BvS All Things Batman v Superman: An Open Discussion (TAG SPOILERS) - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 293

[Mjölnir]

I know some people accept change.

But I was talking specifically about those bringing faithfulness to the comics as an argument.

I understand the appeal of adopting famous versions. But I think a filmmaker needs to work with what he's comfortable with and what he thinks work best for the whole product, or the character in general if he thought.

Anyway, I loved this Lex so it might be easier for me to accept it than those who didn't.

Nice post by the way, and you raise good points.

Yes, making the best movie you can is always the first priority. If that involves changing something than so be it. No one sets out to make a bad movie. Being able to take the comic version people love and making it work as well as anything else will net you some bonus points though.

I'm glad that you liked Lex. He wasn't really to my liking but that doesn't change my stance on changes overall. Me not liking one change doesn't remove the changes in CBM's that I have liked. It's all subjective anyway.

All in all we're lucky to live in times when there's so much for us superhero fans to see that we're pretty sure to find something we like every year.

 

[Dispatch Ninja]

So I saw it a second time last night & I think I hated it even more.

Did anyone notice how in most of Superman's scenes he just stands there brooding & quiet?

Lois with terrorist he stands there quietly
Saving people he stands there quietly
Congress he stands there quietly
Ma Kent he stands there quietly
Lois at Congress he talks a bit but stands there quietly and broods

The only time he talks is when he threatens to kill someone.
"The Bat is dead. Bury it." With Bats
"I'll take you in without breaking you" with Lex
"Where is she?" about ready to shoot his heat vision at Lex
"Stay down. If I wanted it, you'd be dead already." With Bats

You know what would have been a great scene? Superman receiving his statue from Metropolis. Pretty much also helps Bruce and Lex's motivates in hating them.

A cool scene would be Superman at the statue reading the names of the people who died. Lois learns he's there. Superman tells her he wants to remember every name of the people who died in Zod's attack. Not to mourn or feel guilt of not saving them. But to remember them and honor them. Making sure their death isn't for nothing.

But there's no action involved so I understand why Snyder wouldn't want to use it.

Why would you watch it again if you hated it so much the first time? Are you going to be one of those people who complains constantly about the movie but sees it multiple times in the theater anyways and buys multiple versions of the blu-ray?

 

[Gianakin_]

You know what would have been a great scene? Superman receiving his statue from Metropolis. Pretty much also helps Bruce and Lex's motivates in hating them.

The statue was a terrible idea from the get-go: Since the entire first half of BvS is about the controversy he's caused, there's no way the statue would've been raised in the first place.

 

[LEVITIKUZ]

Why would you watch it again if you hated it so much the first time? Are you going to be one of those people who complains constantly about the movie but sees it multiple times in the theater anyways and buys multiple versions of the blu-ray?

Because I love Batman & Superman. Maybe I was in a bad mood when I first saw it or whatever but I wanted to give it a second chance because I want to love this film. Instead i realize I was right the first time and it's bad. There's greatness in it but there's too much cluster**** going on.

The statue was a terrible idea from the get-go: Since the entire first half of BvS is about the controversy he's caused, there's no way the statue would've been raised in the first place.

Agree.

 

[Gianakin_]

Because I love Batman & Superman. Maybe I was in a bad mood when I first saw it or whatever but I wanted to give it a second chance because I want to love this film. Instead i realize I was right the first time and it's bad. There's greatness in it but there's too much cluster**** going on.

I really, REALLY dislike MoS and I believe I won't be seeing it again, unless I'm held at gunpoint, but BvS is Ed Wood levels of bad to me. Really, it's hilariously bad, imo. I'm pretty sure I'll watch it again when it's out on BluRay and genuinely enjoy it.

 

[Wylie Times]

The statue was a terrible idea from the get-go: Since the entire first half of BvS is about the controversy he's caused, there's no way the statue would've been raised in the first place.

Especially 18 months after Zod's invasion.

There would have been huge political battle over the plan to build that statue that would have lasted for years.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

I really, REALLY dislike MoS and I believe I won't be seeing it again, unless I'm held at gunpoint, but BvS is Ed Wood levels of bad to me. Really, it's hilariously bad, imo. I'm pretty sure I'll watch it again when it's out on BluRay and genuinely enjoy it.

What level do you put TPM on out of curiosity since I see you are a SW prequels defender.

 

[Gianakin_]

What level do you put TPM on out of curiosity since I see you are a SW prequels defender.

Damn, I was hoping someone I've already been arguing with would bring it up. What answer do you want? Out of 5, 10, a different scale? It's certainly miles above BvS.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

Damn, I was hoping someone I've already been arguing with would bring it up. What answer do you want? Out of 5, 10, a different scale? It's certainly miles above BvS.

Wow, miles above BvS. Out of 10 works.

 

[javonstokess]

Okay, here's the deal:

Doing a "new take" on a character generally means finding something that's already there and enhancing it or toning it down.

For example: Daredevil essentially started out as a clone of Spider-man. He was the happy go lucky, swashbuckling type. When Frank Miller came on the book, he didn't totally change the nature of the character, he just darkened him up and changed the circumstances. Daredevil was still swashbuckling, but they added layers to the character.

This is just one example.

