The Amazing Spider-Man 2 Based on ASM2's box office and quality, was rebooting a mistake?

[kguillou]

I'm thinking, is the box office results (which, from what I understand, is pretty disappointing) a product of:

a) Simply a bad movie with bad word of mouth, or

b) a lack of interest in the character Spider-Man period as a character (no matter the medium), now being in the shadows of Batman and The Avengers, or

c) a lack of interest in the movie character due to previous efforts (SM3, to some extent TASM), which means the public would be excited again if MS would get the rights, or

d) marketing ruining the film

A combination, or none of those above?


I'm starting to think it's a combination of A, B and C. Yes, I have a bad feeling Spider-Man isn't as popular anymore as a character. Probably due to how badly he's been handled in basically every kind of media.

Sadly, I think you nailed it there. Since 2007 Spider-man as a general franchise has been experiencing a downward spiral. Spider-man 3 was a huge disappointment, later that same year Spiderman went through arguably the most controversial storyline in comic book history and it split the fanbase in two. We had a brief renaissance in the form of the Spectacular Spider-man tv show which was critically heralded.......and then it was cancelled and replaced with someone that, let's say, people don't speak very highly of.

So, in terms of movies, tv, and the comics Spidey has been going through very tumultuous times and I think the general apathy for the character is finally being felt. Spidey's not on top of the world like he used to be for so many decades.

 

[Lord]

Spider-Man 3 didn't take interest outside of the general public, outside of the internet i don't see any hate for that movie.

 

[Oscorp]

Let's be honest, if it were announced tomorrow that Sony has sold the rights back to Marvel, I'd bet the internet would be on fire because of the hope and expectations that would come with such an announcement. Suddenly a world of possibilities would open up for the character and feed our imaginations. People would actually believe we'd get a good/great film.

I also think we need a break from the character. When someone is selling you something that you have diminished or little interest in, then it becomes annoying and looks really desperate. People aren't blind to this fact and that was part of the problem with TASM 2. A large segment of the audience were fatigued by the franchise with it's quick reboot and lackluster films so the advertising came across as almost needy, "please like us, please come see the film!" Overexposure always rubs people the wrong way but Sony didn't care apparently. A sign of desperation and a cry for help. They spent a ton on this and wanted to get paid off.

We''ll get more of the same in the future and no doubt threads like this will become the norm on websites everywhere.

I hope that's the case because that feels hopeful. I agree with you about Spider-Man needing a break. I love him too much, I don't want to see him suffer because of over exposure and underperforming films.

It's like how sometimes you have to be seperated from someone for some time to realise how much you miss him/her.

I don't think the general audience knows or cares about the difference between Marvel Studios or Sony or Fox films. There are a lot of people that don't understand the distinction and just see it all as Marvel movies.

I think most people know Spider-Man is a Marvel character, and he's clearly not in the same Movie universe, so I think the general audience put one and one together in this case.

When it comes to reboots, you've got to go big or go home. Sony played it safe by tweaking the tried and true franchise formula. They earned the audience's apathy.

They could have done something novel like hiring an actual teenager, instead of another actor old enough to be a father of one. Look how popular Spectacular Spider-man was with Spider-Man fans. They could have produced a less expensive movie that stood out from the rest of the superhero crowd, captured the interest of the spider-faithful, and filled the live action family friendly niche that has been absent since Spy Kids.

Instead we get more of the same old same old.

I think Garfield is one of the least problems here. Even in the most negative reviews, he and Emma are appreciated in these films. I don't see how any teenage actor could deliver, it would've just been worse.

What this series needed and needs is to simply make a film that is clever and great on its own. Not just another film leading to something else. One single film that simply is a great film that stands on its own legs.

 

[Oscorp]

Sadly, I think you nailed it there. Since 2007 Spider-man as a general franchise has been experiencing a downward spiral. Spider-man 3 was a huge disappointment, later that same year Spiderman went through arguably the most controversial storyline in comic book history and it split the fanbase in two. We had a brief renaissance in the form of the Spectacular Spider-man tv show which was critically heralded.......and then it was cancelled and replaced with someone that, let's say, people don't speak very highly of.

