Arrow Arrow Season 3 Episode 14 the return

[hafizbat]

I'd rather they made Diggle be the voice of reason telling Oliver not to work with Merlyn. It suits him better. Felicity used to be a fun, witty character but they ruined her character with all the drama.

 

[coluanprime]

I'd rather they made Diggle be the voice of reason telling Oliver not to work with Merlyn. It suits him better. Felicity used to be a fun, witty character but they ruined her character with all the drama.

Why? I would prefer that it would be both of them.

 

[haephestus]

Eh. I just don't understand what the producers/writers are intending for this season.

It was great that Oliver told Thea that she killed Sara. But, why doesn't he just tell her EVERYTHING instead of still holding onto some secrets (i.e. the videotape of the murder and Malcolm's extreme manipulation of Team Arrow). And is someone now going to tell Laurel who murdered Sara so that she knows, and can tell her parents, the complete truth?

And Slade was wasted. They could have developed his character, but he was instead still "crazy" and obsessed with Shado's death. That's really poor motivation for what is otherwise a compelling character.

I also remain extremely confused about Malcolm's plan. The League of Assassins suspected that Malcolm was alive and had various assassins, including Sara, out searching for him. The LOA wanted Malcolm dead because of his role in The Undertaking which violated the LOA's principles or the orders of Ra's or something or other. So, the LOA had already issued a death warrant for Malcolm.

Malcolm decides that the best way to protect himself from the LOA is to manipulate Thea into caring for him as her father. Once Malcolm achieves this, he then drugs Thea and forces her to kill Sara. The LOA then want to find and kill Sara's murdered because she was a member of the LOA, even though Ra's seems to consider her membership to be tenuous at best and she primarily seems to serve as Nyssa's consort rather than a truly active assassin (at least after she rejoins the LOA).

Apparently Ra's is too stubborn to listen to reason and will kill Thea even though it is pretty clear to anyone and everyone that Malcolm manipulated the situation. So, the LOA now issues a death warrant for Sara's killer which is revealed to be Thea. Oliver assumes responsibility for Thea's role in Sara's murder to protect Thea. Oliver doesn't reveal Malcolm's role because apparently Malcolm will "protect" Thea while simultaneously threatening to reveal a video of Thea murdering Sara which will reveal the "truth" to the LOA (and possibly also have Thea arrested by the police).

For some extremely unclear reason, Malcolm believes that Oliver will be able to kill Ra's. This would mean that Oliver is no longer responsible for Sara's death and is free from the LOA. But, I don't see how that would absolve Malcolm of his death sentence. Surely Nyssa or whoever else assumes leadership of the LOA would still execute the death warrants on everyone else the LOA is hunting?

And it really doesn't make sense for Malcolm to believe that Oliver has the skills to kill Ra's or that even if he did have the necessary skills, that he actually has the "killer instinct" to kill Ra's. Oliver is good, but he's not that good, especially when not in his element (i.e. the city) using his best weapon (i.e. the bow and arrow).

So, Malcolm must have suspected that Oliver would die, which would "settle" the debt of Sara's death (although I find it difficult to believe that Ra's would truly accept Oliver's death in place of the real killer, unless he cared so little about Sara that he just wanted to punish someone for her death and move on). But, that wouldn't free Malcolm from the LOA's sights. The LOA would still be hunting Malcolm for his role in The Undertaking.

I guess Oliver's death could have resulted in Malcolm permanently joining and leading Team Arrow, but I'm not sure the assistance of Diggle and Roy (and Thea) would help Malcolm to kill Ra's.

And I don't understand what the LOA is planning. They had two primary goals - kill Malcolm and find and kill Sara's killer. They seem to be extremely poor at achieving their first goal. Malcolm is running around Starling City and hanging out with his daughter on a regular basis, but despite sending DJ Assassin to watch Thea, the LOA don't locate Malcolm? And instead of finding and killed Malcolm, Ra's apparently changes DJ Assassin's orders and tells him to kill Thea (only after seducing her of course). Did Ra's order DJ Assassin to kill Thea because he knows the truth about Sara's death? If so, it would explain why Ra's didn't immediately come after Oliver when Oliver (as the Arrow) revealed that he was alive and back in Starling City. But, if Ra's knew the truth about Sara's death, then why didn't Thea get a duel to the death like Oliver did. And why wasn't Thea immediately murdered instead of the drawn out "death by romance" tactic?

