Agent Carter Agent Carter - S01E05 "The Iron Ceiling"

[Mike Murdock]

^ I know at least NBC prohibits depicting the portrayal of people smoking on the show. Constantine has run into that issue. I suspect it's the same. Who's the last character casually smoking on network television?

I was glad to hear a hearty WaaaaaHooooo!.t:

I did think it was kinda lame that they couldn't let Dugan smoke a cigar on the show. I mean,kids can watch people murder,pass the bourbon around,and have Howard Stark be a revolving door for woman on the show...but have Dum Dum smoke a cigar and it would corrupt the youth of America!!!

Yeah, I wish this is one episode they could loosen that with. It was just such a big part of the culture that it's probably the most anachronistic thing in the show. In reality, nearly everyone should be smoking.

 

[cph9fa]

I haven't seen anyone mention it, but Stark's invention (that Leviathan stole the blueprints of, and tried to get the other engineer to build for them) was called a "photonic amplifier." It was said to manipulate the wave nature of light. This is almost certainly a reference to a laser (the term being an acronym for "Light Amplification by Stimulated Emission of Radiation"). According to wikipedia, real lasers weren't actually invented until the 50's, but the concept of stimulated emission was being explored as early as the late 30's and 40's. So Stark was, as usual, ahead of the curve.

So if the girls in the Black Widow program fight to the death, does that mean only one person in the class becomes a Black Widow by being the last girl standing?

That's what I'm wondering too; there can probably only be one at a time. Natasha probably killed everyone else in the Red Room during her training. Seems eventually she even turned on her instructors too. Maybe she broke out of her handcuffs one night? (The way she broke out of that chair...)

I wonder if we get to see handcuffs in AoU flashbacks (probably not; the program probably changed a lot in 40 years).

At any rate, maybe now we know what happened to Drakov's daughter...

It's interesting then that they are doing the Black Widow program, and obviously Natasha would have gone through that kind of training, and so why would she keep the codename Black Widow when moving over to Shield.

I would think you'd want to drop a name you've been given thanks to you being brainwashed and killing some kids.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only time I recall her actually being called "Black Widow" (in-universe) is when she's "interrogating" the Russian mafia at the beginning of the Avengers, and the boss calls her "the infamous Black Widow." Everyone else calls her "Natasha", or "Agent Romanov", or something similar (or Natalie Rushman, I suppose).

We saw them learning English via Snow White, being brainwashed and indoctrinated via film and child trainee Widows fighting to to the death using moves we see Natasha and Dottie use with one being ordered to snap another neck. We saw one stab Dum Dum and murder another HC. We saw the handcuffs on all the beds and the handcuffs Dotties still uses to sleep. We saw more evidence that Dottie is not only a trained killer but completely unhinged

I wonder. How many words have been spilled in the Avenger's forums over the years regarding Natasha's lack of a Russian accent...

 

[Vartha]

I was glad to hear a hearty WaaaaaHooooo!.t:

I did think it was kinda lame that they couldn't let Dugan smoke a cigar on the show. I mean,kids can watch people murder,pass the bourbon around,and have Howard Stark be a revolving door for woman on the show...but have Dum Dum smoke a cigar and it would corrupt the youth of America!!!

lol Yeah same here. lol I'm glad they kept that in.

 

[antsman41]

bad place of an episode... can't believe they allowed a little girl to stab and shoot people, so awesome.

 

[darthcoolness3]

good episode, I liked the Snow White egg that Disney and Marvel did with the Snow White clip during Dottie's flashback at the beginning of the episode.

 

[JJmelo]

This was my fav episode yet. Loved all of the Marvel connections and the Snow White clip they snuck in. Can't believe Dottie is so ruthless! The inevitable showdown between her and Peggy is gonna be sick!

Here is my full review of the episode (srry it's late)

http://otlnews.net/2015/02/05/agent-carter-review-s1-ep-5-the-iron-ceiling/

 

[zebkillgrave]

I got confused about one thing. Was this a trap set by Leviathan, or did they send out the message not expecting the look into it? Of course then they wouldn't have mentioned Stark.

I'm thinking that something happened here. Maybe that scientist they brought back isn't what we think he is. Otherwise, this little excursion wouldn't make much sense.

 

[MagnarTheGreat]

Another great episode.