So, in terms of movies, tv, and the comics Spidey has been going through very tumultuous times and I think the general apathy for the character is finally being felt. Spidey's not on top of the world like he used to be for so many decades.

Yeah I think that explains it all. It's extremely sad!

 

[LizardMan07]

Come on guys, it's not ALL doom and gloom. There's enough positives to come out of the last two films and I think Sony knows this next one has to be special, I think they'll deliver. Andrew Garfield and Emma Stone deserve at least that for the great performances they've put in

 

[GuestStar2004]

Andrew is great as the character, I think its Sony that's dragging it down, infact like someone has said it feels like a bunch of people had a hand in this movie with ideas and they just used them all so in the end the movie was more script notes then story, I liked the movie btw

I don't agree about needing one villain before it would be good, you can have 2 villains if the plot is structured well

Hopefully Sony back off or get someone to look at the franchise the same way kevin feige is for the MCU not avi Arad

 

[LizardMan07]

I'm a little miffed that the rest of the film is going to make people forget about the death scene as I thought it was fantastic and an effective goodbye to stone in the franchise who did so well. The film feels like it had so much potential to be great, a shame most people won't remember the good bits as the years go on.

I don't know what sony will do if TASM3 bombs.

 

[GuestStar2004]

There are actually a lot of people who liked the movie, I see a lot of praise on tumblr, but on a lot of other places like here it seems doom and gloom has set in

 

[Mace Dolex]

The scene where he cries over Harry at the end is a disgrace (imho ).

Yeah I know people don't look their best when crying but geez it looked like Maguire was "acting" as if he were crying, the little lip quiver wasn't convincing.

 

[Angryfantasyfan]

I think Garfield is one of the least problems here. Even in the most negative reviews, he and Emma are appreciated in these films. I don't see how any teenage actor could deliver, it would've just been worse.

I disagree. Having a 30 year old Peter is why they have to shoot through the high school years at breakneck speed. It forces them into following the same beats as the previous trilogy, leaving the audience with deja vu. It's like they've taken everything from Ultimate Spider-man, but the one thing that differentiates it from the original.

 

[LizardMan07]

There are actually a lot of people who liked the movie, I see a lot of praise on tumblr, but on a lot of other places like here it seems doom and gloom has set in

It's well liked on reddit, and all the people I talked to in my own life loved it, but yeah, I'm a little sad some people didn't like it.

 

[Airnick]

It's well liked on reddit, and all the people I talked to in my own life loved it, but yeah, I'm a little sad some people didn't like it.

TASM2 finished number 2 on comic vine for best Spider-Man movie.

 

[LizardMan07]

So if it's well liked then how did the box office go down? Seems confusing to me as a lot of people seemed to like it

 

[Erzengel]

TASM2 finished number 2 on comic vine for best Spider-Man movie.

You mean 120 out of 377 people voted for TASM2?

 

[LizardMan07]

31% is pretty good in a 5 way poll

 

[Angryfantasyfan]

31% is pretty good in a 5 way poll

It's a sampling of Comic Vine members, not of the general audience needed for a blockbuster to be successful.

 

[chaseter]

My 8 year old cousin's 2nd grade class voted this best Spidey movie yet! That should go on a plaque or something.

 

[OcStat]

Some of you guys are seriously blowing this out of proportion.

This character has endured for 50+ years. You really think 1 movie is all of a sudden the nail in the coffin?

A Character's popularity is always subject to highs and lows. Like Spider-Fan said, the follow up could easily turn things right back around, provided they put the extra effort required into it.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Not one movie. Three movies.

A lot of franchises eventually reach a crossroads, where they really need to deliver a big hit in order to remain relevant. James Bond has been at the plate in this situation three times, in 1977, 1995, and 2006, and hit a home run each time. Had those films flopped, Bond might not be around today. This month actually has TWO franchises in the same situation. Spidey swung and missed. We'll see what the X-Men do in about a week.

 

[OcStat]

No dude, it's one movie. Maybe to you it's the third strike, but none of the others have hit this low point, critically or financially. Amazing Spider-Man might have had mixed reviews but to my recollection they were not overtly negative. It didn't set any records but it was slapped in the middle of Avengers and The Dark Knight.