The problem with Eisenberg's portrayal of Luthor is that it had NONE of the actual character of Lex Luthor in it other than "he was a genius". Even at his Silver Age height, Luthor wasn't the rabid nutball Jesse plays him in BvS. Even Gene Hackman didn't play him that crazy and THAT'S why it doesn't work. Luthor has never, EVER been portrayed as crazy on a consistent basis. He's been driven, calculating and cold-hearted, but not nuts. The writers and actor confused the character with the Joke or Riddler.

There's "doing a new take" and there's "ignoring everything about the character".

A good writer takes the characters and fashions the story around him, not the other way around. When you do the reverse, you start changing the character to fit your story, you lose the characters. Which is my inherent problem with BvS: they made the characters act OUT of character to reach certain story points they wanted to reach. There are ways to make a Batman and Superman fight that make alot more sense than the convoluted mess Snyder came up with.

 

[Gianakin_]

Wow, miles above BvS. Out of 10 works.

6.5. BvS is a 1 for Affleck and Irons.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

6.5. BvS is a 1 for Affleck and Irons.

BvS is a 1 out of 10 and TPM is a 6.5 out of 10. Interesting.

Seems a bit extreme for BvS but certainly everyone is allowed their opinion.

 

[Gianakin_]

BvS is a 1 out of 10 and TPM is a 6.5 out of 10. Interesting.

It is, isn't it? A universally hated director that took cinema forward (even with his failures) made a better movie than a man-child fanboy who's know for mediocre to bad adaptations and BO flops.

 

[The Infernal]

Damn, I was hoping someone I've already been arguing with would bring it up. What answer do you want? Out of 5, 10, a different scale? It's certainly miles above BvS.

I think bringing up what people think of other films to help gauge someone and their opinion in your own mind is a bit pointless. It seems to me people in this situation already have an opinion formed, they just want to cement it in their own mind.

 

[Gianakin_]

I think bringing up what people think of other films to help gauge someone and their opinion in your own mind is a bit pointless. It seems to me people in this situation already have an opinion formed, they just want to cement it in their own mind.

That's exactly what I was implying.

 

[Spider-Aziz]

The statue was a terrible idea from the get-go: Since the entire first half of BvS is about the controversy he's caused, there's no way the statue would've been raised in the first place.

Want to know something else interesting about that statue?
Wally was allowed to spray paint the full phrase, even with a cop there, and his arrest after completing his task.


Whenever I try to think of another positive beside the handful I mentioned in the review thread, something here makes me think of more negative things to say.
This movie might actually be as hilariously bad as you say, but on first view there was very little joy in it.

 

[Gianakin_]

Want to know something else interesting about that statue?
Wally was allowed to spray paint the full phrase, even with a cop there, and his arrest after completing his task.

Oh, man, I'm not even going there cos there are such massive flaws about it that this one's basically a nitpick. You're right, of course.

 

[The Infernal]

It is, isn't it? A universally hated director that took cinema forward (even with his failures) made a better movie than a man-child fanboy who's know for mediocre to bad adaptations and BO flops.

I wouldn't say so, but that's my own view. I also wouldn't load my feelings on those particular films with my views on the directors careers and accomplishments.

 

[Gianakin_]

I wouldn't say so, but that's my own view. I also wouldn't load my feelings on those particular films with my views on the directors careers and accomplishments.

Oh, I'm not. I'm well aware what doesn't work with the Prequels. But since we went a bit OT with my SW tastes, I thought I'd go a little nuts.

 

[javonstokess]

Want to know something else interesting about that statue?
Wally was allowed to spray paint the full phrase, even with a cop there, and his arrest after completing his task.


Whenever I try to think of another positive beside the handful I mentioned in the review thread, something here makes me think of more negative things to say.
This movie might actually be as hilariously bad as you say, but on first view there was very little joy in it.

Outside of Batman being willing to kill Superman for doing nothing more than existing, the dumbest thing in the movie to me is Superman, who's been able to literally hear Lois Lane be in trouble from anywhere on the globe, NOT be able to hear his mother getting kidnapped OR where she's being held (which is clearly within a short travel by flights distance).

I laughed out loud when I saw that.

 

[The Infernal]

That's exactly what I was implying.

I guess it's my day to be Cpt. Obvious.

Oh, I'm not. I'm well aware what doesn't work with the Prequels. But since we went a bit OT with my SW tastes, I thought I'd go a little nuts.

No worries.

 

[Gianakin_]

I guess it's my day to be Cpt. Obvious.

Hey, I'd watch YOUR movie!

 

[The Infernal]

Lol. Tag line. You'll see it coming a mile away.

 

[Predator jp]

Did anyone notice how in most of Superman's scenes he just stands there brooding & quiet?

Lois with terrorist he stands there quietly
Saving people he stands there quietly
Congress he stands there quietly
Ma Kent he stands there quietly
Lois at Congress he talks a bit but stands there quietly and broods

The only time he talks is when he threatens to kill someone.
"The Bat is dead. Bury it." With Bats
"I'll take you in without breaking you" with Lex
"Where is she?" about ready to shoot his heat vision at Lex
"Stay down. If I wanted it, you'd be dead already." With Bats

yeah, this is my biggest complaints.
why didn't they just let him speak?

 

[Gianakin_]

Lol. Tag line. You'll see it coming a mile away.

Genius. Actual genius, not the Alex Luthor kind.