None of them are really "evil" per se. They're brainwashed drones essentially. Not unlike Winter Soldier was with HYDRA actually. And Thompson's proving to be a far more interesting/nuanced character than I expected. Chad Michael Murray's acting in this entire episode was really good, especially in those "confession" scenes.

Chad has come a long way.

 

[Pokkle]

I got confused about one thing. Was this a trap set by Leviathan, or did they send out the message not expecting the look into it? Of course then they wouldn't have mentioned Stark.

I'm thinking that something happened here. Maybe that scientist they brought back isn't what we think he is. Otherwise, this little excursion wouldn't make much sense.

I think that guy they brought back is from Leviathan.

 

[Dark Raven]

So Peggy called Howard Stark a wanker a couple of times in this episode. Was that word around back then, just after the war? It sounded a bit modern to me and slightly anachronistic, but I could be wrong.

 

[Ghostcrow13]

So Peggy called Howard Stark a wanker a couple of times in this episode. Was that word around back then, just after the war? It sounded a bit modern to me and slightly anachronistic, but I could be wrong.

Yes it's quite old, what's weird is the level of perception the word has between UK and US, for me hearing that was a strange as if she had just called him f***er. I have no problems with swear words at all I personally don't see why people care about them, it was just weird to suddenly hear Peggy say it on a show that clearly doesn't use 'bad' language.

 

[kosh33]

I had a thought again on rewatching the episode.. would it be possible that the doctor who was rescued could be a HYDRA agent... maybe HYDRA used the typewriter to rescue the doctor from Leviathan and get him to be part of Project Paperclip and join SHIELD...

i have a further theory that Dr. Ivchenko might be Dr. Faustus actually, and that he was involved in perfecting the brainwashing of the Widows... He also says 'Listen to the sound of my voice'... so let us see if this turns out to be true

 

[Dark Raven]

Yes it's quite old, what's weird is the level of perception the word has between UK and US, for me hearing that was a strange as if she had just called him f***er. I have no problems with swear words at all I personally don't see why people care about them, it was just weird to suddenly hear Peggy say it on a show that clearly doesn't use 'bad' language.

Yeah, in the UK it's not quite as bad as that. It's more like saying someone is a contemptible person, and is used somewhat more playfully than calling someone a f***er. It's probably kind of more equivalent to calling someone a bastard or a dukee, but dukee is rather more American.

Wanker also is quite a distinctly British phrase, and would sound a bit weird in the mouth of an American. That's why you tend to get the likes of Spike in Buffy using it or Peggy here. Also, I think Gwyneth Paltrow used it in Sliding Doors when she was pretending to be a Brit. I think they probably chose that term to emphasise Peggy's Britishness, since she would've sounded strange calling Howard a dukee.

Incidentally, isn't there a composer named Thomas Wanker, who used to score for Buffy the Vampire Slayer? Is that his real name or Thomas Wander? He sometimes credits himself with the latter (or maybe films force him to because they don't like calling him a wanker).

 

[Ghostcrow13]

Yeah, in the UK it's not quite as bad as that. It's more like saying someone is a contemptible person, and is used somewhat more playfully than calling someone a f***er. It's probably kind of more equivalent to calling someone a bastard or a dukee, but dukee is rather more American.

Wanker also is quite a distinctly British phrase, and would sound a bit weird in the mouth of an American. That's why you tend to get the likes of Spike in Buffy using it or Peggy here. Also, I think Gwyneth Paltrow used it in Sliding Doors when she was pretending to be a Brit. I think they probably chose that term to emphasise Peggy's Britishness, since she would've sounded strange calling Howard a dukee.

Incidentally, isn't there a composer named Thomas Wanker, who used to score for Buffy the Vampire Slayer? Is that his real name or Thomas Wander? He sometimes credits himself with the latter (or maybe films force him to because they don't like calling him a wanker).

It's all about context obviously, the way she said it isn't so bad as she is friends with Howard, however the point is she could have called him f***er with the same context and aggressiveness but it wouldn't have been allowed. Which is why I'm saying it was slightly weird to hear.

 

[darthcoolness3]

bad place of an episode... can't believe they allowed a little girl to stab and shoot people, so awesome.

This is why, I am glad that we have the new 9:00 p.m. EST time slot for Marvel Shows on ABC. If this was on at 8:00 p.m. EST instead, ABC would be like, that's too violent, lets edit out the scene.

