nolan's film. I like Batman as a loner. Especially the way it's going now. He's at his best when he's the lone creature of the night. I hate the sidekicks idea to heroes and the superhero teams also. Thats not my Batman. But Robin is different he could work because he essentially is, Batman. Just cut from a different cloth. Robin's origin has a thematic connection to Batman's in that both see their parents killed by criminals, creating an urge to battle the criminal element. Bruce sees a chance to direct the anger and rage that Dick feels in a way that he himself can not, thus creating a father/son bond and understanding between the two. That makes a better story in my opinion.

If they were to include Robin in the Nolan universe, this is how I would like to see it tastefully done.

"And here, we.......GO!"


In Gotham City the Dark Knight/Bruce Wayne is having trouble striking fear into his enemies and the citizens of Gotham. The new TV/Cartoon "The Caped Crusader" (Think the 60s show only more fantastic) based on The Batman's actual "adventures" now airing on every TV in Gotham has now established Batman as an outcast and laughing stalk rather than a a brooding creature of the night, like we saw him in Batman Begins, The Dark Knight etc. While the show features the non-fictional Batman it also introduces the fictional character, Robin (Batman's new crime fighting partner). Since this is a story within a story the Batman in the show has no relation to Bruce Wayne. (instead he is an alien from Batton) Batman is still the vigilante Gotham makes him out to be but this show is merely tarnishing his rep with his enemies with the camp of the actors, props, and gags.

With Batman no longer being feared, Wayne decideds to give into his public image and hang up his cape and cowl. He finds that being an actual playboy billionarehas it's perks, and is much better than the Dark Knight. Later he has his run in with Dick Grayson, (who also has no relation to "The Caped Crusader TV Show") an 10-11 year old who witnesses the brutal and grusome murder of his parents (instead of being acrobats they were instead owners of a wealthy circus company in Gotham with connections to the Wayne family and other billionares) by Tony Zucco (a member of Carmine Falcone's destroyed Mafia empire. Bruce Wayne, who is in the audience, takes pity on the boy, as they are both the orphaned sons of parents murdered in their presence. Upon hearing of Dick's telling of what he saw, the police fears that he will have no place to go, as he is a material witness, but Bruce steps in and partially adopts young Dick, whom no one else wants considering he's still a target for witnessing the murder) At first hesitant, Wayne with the persuasion of the GPD, the simple fact that this was essentially the same incident that happened to him, and saving him from the uncaring juvenile services system decides to take Grayson in as his "son". Strangely the resemblence of Grayson to his "father", Bruce Wayne, is uncanny. The two at Wayne's charity functions are often thought of actually being father and son to those who haven't heard the real story.

Zucco arrives back in Gotham after months of hiding. He is ordered by "insert mob boss name" to take out Grayson before he spills his guts. (His father had something to do with the mob, and they assume Dick has information against them) With the emergence of a new villian (Another plot. Man-Bat? Two-Face? Bane? etc.) along with this new crime syndicate and Zucco Batman must step back into the public's eye. Determined, Bruce Wayne establishes a darker, more menacing Batman that puts his enemies close to death, because of the campy "Crusader" show that makes Batman as menacing as Barney. Bruce juggles the life of being a crime fighting vigilante and......a father toward Grayson. Alfred reminds him that Dick is feeling unloved and scared, which prompts Bruce to realize he must spend more time with him. He later comforts the boy and tries to make him feel better, but Dick breaks down in tears and explains that he saw Zucco before the murder, thus making him responsible. Bruce points out he felt the same way when his parents died, but the pain will go away in time, at least for Dick.

This would have to go beyond what we have ever seen before, even with the Joker in the Dark Knight. Bashing heads, gritty fights etc. A really menacing Batman. If Man-Bat was to be included, it could be part of the story that the people actually begin to fear Batman again because they think this blood hungry creature is The Dark Knight, full throttle. With the body count rising, the City decideds to cancel "The Caped Crusader" to Wayne's liking, but at the same time an unwanted scenario occurs, the apprehension or killing of The Batman by Gotham's finest! (Which Gordon wants nothing to do with leaving yet another plot other than Dick Grayson, the villian/villian's, and the identity crisis)

Later an attack is made that threatens Bruce's life by Zucco. At the rebuilt Wayne Manor, Wayne is mortally wounded by Tony. Feeling guilty yet again Grayson runs away not only for his own safety but for his guardians also. A new issue thickens when Dick is captured and upon learning that Grayson doesn't have the information they sought they hold him for ransom for everything Wayne owns. Batman while still recovering from his injuries goes out on nightly hunts for his "son". And even overcomes the villian/villians, and clears his name.