As for Malcolm's videotape, I'm surprised that Team Arrow is working on something for its release. Is Malcolm intending to send it direct to Ra's? In which instance, I guess Team Arrow couldn't really prevent it, but they could at least compile evidence of Malcolm's involvement. Of course, now that Ra's has apparently decided to kill Thea anyway, does it really matter what happens to the videotape? I guess if it's released publicly, then Daddy Lance and Laurel Lance may come after Thea seeking "justice", but I'm not sure Thea could actually be charged with murder given that there is no victim and the whole videotape looks like some kind of bizarre prank/stunt, especially with a third person filming it. I don't see the Lances trying to kill Thea, no matter how angry they may be about Sara's death. I guess Daddy Lance could dig up Sara's body and somehow explain that they now have the murder victim so Thea can be charge, but he'd also have to explain how and why his supposedly dead daughter actually died 7 years after her first "death" and why she was running around in a mask on the rooftops at night.

As for possible public humiliation following the release of the videotape, I'm not sure that really matters. Felicity could surely devise some magic techno solution which would erase all copies of the video. Or she could produce a bunch of alternate versions showing all sorts of people in place of Thea and Sara and basically make out that it's one big internet prank/stunt/meme.

And I'm still not following Malcolm's plan. I don't understand why Oliver is still agreeing to work with him. So, Oliver knows that the LOA is coming up Thea and presumably Malcolm. Couldn't he try to capture Malcolm and offer him to Ra's? Thea no longer cares for Malcolm, so he doesn't have to worry about "losing" Thea emotionally. By delivering Malcolm to Ra's, Oliver could try to reason with Ra's about Thea's involvement in Sara's death. In that situation, Thea was really just the gun, but it was Malcolm who loaded the gun, aimed it and pulled the trigger. I would have thought that it is at least worth a try as the alternative is to continue "training" with Malcolm, although that training seems a little bizarre as Malcolm is yet to actually train Oliver so I'm not sure what Oliver is learning from the "student" which will help him to kill the "teacher".

Anyway, maybe they'll turn it all around in the final run to the close of the season.

 

[Boy Scout]

Brilliantly put.

 

[DrCosmic]

Eh. I just don't understand what the producers/writers are intending for this season.

...

And I'm still not following Malcolm's plan. I don't understand why Oliver is still agreeing to work with him. So, Oliver knows that the LOA is coming up Thea and presumably Malcolm. Couldn't he try to capture Malcolm and offer him to Ra's? Thea no longer cares for Malcolm, so he doesn't have to worry about "losing" Thea emotionally. By delivering Malcolm to Ra's, Oliver could try to reason with Ra's about Thea's involvement in Sara's death. In that situation, Thea was really just the gun, but it was Malcolm who loaded the gun, aimed it and pulled the trigger. I would have thought that it is at least worth a try as the alternative is to continue "training" with Malcolm, although that training seems a little bizarre as Malcolm is yet to actually train Oliver so I'm not sure what Oliver is learning from the "student" which will help him to kill the "teacher".

Anyway, maybe they'll turn it all around in the final run to the close of the season.

I agree with virtually everything you've said. Add to that Laurel's 'just can't tell my father' about Sara storyline where heart patients, who are career cops, somehow can't handle bad news? And Laurel sees this as an indefinite solution, you can keep going with that, and then start in on another character. The only people not holding large idiot balls this season have been Roy and possibly Diggle, mostly on account of them not saying much. I think this is what happens when you change too much in a season after setting up a certain direction. You're left with dangling ends and a story that no longer makes sense. Putting something cool on the back end doesn't mean much if it doesn't match the front end. Unless you're building the Tumbler, but I digress.

But one point, I do think that kernel of the idea, that Oliver needs Malcolm's training seems legit, in premise. Counting on Ra's to be reasonable doesn't really seem like a solid plan, all things considered. At least, not secure enough to bet your sister's life on. Of course, with the lack of training happening, the execution is clearly awry.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

Oliver is playing the keep your enemies close game and take him down at his weak point

 

[Mike Murdock]

Frankly, Laurel probably could have kept Sara's death a secret indefinitely if she hadn't decided to dress up as her.