 

[Dark Raven]

I found some of the episode a bit darkly lit at times, particularly in the plane before the jump or when sitting around telling stories. I understand some of it was at night time, but in other shows you can still see a bit more clearly.

 

[hoy-small-fry]

After last week's rambling, directionless episode, this was a real return to form. Maybe even the best yet. The addition of the Howling Commandos added so much, and a look at the Black Widow program was great!

Feel like we're getting lots of pieces to a much larger puzzle relating to Finau. But they've cleverly kept us in the dark as to what puzzle we're trying to solve here. Can't wait for the resolution

 

[metaphysician]

Wonder how S.H.I.E.L.D deprogrammed Natasha from so many years of brainwashing & mind control? Wonder if Dottie could be redeemed & made an ally of the SSR/Shield in time but then the show won't last long enough to do that so Dottie will probably be killed off by the end or maybe the show ends on a cliffhanger & we will have to wait for a possible second season that may or may not be to learn her fate.

I don't think SHIELD did deprogram her, per se. Remember, she worked solo for a time, long enough to establish a reputation. I suspect that the Red Room fell apart sometime after the fall of the Soviet Union, and she was ultimately left on her own. Her career as a mercenary was not ethical ( to say the least ), but being forced to go out and make her own way probably did do a fair bit to improve her mental health. Then, along comes Clint Barton who acts in a way outside her paradigm, and she grabs onto him and SHIELD, because on some level she already didn't want to be what the Red Room made her.

 

[Hypestyle]

So who do the Commandos work for, technically? The Army? The CIA? The SSR apparently don't have direct oversight over the group.

 

[Vartha]

UM I think they were a United nations type deal with the SSR

 

[Chance Jackson]

It's interesting then that they are doing the Black Widow program, and obviously Natasha would have gone through that kind of training, and so why would she keep the codename Black Widow when moving over to Shield.

I would think you'd want to drop a name you've been given thanks to you being brainwashed and killing some kids.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the only time I recall her actually being called "Black Widow" (in-universe) is when she's "interrogating" the Russian mafia at the beginning of the Avengers, and the boss calls her "the infamous Black Widow." Everyone else calls her "Natasha", or "Agent Romanov", or something similar (or Natalie Rushman, I suppose)

That is such a great point

So who do the Commandos work for, technically? The Army? The CIA? The SSR apparently don't have direct oversight over the group.

I imagine they are still SSR until otherwise noted but it is possible they were transferred to some other government organizational unit

Then again is the SSR still part of the Army?

 

[Whiskey Tango]

LOL "Susan"!

[YT]kYmWRNZ_0ys[/YT]

 

[Whiskey Tango]

So yeah they showed the AoS preview during this and all I could think was "noooooo screw AoS! Want more Peggy!"

Not sure that's the reaction they were going for t:

I know they have budgetary and time constraints but the big gunfight setpiece felt pretty cheap to me. That's the only real disappointment the show has given me so far. It just felt very weak and uninspired, maybe better direction would have helped? Everything can't be The Killer or John Wick I guess.

Chad Michael Murray was pretty good this ep (I can also ALMOST forgive him for Left Behind; man that movie was ash), and finally we got some background on Thompson. I think he's who Peggy will end up with (assuming it's someone on the show), which means Sousa is either a mole, or doomed.

Although now Jack has something to prove, so his demise looks even more likely. Hrm.

EVERYTHING about the Widow program was badass. Just as I was thinking "Nah, they won't go there" SNAP! They went there.

I wasn't familiar with Regan before this, but now I'm starting to see why people wanted her for Wonder Woman.

I suppose I will never fully like Dugan. I can't get past the stupid hat.

Good ep overall, and since I waited so late in the week to watch it there's another one coming in just a couple days yay!

 

[hoy-small-fry]

So yeah they showed the AoS preview during this and all I could think was "noooooo screw AoS! Want more Peggy!"

Not sure that's the reaction they were going for t:

Right? Going back to AoS is going to be such a comedown!

 

[OB12]

Right? Going back to AoS is going to be such a comedown!

Nah, while I am loving Agent Carter, I am excited to get back to Coulson and the group to see how they delve into the Inhumans and how they tie the upcoming episodes into AoU.