After finding Dick, the Mob, and Zucco (who Grayson ultimately despises) Batman defeats them and saves the boy. In a final confrontation Zucco threatens the Dick's life at gun point only to be stopped by Batman. Zucco does not die and is sent to jail. Vengeful, Grayson lashes out at Batman who brings him back to the "new" Batcave and reveals himself, with the help of Alfred, as Bruce Wayne. He then suggests that Dick's "temporary" stay become indefinite and offers him a place as his crime partner to avenge his parents as he had, to which Dick eagerly accepts.

The next movie or movies can establish Grayson's alter ego.

-It's important to note that he becomes Robin after years of training so it's not obvious that Wayne's adopted son and Robin are one in the same.

After years of training (the same as Wayne with the Leauge of Shadows), Grayson is ready to fight along side Batman and hunt the criminals that created them. (Considering he was much younger than himself and ready earilier, Bruce still made sure he didn't become his partner until he was old enough out of fear of the boy's life) Wayne introduces Grayson to his new body armor, a redisgned black and crimson blood colored Begins suit, (unless destroyed, give him one of Batman's older suits since we know every film introduces a new suit) a cowl from the 10,000 mass produced selection without the ears, (no domino mask here/it does have white lenses though) a the memory cloth cape, and last but not least the famous gauntlets that were given to Bruce by Ducard, his mentor. Grayson utilizes all of Batman's weapons and becomes just as dangerous as his "father".

After several of nightly hunts along side Batman. Crime is at is's lowest. Robin rarely makes puns or sidecracking jokes, he is just as determined to rid "his" city of crime as Batman. (though he does lighten the moment several times considering he's not as "dark" as Batman) The genreal public and criminals dub him.........ROBIN, after the old TV show that mocked Batman.

If Robin is established in Nolans films like this i'd have no problem seeing him on screen again. (Sans nipples and the letter "R" of course) The public needs to name him Robin, and what better way then a campy cartoon that is similar to the old 60s show. Just imagine seeing Bale's/Wayne's distaste to seeing a humorous version of himself? I think this would completely change the general audiences view of Batman. He would no longer be that campy character if something was similar was shown in Batman's "real" universe. He'd cringe, he'd quit.........
 
Did anyone hear the rumor that Robin might appear in the third Batfilm? I hope it comes true. I hear that the third Batman movie will be based on The Long Halloween and Dark Victory. Is there anybody else besides me think that Batman needs Robin? Robin makes Batman feel like a father figure and an older brother and provides light into Batman's grim world.

I think the Dark Victory Robin would make an excellent basis for a future film. Dick Grayson should appear in the third film but he should become Robin in the climax like in Dark Victory or Batman Forever. And it would set the stage for a fourth film and a second trilogy of Batman films ending with Grayson becoming Nightwing and Tim Drake becoming the next Robin. I can't understand why so many people hate Robin when he's been updated so well with Tim Drake. I think Robin should be Dick Grayson but he should wear the red and black updated costume like Tim Drake currently wears and mesh with Batman's dark costume and of course have the letter R but updated of course but no nipples.

Does anybody else want to see Robin in the flesh in a third movie due summer 2011???!!

BATMAN NEEDS ROBIN!!!!!
BATMAN NEEDS ROBIN!!!!!
BATMAN NEEDS ROBIN!!!!!
BATMAN NEEDS ROBIN!!!!!

PLEASE CHRIS NOLAN BRING ROBIN IN THE THIRD MOVIE! WHO'S BATMAN WITHOUT HIS BUDDY!!!!???

Here is the link to the CinemaBlend article about the possiblity of Robin in the next movie:

http://www.cinemablend.com/new.php?id=8738

:brucebat::boba::bh:
 
Thats still stupid. Robin has been an important part to Batman for a long time. You think the audience wont buy that Wayne gets a ward at the same time that Batman gets a sidekick. That is definitely something the general audience has thought of over the years of tv shows and movies and pretty much are over that slight suspension of disbelief.

and dont act like no one is saying that Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movies.
No nobody is saying Robin is too dark. Find me someone who says that. He isn't, a kid sidekick doesn't make batmans character darker.
Also Robin might have been a very important part of batman doesn't mean it automatically makes it good.