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

There seem to be no consequences for Lance keeping Sara is alive plot last season......hmm

 

[zenith16]

Oliver is playing the keep your enemies close game and take him down at his weak point

I don't think Oliver knows what he's doing he just knows his sister is in danger and Ras also threatened the citizen's of starling just any one on any street of it, if he didn't bring the killer or Malcolm to him.

Right now alot of characters haven't been thinking clearly ,if at all & it started from the point of the "who killed Sara story line of a mystery" where people that have no training in both forensic & detective work were trying to solve something they have no experience in. it all worsened from there

 

[Arrowshieldfan]

I don't think Oliver knows what he's doing he just knows his sister is in danger and Ras also threatened the citizen's of starling just any one on any street of it, if he didn't bring the killer or Malcolm to him.

Right now alot of characters haven't been thinking clearly ,if at all & it started from the point of the "who killed Sara story line of a mystery" where people that have no training in both forensic & detective work were trying to solve something they have no experience in. it all worsened from there

I hope they will start to think clearly in episode 15 and beyond......clearly the distraction of a death affect them and blind judgement.....maybe the writer just making a point that OQ is no batman who is a superior detective and forensic expert.....I think Episode 15 will clear up a lot of why the character choose to do what they do....

 

[zenith16]

I hope they will start to think clearly in episode 15 and beyond......clearly the distraction of a death affect them and blind judgement.....maybe the writer just making a point that OQ is no batman who is a superior detective and forensic expert.....I think Episode 15 will clear up a lot of why the character choose to do what they do....

he';s also lacking in serious spy skills (ohh sorry assassin skills) strategic thinking tactics & judgment. Yeah we can blame that on Waller as agency's are supposed to improve someone like him once they take him in if they were gonna bother with him at all. but as we saw with the most recent flash back oy he was screwed over there in that department. the second they showed last season on the island that he was with a an agency after saying that he couldn't keep up with slade strategically I knew something was very wrong cause that should ever ever happen. a few thing would get by you sure you did't see him for a while after all. But you should have some stuff over him as well that he didn't teach you cause he doesn't know some skills that the spy world would teach you.

 

[coluanprime]

I don't see how Oliver teaming up with Malcolm is supposed to be pragmatic or smart. This man killed TWO of Oliver's best friends along with 507 other innocent people and Frank Chen and who knows who else. He used his daughter to kill someone and drugged her. On top of this, he almost got Oliver killed.

I could accept Oliver teaming up with Malcolm in certain situations. Ex: they were both kidnapped by Ra's and the teamed up to fight their way out. Then they split up.
This whole prolonged teamup really isn't working for me.

 

[SpideyVille]

I don't see how Oliver teaming up with Malcolm is supposed to be pragmatic or smart. This man killed TWO of Oliver's best friends along with 507 other innocent people and Frank Chen and who knows who else. He used his daughter to kill someone and drugged her. On top of this, he almost got Oliver killed.

I could accept Oliver teaming up with Malcolm in certain situations. Ex: they were both kidnapped by Ra's and the teamed up to fight their way out. Then they split up.
This whole prolonged teamup really isn't working for me.

They haven't really done any kind of job of showing it on air, but the idea behind Oliver asking Malcolm for helkp is because he needs to learn how o use swords, as well as learning what the League's style of teaching is so he could get a better idea on how to approach the next fight with Ra's.

The problem is they haven't done any training together and now we see Malcolm getting captured and Oliver facing Ra's. It makes me wonder how Oliver and Diggle manage to get away and if Malcolm is going to escape with them. I don't think I've heard anything about Malcolm beyond this episode.

 

[zenith16]

They haven't really done any kind of job of showing it on air, but the idea behind Oliver asking Malcolm for helkp is because he needs to learn how o use swords, as well as learning what the League's style of teaching is so he could get a better idea on how to approach the next fight with Ra's.

The problem is they haven't done any training together and now we see Malcolm getting captured and Oliver facing Ra's. It makes me wonder how Oliver and Diggle manage to get away and if Malcolm is going to escape with them. I don't think I've heard anything about Malcolm beyond this episode.

Oliver's better off with katan's husband who has possibly been stalling Ra's all this time, since he was DJ assassin's contact to Ras.

They have better respect for each other. while Malcolm put's Oliver & his sister in situations which keep getting him nearly killed which makes ollie resist more with each of Malcolm's actions. we've seen Maeso's more capable & he doesn't run at Ras name. the writers have also over play the want of strain with Malcolm & Oliver which making this all fail.

