All Things Wonder Woman: An Open Discussion - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Part 24

[Osiris-Rex]

It's interesting to hear so many of you disliked the 2009 film, I could swear that for the longest time fans considered that movie the crown jewel of all of the DC animated films.

They didn't know any better at the time that there could be a better version of Wonder Woman?

Interesting to read everyone's opinion on the animated film, which I have not seen.

I will have to check it out, for comparison's sake.

Being a comic fan, of course I know about Wonder Woman and have read some of the stories, but I've never really been a big fan of WW specifically until this movie.

The only Wonder Woman animation I have seen was the Supergirl animated movie Superman/Batman: Apocalypse. And I hated that version of Wonder Woman because of the way she treated Superman.
I am more of a Catwoman and Batman fan, so never read much Wonder Woman other than for a while where she worked at a taco stand. I think those were in the 50 cent bin so I decided to give her a try.
But I watched the TV show when it first aired and have been watching Wonder Woman on MeTV for about a year or so now and so the movie was right in my wheelhouse

Sometimes it just takes the right adaptation to make a character feel incredibly relevant and modern. I'm very interested in what Jenkins and Johns can come up with as a story for the sequel.

I was the same way about Supergirl until the TV show. Supergirl wasn't even on my radar before that. Did like Supergirl in Smallville, though.
But mostly because Laura Vandervoort was so beautiful. Laura could have been playing Bumblebee and I would have fallen for her.

 

[NotNickFury]

So I don't know if there's been a thread or discussion it since I've seen this happen for other films on these forums, but has there been any discussion, I suppose, on what folks DIDN'T like about Wonder Woman, or just critiques in general?

 

[Silly Cat]

So I don't know if there's been a thread or discussion it since I've seen this happen for other films on these forums, but has there been any discussion, I suppose, on what folks DIDN'T like about Wonder Woman, or just critiques in general?

I think everyone's just thrilled that DC finally knocked one out of the park, that nobody's concentrating that much on any flaws of the film. LOL

But it's true, no film is perfect.

I think the one weakness of the film was Ares, I would have liked to have known more about him as a villain...he was just sort of the generic bad guy. But that's pretty typical in any origin film, the focus is on setting up the hero not so much the villain.

Now that Diana's back-story has been established I'm hoping the next Wonder Woman film will give us a more fleshed out Villain for Diana to go up against. Maybe a more personal villain this time, rather then a Super-powered world destroying one.

 

[StormC]

Hey, so...

Wonder Woman's a good date movie, right?

 

[Mach2Infinity]

Not sure if this question belongs here as it doesn't pertain to the film. But generally in the comics/lore, how have the Amazons reacted when the male members of the JL were allowed on Themyscira? Do they consider Superman, Batman, Flash et al to be the modern incarnation of Hercules, Perseus etc? I have seen the animated films but from what I recall they just showed up and became accepted pretty much straight away.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

Not sure if this question belongs here as it doesn't pertain to the film. But generally in the comics/lore, how have the Amazons reacted when the male members of the JL were allowed on Themyscira? Do they consider Superman, Batman, Flash et al to be the modern incarnation of Hercules, Perseus etc? I have seen the animated films but from what I recall they just showed up and became accepted pretty much straight away.

As so much it depends on the times and the writers. There have certainly been moments of narration over the decades where we can read Diana's thoughts on Superman comparing him to the heroes and gods of myth from the ancient world.

The Amazons in comics and toons have had all sorts of opinions and reactions to Diana's fellow heroes. Often they have made a point to show that the male heroes are an anomaly on the island or not embraced by the masses. Of course they have shown the heroes receiving thanks and adulation from the Amazons as well.

 

[Willi Berg]

Not sure if this question belongs here as it doesn't pertain to the film. But generally in the comics/lore, how have the Amazons reacted when the male members of the JL were allowed on Themyscira? Do they consider Superman, Batman, Flash et al to be the modern incarnation of Hercules, Perseus etc? I have seen the animated films but from what I recall they just showed up and became accepted pretty much straight away.

