DC to "Rebirth" in June - Part 2

[DoomRulz]

So I'm in love with Batman Annual #3. I love any story that explores the father/son dynamic between Bruce and Alfred and this was my favourite such story. The ending was so touching.

 

[CrimsonMist]

Anyone check out Detective Comics #994? Felt a little too much like it wad written by a kid playing with their action figures, what with some of the (very) melodramatic dialogue. But otherwise, it was pretty damn good and a nice return to a somewhat low-key detective story that's been sorely lacking.

Plus Doug Mahnke's art is tops.

 

[Mani-Man]

So I'm in love with Batman Annual #3. I love any story that explores the father/son dynamic between Bruce and Alfred and this was my favourite such story. The ending was so touching.

Oh yeah, i always love when they show how much of a father Alfred is and how incredible important he is for Bruce.
Without him there would be no Batman and i think too many writers ignore or forget that.
Thats why i loved it so god damn much.

Anyone check out Detective Comics #994? Felt a little too much like it wad written by a kid playing with their action figures, what with some of the (very) melodramatic dialogue. But otherwise, it was pretty damn good and a nice return to a somewhat low-key detective story that's been sorely lacking.

Plus Doug Mahnke's art is tops.

It felt overall a bit weird and trying too much...but yeah i liked it.
Detective Comics delivers almost always since a long time...more than Kings batman.

 

[Babillygunn]

Loved Detective 994, especially the dialogue with Bats and Gordon. Mani, I have to confess, King has now officially won me over on Batman. He’s been killing it since the wedding issue. I just hated War of Jokes and Riddles.

 

[Mani-Man]

Loved Detective 994, especially the dialogue with Bats and Gordon. Mani, I have to confess, King has now officially won me over on Batman. He’s been killing it since the wedding issue. I just hated War of Jokes and Riddles.

I can feel my resolve on King slowly wearing down, he seems to write storys that fit more his style and not some huge storylines that he cant deliver on.
His first half is awful, the whole wedding thing is awful...but he seems to get closer in finding his rythm.

You can see differences between his run before the wedding and after, its all better paced and compacter written...so i can see him now winning people over.

But for me it still takes a long way since im so incredible bitter on the fantastic arcs he had in his early run and botched so incredible.

If he continues then i can see myself in a few months praise the hell out of him
He gets there, but not yet enough to make me go back to be a regular reader of the comics.

 

[Babillygunn]

I agree with your assessment Mani. King’s strength is writing smaller, intimate stories. We have gotten used to Batman being all about the huge event stories. It’s taking some getting used to for his style. But I Have really grown to appreciate it.

With War of Jokes and Riddles, I thought he really didn’t understand the character of Batman. I had a real hard time with how Batman handled the whole Kite-Man’s son stuff. It really ticked me off. But sticking with it, I have gotten treated to some beautiful writing since then. There are some strange choices he’s made. I feel like there are a lot of loose ends, like what ever happened to Gotham Girl and why does she just disappear so often. But overall, it has really gotten strong. Cold Days was absolutely incredible. And I actually liked the wedding stuff. I loved Selina’s ode to Batman and thought it was one of the best Batman descriptions ever:

“He is:

The Dark Knight. The Caped Crusader. The World’s Greatest Detective.

A man whose power is: he’s the best he can be at everything anyone can be.

He’s not like us. He’s better than us.

That scares us, yes. But it also comforts us.

It’s because he’s better than us that he will always be there.

As each night returns, so shall the Bat.

Forever. “

 

[Primal Slayer]

Green Arrow cancelled.

 

[CrimsonMist]

I agree with your assessment Mani. King’s strength is writing smaller, intimate stories. We have gotten used to Batman being all about the huge event stories. It’s taking some getting used to for his style. But I Have really grown to appreciate it.