 

[SpideyVille]

Oliver's better off with katan's husband who has possibly been stalling Ra's all this time, since he was DJ assassin's contact to Ras.

They have better respect for each other. while Malcolm put's Oliver & his sister in situations which keep getting him nearly killed which makes ollie resist more with each of Malcolm's actions. we've seen Maeso's more capable & he doesn't run at Ras name. the writers have also over play the want of strain with Malcolm & Oliver which making this all fail.

But the issue is Maseo is a member of the League. He helped Oliver because he owed it to him, but choosing to defect and train Oliver to kill his master is just something that makes absolutely no sense, unless he wanted out of the League. But his last scene with Tatsu proves he rather remain in the League and does not want to leave or kill his Master.

 

[zenith16]

But the issue is Maseo is a member of the League. He helped Oliver because he owed it to him, but choosing to defect and train Oliver to kill his master is just something that makes absolutely no sense, unless he wanted out of the League. But his last scene with Tatsu proves he rather remain in the League and does not want to leave or kill his Master.

yeah something about that's off. he's ether on a mission there for some else besides Ras or on the run from Waller him self which that still has yet to be fully explained or shown what happen to that son of his ?

& pretty much saving your family your gonna keep owing that buddy of yours . Maeso should just joined a rival agency that ll be in Wallers face though . if he can't get a face change

 

[SpideyVille]

The most easiest conclusion is that his son died and he did something similar to Malcolm, where he joined the League to forget or escape. I think it's going to be revealed that their son died because of Waller rather than because of China White, and something he did was directly responsible for it.

 

[hafizbat]

Everyone is making very valid points and questions; this season is definitely a mess right now. I'd just like to point out that it's not that unreasonable that the league can't find Merlyn. If the show has told us anything, it's that Malcolm is a highly skilled, dangerous man. As a former (presumably exceptional) member of the league, it makes sense that he'd know their capabilities and would be able to hide his tracks.

As clumsy and convoluted this season has been, I still think Merlyn is a great villain and a valuable asset to the show. Let's hope they finish the season sharply.

 

[zenith16]

Everyone is making very valid points and questions; this season is definitely a mess right now. I'd just like to point out that it's not that unreasonable that the league can't find Merlyn. If the show has told us anything, it's that Malcolm is a highly skilled, dangerous man. As a former (presumably exceptional) member of the league, it makes sense that he'd know their capabilities and would be able to hide his tracks.

As clumsy and convoluted this season has been, I still think Merlyn is a great villain and a valuable asset to the show. Let's hope they finish the season sharply.

the problem is he's been out in the open with in starling city where they can easily ambush him like they did Oliver in that alleyway. or have a sniper take him out. He's not hiding very well ,& the way he'll be caught will make question this even more. Apparently only Ras can capture him & man does Ras take his sweet time doing so.

Well this version of him does anyways he has weird mood swings I tell ya .

we'll see how this ends though.

 

[Loki882]

Another problem is that, with Ra's at least, we have a huge case of "telling not showing." This entire plot is dependent on Oliver thinking that Ra's would not only kill Malcolm, but also Thea. Here's the problem, the ONLY evidence that he/we have of that is essentially "because Malcolm said so." It's actually a big problem with the season as a whole, people just seem to accept anything that Malcolm says as truth (even though he's one of the least trustworthy characters on the show).

From what little that we've actually SEEN of Ra's, and what other characters not named Malcolm Merlyn have said about him, paint him as a man who is extremely ruthless and who will not hesitate to use violence to achieve his goals. However, he also seems to be a rational man who rules of conduct and a twisted code of ethics. So I just have a hard time buying that this guy would automatically want Thea dead regardless of any actual context for her actions. And I also have a hard time buying that Oliver would so easily believe this, when the ONLY evidence that he has is Malcolm's word.

Attention writers, there's this little rule in writing called "show don't tell." If you want us to buy something like this, then you have to put in the effort to actual SHOW decent evidence to back it up. The word of a pathological liar/psychotic mass-murder just isn't good enough, not even close.

