The Dark Knight Establish the Coin in TDK?

[Abaddon]

But there's a great irony in being scarred(physically and emotional) in a court of law.

 

[CaptainClown]

Oh there is and I think I will just make a thread about how he becomes scarred. But to stay on topic I like the idea that the coin is from his father.

 

[theDarkerKnight]

cap't clown..read my thought...maybe youll dig on that

 

[smatt584]

It's been a while since I've read The Long Halloween, did it give any mention as to why Bruce was attending the hearing? Either way, it can easily be explained, much how I did earlier, if the need were ever to arise.

No, i don't think it did explain why he was there, but he was disguised as someone else, not as Bruce Wayne or Batman, but in a black jacket, stocking hat, fake beard and glasses.

 

[CaptainClown]

No, i don't think it did explain why he was there, but he was disguised as someone else, not as Bruce Wayne or Batman, but in a black jacket, stocking hat, fake beard and glasses.

Like the prestige

 

[smatt584]

yeah, only less predictable

 

[CaptainClown]

just a little

 

[Steelsheen]

I think that there at least needs to be some level of "problem" within Harvey before he finally snapped. I know some, like Stormin' Norman think Harvey should be entirely free of all mental problems prior to the accident but there are a few angles which I think work in context of the Harvey Dent story.

1) Deep seeded schizophrenia: As long as Harvey had complete control over it prior to the accident, he's still just as heroic a character. Much like with Batman, its not who you are underneath, but your actions that define you, especially to the audience.

2) A slowly developing problem: If Harvey starts to unravel in the second act, after having been firmly established as a good guy to begin with, it makes him much more compelling because he begins as someone who is heroic, but through circumstances where he can't make a "right" decision (such as being forced to choose between the two ferries) he slowly begins to get to that point. The acid then changes him from someone who is slowly unravelling into a less decent, but still capable human being into someone whose original persona has completely collapsed.

In my mind, simply taking someone who is the perfect person, able to handle whatever is thrown at him, and have him turn to a life of crime simply because of a horrible accident (which plenty of others remain reasonable human beings after) just does not work in my mind. Instead the story is much more compelling, as with any tragedy, when you can see the gradual decline of the character and the final act which brings about their downfall.

great post man

i'm also of the idea that Harvey has some psychological issues. i mean we all do right? its just varying degrees. only with Harvey, he met a really nasty accident at the wrong place and the wrong time. an unfortunate victim of chance. hence giving added significance to the coin flipping as well.

 

[The Mighty Wind]

But there's a great irony in being scarred(physically and emotional) in a court of law.

Exactly. Its a testament to everything that creates the two-face persona. Quite simply, the system doesn't work in Gotham, to the point where an innocent District Attorney is scarred by the (very guilty) gangster he is prosecuting.

 

[smatt584]

great post man

i'm also of the idea that Harvey has some psychological issues. i mean we all do right? its just varying degrees. only with Harvey, he met a really nasty accident at the wrong place and the wrong time. an unfortunate victim of chance. hence giving added significance to the coin flipping as well.

Exactly. There should definitely be a violent undercurrent to his character, good guy or not. There should be some moments in there where maybe someone has to step in to keep him from punching a mobster or something. Just give him some issues, nothing to Shakespeare-ian, just something he has to struggle with a little. This will make the full-out mental collapse more believable and much more dramatic and tragic. That's one of the reasons why Two-Face is my favorite bat-villain, the character is extremely well-rounded and sympathetic. One of the more believable characters because there are at least logical conclusions for the source of his break.

 

[Abaddon]

I think that there at least needs to be some level of "problem" within Harvey before he finally snapped. I know some, like Stormin' Norman think Harvey should be entirely free of all mental problems prior to the accident but there are a few angles which I think work in context of the Harvey Dent story.

1) Deep seeded schizophrenia: As long as Harvey had complete control over it prior to the accident, he's still just as heroic a character. Much like with Batman, its not who you are underneath, but your actions that define you, especially to the audience.

2) A slowly developing problem: If Harvey starts to unravel in the second act, after having been firmly established as a good guy to begin with, it makes him much more compelling because he begins as someone who is heroic, but through circumstances where he can't make a "right" decision (such as being forced to choose between the two ferries) he slowly begins to get to that point. The acid then changes him from someone who is slowly unravelling into a less decent, but still capable human being into someone whose original persona has completely collapsed.

In my mind, simply taking someone who is the perfect person, able to handle whatever is thrown at him, and have him turn to a life of crime simply because of a horrible accident (which plenty of others remain reasonable human beings after) just does not work in my mind. Instead the story is much more compelling, as with any tragedy, when you can see the gradual decline of the character and the final act which brings about their downfall.

I agree 100%. It's understandable that any person in Harvey's position might experience a mental breakdown, but a full-fledged villain? I think not.

 

[Muziko]

Agreed. That is an aspect of Harvey Dent/Two-Face that I hope Nolan & Co. show in TDK.