In the Justice League animated series, in the episode "Paradise Lost", Diana is actually exiled from Themyscira for allowing men (the male superheroes) on the island, even though they helped free the Amazons, who had been turned into statues.

I haven't read too many instances where the JL are on the island. I do remember in New Frontier, Clark wasn't even allowed on the island:

So I don't know if there's been a thread or discussion it since I've seen this happen for other films on these forums, but has there been any discussion, I suppose, on what folks DIDN'T like about Wonder Woman, or just critiques in general?

The Reviews thread contains positive and negative points, even though the movie is obviously receiving a lot of praise.

 

[Raiden]

It was sort of a combo of Thor and the first Capt. America, but I liked Wonder Woman better then both of them, lol. I don't think parallel's are necessarily a bad thing as they are inevitable in Superhero films, because we are using similar themes over and over again. Sure you can try to be different but their is only so many ways you can tell a heroes journey without touching on some things that have been done before, doesn't make your version a rip-off.

Diana is much more likable then Thor, and I liked her romance with Steve Trevor better then Capts and Peggy's...sue me.

I think it's interesting to compare Patty Jenkins' direction with Kenneth Branagh (Thor) and Joe Johnson (CA:TFA). I think Branagh's Shakespearan background makes him more in tune with the whole Thor-Loki-Odin relationship, as it captures some of the classic Shakespeare themes, but when it comes to relationship between Thor and Jane I think Branagh faltered.

Johnson did a better job of establishing the romance between Steve and Peggy in TFA, but the lack of presence of Peggy during Steve's tour of duty with the Howling Commandos limited their relationship after he became Super Soldier, unlike Diana and Steve in WW who get to develop theirs all the way through. What surprised me the most is that I think Jenkins did a better job with the gritty World War I battles vs Johnson's WWII scenes. Jenkins was smart in giving us scenes where we can understand each soldier and their personality on Steve's team, but the infamous Howling Commandos did not get the same treatment and ended up as just faces in the crowd. Furthermore, Jenkins' careful chronicle of the battle at No Man's Land gave the movie its heart and soul, but in TFA there was no memorable battle scene, only a montage of what Capt. America and his Commandos did against Red Skull's factories. I do think the first half of the movie where we get to see Steve's transformation from a 98 lbs. weakling to a SS was what the second half should have been. It's obvious to me that Johnson pretty much rushed the movie after Steve joined the forces and it could have been avoided with a better script.

I do think Jenkins, by comparison, had a more solid script and better direction than her Marvel counterparts, and to think that she was once attached to Thor: The Dark World makes me believe that Feige really missed an opportunity to hire a director who could have made a difference in MCU.

 

[ajzz]

Wonder Woman was just released in Spain yesterday, and Spanish YouTubers are starting to review it.

 

[Flemm]

I do think Jenkins, by comparison, had a more solid script and better direction than her Marvel counterparts, and to think that she was once attached to Thor: The Dark World makes me believe that Feige really missed an opportunity to hire a director who could have made a difference in MCU.

Well, as much as I love the MCU, it can't have *all* the good directors

Maybe Jenkins' version of that film would have been a success, but I doubt it would have been the breakout success this movie has been, or made the kind of big impression this movie has, so things probably worked out for the best in the end.

Apparently she wanted that movie to be a love story, and really, in many ways, this movie is, too.

But people have complained that Hemsworth and Portman have roughly the chemistry of two strangers sitting together at a bus stop, so what Gadot and Pine were able to do in this movie really makes a big difference.

Among other things, Wonder Woman is a moving, convincing love story, and I would say that the romance doesn't even feel like a huge focus along the way. It kind of sneaks up on you.

 

[Iceman]

Patty could have done a great job on Thor.

 

[Greenlite]

Well, as much as I love the MCU, it can't have *all* the good directors

Maybe Jenkins' version of that film would have been a success, but I doubt it would have been the breakout success this movie has been, or made the kind of big impression this movie has, so things probably worked out for the best in the end.

Apparently she wanted that movie to be a love story, and really, in many ways, this movie is, too.