With War of Jokes and Riddles, I thought he really didn’t understand the character of Batman. I had a real hard time with how Batman handled the whole Kite-Man’s son stuff. It really ticked me off. But sticking with it, I have gotten treated to some beautiful writing since then. There are some strange choices he’s made. I feel like there are a lot of loose ends, like what ever happened to Gotham Girl and why does she just disappear so often. But overall, it has really gotten strong. Cold Days was absolutely incredible. And I actually liked the wedding stuff. I loved Selina’s ode to Batman and thought it was one of the best Batman descriptions ever:

I still don't quite understand why everyone rags on King for the lack of a wedding. Much like killing a character, or making a character a villain, we know that a wedding isn't going to happen. And considering that it came at the mid-point? It's foolish to get upset over. The lack of a wedding is an emotional high point to kick the story into it's second phase. That reveal at the end was when King made me really feel like **** got real, and he's been building on that ever since.

Not sure if you or ManiMan ever followed wrestling, but I liken the scenario to when Hulk Hogan turned heel and joined the NWO. If Sting, Lex Luger and the Macho Man beat Kevin Nash and Scott Hall at that Bash at the Beach after WCW built up that whole "Outsiders" invasion angle, it would have fell flat. Having Hogan come out and turn heel, though? That took the story to a whole new level, and set the stage for the Crow Sting, and all of those great moments that came out of the next year or so of storytelling. So with Tom King's Batman, Bane foiling the wedding is taking the story forward and escalating the stakes. It's been a tough few months seeing Bruce in a downward spiral trying to make sense of the conspiracy and being knocked down a few pegs in a way that I haven't quite seen before. Plus, King posted a drawing by Mikel Janin of Batman and Catwoman embracing on a gargoyle over a rain swept Gotham, cryptically telling us "Coming up in Batman". So I'm anticipating a highly emotional reunion.

That said, I re-read everything in the lead up to issue 50, and I liked The War of Jokes and Riddles much more the second go-round. The fact that the whole thing was a massive ploy created by the Riddler to get the Joker out of his fugue state was, within the context of the story, brilliantly infuriating. It made Batman's mistakes, like mishandling Kite-Man's son's death, all the more poignant because it was more than just a casualty of war. It was a joke. And I loved how King kind of re-contextualized Batman's relationship with the Joker in the moment that Batman realizes the nothingness of the whole war. On top of that, I loved how the whole story was about the fallout of the war, the small moments within it, rather than about the war itself. The dinner issue is still my favorite. But still, I would have loved to see it play out as a maxi-series outside of the main title as originally conceived by King and Mitch Gerads, before editorial put the kibosh on that.

I've been loving King's Batman since I Am Suicide. After the bombastic, overwritten nonsense from Snyder, King's take was a very welcome turn of the wheel. If anything, I can truly appreciate King as a craftsman. His books never feel like the run of the mill superhero book. Everything is crafted with intent, from the panel layouts, to the dialogue, and the pacing that all of the elements create. Everything feels deliberate. This is clearly illustrated in King's issue of "The Button" vs Williamson's issues, that feel like every other superhero book on the stands.

 

[Babillygunn]

Seriously, my screen name is BABILLYGUNN and you aren’t sure if I watched 90’s wrestling? Lol. But yeah, I see your point on King. It was just a tonal shift. It took some getting used to. I really appreciate it more now. I will however always hate Jokes and Riddles because of how Batman didn’t seem to be upset over Kite Man’s son. That was a really upsetting choice.

 

[Babillygunn]

Green Arrow cancelled.

That is really disappointing. While the title has kind of been all over the place, it hasn’t been awful. At times it has been really good. And there are a lot of things that it really gets right about the character. It has really showcase Oliver’s relationship with Black canary very well. It has also done a good job of showing his strained relationship with the justice league. I would have liked to have seen more of his SJW persona thrown in and more of him fighting for the poor and marginalized. It really started out that way and then kind of got lost. Not going to lie, I’ll miss this title.