Yes we've seen a decline, but the comic book movie market is entirely different than it was in Spider-Man's heyday. We have at least 2 or 3 comic movies every year now.

And even if it is his third strike, there's always Spidey's next time at bat. That is going to be in 2016. They are not going to put Spider-Man up on the shelf.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I am admittingly speculating here, but I really believe that this was the one they needed to get right. They lost a lot of their audience with this picture. Even if they correct a lot of the problems and TASM3 ends up being a good film, I think the box office will nosedive.

We have experienced a recent precedent within the genre for this. Just look at how the X-Men box office plummeted after The Last Stand and X-Men: Origins. At that point the audience didn't care that First Class was great. They had already been burned too many times.

Heck, I'm a Spider-Man fan and even I'm not going to bother with the third one unless there is a change with the writer and director.

 

[SoNicRaDiATioN]

No dude, it's one movie. Maybe to you it's the third strike, but none of the others have hit this low point, critically or financially. Amazing Spider-Man might have had mixed reviews but to my recollection they were not overtly negative. It didn't set any records but it was slapped in the middle of Avengers and The Dark Knight.

Yes we've seen a decline, but the comic book movie market is entirely different than it was in Spider-Man's heyday. We have at least 2 or 3 comic movies every year now.

And even if it is his third strike, there's always Spidey's next time at bat. That is going to be in 2016. They are not going to put Spider-Man up on the shelf.

That's the problem, Sony will run the character into the ground because they don't want to lose the rights. It's the same creative team behind the next film and likely the same results will follow. We've had two films in this new series and neither became anything other then quickly forgotten. Both are seen as inferior to other films in the genre that same year. In 2012 it was The Avengers and TDKR. This year it's Cap 2 and very likely DoFP and GoTG. This series, no, the the last three films have completely taken the luster off the character. The general audience have clearly demonstrated their dwindling appetite for mediocrity, i.e. Spider-Man films, as the revenues have dramatically decreased. Now Sony is going to continue to shove the films down a GA's throat and alienate them even further. Why should anyone expect anything different then what we've gotten? The films certainly aren't terrible and have some definite bright spots (Garfield's portrayal of Spidey being #1), but those are few and far between imo. I'm glad you're optimistic, but I think you'd be in the minority if you consider the entire audience that Sony is trying to win over.

 

[Human Torch]

Eh,it's an awful lot of doom and gloom here,but I think they nailed Spidey in this film.Now the film has it's problems (not the least of which is the studio fingerprints all over it) but to single this out as the demise of Spidey as a viable character is very premature.They seem to be heading in the right direction,thankfully moving away from the insipid TASM.A better writer(s) would go a long way in producing a better plot for pt 3.

 

[SoNicRaDiATioN]

The proof is in the pudding. Marvel's flagship character will struggle to 200 m in his own backyard. Momentum is in the toilet and the franchise is an afterthought in comparison to it's contemporaries.

 

[AF3619]

sadly i kinda agree, Sony will go forward with the franchise and rush it until they need to reboot it again, they don´t take time to make something they want to do they do it to keep the character and the money that comes with the franchise, the final product in both movies seems unpolished and rushed, the acting and some good scenes save this movie for many .
Sony don´t learn from their mistakes they keep moving forward building up to something that is not sure if it´s going to succeed, also Spider-man right now is just a trend movie, the first tried the grounded tone because it was successful to TDK trilogy then Avengers was successful and tried match the tone, and landed in a Batman Forever tone sometimes and that IMHO is why Sony fails, they want to be Marvel but they fail to see how they did it, slowly and with each movie beeing good on their own not just a trailer for stuff to come.

I even think they chose Marc Webb to direct these because he is an unexperienced, but talented director that can´t fight back the studio or the producer, i think he just does what he is told to and tries to do the best with what they give him to work with, i feel sony hired him so they didn´t have another person reject the scripts that they give him.

Don´t get me wrong i like this movie and even if i want to continue seeing these movie i can´t stop thinking sony needs to stop and really think what they are doing, try to make a better script and better marketing techniques because if the trend continues, less and less money they will make until everyone is tired of this franchise.