But people have complained that Hemsworth and Portman have roughly the chemistry of two strangers sitting together at a bus stop, so what Gadot and Pine were able to do in this movie really makes a big difference.

Among other things, Wonder Woman is a moving, convincing love story, and I would say that the romance doesn't even feel like a huge focus along the way. It kind of sneaks up on you.

Patty'd have directed Natalie to a Black Swan if you know what I mean.

 

[rickfox]

as I quote

Wonder Woman met Steve for the first time on a plane crashing into the Sea. And saw him for the last time on a plane going into the sky

 

[Bagide]

as I quote

Wonder Woman met Steve for the first time on a plane crashing into the Sea. And saw him for the last time on a plane going into the sky

Hadn't picked up on that

 

[Osiris-Rex]

Well, as much as I love the MCU, it can't have *all* the good directors

Maybe Jenkins' version of that film would have been a success, but I doubt it would have been the breakout success this movie has been, or made the kind of big impression this movie has, so things probably worked out for the best in the end.

Apparently she wanted that movie to be a love story, and really, in many ways, this movie is, too.

But people have complained that Hemsworth and Portman have roughly the chemistry of two strangers sitting together at a bus stop, so what Gadot and Pine were able to do in this movie really makes a big difference.

Among other things, Wonder Woman is a moving, convincing love story, and I would say that the romance doesn't even feel like a huge focus along the way. It kind of sneaks up on you.

I even felt there was a bit of a romantic vibe with the General Ludendorff and Dr. Poison relationship. It seemed like he cared about her and respected her work, they were more partners than she was just working for him.
He seemed fascinated by her work. And she cared about him too, making him a special present for his nose. Plus they seemed to get a kick out of their prank with the gas mask. Almost like they had TP'd someone's house.

 

[jaymes_e06]

 

[Blitzkrieg]

I saw Wonder Woman earlier today for the 2nd time and I can safely say that it is one my favorite CBMs/general movies ever. It was even better than the first time. I have no words to describe my feelings. WW is simply amazing.

 

[Raiden]

Patty'd have directed Natalie to a Black Swan if you know what I mean.

Portman was the one who was advocating for Jenkins to be Thor 2's director in the first place. I think she would have done better if Jenkins was onboard.

 

[Flemm]

I think Thor 1 is a better movie than The Dark World mostly because Branagh got much better performances out of everyone involved than Taylor did in the second movie. In TDW, it feels like everyone is phoning it in, or sleep-walking through it.

So I agree that Jenkins could have made a big difference there.

 

[Greenlite]

Portman was the one who was advocating for Jenkins to be Thor 2's director in the first place. I think she would have done better if Jenkins was onboard.

Thanks for reminding me, that's probably why Natalie was so cold towards the franchise in the last few years.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

There's always the possibility that Jenkins could have done bad on either Thor movie, we'll never know.
I personally can't stand either one but I think Thor was worse because it was full of Kenneth's usual shallow story telling with a lack of soul to characters motivations and actions.
Thor 2 at least had Loki being awesome.

 

[Silly Cat]

Thanks for reminding me, that's probably why Natalie was so cold towards the franchise in the last few years.

I can't blame Natalie for being cold towards the franchise...I mean what has she been able to do with the character really? Natalie is a good actress but the role of Jane is about as dull as dishwater honestly, and that's really the writers fault as they could have found ways to make Jane more interesting as a character, instead she just comes across as a generic scientist in a universe full of scientists.

And it doesn't help that Natalie and Hemsworth don't have much romantic chemistry, but I still feel Natalie could have done more with the part of Jane if she'd been given more to work with. Or if her and Thor had been given more scenes to bond, instead their relationship came across as very superficial.

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

[YT]w-QhdzQo66o[/YT]

Some interesting points here.

 

[MydnightPhoenix]

I don't feel sorry for Natalie. I found her bad in the role from the beginning and feel she should have learned from Star Wars about getting signed to a franchise.
Patty and Co. made some of the side characters memorable #1 being Antiope. So maybe she could have done more for the Jane character.

 

[dhandler01]

[YT]w-QhdzQo66o[/YT]

Some interesting points here.

I literally agreed with everything that video said