Discussion in 'Batman Begins' started by Micromind, Nov 24, 2011.
BB edges out Spider-Man.
I don't think so.
Batman Begins got me invested with the character in a way that no other depiction of the character in any medium of entertainment has ever done before in the past, not even the 90's animated series.
One of the greatest scenes in the movie (and any film, for that matter) is the party scene where Bruce has to shift into drunk mode in order to convince the guests to leave his house in order to protect them.
Even though I was fully aware of Bruce's intention in this scene, I still felt uncomfortable watching it... for all the right reasons.
I felt legitimately uncomfortable for the guests in this scene and could easily put myself in their place because Bale's performance was so thoroughly convincing.
What adds to the texture of this scene, is the conversation Bruce had earlier with Alfred:
Alfred Pennyworth: If those are to be the first of many injuries to come, it would be wise to find a suitable excuse. Polo, for instance.
Bruce Wayne: I'm not learning polo, Alfred.
Alfred Pennyworth: Strange injuries a non-existent social life, these things beg the question as to what exactly does Bruce Wayne do with his time and his money.
Bruce Wayne: And what does someone like me do?
Alfred Pennyworth: Drive sports cars, date movie stars, buy things that are not for sale... who knows, Master Wayne? You start pretending to have fun, you might even have a little by accident.
This paints a subtle, yet vivid picture of how Bruce feels about the class of people he associates with during the day in order to maintain his false persona, and you can tell he doesn't have as much fun with it as Alfred would like him too. So how much of this:
Bruce Wayne: No, really. Uh... There's a thing about being a Wayne that... you're never short of a few freeloaders, like yourselves, to fill up your mansion with, so, here's to you people. Thank you.
Fredericks: That's enough, Bruce.
Bruce Wayne: Mm... I'm not finished. To all of you, uh, all you phonies, all of you two-faced friends, you sycophantic suck-ups who smile through your teeth at me, please leave me in peace. Please go. Stop smiling. It's not a joke. Please leave. The party's over. Get out."
...is actually an act?
This, along with may other brilliant moments in the film, are what makes this movie a cut above the rest of the genre and one of the top 5 most influential films of the 21st century.
Am I the only one who thinks Begins is the best film in the trilogy?
No, you're not. There's a guy called "BatmanGoesToRio" who thinks the same.
So does some guy called "bh/hhh" t:
I like the more understated tone of this film. I love origin stories and I love how this fillm takes its time to show us the hero in the outfit. Its defiantly one of my favorite origin films ever and my first real Batman movie. I would for my personal tastes throw in Iron Man, Ang Lee's Hulk and Sam Rami's Spider Man as some of the best origin stores alongside BB.
I'm a huge fan of superhero origin films and Batman Begins is fantastic. I think its not afraid to go into comic book mode like the sequel tried so hard not to. That's one of the reasons I think its the best Batman film also I have to admit I'm kinda cliche and I like happy endings too. Which I feel the sequels didn't have.
The origin side of the story in undoubtedly the best one. The tone is just great. problem is that, as you say, the film takes a lot of time to show us the hero in the outfit but when it does,... it doesn't really.
Well, many movies before BB weren't afraid to go all comic book mode. And you have to admit the impact of a tragic ending story. Hamlet was originally written with a happy ending (Hamlet gets married), then Shakespeare changed it to a tragic ending and nobody else bothered to remember the original story.
That said, the ending of BB (rooftop scene and Joker card) was phenomenal, but the Bruce/Rachel thing didn't end happily precisely, although not tragically either.
What does that even mean? lol
Lol. Ok, I mean that they took their time, which was great, and when Batman was supposed to be there in all his glory, they kinda made him invisible. Now, that worked just fine in his first apparition, but you cannot keep the hero invisible throughout the whole movie.
I still don't understand what you're saying lol. His first appearance was edited quickly because it was from the perspective of the criminal. But I don't recall that happening again. I really don't. But if it did, it was probably only briefly when he fought more criminals. Everything else, or I should say everything in general, was visible.
Well, the subject of the choppy action scenes was widely discussed here and in other forums. You can't follow Batman's fights, not even on the train with Ra's. If that at first made a great point and effect, the second time was just annoying and at the end it was just frustrating not being able to see Batman in action in a Batman movie.
Never said they didn't, I'm comparing it to the other 2 Nolan films which I don't think ended as hopeful in my opinion. The second one ends with an excitement for what's to cone for sure but it's not a happy end and the third one ends where Bruce is no longer Batman so that's already a downer for me. But it's just my personal preference for what I call a happy ending and that's not to say he gets the girl just a it's gonna be alright etc.