Audience over the years have seen Robin in live action as three incarnations. That really old show, The Adam West Batman and Batman and Robin. Robin did not bring anything to the table, you make it sound like Batman isn't complete without Robin.
 
No nobody is saying Robin is too dark. Find me someone who says that. He isn't, a kid sidekick doesn't make batmans character darker.
Also Robin might have been a very important part of batman doesn't mean it automatically makes it good.

Are you even reading my posts? I said that Nolans tone is too dark for Robin. That Robin is too light for Nolans tone. That Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movie and make it too light and silly. Should I say it once more?

I can see where you might come to that conclusion in my first posy, but my second part definitely stated it more clearly

Audience over the years have seen Robin in live action as three incarnations. That really old show, The Adam West Batman and Batman and Robin. Robin did not bring anything to the table, you make it sound like Batman isn't complete without Robin.

They were weak protrayals according to you, someone I assume as knowledge of the comic series. But to the general public, this is how they saw Robin. If Nolan has proven anything he has adapted his characters well enough to fit the story at hand as well as stay true to the comic source

And yes, Batman is not complete without Robin in the comics. He keeps him grounded and keeps him sane. Robin represents everything that Batman is fighting for. The truly innocent tarnished by tragedy. And he is being trained to carry the mantle making Batman immortal and the symbol of The Bat (a very important thematic element in Nolans movies) even stronger.

And the Timmverse Robin, especially the Dick Grayson in version in B:TAS brought plentyto the table.
 
Are you even reading my posts? I said that Nolans tone is too dark for Robin. That Robin is too light for Nolans tone. That Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movie and make it too light and silly. Should I say it once more?



They were weak protrayals according to you, someone I assume as knowledge of the comic series. But to the general public, this is how they saw Robin. If Nolan has proven anything he has adapted his characters well enough to fit the story at hand as well as stay true to the comic source

And yes, Batman is not complete without Robin in the comics. He keeps him grounded and keeps him sane. Robin represents everything that Batman is fighting for. The truly innocent tarnished by tragedy.

And the Timmverse Robin, especially the Dick Grayson in version in B:TAS brought plentyto the table.
No the way you presented it in other posts was that adding Robin was too dark. You should reread your posts and realize I can't read your implications when you write them since your context is confusing.
Now I must agree with you that is the general consensus on Robin and the Nolan series.

These weak portrayals help establish that belief Batman was a gay superhero. The way that they were portrayed and just about everything about them brought back those weird moments. Burt Ward while being really fun, he didn't bring anything to the table just allow Batman to bounce dialogu off someone. Chris ODonnell ya he had a conflict with batman cause a woman got in between them and their latex..

Robin isn't truly innocent tarnished by tragedy though. That is the whole reason why Batman takes him in. The whole purpose of Robin though was to make Batman kid friendly,which he does.

As I stated before bring robin in, but not for these series. Robin just brings back memories of Schumacher. If anything show a kid and lets leave it at that.
 
No the way you presented it in other posts was that adding Robin was too dark. You should reread your posts and realize I can't read your implications when you write them since your context is confusing.
Now I must agree with you that is the general consensus on Robin and the Nolan series.

My second post says verbatim: dont act like no one is saying that Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movies. But yes in my first post I used "it" as the movie with little explanation, even though if I were referring to Robin i would have said "he," I guess I could see the confusion

These weak portrayals help establish that belief Batman was a gay superhero. The way that they were portrayed and just about everything about them brought back those weird moments. Burt Ward while being really fun, he didn't bring anything to the table just allow Batman to bounce dialogu off someone. Chris ODonnell ya he had a conflict with batman cause a woman got in between them and their latex..

Yet you fail to mention the animated Robin who brought plenty. Beside the fact that the gay comment came from the flamboyant Adam West series which is hardly true to the source, as well as these beliefs were coming from fingerpoint censors who were putting out fires where there wasnt any.

Robin isn't truly innocent tarnished by tragedy though. That is the whole reason why Batman takes him in. The whole purpose of Robin though was to make Batman kid friendly,which he does.

Original intentions? Yes. But Robin has evolved as a character to serve the innocent tarnished by tragedy. Even Batman has evolved. He originally used guns.

As I stated before bring robin in, but not for these series. Robin just brings back memories of Schumacher. If anything show a kid and lets leave it at that.