 

[zenith16]

Another problem is that, with Ra's at least, we have a huge case of "telling not showing." This entire plot is dependent on Oliver thinking that Ra's would not only kill Malcolm, but also Thea. Here's the problem, the ONLY evidence that he/we have of that is essentially "because Malcolm said so." It's actually a big problem with the season as a whole, people just seem to accept anything that Malcolm says as truth (even though he's one of the least trustworthy characters on the show).

From what little that we've actually SEEN of Ra's, and what other characters not named Malcolm Merlyn have said about him, paint him as a man who is extremely ruthless and who will not hesitate to use violence to achieve his goals. However, he also seems to be a rational man who rules of conduct and a twisted code of ethics. So I just have a hard time buying that this guy would automatically want Thea dead regardless of any actual context for her actions. And I also have a hard time buying that Oliver would so easily believe this, when the ONLY evidence that he has is Malcolm's word.

Attention writers, there's this little rule in writing called "show don't tell." If you want us to buy something like this, then you have to put in the effort to actual SHOW decent evidence to back it up. The word of a pathological liar/psychotic mass-murder just isn't good enough, not even close.

Ras did tell ollie the he sent his assassin's to killing random people on the any street of the city of starling though if Oliver didn't bring him the killer of sara or Malcolm him self. So that may be why, cause Ras said that before Oliver came back to challenge him.

So the reason is Ras is flipfloppy with his weird lazy mood swings & yes he would still kill people that have nothing to do with this at all .

Rational with Ras & his first born daughter with in this show hasn't been show well they are far from rational


the other reason is Oliver is in fear of that Video after Malcolm showed it to him. Malcolm told Oliver specifically & he used the word if he (Malcolm him self) dies. he can be killed by anyone not just Oliver. it be out o the web

other wise I fully agree. the problem is Oliver doesn't know what to do at all with that He has a hacker of a girl friend & he doesn't know what to do

yet they showed a hacker in CBS shows that were able to shut down the web in episodes similar like Ncis LA with their resident hacker Eric there. til they found their web problem took down people causing it.

 

[Loki882]

That's not the same thing, at all. First of all, we don't know if Ra's was telling the truth there because it was never put to the test. He may very well have been bluffing. And there's between that and "oh your was brainwashed and had no idea what she was doing, and Merlyn did it. Oh well she dies anyway." Sorry, but you cannot compare the two situations, they're COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!! And Ra's HAS ben shown to be rational, every time we see him in fact. If anything, it's more likely that the only thing that would change is that he'd want MALCOLM dead even more.

All of this controversy/debate could have been avoided if the writers would have simply SHOWN us some concrete evidence either way. As opposed to "well Malcolm said it, so it must be true."

 

[zenith16]

That's not the same thing, at all. First of all, we don't know if Ra's was telling the truth there because it was never put to the test. He may very well have been bluffing. And there's between that and "oh your was brainwashed and had no idea what she was doing, and Merlyn did it. Oh well she dies anyway." Sorry, but you cannot compare the two situations, they're COMPLETELY DIFFERENT!! And Ra's HAS ben shown to be rational, every time we see him in fact. If anything, it's more likely that the only thing that would change is that he'd want MALCOLM dead even more.

All of this controversy/debate could have been avoided if the writers would have simply SHOWN us some concrete evidence either way. As opposed to "well Malcolm said it, so it must be true."

oh sorry I ment that I agree with you, with that post I guess in Oliver case he didn't want to take chances with Ras. he does have alot o assasi's after all. But about Ras threat but they didn't execute right at all.

As to Malcolm if he went that far to have the video happen it might have been true he would have had some one or an automated program put it out out on the web they've shown he's tech savvy enough and look what the did to the layer besides walking in with ease, he has camera's in there which team arrow still haven't picked up on . oh he most defeitly will play the sor loser card to have thea put i daer of he bits it. but the the writers went the weird Flipflopping with Malcolm.

I do agree with the rest of what you said.

Well minus the rational part . I can't say that with his mood swings about caring about sara and how he how want's Malcolm dead or alive brought in front of now but is taking his sweet time to go after him when Malcolm's barely hiding walking out in the open of Starling just to see thea at her club or apartment & that's due to the writers. I just can't say that with the action Ras is doing o hes show is he weirdly doesn't care at times or is lazy about it. that's it.

 

[haephestus]

Is the video even relevant any more?

Thea, for some unknown reason, is already on the LOA hit list. Ra's ordered Maseo to send DJ Assassin to watch, seduce and then kill Thea in Starling City. So, Thea is already a target for the LOA.