A downer for Bruce would be to end Rises and still be Batman. After the message they're trying to tell and what he goes through, for Bruce to be subjected to more years in hell would be depressing as hell. Him standing on a building with a cowl on as the ending would have NOT felt triumphant but a repetitive loss for me. Rises was a super happy ending for Bruce.
TDK was the only really dark ending. Begins was somewhere in the middle.
BB ending was a **** YEAH moment. TDK's was a goosebumpy but dark as hell ending. TDKR was a super emotional but happy moment.
Well have to disagree but to me Bruce Wayne is Batman and when he stops been Batman the story isn't interesting for me. Also I only feel like he needed to stop been Batman in the 3rd one, the others I didn't get that same feeling. Rises was a happy ending for Bruce but not in my eyes as a Batman fan cause its supposed to be the never ending battle. Are we supposed to believe Bruce Wayne will be happy living in France with Selina Kyle if he hears ****s going down in Gotham again? Not for me.
The end of TDKR just doesn't feel right. I was hoping for something like Bruce realizing that he always will be Batman and that Gotham will always need Batman. The Dark Knight Rises.... and stays.
Anyone else know see the cool message on the soundtrack, if you take the first letters of tracks 4 through 9.
It's funny how often people mistake the ending for France. It's Florence, Italy.
TDKR ending ruled. I knew we weren't gonna get the "rooftop/live to fight another day" ending when Nolan said that he was interesting in ending the story rather than infinitely blowing up the balloon.
Exactly. We got a definitive ending to Bruce's story, and the fan in me felt Bruce fully deserved his happy ending. It's one thing to want to see the never-ending battle of crime Batman fights (which the trilogy was not about), but in no way is that a fault of the movie. In context of Nolan's interpretation, the ending fits.
That would have been extremely boring to me. A lack of creativity. I can read any comic or watch any past or future Batman movie if I wanted an ending like that, where Batman carries on forever. If a director has nothing new to say, they should just not say anything at all. That's how I feel now.
Gotham will always need Batman, and that's what we got. It's just done without Bruce. Batman needs to carry through every generation. 200 years later, Gotham may need Batman and there won't be a Bruce Wayne to do it, but Batman lives on no matter what. It worked with Batman Beyond and I feel it worked better here because we didn't have to actually see some different character under the cowl. Or see some depressing 80 year old Bruce not being able to do anything other than bark orders & walk around all miserable for entire stories. Which I like in Beyond but it gets depressing to watch sometimes. So I feel like Nolan took a bit of that concept but didn't subject us to such an extreme story.
Count me in with those who aren't a fan of the ending of TDKRises. Even though I understood why Nolan chose to end it that way, which makes sense in the context of that whole trilogy. Plus the ending would've worked better if they hadn't killed Rachel in TDK. And having Bruce spend the rest of his life with her instead of Selina. Afterall at the end of Rises the day has come for Bruce to no longer need Batman so he and Rachel could be together. But apparantly it still does since Blake is taking over. I still wouldn't have been a fan if it went that way either, b/c I see Batman/Bruce as a tragic character. A happily ever after ending for Bruce isn't my cup of tea. Plus crime could erupt anytime in Gotham. As long as there's good there's also evil. Idk how Bruce believes Gotham's in good hands with Blake in charge. A cop without none of Bruce's training, intellect, and skills isn't enough, imo. I'd rather it ended differently without having Bruce retire twice. But it is what it is.
Agreed. Not with the Rachel part, I was cool with that. It makes the villain more evil when he actually kills and kills someone close to the hero. If not you end up as just another goofball villain like Loki. I don't agree with Batman retiring. Or taking 8 years off. To me Nolan simply doesn't get Batman if he thinks Batman would do that. I don't care if it's unrealistic to keep fighting. There was plenty of unrealism going on.
It's not about getting Batman or not. Batman doesn't retire because comics have to be sold, that's just the harsh truth. Even if it wasn't, storytellers are allowed (especially in other mediums) to change things to fit their interpretation. Otherwise you're a slave to the source material. Some people don't mind that, others want to bend the rules a bit and have some freedom. You know, try something new. Nolan's not wrong for wanting to end Bruce's story.
I applaud him for it. It took balls. It's still one of my favorite endings in the history of cinema and one of my favorite batman stories ever.
Well, it's out of the way and in the past now. I hope I never see Batman do that again.