But bringing back Two Face doesnt? Get over Schumacher. You obsessive fanboys cling to the bad but you never see the potential in anything. Is the Cap movie gonna remind you about those awful serials and TV movies?Will the Incredible Hulk remind you of the Ang Lee trainwreck? I doubt it.
 
My second post says verbatim: dont act like no one is saying that Robin would ruin the dark tone of Nolans movies. But yes in my first post I used "it" as the movie, if I were referring to Robin i would have said "he"



Yet you fail to mention the animated Robin who brought plenty. Beside the fact that the gay comment came from the flamboyant Adam West series which is hardly true to the source, as well as these beliefs were coming from fingerpoint censors who were putting out fires where there wasnt any.



Original intentions? Yes. But Robin has evolved as a character to serve the innocent tarnished by tragedy. Even Batman has evolved. He originally used guns.



But bringing back Two Face doesnt? Get over Schumacher. You obsessive fanboys cling to the bad but you never see the potential in anything. Is the Cap movie gonna remind you about those awful serials and TV movies?Will the Incredible Hulk remind you of the Ang Lee trainwreck? I doubt it.
Hhaha obsessive Fanboy, you are the one that wants Robin in the series haha

I dont get why people dont think Robin wouldnt fit with Nolans direction. Because its too dark? Tim was introduced when bats was at his darkest. Thats the function of Robin. And realism? If fear gas and electro-hanggliders can come of as realistic so can a kid in a cape.
This is directly from your post, it can easily imply that Robin is too dark. Judging by the rest of your post it is safe to assume you think so.

Now Robin in the Animated Series did an alright job, but remember that not a lot of people have seen the Animated Series. The Animated series is popular among comic book crowds but not the general public, and if they did see the Animated Series chances are they didn't see an episode with RObin in it because he wasn't in that often.

Ya so whats the argument, characters do change. When the character changes into a tragic character as well you can't use the excuse he represents innocence untarnished from tragedy because he simply isn't anymore.

I liked the Schumacher series thank you very much. However speaking from a general public point of view Batman and ROBIN, is hailed as one of the worst movies ever. Try explaining how Mr. Freeze, The Riddler or Bane work to a person who doesn't read the comics. Chances are they would describe the depictions in the movie. Movies are more prominent then comics or incarnations in animated series, so a general movie goer would only be able to associate with what is being produced from the past.
Batman Begins was a great movie but it was after Batman and Robin, hell audiences didn't flock to it because it was just another Batman movie to them. They don't really look into things like you or me, and just talking about Robin would bring back bad memories.
 
This is directly from your post, it can easily imply that Robin is too dark. Judging by the rest of your post it is safe to assume you think so.

The pronoun it refers to inanimate objects not people as well as the most recent noun used thus Nolan's movies. And you said in neither case was i clear when i was obiously clear in my second post.

Now Robin in the Animated Series did an alright job, but remember that not a lot of people have seen the Animated Series. The Animated series is popular among comic book crowds but not the general public, and if they did see the Animated Series chances are they didn't see an episode with RObin in it because he wasn't in that often.

So.....

The general public still know that Batman has a sidekick Robin. Thats all they need to know because the general audience probably also thought Batman was a guy dressed as a bat fighting crime but were pleasantly surprised when BB was more dramatic.

Ya so whats the argument, characters do change. When the character changes into a tragic character as well you can't use the excuse he represents innocence untarnished from tragedy because he simply isn't anymore.

My argumentis that Robin represents what Batman is fighting for thematically as well as the future of the Batman as a symbol. Its easy to understand but you seem to think that his one and only use was to make Batman kid friendly and thats all he'll be good for.

I liked the Schumacher series thank you very much. However speaking from a general public point of view Batman and ROBIN, is hailed as one of the worst movies ever. Try explaining how Mr. Freeze, The Riddler or Bane work to a person who doesn't read the comics. Chances are they would describe the depictions in the movie. Movies are more prominent then comics or incarnations in animated series, so a general movie goer would only be able to associate with what is being produced from the past.
Batman Begins was a great movie but it was after Batman and Robin, hell audiences didn't flock to it because it was just another Batman movie to them. They don't really look into things like you or me, and just talking about Robin would bring back bad memories.

Well if Batman and Two Face can have a revival why cant Robin? Schumacher has long been forgotten. And every bad element of Batman and Robin was overshadowed by Arnold. And if anyone has anything good to say about those movies it tends to be about Chris O'Donnell
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Staff online

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
202,288
Messages
22,080,469
Members
45,880
Latest member
Heartbeat
Back
Top
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"