Sure, the public release of the video could cause some problems for Thea, but the apparent murder of a mysterious masked woman on a roof top would presumably be pretty difficult for the authorities to investigate without an identified victim and without a body.

Sure, Daddy Lance and Laurel Lance could point the way to Sara's grave, but they'd have to somehow explain how someone who died seven (?) years ago was still alive a few months ago and was running around on a rooftop in a mask. I guess the Lances could team up to kill Thea to avenge Sara, but that seems pretty unlikely since it's obvious that a third person was there and, although somewhat implausible, a mind-control drug isn't outside of the realm of possibility in Starling City, especially after Mirakuru (sp?), Vertigo, Oliver's magical herbs, etc.

At best, the only real damage arising from the public release of the video at this stage would appear to be embarrassment for Thea for participating in some weird night-time activities. But, that could even make Verdant more appealing to a certain crowd. Or if Verdant went under, then she'd still have Malcolm's fortune to head anywhere in the world to escape her public shame.

And I don't think that Malcolm has been doing a great job of "hiding" in Starling City. Malcolm has been running around both in and out of his Dark Archer costume pretty freely and has been a regular visitor to Thea's apartment. If DJ Assassin was half-way decent at his job, he would have seen Malcolm multiple times. And if DJ Assassin didn't see him, then I'm surprised none of Ra's other operatives have spied Malcolm running around the city or that none of Malcolm's employees have thought to sell-out Malcolm's continued living existence to the highest bidder.

 

[zenith16]

Is the video even relevant any more?

Thea, for some unknown reason, is already on the LOA hit list. Ra's ordered Maseo to send DJ Assassin to watch, seduce and then kill Thea in Starling City. So, Thea is already a target for the LOA.

Sure, the public release of the video could cause some problems for Thea, but the apparent murder of a mysterious masked woman on a roof top would presumably be pretty difficult for the authorities to investigate without an identified victim and without a body.

Sure, Daddy Lance and Laurel Lance could point the way to Sara's grave, but they'd have to somehow explain how someone who died seven (?) years ago was still alive a few months ago and was running around on a rooftop in a mask. I guess the Lances could team up to kill Thea to avenge Sara, but that seems pretty unlikely since it's obvious that a third person was there and, although somewhat implausible, a mind-control drug isn't outside of the realm of possibility in Starling City, especially after Mirakuru (sp?), Vertigo, Oliver's magical herbs, etc.

At best, the only real damage arising from the public release of the video at this stage would appear to be embarrassment for Thea for participating in some weird night-time activities. But, that could even make Verdant more appealing to a certain crowd. Or if Verdant went under, then she'd still have Malcolm's fortune to head anywhere in the world to escape her public shame.

And I don't think that Malcolm has been doing a great job of "hiding" in Starling City. Malcolm has been running around both in and out of his Dark Archer costume pretty freely and has been a regular visitor to Thea's apartment. If DJ Assassin was half-way decent at his job, he would have seen Malcolm multiple times. And if DJ Assassin didn't see him, then I'm surprised none of Ra's other operatives have spied Malcolm running around the city or that none of Malcolm's employees have thought to sell-out Malcolm's continued living existence to the highest bidder.

yeah about that some people met sara as a bartender at the club when Ollie owned it & thea was assistant manger. other then the small circle of ollies team his mother thea the the lace parents etc Like that doctor that look them both over when they lied to Laural about a motor bike accident at the hospital, which there are records. they were people that saw sara work there at that Club & walk around in the day time even if we don't see those other people she did interact with others.

she wasn't hiding her self as sara . the cops will indeed ask but she did interact with people half of them must have know especially with her visits to his office before his promotion to captain . & bartenders do have to have a relationship with drunks at their bar area & those people know the bartenders by name. like we saw with captain lance telling that poor bartender about his Daughters which often used with stories she wasn't staying that down low out of raydar.

the only one that would be in trouble would be Laurel for burring sara like she did will have to do alot of the explanation. the made her stupid moving sara's body around etc to the club Vardent & putting Sara's body in the grave. But to have the cops exhume the body ah can't make her any more stupid the she already has been during that event. They might not make her do that or her dad.

The rest of what you said about Malcolm I agree with a lot is off . he did make him self a easy target which should had more then one attempt at his life .