 

[Mani-Man]

That is really disappointing. While the title has kind of been all over the place, it hasn’t been awful. At times it has been really good. And there are a lot of things that it really gets right about the character. It has really showcase Oliver’s relationship with Black canary very well. It has also done a good job of showing his strained relationship with the justice league. I would have liked to have seen more of his SJW persona thrown in and more of him fighting for the poor and marginalized. It really started out that way and then kind of got lost. Not going to lie, I’ll miss this title.

Yeah, i really liked the run.
Maybe 3-4 issues werent that great but otherwise it was solid overall.
It didnt break any molds or changed the landscape but it was always nice to follow the next adventure and arc.

I loved how the character were written and Olivers relationship with Black Canary or pretty much everyone...just a really lovely series.
Damn shame, i will miss it.

 

[DoomRulz]

What, why?! Why the hell is GA being canned?!

 

[Mani-Man]

What, why?! Why the hell is GA being canned?!

From what i gather so far is that it might just be ending and they do a Green Arrow/Black canary comic series 2019 and that they might not see a reason to have two Green Arrow ongoing comics.
But im not sure yet, its a bit unclear.

While we are at changes in the comic book landscape, has anybody a writer they would like to see on Batman?
From what i gather Batman 105 will be Kings last issue, so im curious who could come next.
While i will not be sad that King will be gone, by the time of it i will probably find some appreciation for his work...except the awful batcat stuff...but thats beside the point.

Im curious in general what 2019 will bring and what DC has planned.

 

[Babillygunn]

I’m thinking 2019 will continue to see Joelle Jone pushed for marquee name comics as a writer and artist. And deservedly so. Wonderful work on Catwoman and great art for Batman.

 

[_Superman_]

I am more and more finding myself waiting them to put Johnathan Kent with the Legion of Superheroes and just start a new book with him in the 31 century fighting along side them and becoming a hero in his own right and growing.

 

[Primal Slayer]

What, why?! Why the hell is GA being canned?!

Because the sales SUCKED recently. It was the lowest selling main title from DC this past month.

 

[DoomRulz]

Can we all agree that Mark Russell must never be allowed near a comic book ever again? HQ #56 was beyond painful.

 

[Mani-Man]

Can we all agree that Mark Russell must never be allowed near a comic book ever again? HQ #56 was beyond painful.

Was it? Isnt Russell even awarded with an Eisner Award for his comedic writing?
Seems like a good fit...but the whole rebirth harley quinn idea imo is in general not one i really liked and i couldnt get into the series.

 

[DoomRulz]

The whole issue was self-indulgent leftist wank. Forgive my tone because I hate using that sort of reductionist language but ugh...he was taking the most obvious, cheapest pot shots at GamerGate, men's rights activists, anything that's identified popularly as "alt-right". It was so in your face that it was insulting.

 

[Motown Marvel]

Every criticism of GamerGate/Men's Rights Activists is worthwhile, even poorly constructed criticisms.

 

[DoomRulz]

Every criticism of GamerGate/Men's Rights Activists is worthwhile, even poorly constructed criticisms.

If you say so.

 

[Mani-Man]

Every criticism of GamerGate/Men's Rights Activists is worthwhile, even poorly constructed criticisms.

Yeah, im with you on that.

 

[DoomRulz]

It's worthwhile if it's in context and has a factual basis to it, unlike the self-indulgent tripe Russell gave us. I could practically see him patting himself on the back everytime I turned the page.

It'd be like trying to criticize feminism by throwing in a character with multi-colored hair and having her dialogue written in all caps, shouting about street harassment or some such just for the lolz.

 

[Babillygunn]

I’ll go ahead and say it: Tomasi is the best there is.

 

[Mani-Man]

I’ll go ahead and say it: Tomasi is the best there is.

Hm, hard to say but he is definitly damn good.
Most of the stuff he did is solid, not everything is groundbreaking or so...but its enjoyable and you want to go back from time to time.

Detective Comics 994 and 995 are fantastic and really strong written.